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    Default Stoudemire Set On Implementing D In NYC - Hoopsworld

    While a lot of NBA superstars have been making waves hitting the streetball circuit this summer during the ongoing lockout, New York Knicks All-Star forward Amar’e Stoudemire has been notably absent from the headlines.

    According to multiple reports the absence is due to Stoudemire still being limited from the back injury suffered before game two of team’s first-round playoff series against the Boston Celtics back in April.

    Lingering back injuries have derailed many careers and the nine year veteran’s health has given Knicks fans a cause for concern heading into the upcoming season.

    The fear is compounded factoring in the Phoenix Suns’ reluctance to guarantee more than four years when Stoudemire hit free agency last summer due to durability issues.

    However Stoudemire doesn’t believe the injury will force him to miss any on court action, even training camp, if the labor dispute ends and the 2012 campaign starts as scheduled.


    “No question,” Stoudemire responded to Frank Isola of the New York Daily News on whether he’d be ready for the start of training camp. “I feel great. I feel good. I’ve been resting and rehabbing all summer. That’s my main priority.”

    While most are focusing on the health issues, Stoudemire is thinking long term with his eyes set on bringing the Larry O’Brien championship trophy back to the Big Apple.

    The six-time All-Star feels that in order to hoist the trophy his high powered offensive minded team must be willing to give equal effort on the defensive side of the ball.

    “For us to win a championship, defense has to be a primary force,” Stoudemire said. “It has to be something that we focus in on. Everyone has to buy into it and everyone has to become much better [defensively].”

    Improving defensively as a team is seemingly the theme of the offseason.

    Last week embattled head coach Mike D’Antoni, known for his prowess producing high powered offensive attacks, hired former Atlanta Hawks coach Mike Woodson as his top assistant.

    It is widely believed Woodson’s primary role is to improve overall team defense and implementing strategies to limit opposing offenses.

    Stoudemire applauded the move by the team to bolster its coaching staff and feels the hire brings the club one step closer to its goal of winning a title.

    “I think it’s great,” Stoudemire said. “It’s definitely what we talked about, improving defensively. With the help of Mike (Woodson) it’s going to be really positive for us. But it’s up to us as players to take that commitment and implement it.”

    The Knicks allowed a whopping 105.7 points per game during the 2011 season, which was the second worst in the league, and more than any other team who made a playoff appearance.


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    Walk the walk, STAT.

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    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    He better learn how to play some D first. Dude's rotations are awful and his man to man commitment play to play is similar to Melo's, horrible.

    He needs to get in the film room to learn opposing players and offenses tendencies. This will help his rotations and knowledge of where to be when a player he's guarding makes his move. That's the difference between he and Melo and a player like Paul. Paul's just alot smarter on the defensive end. He takes that challenge to improve aptitude in this area. Melo and Amare don't. Being slow to rotate comes from lack of study plain and simple.

    This should improve due to increased focus on D by MW but we will see.

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    You know how I feel about Amar'e's D honestly --- he blocked nearly 2 a game last season (1.9). Most of the season, he was over 2 a game on average..That's hardly "awful" defense. I'll take that again. To me, even with some defensive lapses from time to time, that's pretty good defense right there from STAT, mostly coming weak-side which goes to show that his defensive rotations and reads weren't awful..Do they need some work? Sure, but I don't think he was awful defensively... Sometimes his shot-blocking was downright dominant -- remember how he won that game for us in Charlotte with his shot-blocking?? What did he have, at least 5 that game, including a couple of huge ones down the stretch to seal the deal?? How 'bout the huge block on LeDouche to seal that victory?? Those 2 games immediately come to mind but there were others..

    To me, Amar'e needs to average 10 rebs a game this coming season. That's where he really needs to increase his contribution. Gimme the 20-25 ppg (maybe less this yr with Melo and a few other capable offensive players in the mix, which is fine with me--he won't have the shoulder the entire scoring load for the first 3/4 of the season this time. Maybe we can keep him fresh for the playoffs this year), 2 blks per and 10+ rebs for the first time in his career. He does that, I won't have any problems with the guy at all. ****, even if he falls a little short with the rebounding again I won't have any problems with the man..I love the guy. But if he were to look in the mirror and think where he could increase his productivity in order to help the team, it's gotta be rebounding. He does everything else either extremely well (scoring, getting to the line, great leadership) to at least above average (defense/shot-blocking) imho. 8.8 rebs/per career, down to 8.2 last year..That's Nene/Eddy Curry territory..He's capable of more than that. Find a way to get us another 2 rebs a game...He's so strong both physically and mentally, it's really surprising he isn't a better rebounder. Maybe he has small hands or the great rebounding instincts just aren't there...Effort's always there... It's puzzling...Hopefully this year will be different. Remember, early on pre-Melo, it was the rebounding that was a glaring problem. It even remained at times after Melo. Yeah Melo and Fields are above-average rebounders for their positions and they'll help, but Amar'e needs to do better...Team defense needs to get better and it looks like it will with Woodson on board...Now they need to figure out some ways to squeeze out a few more rebounds a game. If we can control the glass and limit other teams' opportunities better than we did last year, it should translate into more wins...There are some things mgmt. can do to help (incorporating Jerome Jordan should help if he's ready, Jorts too. Maybe we can go out and pick up a Jeff Adrien on the cheap. GS cut him; I think he's available..Maybe pick up Joe Alexander who went for almost 10/rebs a game last year in the DL, not to mention Alexander's still quite skilled in other areas---this guy would be a nice hybrid forward who could back up both Stoudemire and Melo), but it's gotta start with STAT. He's our man down low. He's gotta be much more forceful on the glass and set the tone..8.2 a game's too low.. We need more from him here. If we're gonna sit here and nitpick the man, his rebounding is more of an issue over his defense..
    Last edited by finestrg; Sep 09, 2011 at 09:33.

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    No offense, but blocks are a small facet of defense.

    Amar'e needs to be the one who steps up in the defense area, most notably the fact that anyone being guarded by Amar'e has a chance to have a career scoring and rebounding night against him.

    His man to man and post defense is pathetic.

    As the leader of the team, he has to be the defensive anchor, by all means necessary.

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    No offense taken. However, I disagree that shot-blocking is a small part of defense. I think it's a major component and a huge plus overall defensively if you have guys that can actually do it. Amar'e can. I just threw it out there --- the man went for almost 2 a game and won at least two games with his shot-blocking alone last year. And I know there were others..I also disagree that his man-to-man defense was "pathetic." Don't know what to tell ya, I watched every game, and it wasn't pathetic. As I said, it could certainly use some work, but it wasn't pathetic. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on these two points..

    I do agree with your statement about Amar'e being the anchor inside, although I'd like to see him improve more in the rebounding category first and foremost...If he somehow improves defensively over last year where he averaged nearly 2 blocks a game, to me that's gravy...We need better rebounding output from the guy. In the last game of the year against the Celts in the playoffs he grabbed 12 rebounds, bad back and all. He's capable of more than 8.2 rebounds per. If he can man up and go for over 10 rebounds a game, it'll translate into more wins. No doubt in my mind. More than anything else, on the glass is where I'd really like Amar'e to step up and set the tone.

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    Last season wasn't even Amar'e best year.

    He has always been a good shotblocker, but he has never been called a good defender because of it.

    That's like calling Love and Z-bo good defender because of their rebound averages.

    He has admitted himself, he hasn't been taught how, but he was decent under Gentry, which was the only coach that gave him a concept of defense to work with.

    Amar'e is not a good defender, but if he is gonna talk about it, he needs to be about it.

    All players have moments where the have a spurt of good defense, and Amar'e has done that.

    Defense, individually spans far beyond a block shot.

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    I hear ya on the whole "if you're gonna talk the talk.." stuff. Hopefully Amar'e will improve his man to man defense. I agree with you guys -- there's room for improvement there. The thing I have a problem with is using words like "awful" and "pathetic" to describe his overall defensive impact. That's going way overboard and just isn't accurate..I mean the man WON games with his shot-blocking for Christ's sake. How can you poo-poo that?? LOL..I wouldn't use those words at all. Big difference in saying he's a pathetic defender and saying he has room for improvement in that area if you ask me.

    Just my : I'd much rather see Amar'e improve his rebounding and cut down on his turnover rate (much too high last year -- 1st time he's gone for over 3/game in his career..I'd concede that some games, esp. early on, he looked "pathetic" handling the ball, esp. trying to put it on the floor from 15-18'. He got better with it, but there were times when he looked like a turnover factory out there early on). If he can accomplish those two things, I'll take a sustained level of defense from last year (I want those 2 blocks a game again). Now if he can do those two things plus improve on defense and buy into some effective defensive scheme coach Woodson chooses to implement, whatever that may be, then great..All the better. To me it's his rebounding and turnovers that he needs to tighten up first above all else. Then his defense, an area where he already has a significant impact with his shot-blocking. All I'm sayin'..
    Last edited by finestrg; Sep 09, 2011 at 13:36.

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    Amar'e also was a major contributor to why forwards and centers alike ran amuck on us.

    I still can't get over dropping off a 30/30 to Kevin Love.

    Amar'e defense is pathetic, I'm sorry, anything short of that is lying.

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    Originally Posted by knickscity
    Amar'e also was a major contributor to why forwards and centers alike ran amuck on us.

    I still can't get over dropping off a 30/30 to Kevin Love.

    Amar'e defense is pathetic, I'm sorry, anything short of that is lying.
    Man I would love to watch that game again..From what I remember, it was Amar'e's lack of rebounding that was the biggest problem in that game by far, more than his man-to-man D on Love. I remember screaming about it during that game like it was yesterday..From what I remember it was all of Love's 2nd opportunities that lead to most of those pts. I remember Love doing a majority of his damage that night hitting the offensive glass harder than anyone I've ever seen in my life (COUNTLESS taps, tip ins, putbacks etc.) over him taking Amar'e down low and abusing him with post moves. That's not how it went down..All of Love's offensive rebounds in that game, however many he had, led to most of his points from what I recall. Offensive rebounds by the truck-load, a low post move here, a 3-ball there and all of a sudden he had 30 (finished with 31 pts)...Love's boardwork killed us that night -- more than his 30 pts..Dude had 15 rebs in the 3rd quarter alone..Amar'e and co. just couldn't keep him off the glass..I'm glad you brought that game up -- it epitomizes exactly what I'm talking about here. Amar'e needs to focus more on the glass this year than anything else. Case closed.
    Last edited by finestrg; Sep 09, 2011 at 18:24.

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    Originally Posted by finestrg
    You know how I feel about Amar'e's D honestly --- he blocked nearly 2 a game last season (1.9). Most of the season, he was over 2 a game on average..That's hardly "awful" defense. I'll take that again. To me, even with some defensive lapses from time to time, that's pretty good defense right there from STAT, mostly coming weak-side which goes to show that his defensive rotations and reads weren't awful..Do they need some work? Sure, but I don't think he was awful defensively... Sometimes his shot-blocking was downright dominant -- remember how he won that game for us in Charlotte with his shot-blocking?? What did he have, at least 5 that game, including a couple of huge ones down the stretch to seal the deal?? How 'bout the huge block on LeDouche to seal that victory?? Those 2 games immediately come to mind but there were others..
    I will agree with u on Amare's domination on Defense....Amare plays
    20 minutes of hard defense....however....Amare's 16 minutes of laid
    back defense (averaging 36 minutes per game) is why fans call Amare
    defense "awful & pathetic".
    Having Melo in the lineup....Amare will have to play 30+ minutes of hard-
    knox defense consistently in a halfcourt setting with Melo as his SF.
    Amare has always had great defensive SF in his lineup the past 9 seasons
    (Marion, Jim Jackson, Q.Rich, Diaw, Grant Hill, and Chandler) these SF took alot of defensive pressure off of Amare.

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    What i recall from that game is Beasly and Love putting Amar'e in ridiculous foul trouble.

    Those two had 75 points between them, and yes I hold Amar'e fully responsible for that.

    They were playing out of position just like he was, but somehow they made Amar'e look like pure trash.

    I was not a happy camper watching that one, but there were others where Amar'e in particular looked lost on the floor on the defensive end, and front court paraded in the lane like no one was there.

    He was our primary center/big in the post.

    As the leader I fully expect him to clean that up, even if he has to foul out trying to do it.

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    Originally Posted by knickscity
    What i recall from that game is Beasly and Love putting Amar'e in ridiculous foul trouble.

    Those two had 75 points between them, and yes I hold Amar'e fully responsible for that.

    They were playing out of position just like he was, but somehow they made Amar'e look like pure trash.

    I was not a happy camper watching that one, but there were others where Amar'e in particular looked lost on the floor on the defensive end, and front court paraded in the lane like no one was there.

    He was our primary center/big in the post.

    As the leader I fully expect him to clean that up, even if he has to foul out trying to do it.
    The bolded epitomizes the defensive play of Amare. There were too many games where lackluster defensive play costed us wins and he was a primary contributor to that. There were way too many times last season where i was cursing Amare on my plasma after he missed a rotation, or saw the assignment and just didn't move his feet fast enough.. and oops another layup. Part of that is bad coaching. But what's gonna be Amare's excuse this year. He needs to get in the film rm, spend some hours in that bich and get comfy with what he needs to do mentally. Most of his mistakes are mental. Sometimes he lazy but most of it is mental.

    Nd I'm sry but getting his two momentum blks in the forth during our usual run does not make him a good defender, not even close. Defense is nuanced. It's about being there and always being solid on your keys, always knowing what's coming, drawing a charge, always boxing out, knowing how to use your length and body position with out fouling, or even jumping every time, hustle. Amare's play is totally antithetical to these aspects. I don't kno what the hell some of you are seeing out there on the court the way you talk.

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    It's definitely mental with him, just never been trained how to defend.

    I can't believe some are actually saying Amar'e plays good defense.

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    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    He better learn how to play some D first. Dude's rotations are awful and his man to man commitment play to play is similar to Melo's, horrible.

    He needs to get in the film room to learn opposing players and offenses tendencies. This will help his rotations and knowledge of where to be when a player he's guarding makes his move. That's the difference between he and Melo and a player like Paul. Paul's just alot smarter on the defensive end. He takes that challenge to improve aptitude in this area. Melo and Amare don't. Being slow to rotate comes from lack of study plain and simple.

    This should improve due to increased focus on D by MW but we will see.
    It's not just studying opponents that'll get it done, it's going to take some hard nosed will to get Amar'e to match his media swag on this one.

    Originally Posted by finestrg
    You know how I feel about Amar'e's D honestly --- he blocked nearly 2 a game last season (1.9). Most of the season, he was over 2 a game on average..That's hardly "awful" defense. I'll take that again. To me, even with some defensive lapses from time to time, that's pretty good defense right there from STAT, mostly coming weak-side which goes to show that his defensive rotations and reads weren't awful..Do they need some work? Sure, but I don't think he was awful defensively... Sometimes his shot-blocking was downright dominant -- remember how he won that game for us in Charlotte with his shot-blocking?? What did he have, at least 5 that game, including a couple of huge ones down the stretch to seal the deal?? How 'bout the huge block on LeDouche to seal that victory?? Those 2 games immediately come to mind but there were others..

    To me, Amar'e needs to average 10 rebs a game this coming season. That's where he really needs to increase his contribution. Gimme the 20-25 ppg (maybe less this yr with Melo and a few other capable offensive players in the mix, which is fine with me--he won't have the shoulder the entire scoring load for the first 3/4 of the season this time. Maybe we can keep him fresh for the playoffs this year), 2 blks per and 10+ rebs for the first time in his career. He does that, I won't have any problems with the guy at all. ****, even if he falls a little short with the rebounding again I won't have any problems with the man..I love the guy. But if he were to look in the mirror and think where he could increase his productivity in order to help the team, it's gotta be rebounding. He does everything else either extremely well (scoring, getting to the line, great leadership) to at least above average (defense/shot-blocking) imho. 8.8 rebs/per career, down to 8.2 last year..That's Nene/Eddy Curry territory..He's capable of more than that. Find a way to get us another 2 rebs a game...He's so strong both physically and mentally, it's really surprising he isn't a better rebounder. Maybe he has small hands or the great rebounding instincts just aren't there...Effort's always there... It's puzzling...Hopefully this year will be different. Remember, early on pre-Melo, it was the rebounding that was a glaring problem. It even remained at times after Melo. Yeah Melo and Fields are above-average rebounders for their positions and they'll help, but Amar'e needs to do better...Team defense needs to get better and it looks like it will with Woodson on board...Now they need to figure out some ways to squeeze out a few more rebounds a game. If we can control the glass and limit other teams' opportunities better than we did last year, it should translate into more wins...There are some things mgmt. can do to help (incorporating Jerome Jordan should help if he's ready, Jorts too. Maybe we can go out and pick up a Jeff Adrien on the cheap. GS cut him; I think he's available..Maybe pick up Joe Alexander who went for almost 10/rebs a game last year in the DL, not to mention Alexander's still quite skilled in other areas---this guy would be a nice hybrid forward who could back up both Stoudemire and Melo), but it's gotta start with STAT. He's our man down low. He's gotta be much more forceful on the glass and set the tone..8.2 a game's too low.. We need more from him here. If we're gonna sit here and nitpick the man, his rebounding is more of an issue over his defense..
    At least 10. He's athletically gifted, strong and has the offensive leniency in Melo, Billups and [fingers crossed] Shumpert to exert himself more where his team needs him most.

    Originally Posted by finestrg
    No offense taken. However, I disagree that shot-blocking is a small part of defense. I think it's a major component and a huge plus overall defensively if you have guys that can actually do it. Amar'e can. I just threw it out there --- the man went for almost 2 a game and won at least two games with his shot-blocking alone last year. And I know there were others..I also disagree that his man-to-man defense was "pathetic." Don't know what to tell ya, I watched every game, and it wasn't pathetic. As I said, it could certainly use some work, but it wasn't pathetic. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on these two points..

    I do agree with your statement about Amar'e being the anchor inside, although I'd like to see him improve more in the rebounding category first and foremost...If he somehow improves defensively over last year where he averaged nearly 2 blocks a game, to me that's gravy...We need better rebounding output from the guy. In the last game of the year against the Celts in the playoffs he grabbed 12 rebounds, bad back and all. He's capable of more than 8.2 rebounds per. If he can man up and go for over 10 rebounds a game, it'll translate into more wins. No doubt in my mind. More than anything else, on the glass is where I'd really like Amar'e to step up and set the tone.
    He lacks physicality and aggression. His blocks are all helpers or chase downs. Rarely does he move laterally to stifle his direct opponent. The same goes for the handful of charges he took last season.

    Originally Posted by knickscity
    Amar'e also was a major contributor to why forwards and centers alike ran amuck on us.

    I still can't get over dropping off a 30/30 to Kevin Love.

    Amar'e defense is pathetic, I'm sorry, anything short of that is lying.
    Detroit's PF rookie last year, Monroe I believe, made STAT look like a ***** in what eventually became a long ranged barrage victory for us. 16 boards! 16!

    In fact, the amount of career games from front court opponent's last season was just embarrassing.

    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    The bolded epitomizes the defensive play of Amare. There were too many games where lackluster defensive play costed us wins and he was a primary contributor to that. There were way too many times last season where i was cursing Amare on my plasma after he missed a rotation, or saw the assignment and just didn't move his feet fast enough.. and oops another layup. Part of that is bad coaching. But what's gonna be Amare's excuse this year. He needs to get in the film rm, spend some hours in that bich and get comfy with what he needs to do mentally. Most of his mistakes are mental. Sometimes he lazy but most of it is mental.

    Nd I'm sry but getting his two momentum blks in the forth during our usual run does not make him a good defender, not even close. Defense is nuanced. It's about being there and always being solid on your keys, always knowing what's coming, drawing a charge, always boxing out, knowing how to use your length and body position with out fouling, or even jumping every time, hustle. Amare's play is totally antithetical to these aspects. I don't kno what the hell some of you are seeing out there on the court the way you talk.
    You're right there, Rondo! The frustration that coincides with it all, is the fact that he is obviously capable.

    If there were underachiever awards in the NBA, you'd assume STAT would be in consideration for UDPOY annually. Not what I want to see from a captain. Harsh, but certainly not unfair.

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    Amar'e got a few nice blocks here or there but in general his man defense is horrible. He manages to look OK at times on help D because of his length and athleticism but got exposed by Kevin Love and Greg Monroe last year.

    I know Love is a good rebounder and Amar'e isn't but for goodness' sake, Amar'e, BOX OUT, BOX THE **** OUT!

    Seriously Amar'e is strong and has length. All he really has to do to become a passable defender and rebounder is BOX OUT and at least try a little harder to stop his man from getting to the basket. He rotates poorly on defense, often looks lost, and manages to avoid the ire of the press because every couple of games he'll get a chase down block or pick up a block on help defense.

    Not saying that shotblocking isn't important but JVG made a good point when he said that the Knicks blocked so many shots last season because teams took far more shots in the paint because we let them get to the basket way too easily. Yeah, it's nice when Amar'e manages to recover and protect the basket, but it's sad when you consider that the player should never have been near the basket in the first place had Amar'e boxed out and gotten the defensive rebound or if Amar'e actually tried harder.

    Tim Duncan is one of the best defenders of all time at PF. There's no way Amar'e is any less physically gifted than Duncan is, in fact Amar'e is probably way more physically gifted than Duncan even when Duncan was in his prime, the difference is Duncan had better defensive awareness, rebound positioning, and all in all used his length and his basketball IQ to lead some of the best defensive teams ever. I honestly believe that Amar'e has the PHYSICAL gifts to become one of the best defenders in this league - it's really an awful shame that his wingspan and athleticism go to absolute waste when the ball isn't in NY's hands.
    Last edited by SSj4Wingzero; Sep 11, 2011 at 16:41.

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