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Thread: Talks finally going the right direction...

  1. #16
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    Lightbulb Water and Oil....the two are different liquids

    Originally Posted by Dzwonsson
    But isn't it weird that the employees want to earn more than their employers?
    u and so many others are looking at the NBA in the wrong perspective.....
    The owners are nothing more than a "promoter" of a client (player), with
    the "rights" to sit, play, or trade clients to other promoters.

    An entertainer is an entire different world from employer-employee.

  2. #17
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    Kiyaman's right - this isn't the same world. There are VERY FEW people in the world who can play NBA ball. It's not like working at a Wal-Mart where you have to accept a low wage simply because if you don't they'll just find someone else to do it instead cause anybody can do that job.

    The NBA can't just take all of its players and replace them.

  3. #18
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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzero
    The NBA can't just take all of its players and replace them.
    sure they can... they can go out and sign 2nd..and 3rd tier players.. and play the season...ofcourse the product will sux...

  4. #19
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    Boston Herald: after breaking off talks last Friday, the NBA and players’ union are expected to resume face to face negotiations this Saturday in New York, according to involved sources.

    We’re still awaiting confirmation from the league office, but sources say the plan is pretty much set.

    The sides have been working within their own groups for the most part in these last days, setting their positions and deciding whether they will move from their most recent offers — and, if so, by how much.


    I'm not very optimistic, but still think it's quite better to sit together and try to figure out how to make a deal than to stay in the trenches and avoid any contact with each other...

  5. #20
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    Now that we've lost games, it's become a bread and butter issue. Both sides losing millions of dollars with every game lost, let the players step up and say they'll accept the 50/50 deal with incentives if revenues pass a certain mark. Let the owners abandon the "hard cap" and keep the exceptions with possibly reducing max years by one year. I think that will get a deal done.

  6. #21
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    The choice the owners have left the plyers is: or you get 50/50 and the hard cap without any exceptions or 47% of the BRI and some concessions on a couple of system issues. I'd certainly enjoy both parties agree on the terms you noticed, but I doubt it's possible. The union get what the owners are willing to give them, the 50/50 split which is for many teams at least a break even and the hard cap. It's a take it or leave it (and starve) proposal for the players and a win-win situation for the owners. The sooner the players realize they have gotten into a dead end street the better.

  7. #22
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    Stand your ground players. Some of us know what it really is...
    Principles are more important than playing the game.

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  8. #23
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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzero
    Kiyaman's right - this isn't the same world. There are VERY FEW people in the world who can play NBA ball. It's not like working at a Wal-Mart where you have to accept a low wage simply because if you don't they'll just find someone else to do it instead cause anybody can do that job.

    The NBA can't just take all of its players and replace them.
    THIS is the reason why the NBPA will not accept a 50/50 split. Anyone with money can be an owner, but you have to be extrordinary to make it into the NBA (for the most part). Any success the league has will always be attributed to the players.

    There's a reason why most nationally televised games feature teams with all-stars/superstars... they drive the ratings! Yes, the same ratings that allow the NBA to get those billion dollar television deals from ESPN, TNT and NBC. I want the season to start yesterday but I understand what they are fighting for.

    Owners and players are not equal partners in this money machine.

  9. #24
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    Originally Posted by nyk_nyk
    Anyone with money can be an owner
    so the answer is let the players who have been in the league for a few years and have had made some $$$... like the kobes/melo's/kg's/amare's/etc start their own league, and they can pay the players 53 or 55 or 80% of the $$$...

    it's pretty simple...

  10. #25
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    The most important bargaining session yet in the ongoing labor strife is set to begin at 4 p.m. today in a Manhattan hotel. Without movement by the two sides this weekend, it’s likely there will be no NBA basketball in 2011 and the entire 2011-12 season could be in jeopardy.
    Positions on both sides are starting to harden. Many owners, who met among themselves this morning at 10 a.m., are expected to push to have the 50-50 split offer for basketball-related revenue taken off the table if the players refuse to accept it.
    On the players side, some union members are talking decertification of the players association if the owners can’t meet their desire for 52 percent of BRI. Players also refuse to accept contract structuring and limitations that would be like a hard salary cap. Decertification would allow the players to sue on antitrust grounds, meaning the season likely would be lost. Meanwhile, the $4 billion BRI pie already has shrunk with the cancellation of all the games scheduled for November.
    One ray of hope: Federal mediator George H. Cohen rejoins the collective bargaining, which could bring a calming influence.

  11. #26
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    The NY Times has a better report of the lockout than Yahoo. Doesn't look good, they made progress on the BRI but the system issues seem to be going nowhere. I have to agree that free agency will be limited with some of these gimmicks the league wants to impose on luxury tax paying teams, like a repeater tax, no sign and trades or MLEs. The sides are really close on the BRI but the system changes will have a negative impact on free agency and salaries for every NBA player. I don't see the players going for this deal, giving up 7% in revenues and getting future contracts cut by ~20% with this deal.

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  12. #27
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    Angry

    The players would be just a bunch of knuckleheads if they didn't the accept the league's proposal. They seem to be stuck in a kind of unreal world they've imagined themselves where they'd get their 51% (or even 57%!) plus tons of concessions that would allow them to make more and more big bucks, so they could wipe their asses with $100,000 bills. How the **** dare they say they feel sorry for arena workers, vendors and another people whose lives are affected by this lockout? They don't give a **** about those people and they don't give a **** about us, the fans. Every time I see Fisher or Hunter speaking I see those dollar signs in their eyes. I apologize for my language, but these greedy bitches make me sick...

  13. #28
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    The player's won't get a better deal, for sure. But, I understand their frustrations. The only reason people watch the NBA is because of the players. With a regular company, management and Chief Executives make the decisions that drive business and make money. Not with sports teams. The owners sit on their fat butts and let the players derive the income for them.

    The players have conceded on every point. The owners have not. They got what they needed to become profitable, asked for more, and when the players gave it to them, they asked for more. The Players went from 57 million to 52, to 51. The owners then said, no, come down to 50, with a BS 49-51 ban, and then we are going to make sure we come down on all system issues, as well.

    AGAIN, the players, if they want a season, are at the owner's mercy, but there may be a time where the players have to draw a line in the sand and say, "we will not be steamrolled by strong-arm negotiation tactics."

    Remember. There will be another CBA after this, and the owners will again try to push for more concessions from the Players. At one point and time, the Players will have to be willing to miss an entire season. Maybe it is this time. Maybe not.

  14. #29
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    Originally Posted by nyk_nyk
    THIS is the reason why the NBPA will not accept a 50/50 split. Anyone with money can be an owner, but you have to be extrordinary to make it into the NBA (for the most part). Any success the league has will always be attributed to the players.

    There's a reason why most nationally televised games feature teams with all-stars/superstars... they drive the ratings! Yes, the same ratings that allow the NBA to get those billion dollar television deals from ESPN, TNT and NBC. I want the season to start yesterday but I understand what they are fighting for.

    Owners and players are not equal partners in this money machine.
    You said it yourself right there, the reason most nationally televised games feature teams with all stars/superstars... So where do you think most of the money is going? Yes to those teams with all stars and superstars.

    I don't really see how people can't understand that the smaller market owners have every right to push for the best deal possible. Running a business at a loss is a totally pointless exercise.

    I really can't believe the players haven't made a deal yet. They got their 51 percent, the NBA made a lot of concessions. Yet they still aren't willing.

    This feels like a battle of ego's at this point.

  15. #30
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    Originally Posted by smokes
    You said it yourself right there, the reason most nationally televised games feature teams with all stars/superstars... So where do you think most of the money is going? Yes to those teams with all stars and superstars.

    I don't really see how people can't understand that the smaller market owners have every right to push for the best deal possible. Running a business at a loss is a totally pointless exercise.

    I really can't believe the players haven't made a deal yet. They got their 51 percent, the NBA made a lot of concessions. Yet they still aren't willing.

    This feels like a battle of ego's at this point.
    Wait, Smokes, what concessions did the NBA make? The 51 you are discussing is not a true 51. The 51 you pointed out is almost impossible for the players to get. They presented a proposal that was essentially 50%. If the players were to get 51%, it would take the NBA beating projections by 20%. That is practically impossible.

    The loss of the "hard cap" was not a concession. It was a non-starter. All I've seen is the players concede, conceded, concede, and the NBA owners refuse to even try.

    If you want a great article on this all, you can find it here:

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    Why don’t the players settle?
    Perhaps because they have done so well in the past, it’s hard for the players to accept that the owners are dead set on hammering them this time. They feel, correctly, that they have been making all the concessions. Imagine trying to redo your “chores deal” with your spouse, with one side giving in on every negotiating point. As human beings, we are programmed to reject one-sided deals, even when surrender might be the rational choice.

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