You and the million degrees you have huh? :)
Notice after it says: "I am going to bring against Tyre Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, king of kings, with horses and chariots, with horsemen and a great army."
It states: He will ravage your settlements on the mainland with the sword; he will set up siege works against you, build a ramp up to your walls and raise his shields against you. He will direct the blows of his battering rams against your walls and demolish your towers with his weapons. His horses will be so many that they will cover you with dust. Your walls will tremble at the noise of the war horses, wagons and chariots when he enters your gates as men enter a city whose walls have been broken through. The hoofs of his horses will trample all your streets; he will kill your people with the sword, and your strong pillars will fall to the ground. They will plunder your wealth and loot your merchandise;
All of this is in reference to Nebuchadnezzar destroying Tyre, which he was never able to do.
In addition: I will make you a bare rock, and you will become a place to spread fishnets. You will never be rebuilt, for I YAHWEH have spoken, declares the Sovereign LORD.
This sounds like a contradicting statement. It sounds like Tyre will be destroyed and never rebuilt. But then, "a place to spread fishnets" sounds to me like a small fishing village. (By the way, what secular historian would say "a place to spread fishnets" without trying to tie in its reference to the bible? This must have been copied and pasted from a creationist's website again). Tyre is one of the largest port cities in Lebanon. It is not a fishing village, it is an importing and exporting hub in the Mediterranean Sea. It has a population of over 114,000. That does does not sound like a small fishing village or "place to spread fishnets".
But that's the bible in a nutshell, isn't it? It is open to interpretation. Hence the multiple sects of Christianity, each with their own version, and each just as convinced as you are about interpreting the bible correctly.
Because any word of "GOD" has to be free of ANY INTERPRETATION other than what is directly written. The very moment you start looking at ANY biblical passage, story, tale, etc...and infer a different meaning than what is being expressly said on the page...and you start thinking there is deeper more implied meaning to the words other than what is written there.
You have just proved GOD to be fallible. Now, unless you believe that GOD is IMPERFECT..you cannot possibly re-interpret, re-analyze, re-think, re-structure, what he's written. Basically, you can't have a better understanding of it than GOD. To re-interpret what you believe GOD has written in the black and white automatically suggest you do not agree with him on the matter.
Now at the moment you disagree your are not disagreeing simply because you feel the need to do so, or because you feel that this holy text is a false representation of the true word of "GOD" either. Because truly if you reject parts of it as the word of "GOD" you merely lack the balls, and strength of mind to reject all of it. You disagree because of what society overall has deemed bad...things like (slavery, rape, murder, war, famine) as bad things. The bible in several passages uncompromisingly advocates for these things to be carried out.
According to the Bible you are supposed to..
Kill Non-Believers of YOUR GOD
Not associate with Non-Believers
Stone your children for cursing
Let a rapist marry their victim
Not show any mercy, nor compassion towards non-believer
Dueteronomy 13:7-11 (Very clear and there is NO room for re-interpreting what one of faith must do to a non-believer)
If you disagree with killing non-believers or any of the above...then quite frankly you are more MORAL than GOD.
Yeah...that's just f*cked up. The bible tells you to kill your best friend or relative if they try and convince you of another religion. And this is evidence of morality from God?!? LOL The rule of law is more moral than God.
Knicks4lyfe, have you killed anybody?
Acts says out of one man, all men came to be. What race Adam and Eve were is not told. But they were human for sure.
Secular history reports that Babylon destroyed Tyre's MAINLAND. Just as the Bible said Nebuchadnezzar would do. He did that. Because Alexander the great used the ruins of the mainland to make a causeway to the city Island the Tyrians fled too for refug e during the Babylonian siege. So again, it is you misinterpreting the whole prophecy. Not the prophecy being incorrect. What God said would happen, happened.
Also, Jehovah said he was going to bring MANY NATIONS against Tyre. Had he stopped at Nebuchadnezzar and Babylon, if they in fact would have destroyed it totally, then logic indicates that MANY NATIONS THEN COULD NOT COME AGAINST IT. So in order for the prophecy to come true, Tyre needed to withstand blows from many nations, until it becomes what it is today, a drying yard for dragnets.
Do you go to creationists websites to support your side of the debate? Or sites that support your view?
Besides, it was Nina Jidejian, in her book Tyre Through the Ages that said "The port has become a haven today for fishing boats and a place for spreading nets," Not a JW. Why don't you read her book? Moving on.
Considering Tyre is not even called Tyre anymore (sur) , considering Tyre was once a world leading sea power, that once was able to battle with a world power 13 years, and is now as Nina Jidejian said, "a haven for fishing boats and a place for spreading nets," I would say the bibles prophetic word has again rang true.
The bible did not contradict itself, Tyre never will ever again be a power, or rebuilt so to speak. It will be what it is now. Because Jehovah said so.
The bible, like any other book in history, has a theme. A single theme. If everyone followed or understood the theme, interpretation would be made easy, because it speaks for itself. But most people don't even know what the theme of the bible is, that is why there is so many views and beliefs on the bible. And even differing Christian sects.
However, on the difference of Christian sects, Jesus said this
Mathew 7:21 “Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.
So Jesus here implies that many will know of him, and even praise him as their savior, but only those doing the will of his father will enter the Kingdom of the heavens. All Christian sects do not live up to doing the will of the Father. This is why they differ in interpretations.
But Jehovah, Jesus and the bible itself explain there is only ONE CRITERIA. DO THE WILL OF JEHOVAH. Only one group of Christians in the world want to do this. Which in turn is why Jehovah favors them as a people.
LMAO. You're either one funny guy or one ignorant mother****er.
1) You just proved my point as instead of contending with my argument, you made it about me. You made it a personal assault on me instead of the argument I presented. Easily something that can be interpreted as a sign of weakness or desperation.
2) Evidence does NOT equal proof. I believe in evidence. I believe you can never truly prove something. They are different. Evidence is something that SUPPORTS your idea or theory. It in NO way is proof or can be taken as proof to the validity of that point. Thus, the entire argument you made in the post is invalid.
Before you try to **** with me over something like that, saying that I contradict myself and that I'm a hypocrite, make sure you know what the **** you're talking about.
But hey, I know you'll try to turn this around on me, because I'm a godless heathen or whatever, but it'll only further reinforce what I've stated here. You have very little evidence, the majority of your arguments are personal attacks or restatements of your religious beliefs that you pass off as fact without evidence.
Say whatever you want, because you cannot win. You have EVERYTHING to lose if god isn't real, I have nothing. I am without fear, death does not bother me. My life is meaningless and pointless. I am not even a speck of dust in the events of the universe. I am free while you are a slave.
Alright that's it. We've tried reason, evidence, logic, all to disprove WHY the Bible is not only intellectually an inferior document written by primitive people's, but also why you DON'T even draw your morals from it. I'll try and indulge you in some biblical morality if you'd be willing to give yes or no responses to the following questions.
Do you feel it is moral to kill a non-believer?
Do you feel it is moral or just for a rapist to marry his/her victim?
Do you feel that exorcism is the right course of action to administer if someone says they wish to commit suicide?
Do you feel it is just to stone a child for cursing their parents?
Do you feel a just loving GOD would allow for incest?
You are being selective here. You are basing the truth of the prophecy on "many nations" and "a place to spread fishnets". But you are ignoring the part where it says Nebuchadnezzar destroys and conquers Tyre:
Your walls will tremble at the noise of the war horses, wagons and chariots when he enters your gates as men enter a city whose walls have been broken through. The hoofs of his horses will trample all your streets; he will kill your people with the sword, and your strong pillars will fall to the ground. They will plunder your wealth and loot your merchandise;
He tried for 13 years but was never able to do so and essentially made a compromise peace agreement. I'm not misinterpreting the bible here nor am I misunderstanding history.
It was often attacked by Egypt, besieged by Shalmaneser V, who was assisted by the Phoenicians of the mainland, for five years, and by Nebuchadnezzar (586–573 BC) for thirteen years, without success, although a compromise peace was made in which Tyre paid tribute to the Babylonians. It later fell under the power of the Persians.
A place never to be rebuilt and a place to spread fishnets. This is just false.
Today it is the fourth largest city in Lebanon  and houses one of the nation's major ports known locally in French as Soûr. Tyre is a popular destination for tourists.
It is quite a bit more than just a place in rubble to spread fishnets. And again, I've stated this before, it is hardly a profound prophecy predicting Tyre will be a place for fishing. It's on the Mediterranean Sea!! Wow! What a prophecy!! LOL.
So let me get this right, you are free because you choose to live a wicked, selfish and meaningless life, based on the matrix and warped reality that you speak of? Meanwhile I am not free because I choose to live a morally clean lifestyle that not only benefits myself, but others as well, for the sake of drawing close to the God who proves who he is to all who follow him?? So If I was like you, I'd be better off? You wanna go that far?
If I continue to live my life, and all I believed was proven false, I'd be fine with being a person that was an example to my kids as a great father, example to my wife as a great husband, and an example to society as an upstanding moral individual. If you call that meaningless, with all that is wrong with people in the world , more power to you :thumbsup:
And the stories are not impossible because they can happen. You believe that africanus is our ancestor, and not all scientists agree with you. But you still believe it. Cuz you choose too. Period. Just as I choose to believe the bible.
I will try and say it again for emphasis. If Nebuchadnezzar had in fact destroyed Tyre totally , that means Mainland and island city, meaning there was two parts of it, then no other nation could have pummeled it as the prophecy states would happen. EFFECTIVELY KILLING THE PROPHECY.
By the way, you are ignoring the intricate details of the prophecy being fulfilled totally to try and convince yourself you have it right. Like Alex the great scraping up the dust of the mainland to get to the island city (as spoken of in ezekiel 26:4) . Like the whole army of the Tyrians being defeated at sea, fulfilling the words at zechariah 9:4 which plainly states
Look! Jehovah himself will dispossess her, and into the sea he will certainly strike down her military force; and in the fire she herself will be devoured.
That is exactly what happened! Alexanders army defeated the whole tyrian army at sea, and then his men set the island on fire for those inhabitants who resisted.
What is your take for these parts? It was written after?
Many nations will pummel it. Check. ezk 26:3-5
Nebuchadnezzar would destroy the mainland. Check. ezk 26:7
The scraps from the dust of the destroyed mainland used. Check ezk 26:4
Military force defeated at sea, island city torched by fire. Check zech 9:4
Becoming a dry yard for dragnets. Check
The bible seems to have accurately foretold all of these things, and you scoff?
Notice the bible said it would never be rebuilt. It did not say never inhab ited, or used. It said rebuilt. It's kinda like our Knicks. When the Knicks become a REAL team, a team we ca n root for like say, the 99 team vs the spurs, we'll say, they have been REBUILT. In the meantime, the Garden is still here, the Knicks are still a team in the NBA, even a team that people root for. Just n ot a good team, or a team with prestige as it has been a time or two in the past.
That is the case of Tyre. It was once a world leading, not city leading.. WORLD LEADING SEA POWER. They did more than just fish, they traded Gold and Ophir and many other things in their prime as a people. They had a voice in world affairs. They went from that, to being a sea port.
That is like the Knicks going from 60-22 and a finals appearance to the first pick in the draft.
If Tyre ever becomes a leading sea power in the world, and trades with world powers on a large scale, and can fend of world powers, then one can say it has been rebuilt. Til then, it's just like the state of the Knicks.. they're around, but nobody notices.
Plus, how can you draw that my life is "wicked and selfish."
If you really look at it, selfishness is the nature of man. You have never done a thing in your entire life that wasn't selfish. Not a single thing.
Donated money? Did it to make yourself feel good and relieve yourself of guilt. Not your fault others suffer.
There aren't selfless actions, only selfish actions. Someone who does something with nothing to gain is non-existent. It denies human logic to do something that gives you nothing back.
But hey, think I'm crazy or whatever, but it just shows you're in denial. I mean, who would really like to believe this? It doesn't give you a whole lot.
And I interpret it differently when it comes to Nebuchadnezzar. I read it as him destroying and conquering Tyre, you do not. That doesn't mean I'm disregarding the "many nations" part, I just read it as Nebuchadnezzar doing all of those things because it only refers to him after it mentions that it will be destroyed. That many nations will come but Nebuchadnezzar will be the one to conquer and destroy Tyre.