A realistic trade for our Knicks. Really Donnie should consider this one!

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Nov 18, 2008, 07:32
New New York

A realistic trade for our Knicks. Really Donnie should consider this one!

I tried to enter this trade into our site's trade contest but kept getting kicked out! Anyways here it is please take for consideration!

New York Knicks

<TABLE class=tablehead style="CLEAR: both" cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=3><TBODY><TR class=colhead><TH colSpan=2>Incoming Players</TH></TR><TR class=oddrow><TD width=35>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshot...ers/35/125.jpg </TD><TD vAlign=top>Marcus Camby
Salary: $10,000,000 Years Remaining: 2
PTS: 7.7 REB: 9.6 AST: 1.0 PER: 18.87
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Outgoing Players: Malik Rose, David Lee
http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogo.../trans/lac.gif Los Angeles Clippers

<TABLE class=tablehead style="CLEAR: both" cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=3><TBODY><TR class=colhead><TH colSpan=2>Incoming Players</TH></TR><TR class=oddrow><TD width=35>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshot...ers/35/739.jpg </TD><TD vAlign=top>Malik Rose
Salary: $7,647,500 Years Remaining: 1
PTS: 1.7 REB: 2.0 AST: 0.4 PER: -4.11
</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow><TD width=35>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshot...rs/35/2772.jpg </TD><TD vAlign=top>David Lee
Salary: $1,788,033 Years Remaining: 1
PTS: 11.4 REB: 6.6 AST: 1.9 PER: 13.70
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Outgoing Players: Marcus Camby

So we trade a current fan favorite for a former fan favorite. This deal brings the compliment to Zach The Knicks need. Marcus will get us around three blocks a game thus giving us the interior defensive presence we need so bad. Offensively this is a lateral move as well, Lee and Camby are about as good at scoring the ball. Camby's contract is smaller than what The Knicks would've given David Lee as an extension, plus expires at the critical year. Likely The Knicks could resign Camby at The MLE value of 5 million per when his current contract expires.

How this benefits the Clippers is that they get a nice compliment to Kaman in the post. David as a starter will get 10 rebs a game so he and Kaman should rebound exactly the same as Camby. Now where they lose in shotblocking, they gain in youth! Kaman and Lee will be the froncourt of the future where as Camby-Kaman probably ends when Camby's contract expires. David gets to stay in a Big Markert playing in LA. Malik ofcourse is just a throw in to this trade to make the numbers work.

Please let me know your thoughts!
Nov 18, 2008, 09:08
Pedro De Pacas

Doesn't make any sense to me....we would still be stucked with all of our bad contracts and give away 2 valuable assets.
Nov 18, 2008, 09:40
knicklover

It will make us better this year and right now, but we will still suck and the long term plans will be harder to implement. If we are going to trade Lee, we want to make sure we get rid of a bad contract with him. The idea is NOT to win more games this year. The idea is to improve the team now (or at least go sideways) AND MORE IMPORTANTLY improve it's long term position to be good enough to compete for it ALL in a few years.
Nov 18, 2008, 09:40
portega1968

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedro De Pacas

Doesn't make any sense to me....we would still be stucked with all of our bad contracts and give away 2 valuable assets.

cosign

that trade only thinks about what we can do this year.

We should only include Lee in a deal that helps us get rid of Zach or Curry.

If we want help this year, I think Walsh should call Mark Cuban and see if he's interested in swapping Kidd for Stephon, who have tradeable one year deals. But with all the talk of buying out STeph, it's obvious everyone is gonna play the waiting game on that one.

Bottom line, no to any deal involving Lee that doesn't help us get rid of those long-term deals that are eating up our cap for 2010.
Nov 18, 2008, 10:53
richtree

tambien' Portega ...

You don't get Lee unless you take something else....

scratchada my back ., ida scratchada your back
Nov 18, 2008, 11:02
New New York

Don't think do Black and White

First off we have to stop being so obsessed with dumping Curry,Randolph or Jerome James' contracts! I know we need to move these contracts, but it probably not going to realistically happen this year especially with Eddy hurt! Not to mention trading David Lee and Zach Randolph leaves our front court completley bare. Zach is a player I would consider keeping if there is a player playing aside him that can compliment him, this trade does that.

Now one of you mentioned that we would be giving up two assets in this trade, and you're right! See generally that is how trades are done, you give up something of value in return for something of value. Giving up David Lee and Malik's contract to get us a rebounding shot blocker who fits into Dantoni's system is completley fair for The Knicks and Clippers. I know a lot of us have gotten used to Isiah's trades where we give up little to nothing for a player with more talent (and a bigger contract), but in order to rebuild our team we need to make some sacrifices.
Nov 18, 2008, 11:10
metrocard

Clippers would laugh at this.
But I would love Camby here.

The only way I see Clippers doing this is if they're rebuilding.
I can't see them rebuilding with Davis, Kaman, Camby, and Mobley. They could be a competitive team if Thorton and Gordon develop into consistent players
Nov 18, 2008, 11:58
knicklover

Quote:

Originally Posted by New New York

I know a lot of us have gotten used to Isiah's trades where we give up little to nothing for a player with more talent (and a bigger contract), but in order to rebuild our team we need to make some sacrifices.

In order to rebuild our team we need to think almost 100% about how much a player gets paid versus how much he is actually worth to the team as a player. That means getting rid of all overpaid players (almost no matter how good they are) and trying to accumulate young players and draft picks that have potential.

Once the team has moved itself into a position of having a good mix of young diversified talent of good value relative to their salary structure, then the objective can be to fill out specific needs with trades, draft picks, free agents etc... because you have the salary cap room to do so.

It is incredibly difficult to try to simply shuffle players around year to year improving inch by inch to get to the promised land and also stay under the cap so you can re-sign or add some of the pieces you need to win it all etc...

Anyone that hasn't learned from the Isiah lesson is a crazy man!

Right now we have a handful of potential long term pieces to the puzzle at good salaries (Chandler, Robinson, Lee, and Gallinari). Everyone else is either very overpaid, old, flawed in some way, or some combination of the above. That doesn't mean one or more of the rest can't be part of an ultimate championship team as a key role player or even starter, but they should not be CORE in our thinking. That means we should be looking to move any and all of the others for more of those long term young key type players and more picks.

Of course, that doesn't mean you just give them away. You just try to get more value back than you give IN TERMS OF PLAYER VERSUS SALARY AND NOT JUST IN TERMS OF PLAYER!!!!!!!

It's not about stockpiling good players. It's about stockpiling good players that don't make too much money so you can get as many of them on the team as possible and fill out ALL YOUR NEEDS!

It's a LONG TERM PROCESS!!!!
Nov 18, 2008, 12:25
TR1LL10N

Quote:

Originally Posted by New New York

I tried to enter this trade into our site's trade contest but kept getting kicked out! Anyways here it is please take for consideration!

New York Knicks

<table class="tablehead" style="clear: both;" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="colhead"><th colspan="2">Incoming Players</th></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td width="35">http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshot...ers/35/125.jpg </td><td valign="top">Marcus Camby
Salary: $10,000,000 Years Remaining: 2
PTS: 7.7 REB: 9.6 AST: 1.0 PER: 18.87
</td></tr></tbody></table>
Outgoing Players: Malik Rose, David Lee
http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogo.../trans/lac.gif Los Angeles Clippers

<table class="tablehead" style="clear: both;" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="colhead"><th colspan="2">Incoming Players</th></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td width="35">http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshot...ers/35/739.jpg </td><td valign="top">Malik Rose
Salary: $7,647,500 Years Remaining: 1
PTS: 1.7 REB: 2.0 AST: 0.4 PER: -4.11
</td></tr><tr class="oddrow"><td width="35">http://assets.espn.go.com/i/headshot...rs/35/2772.jpg </td><td valign="top">David Lee
Salary: $1,788,033 Years Remaining: 1
PTS: 11.4 REB: 6.6 AST: 1.9 PER: 13.70
</td></tr></tbody></table>
Outgoing Players: Marcus Camby

So we trade a current fan favorite for a former fan favorite. This deal brings the compliment to Zach The Knicks need. Marcus will get us around three blocks a game thus giving us the interior defensive presence we need so bad. Offensively this is a lateral move as well, Lee and Camby are about as good at scoring the ball. Camby's contract is smaller than what The Knicks would've given David Lee as an extension, plus expires at the critical year. Likely The Knicks could resign Camby at The MLE value of 5 million per when his current contract expires.

How this benefits the Clippers is that they get a nice compliment to Kaman in the post. David as a starter will get 10 rebs a game so he and Kaman should rebound exactly the same as Camby. Now where they lose in shotblocking, they gain in youth! Kaman and Lee will be the froncourt of the future where as Camby-Kaman probably ends when Camby's contract expires. David gets to stay in a Big Markert playing in LA. Malik ofcourse is just a throw in to this trade to make the numbers work.

Please let me know your thoughts!

If we were close to competing for a title I might think about this. Since we are far from that and looking towards the future I think trading for Camby is not a good idea. He is over 30 and not getting any younger. If we want a shotblocker who can run the floor, has an upside and is young, Sean Williams fits the bill.

We need a long term strategy, something Isiah did not have a clue about. Thankfully Walsh has a vision and I seriously doubt Camby fits in to our future.
Nov 19, 2008, 00:19
D-Lee42fan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pedro De Pacas

Doesn't make any sense to me....we would still be stucked with all of our bad contracts and give away 2 valuable assets.

i wouldnt call Rose a "valuable asset"-haha. but dont trade my boy LEE away for Camby, since he left Denver he's been a disappointment to LAC. Do us a favor dont bring em back to NY. We are finally starting to recover from the past years mistakes.
Nov 19, 2008, 07:23
New New York

Quote:

Originally Posted by TR1LL10N

If we were close to competing for a title I might think about this. Since we are far from that and looking towards the future I think trading for Camby is not a good idea. He is over 30 and not getting any younger. If we want a shotblocker who can run the floor, has an upside and is young, Sean Williams fits the bill.

We need a long term strategy, something Isiah did not have a clue about. Thankfully Walsh has a vision and I seriously doubt Camby fits in to our future.

Hear me out....I don't want to say that youth is overatted....but I think in our case we don't need it. If we continue to get younger then players like Crawford,Nate,Lee etc. become our vets and the problem with that is that they have been on losing teams their whole careers so who's teaching the youth on the team how to win?. Look I like Malik Rose I'm certain he gives great locker room speeches, but at some point we need veteran players making an impact on the floor. Plus Marcus Camby isnt Mutumbo, he is the same age as Duncan,AI,Baron Davis,Ray Allen etc. and we wouldnt call any of those players washed up. Marcus has been to The Finals he knows what is like to be successful in NY. I'm not saying he is the team's savior, I think that it would still be a stretch to make the playoffs even with him, but, he does help adress three major issues; interior defense,veteren leadership, and how to resign David Lee while montoiring the cap. Again we will have to give David around 9 million per which is less than what Marcus makes in his two final years on his contract. This deal doesnt affect our ability to get under the cap while making us a better team which is a win win for me! If we want to attract these free agents in 2010 then we need to show we can be a winning team, not just a young team with promise like Isiah had put together.
Nov 19, 2008, 08:05
TR1LL10N

Quote:

Originally Posted by New New York

Hear me out....I don't want to say that youth is overatted....but I think in our case we don't need it. If we continue to get younger then players like Crawford,Nate,Lee etc. become our vets and the problem with that is that they have been on losing teams their whole careers so who's teaching the youth on the team how to win?. Look I like Malik Rose I'm certain he gives great locker room speeches, but at some point we need veteran players making an impact on the floor. Plus Marcus Camby isnt Mutumbo, he is the same age as Duncan,AI,Baron Davis,Ray Allen etc. and we wouldnt call any of those players washed up. Marcus has been to The Finals he knows what is like to be successful in NY. I'm not saying he is the team's savior, I think that it would still be a stretch to make the playoffs even with him, but, he does help adress three major issues; interior defense,veteren leadership, and how to resign David Lee while montoiring the cap. Again we will have to give David around 9 million per which is less than what Marcus makes in his two final years on his contract. This deal doesnt affect our ability to get under the cap while making us a better team which is a win win for me! If we want to attract these free agents in 2010 then we need to show we can be a winning team, not just a young team with promise like Isiah had put together.

I am all for bringing in an veteran who will be an impact player on the floor but Camby is not that player. I like Camby and agree he is a hardworker and knows how to win but Camby would do little to bring us a title. I think we need to keep our eye on the ball, stay a lotto team and develop our youth. I only want to make the playoffs if it's a step in the right direction long term or we can make a serious run at a ring. There isn't any point in getting knocked out in the first round if we can't build on that experiance. Believe me, if we can get a player like Lebron we do not need to worry about Nate being a veteran leader. I think Walsh can and will deliver this caliber of player in the next 2-3 years. If we trust in Walsh to do that we should be developing out youth and putting solid role players together so our team is one superstar away from greatness.

P.S. If we can get Camby without losing Lee I am all for it. I think Lee packaged with Marbury can get us a better player than Camby.