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Thread: I don't want CP3 or Howard during 2012's offseason...

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    Default I don't want CP3 or Howard during 2012's offseason...

    We now have two top 5 offensive scorers & two top 10 overall players in Amare & Carmelo. Thats more than enough to build a strong team around. We're on the verge of being able to compete for a championship for the next 5-7 years.

    Look at Miami. They have 2 great players in LeBron & Wade with a really good player in Bosh. Other than that, A bunch of 3rd string players. If the cap really goes down to around 42 million, that franchise could be in deep cap hell with just about no ability to improve.

    I enjoy the thought of Paul, Melo & Amare or Melo, Amare & Howard, but with a new CBA, I'd rather see NY go another route. Even if we land Paul, we'll still need a productive C, 2G & solid depth coming of bench because Fields will be looking for a contract extension. It could become next to impossible to improve our team.

    I'd rather NY go after either Jordan or Marc Gasol as our future Center, while keeping Fields along with the ability to still upgrade the roster. Gasol is a restricted FA though.

    Thoughts?

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    I hear where you are coming from, but the reason why we lost yesterday is because we couldn't stop Howard or Nelson. Granted Neslon had an anomaly of a game but once we shut down one, the other took over.

    If we had either a stud C, or a stud PG, we would have won that game. To be honest, all we need is one more stud, preferably a PG, and we will be in that elite tier 1 status.

    If we get Paul, you can't really compare us too the Heat's big three because they pretty much have the same player in Wade/Lebron with a weak front court. Bosh is more of a shooter than a banger, making him more of a Lebron type player that Stoudemire.

    With Paul and a big average C, we cover most of the court with three different but complimentary players (i.e. Celtics). If we can just get Fields to be more consistent shooter and force a defender to guard him tighter, we will be younger and more dynamic than Boston. I'd put us up against anyone.

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    Fields becomes a free agent during 2012 I believe. I could be wrong though.

    Regardless, the cap is currenty set @ 58 million. It's expected to drop down to 42 after a new CBA takes place during the offseason.

    Trust me, I'd love to see the Knicks with 3 of the top 10 superstars just as much as the next man, but not if it means we'll be in cap hell (yet again), with just about no ability to sign our own draft picks, players or even add solid depth coming off the bench I'd have to say no.

    You think Miami has problems right now @ C & PG? The cap is currently set @ 58...just wait for it to drop down to 42. They'll be in cap hell & won't be able to afford LeBron, Wade & Bosh. They should have kept Beasley & walked on Bosh. They would be better off in terms of building a dynasty with LeBron & Wade. That potential dynasty will never happen all because of a new CBA.

    If the new CBA doesn't drop the cap below 52 million, I'm all for either Paul or Howard. I'd love it.

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    I don't think we have any realistic shot of landing Dwight Howard, but I think it would be nuts to pass up on the most dominant C in the game just to hold onto Landry Fields & add a few more role players, but that's just me. Add Dwight Howard to Melo & Stat & that's multiple championships guaranteed.

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    Originally Posted by STAT1
    I don't think we have any realistic shot of landing Dwight Howard, but I think it would be nuts to pass up on the most dominant C in the game just to hold onto Landry Fields & add a few more role players, but that's just me. Add Dwight Howard to Melo & Stat & that's multiple championships guaranteed.
    I could not agree more with your post!!! Acquiring Howard would truly give this team multiple championships that Knick fans have been waiting for.

    But wishing for Howard and being able to get him, well lets just say that would be the ultimate dream.

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    Originally Posted by KnicksFanFromQueens1985
    Fields becomes a free agent during 2012 I believe. I could be wrong though.

    Regardless, the cap is currenty set @ 58 million. It's expected to drop down to 42 after a new CBA takes place during the offseason.

    Trust me, I'd love to see the Knicks with 3 of the top 10 superstars just as much as the next man, but not if it means we'll be in cap hell (yet again), with just about no ability to sign our own draft picks, players or even add solid depth coming off the bench I'd have to say no.

    You think Miami has problems right now @ C & PG? The cap is currently set @ 58...just wait for it to drop down to 42. They'll be in cap hell & won't be able to afford LeBron, Wade & Bosh. They should have kept Beasley & walked on Bosh. They would be better off in terms of building a dynasty with LeBron & Wade. That potential dynasty will never happen all because of a new CBA.

    If the new CBA doesn't drop the cap below 52 million, I'm all for either Paul or Howard. I'd love it.
    The Caps not going to drop down to 42 million...I don't know where you're getting your information from but I would double check it. We are in the middle of the road Cap wise compared to the rest of the NBA and David Stern loves these super teams... No way in hell does the league drop the cap more than a million or two. If anything I bet it ends up equaling out to be about the same as it is this year but they might end up making it a hard cap.
    Also,
    I do agree we don't need a third star but a bunch of NICE role players (14-18 PPG C, SG, PG) to compliment our all-stars. Our stars can make middle of the road guys play like all-stars due to attracting all the attention away from them. As everyone has seen so far, Miami's blue-print was kind of skewed. The trick is to get two bonafied all-stars and some complimentary players and let the role players sign for the vets minimum to get a ring. Miami just got one too many. This is also the reason that the Caps not going to drop significantly, the NBA makes all it's money off of the big markets being good (Lakers, Miami, Chicago, ect.) and they're not going to penalize them for making quality teams. IMO If anything the NBA will get rid of about 4 teams and keep the cap the same.
    Last edited by KingofNy; Mar 02, 2011 at 21:08.

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    i actually agree with this we dont NEED a 3rd super elite player we have 2 of em already now we should focus on building a team around them and bulliups can still give us a strong 3 years, in that time we should be grooming a PG ( through draft ). add a C and a solid bench player and we can take the chip NEXT YEAR. if we get the 3rd superstar great if not so be it were in incredible shape for the next 6-7 years

    this thread is getting 5 stars from me

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    I don't understand why everyone is obsessed with getting a 3rd superstar. I suppose its because Boston had a big 3, and now miami has a big 3, but the lakers who have been more successful than bos and mia don't have a big 3, they have a big 2 with Kobe and Gasol surrounded by complimentary players.

    Amare Melo and CP3 surrounded by nothing <<< Amare and Melo and the rest of the roster filled with as many role players (including some size) as the cap will allow.

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    Originally Posted by Stat4mvp
    I don't understand why everyone is obsessed with getting a 3rd superstar. I suppose its because Boston had a big 3, and now miami has a big 3, but the lakers who have been more successful than bos and mia don't have a big 3, they have a big 2 with Kobe and Gasol surrounded by complimentary players.

    Amare Melo and CP3 surrounded by nothing <<< Amare and Melo and the rest of the roster filled with as many role players (including some size) as the cap will allow.

    Exactly, if we can find a way to get a young up and coming serviceable PG that can grow into the role as well as a defensive minded type C (Jordan?) I would rather have that team than a team with CP3. I personally prefer DWill anyways and after Paul's showing tonight and the ESPN article about his game since injury, this just proved it for me.

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    @ KingofNy: I've read many reports of the cap getting reduced to 42-45, but if your correct with the cap only getting reduced 1 or 2 million (I'd like to see some links), but if thats truly the case, of course I'd love either CP3 or Howard. If it only drops 1 or 2 million we could also sign Fields to about 4-5 per. He's an excellent off the ball player.

    My choice would be Dwight for 5 reasons. He doesn't have a history of injuris, he's the most dominating big man in the NBA, youngest player in NBA history to record 7,000 rebounds, would turn NY into a top 5 defensive unit (he's a freak on D' due to his size, ability to block shots, clog the middle of the paint & dominate the boards) & NY would also host the NBA's best front line with Dwight & Stoudemire. Bynum & Gasol who?

    I believe Douglas will develope over the next 2 years learning behind Billups on offense & Carter this year on defense. Douglas, Fields, Melo, Amare, Howard. Sign me up.

    I just can't see the cap dropping by less than 10 million per.

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    @ Stat4MVP, I agree with you 100%. I guess Boston & now Miami has become the new trend for fans around the NBA. I wouldn't mind a CP3, Howard or Willians but I'm more than just willing to move on without none of the above.

    I grew up loving the Knicks since the early 90's. If we had one more superstar other than just Ewing, we could have gotten past the Bulls & who knows how many championships NY could have won. Starks & Oakley were nice, but we were only 1 star away from reaching greatness. You don't need 3 superstars. Not when you have two of the top 10 in Melo & Amare.

    Joran & Pippen, Hakeem & Drexler, Reggie & Smitz, Mourning & Hardaway, Shaq & Penny, Robinson & Avery, Robinson & Duncan, Shaq & Kobe, Kobe & Gasol, Wade & Shaq etc, etc... Some of those side kicks weren't even superstars, but they all got the job done, competed for championships & most either made the finals or won a ring.

    Of course I wouldn't mind Howard but I'm willing to see my team build around Amare & now Carmelo.

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    You can't judge Paul by one game today. No doubt he has had an off year but everyone knows he isnt happy in NO and wanted to leave before the year. He looked depressed today.

    Regardless, even on his tough stretch the past few games, he leads the league in steals and is 4th in assists. Paul is the type of player that NEEDs a big man like Stoudemire to play off of. Him dishing the ball to Melo and STAT on the Pick and Roll would make for an almost unguardable team.

    Teams would have to double STAT or Melo leaving Paul constantly open from downtown. Again, I understand why people think that the big 3 could be a bad idea with the cap, but these three players will work much better together than Miami, making it worth it.

    Even with the CBA most likely dropping the cap, the Knicks still have close to the most room under to afford a near max player. I wouldnt be surprised to see players renegotiate contracts or take much less money to sign. They understand that bringing a title to NY can bring them much more $$ than just their salary.

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    All of this sounds eerily familiar to the same reasoning that people used to argue against trading for Melo this year. The whole "1 Superstar + Role player depth >>>> 2 Superstars + scrubs" argument is now becoming the "2 Superstars + Role player depth >>>> 3 Superstars + scrubs " debate. IMO there isn't a GM in the NBA that would pass up on the opportunity to get Dwight Howard regardless of how many Landry Fields they'd have to trade away. Not that this is even worth much of a debate, we're probably not in any position to acquire the guy next year anyway.

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    It's been NY's goal (fans included) to land two stars for years now. We all wanted James, but walking away with both Melo & Amare has became a dream come true for the fans who have continued to dream over the past 10+ years.

    You cant compare the Melo & Amare situation, to the whole adding a 3rd star debate. Every Knick fan knew we had more than enough cap space to add two max contracts. Thats been our plan for 3-5 years now...

    Being realistic, we all knew, or know there was, or will be no chance to add another star. It's foolish to compare the two situations because they have no bearing on one another.

    It's also foolish to throw Fields under the bus for another star. He's been our best rook since god knows when. Basketball has always been a team game, & will always be more than just offensive production. Fields has tough D, he's able to make an impact without the ball, he's an excellent off the ball player, & he's one of the best rebounders as a guard. The kid can become a championship piece, he's a winner

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    I'll also definitely take a more complete team. Howard would probably be the best one to add on to Melo and A'mare if we did go the three max players route. We'd have a beast on defense, who wouldn't even need to score much to scare the opposing opponents. Howard really could average 8-10 points on our team and that would be major. Also, he stays healthy.

    Still though, I rather not be locked in the cap because of three contracts, and the feeling of a complete team is better for me.

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