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Thread: Anyone else confident in Toney Douglas as our PG?

  1. #31
    Veteran mafra's Avatar
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    I think we signed Bibby b/c we're confident T-Douglas is fine to run the point. he's had 2 years in the offense. Is healthy. Plays excellent defense. Can hit the 3. Remember a guy like Rondo, and what happened to his game when the talent around him improved?

    Let's compare Rondo to Douglas, the first 2 years of their careers:

    Minutes per game
    Rondo had 23:30 & 29:53
    Douglas had 19:23 & 24:18

    Points per game
    Rondo had 6.4 & 10.6
    Douglas had 8.6 & 10.6

    Assists per game
    Rondo had 3.8 & 5.1
    Douglas had 2.0 & 3.0

    Steals per game
    Rondo had 1.6 & 1.7
    Douglas had 0.8 & 1.1

    Turnovers per game
    Rondo had 1.8 & 1.9
    Douglas had 1.0 & 1.1

    Rebounds per game
    Rondo had 3.7 & 4.2
    Douglas had 1.9 & 3.0

    3-point shooting pct
    Rondo shot 20.7 & 26.3
    Douglas shot 38.9 & 37.3

    *Although Rondo shot 48 total 3s his first 2 years, while Douglas shot about 560 of them.

    Their FG% & FT% were pretty much dead even.

    BOTH PLAYERS improved gradually, from season to season. Douglas improved his soph season & he played the entire year with a bum shoulder.

    I think it's fair to expect Douglas to continue progressing. He is healthy, added 15 pounds of muscle.

    Both players play GREAT defense.

    Both players are basically the same size. Rondo the longer wingspan, while Douglas an inch taller.

    Both were very good players in college.

    Rondo saw his career take off when the Big-3 emerged in BOS. I expect the same thing to happen with Douglas, now that he's playing with one of the best front courts in the NBA.

    Rondo was the better pure PG. A much better passer, But Douglas is a much better shooter (from downtown). Both can penetrate.

    The key is: Will Douglas learn to be a pass-orientated PG. Facilitate? Run the p-&-r? We shall see.

    Put, brace yourself. Our Big-3 might find out sometime in the upcoming post season, that we have a nother emerging star...

  2. #32
    Evacuee Crazy⑧s's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KingStarbury3
    He deserves a chance
    He does indeed. It's not like he'll be playing a predominant role. He's basically, given that D'Antoni can adapt to the weight of his frontline, playing a D Fisher role: provide and shoot - with the ability to drive, as well.

    I think he's earned the stripes to have a crack at the starting 1. It'll be a small window of opportunity for him if he comes out lost though, I believe.

    With all this Barea talk, I have to say that I'd much prefer the pre-injury Douglas out of the 2. Cheaper, bigger, stronger, faster.

    I like Barrea's game, but not here, not now.

  3. #33
    Veteran Paul1355's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by iSaYughh
    Yep. You're right -- we just have the 2.M milly to offer.

    I see J Rich def commanding a lot more. Hamilton, though....idk...The Bulls prolly will overpay for a SG.

    Let's hope it's JRich, since he's arguably the best of those three anyways. And maybe Hamilton can fall to us for the 2.5.

    If reports are true that we get Barea, and lose Douglas, it may be more important to get Hamilton, and then potentially make Fields a 6th man who swings between the 2 and 3.
    Barea might just sign with us for the min mid level

  4. #34
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    Default Toney Defense

    Toney Defense is an important cog in a champion Knickerbocker wheel.
    it's not imperative that he be a PG in this offense, but be a solid contributor,
    especially off the bench. the man can hit three's, the man can defend,
    two NEEDED aspects in the SSOL. I agree he deserves a chance to prove
    himself; he's had 2 years with Antoni and the Knicks, has steadily improved,
    gotten healthy (huge factor!), and is a hungry humble athlete. I like the guy!

    KEEP TONEY D!!

  5. #35
    The Knicks are Back DaTPRiNCE's Avatar
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    apparently its not a sign and trade were just signing Douglas flat out. if its for the contract thats offered then that's great. will be an awesome spark of the bench that can play minutes and really change a game for us. Its looking like Douglas will be our starter come christmas day and as ive stated im all for it. Mafra's comment said it all; improving gradually then get put in the limelight and ready to handle it. everyone shook their head when Rondo was made starter for Boston where are they now that he's an allstar? just saying. . Douglas can see similar success to a good starter and reliable

  6. #36
    Nein, Mann! Lercher's Avatar
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    We all keep saying we need a starting point guard. But today I read something that made me aware we are underrating Toney as well:

    D'Antoni was most impressed with a six-game stretch March 2-10 in which Douglas filled in for an injured Billups in the starting role. The Knicks won four of the six games and Douglas' production jumped to 16.8 points, 6.8 assists and 3.5 rebounds per game. He committed only 10 turnovers in the six games.

    I checked some recaps and Douglas made 8 assists against Dallas, 10 against Memphis and 7 against Atlanta, except of an uneasy start against New Orleans and Cleveland (in both cases 5 assists) he delivered pretty well.
    Last edited by Lercher; Dec 12, 2011 at 09:47.

  7. #37
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    Default Shumpert Shumpert Shumpert Shumpert

    The person who deserves a shot here is Iman Shumpert.

    And Landry Fields at the 2 is also being disrespected and under-rated.

  8. #38
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    Originally Posted by serendipity10
    Toney Douglas will never be a successful starter his best will be a Jason Terry type of sixth man. For know he can start because the Knicks don't have options. He doesn't necessarily have to be great but want great, it is the only way to be real contenders.

    Last I heard there is slight chance Baron Davis will be amnestied, and Knicks would be interested. The Knicks need a veteran pass first pg to maybe change TD's game, but the Knicks next step is looking for a starting point guard.
    I agree, Douglas is a perfect spark off the bench type player. Like Terry and Barrea(sp) were for Dallas. I just dont beleive he has the skill set and experience to be the base of the fire. But as we saw last year with Dallas, that spark is instrumental to keeping a high energy level throughout the game and does wonders for a lineup. If we can land an experienced Point and get that crawford deal done I think we would have what Dallas had. A strong high energy back court rotation that can keep the pressure on a defense all game long with or without our stars on the floor

  9. #39
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    People forget that Billups was even more of a defensive liablity vs. speedy PGs. That disrupted our entire game plan. Remember when TD had to play with Billups just to keep things even on defense?

    We essentially traded Billups for Chandler though I still think we overpaid, it'll help us long term. TD is cheap and maybe we can finally start developing some players.

  10. #40
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    Originally Posted by iJoe
    People forget that Billups was even more of a defensive liablity vs. speedy PGs. That disrupted our entire game plan. Remember when TD had to play with Billups just to keep things even on defense?

    We essentially traded Billups for Chandler though I still think we overpaid, it'll help us long term. TD is cheap and maybe we can finally start developing some players.
    There is no center that is actually good that would go for any less that what we paid. I mean, DeAndre Jordan is making 12 million a year now.. So if we were going to spend money I'd rather it be on a center that was actually really good, instead of paying a lot for one that is just beyond medicore... Not that Deandre is medicore, I think he is pretty good, just not worth that kind of money. I would hate to see us spend like 10 million a year on someone like Delambert though

    Plus Tyson actually took 2 million less to play here than for what Golden State was offering him for what thats worth

  11. #41
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    T.Doug deserves a shot. He's energetic, has what we need in Defense and can shoot the 3 ball. All he needs to do is work on his passing and vision...which should improve with minutes. He just needs quality time with the starters so he can feel them out...

  12. #42
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    Default Douglas

    Originally Posted by AmareForPresident
    I feel the EXACT same way bro, ppl tend to forget how well TD play as starting PG when Billups first got injured. I say give Toney the keys and lets see if it works out.
    A little review here might be in order. When Billips arrived we saw shades of his best play but it was short lived with multiple injuries especially down the stretch when we needed him. Then Toney Douglas filled in well in 4 out the 6 games he started but, in the playoffs we saw how out classed he was against RONDO. I still believe he has earned a chance to start and if he can learn to execute the "PICK AND ROLL" with Amare ala Nash that will seal the deal as to his worth. If he can't trust me Bibby can and will. We do not need scoring out of the PG. We need him to see the floor...get 7-10 assists and hit an open 3 to keep the defense from collasping. Certainly getting Chandler was the missing key. All else is fixable.
    Last edited by DrB; Dec 13, 2011 at 13:19. Reason: spelling ..Tony to TONEY

  13. #43
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    All that TD has to do is push the rock, limit stupid turnovers and play some solid defense, he is very capable!

  14. #44
    SWAGABURY KingStarbury3's Avatar
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    Douglas > Rondo

    Real Talk

  15. #45
    Veteran quiggle's Avatar
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    it's pretty clear to me that the Knicks want to develop douglas so he can increase his trade value. its a little delusional some of you think he is the point guard of this team for years to come. i wouldnt be surprised that this is his last season with the Knicks.

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