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Thread: Z-Bo and Jamal

  1. #31
    Veteran nyk_nyk's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TR1LL10N
    So would you rather have Zbo and Crawford or Amare and MELO?
    I think Dzwonsson's point is that we mostly cater to the players MDA feels comfortable with (mainly offense) instead of acquiring or keeping players that balance out the teams offense/defense.

    IMO that's the point he's trying to make but he can correct me if I'm wrong.

  2. #32
    Nein, Mann! Weissenberg's Avatar
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    I just did want to mention under our current coaching stuff it is almost impossible to discover player's talent and ability to improve. MDA is known of willingness to have a player, that we could call a 'final product'. And therefore I was not surprised it seems some of our former players improved well enough to become valuable parts of the organizations they have been traded to. Their new coaches saw their potential and gave them a chance and that's what almost never happens under Mike, who prefers to bench a player he doesn't feel comfortable with.

  3. #33
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    Originally Posted by Sprewell-Houston
    Why did both fail in New York?

    Z-Bo just lifted Memphis over the Spurs in a fantastic playoff series. He's putting up 20-10 for years, a true double double machine, good jump shot, good at posting up and a determined competitor.
    Zach Randolph was always an elite power forward. He doesn't play defense, but he does everything else.

    People just kept criticizing him, because they wanted him to be God.

    Randolph can't lead a team by himself. He needs help. In Memphis, he has the help needed to win games(Gasol, Conley, Allen, Battier, Gay-when healthy). That's what he needed in New York, but all he had was Quentin Richardson, Eddy Curry, and Mardy Collins.

    I was supportive of Randolph the entire time he was on the Knicks, and people kept giving me a hard time about it.

    I guess now you guys see what me, Kiyaman, and Kingstarbury saw in Zach Randolph.

    I was not a big fan of Jamal Crawford, and I'm still not. But I always mentioned how he was a good shooter and deserved to stay on the team.
    Like Randolph, he doesn't play defense, but he can score in bunches.

    It's the same thing with Stephon Marbury. People wanted him to be God.
    Seriously, not even Michael Jordan himself could have been successful with a frontcourt of Quentin Richardson, Channing Frye, and Eddy Curry. That had nothing to do with Marbury.

    I was never a fan of trying to buy a championship. I wanted the Knicks to build up their team little by little.

    But I still like Stoudemire, Anthony, and Billups. I just want Antoni off the team.

  4. #34
    Veteran Sprewell-Houston's Avatar
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    Good post abcd.

    Agree with you on everything, except Billups. I must admit he didn't play much, but I'm not convinced he's what we need at this stage of his career. He's pretty much a volume shooter these days and not as good of a playmaker as I thought.

    I hope you guys are right (those who support him) and he'll have a good overall season in 2011-2012!

    I'd rather see him putting up 16 ppg and 8 apg than 20 ppg and 5 apg on erratic shooting.

  5. #35
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Sprewell-Houston
    Good post abcd.

    Agree with you on everything, except Billups. I must admit he didn't play much, but I'm not convinced he's what we need at this stage of his career. He's pretty much a volume shooter these days and not as good of a playmaker as I thought.

    I hope you guys are right (those who support him) and he'll have a good overall season in 2011-2012!

    I'd rather see him putting up 16 ppg and 8 apg than 20 ppg and 5 apg on erratic shooting.
    The tricky thing with Billups is - at the very least he is a name. We can move him as a trade chip for something better (his 14.2 mil expiring is a pretty huge trade chip)...if he can stay on the floor, we could flip him around for something nice, especially if he gets inflated stats playing with Amare and Carmelo.

    Also: I am very surprised (even more than I was before) at how many people supported Z-Bo...I thought I was in the minority, but I guess it was a silent majority that supported the guy.

  6. #36
    Nein, Mann! Weissenberg's Avatar
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    Actually a lot of Knicks fans (me included) were a bit more silent those dark days... I didn't even know about place like this where I could have a talk on our team with other fans. And maybe that's why you didn't realize some people supported ZR as well...

    edit: now I'm quite sure Berman reads this forum, we started discussing our trade possibilities in the upcoming 2011/12 season, Berman writes about that the next day, now we're talking about 'what could happen if we kept Randolph and Crawford' and Berman posted an article concerning the same issues on his Knicks blog just two hours ago.
    Last edited by Weissenberg; May 02, 2011 at 17:08.

  7. #37
    SWAGABURY KingStarbury3's Avatar
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    Green rep for ABCD's post

    That was about as on point as it gets

    And i just wanted to add

    who saw Randolph son the sh*t outta kendikk Jerkins?

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    Kevin Durant declared Zach Randolph the best forward in the league.

    "You canít stop him," Durant said. "Heís an animal . . . Heís the best power forward in the league."

    Kendrick Perkins didnít rubber stamp that endorsement. Perkins declined to name his top power forward, but itís not Randolph.

    ďIf he says so,Ē Perkins said about Durantís opinion. ďI donít agree . . . Iím not going to give my opposing opponent the credit that I got to go against. So if Kevin says (Randolph is) the best power forward, then thatís Kevinís opinion.íí

    After being told in a news conference about Durantís compliment, Randolph said, ďOh, yeah, I got to agree with that. Thanks, KD. I appreciate it.Ē Randolph also said that, overall, ďI donít get lot of respect that I deserve.íí

    Certainly not from Perkins. Informed what the Boston big man had said, the 6-9, 255-pound Randolph told FOXSports.com:

    ďPerkís good, but all Perk can do is foul me. Thatís the only thing he can do. The best thing about his defense on me is to foul me . . . He canít (stop Randolph). Heís too slow. Heís a big body. He can foul.

    ďI donít think nobody in the league can stop me. Not only Perk. I tell Perk to his face. I already told him before.íí


    I believe Zach too he'd snuff the sh*t outta perkins if he stepped to him

  8. #38
    Super Moderator RunningJumper's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KingStarbury3
    Green rep for ABCD's post

    That was about as on point as it gets

    And i just wanted to add

    who saw Randolph son the sh*t outta kendikk Jerkins?

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]





    I believe Zach too he'd snuff the sh*t outta perkins if he stepped to him


    Z-Bo and Crawford continuing where they left off in the second round.

  9. #39
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    They played pretty well with us. In fact, I think we could have gone far with them. When they started clicking together they were traded and the excuse giving was their high contracts. I know it had alot to do with coaches inability to coach players that didn't really fit his system, but that to me was the real problem. You have to be able to adapt and use who you have to their best potential. Coach is not good at this. These 2 guys went to 2 separate teams and excell within those respected systems in no time. Gelling is not just a player thing...you also have to be feeling your coach.

  10. #40
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    Originally Posted by Real NY Baller
    They played pretty well with us. In fact, I think we could have gone far with them. When they started clicking together they were traded and the excuse giving was their high contracts. I know it had alot to do with coaches inability to coach players that didn't really fit his system, but that to me was the real problem. You have to be able to adapt and use who you have to their best potential. Coach is not good at this. These 2 guys went to 2 separate teams and excell within those respected systems in no time. Gelling is not just a player thing...you also have to be feeling your coach.
    You're right.

    Trading Jamal and Zach Randolph had nothing to do with going after any of the guys in the free agent class of 2010 as well as getting out from under salary cap hell and had everything to do with the coach.

    ****ing idiot.

  11. #41
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    You're right.

    Trading Jamal and Zach Randolph had nothing to do with going after any of the guys in the free agent class of 2010 as well as getting out from under salary cap hell and had everything to do with the coach.

    ****ing idiot.
    huh?lol

    you curse too much over the net about subjective material... which leads me to believe that you are a ****ing coward. I haven't met a soul yet (in person) that talks like you and a few others on here. It's actually comical to say the least.

    Anyways, I know I'm right. What was told to followers by the brass dosen't get to me. If there was another coach to get this team clicking the money would have been a non issue. They never really had a chance once they started to get it going...not with the revolving door spinning every 2 weeks or so.

    I said my piece on it, if you don't like...fine with me. You can continue to waste your time bickering about my post. It'll only show what type of dude you are to take a BBall comment in a forum so serious. priceless.

  12. #42
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Real NY Baller

    you curse too much over the net about subjective material... which leads me to believe that you are a ****ing coward.
    ::

    The revolving door was instituted in order to get this team a fresh new start and go after the free agents of 2010. This is coming from someone who supported Zach Randolph while he was here.

    If you don't realize what was happening...I don't know what to tell you. Wouldn't have mattered who the coach was, Walsh had us early on setting our sights on the 2010 plan.

    You say what the brass says doesn't get to you, as if you operate on some higher plain - -when you can't even get your grammar right half the time. Give it up man, us trading these two had everything to do with 2010 and nothing to do with the coach. You just are so obsessed with MDA you will take any chance to attack him.

  13. #43
    Quiet Storm New New York's Avatar
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    Z-Bo and Jamal are thriving because how they are being used now is conducive to their games!

    Isiah wanted to pair Zach Randolph and Curry on the frontline together which the only benefit to that was Randolph being able to make up for Curry's lack of rebounding, but the two of them could not co-exist....and then the argument is to pair him up w/ Lee of the Front Court, but opposing teams would have an absoulut field day on the offensive end (as they wouldve w/ Curry).


    Marbuary and Crawford in the backcourt was a perfect anology to Zbo and Curry in the frontcourt, two talented players (and Curry was for one season just that) who don't compliment each other.

    Plus Crawford needs consistent scorers around him to thrive, he is too streaky to rely on as much as we did.


    Now lets talk money!!!!

    Simply put Zach Randolph is not worthy of his salary. So if he was still a Knick he would be eating payroll with minimal success to our roster.

    Boozer
    Noah
    Nene
    Al Jefferson
    LarMarcus Aldridge

    All of these players are currently making less money than Zach and each of them are making less money at the end of their deals than Zach (so you don't think I'm comparing his final year to someone's first). I left off Bosh simply because he likely wouldve made more if he didnt join the Heat.


    Insert any of these players into Memphis' lineup and to me you have just as much success.

  14. #44
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    The reason why Z-bo and Jamal didn't work in NY is Starbury bottomline. You say we had to get rid of Z-bo because of cap-hell? Well was Steph making 20 or 21 million that year??? And Steph was supposed to be savior and team leader and turned out to be a complete and total idiot. And I remember the Starbury Wars, the "Z-bo black hole" threads, and the "Jamal is a Chucker" threads. But Jamal is leading the Hawks in scoring off the bench and Z-bo is carrying Memphis. Shows what the Knicks and Knicks fans knew about basketball back then: NOTHIN!!!!

  15. #45
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    ::

    The revolving door was instituted in order to get this team a fresh new start and go after the free agents of 2010. This is coming from someone who supported Zach Randolph while he was here.

    If you don't realize what was happening...I don't know what to tell you. Wouldn't have mattered who the coach was, Walsh had us early on setting our sights on the 2010 plan.

    You say what the brass says doesn't get to you, as if you operate on some higher plain - -when you can't even get your grammar right half the time. Give it up man, us trading these two had everything to do with 2010 and nothing to do with the coach. You just are so obsessed with MDA you will take any chance to attack him.
    The team was giving a fresh start because coach couldn't do his job with the guys he had. I know what was said about cap space and the whole shabang, it was mainly an excuse for the coach because Walsh brought him in. Like I said earlier, if we had the right coach the money and the 2010 FA's would have been an non issue. Instead, we went into another rebuilding stage because many of those players didn't respect D'ant's system. This is already known...and yet you say I'm obsessed with coach. I'm not the one sticking up for him and his obvious flaws. I just want him out!!

    You must be a youngin, only the immature and those that find their arguments weak will ever make an issue about grammar in such a place. SMH.
    I'm not European so I will never ever, ever, ever try to master the language. I deal with many people (lawyers,accountants,bankers,etc) all with poor English writing. In fact, they have secretaries and proof readers to handle that menial nonsense for them... (hint, hint). Even hip hop makes Billions "trashing" the English language, slang has never been so fun. Further more, the most successful/richest people in the world speak Hebrew, Arabic and Mandarin...many of them don't even speak a lick of English, so trash the false superiority act and stay on topic and stop showing your age and slip.

    Don't go thinking you're smart because you know how to cross your "T's" and dot your I's". I've seen that card played more than the race card.

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