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Thread: D’Antoni not solely to blame for Knicks mess

  1. #31
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    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    Its very clear you don't understand the offense we run. Ive explained what's involved many times. Refer to my posts and the post of others w an inkling. The players are responsible for understanding where the ball needs to move and committing to executing, along w maintaing the spacing n not settling for isos constently or when the O breaks down. I cant keep arguing w you because it is clear that your knowledge base is just not there. Its a waste of my time. Read up on 7 seconds or less offense please. There's alot of stuff floating about the Internet for you to refer to. Good day.
    You keep saying the offense we run, but were aren't running it, and he holds no one accountable, he just sits there like he's giving up.The players see him doing this and they do the same thing, that's my problem with this coach.

  2. #32
    Veteran KingofNy's Avatar
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    Anyone's who's claiming MDA isn't the problem doesn't understand basketball or how plays are run.

    Check out this article, it's pretty good and goes into the real problems that we Knicks fans face under D'Antoni.

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    "After three straight losses at home, two of them against sub-.500 teams, it may be time to wonder if D’Antoni has a lifeline."

    Meanwhile, the Knicks (20-23 since the trade) risk becoming a cautionary tale: the dysfunctional family led by a stubborn father (James L. Dolan, the Garden’s chairman) who traded his inheritance for a house that wasn’t built yet.

    Also, here's another article saying tonight could be Antoni's last game as a Knick.

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

  3. #33
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    ^^ Are you kidding me?

    Those articles say *nothing*! Like, *nothing*. These are the articles that back up all this "backetball knowledge" and nuance into how offenses are run, and systems are run?

    I'm sorry. But, everywhere.

    Those articles are just tell-nothing superfialities, and statements about the ultimate wet dream for MDA haters -- "if we lose to Denver, surely Dolan will fire MDA".

    If anything, the articles actually *touch* upon an actual discussion which would support MDA -- which is STAT being at his best in an up tempo, free flowing offensive system, with a decent starting PG who can be molded to play in such an environment.

    Kinda like how STAT became a lock all-star player, even with injuries, being groomed outta highschool by MDA; and how MDA took an ok starter and made him an all-star level player in Felton, and took a middle of the road all-star in Nash, and made him a multi-MVP and lock HOF'er. Not to mention the other talents who *flourished* under MDA, as his sytem went to work....Not unlike how it was already taking hold last year.

    Those articles don't say anything, though. It's just more of the same ol' mantra and chanting that's overspewing in this forum. Except it's bundled in a weak, watered down, journalistic package.

    Look, I guess if this is type of knowledge, and depth of analysis, you base your opinions on; which is clearly is, as aside from these articles, it's basically on the same plane with what 90+% of anti-MDA people say over and over again anyways....

    Then yes, you are all absolutely right about MDA, and there is nothing that can be said -- or done -- that can pierce that bubble and shake that perspective.

    Outside of maybe a championship. But we all know that won't do it, either. As the following year if there are problems or we fell short of a repeat, we surely know where the blame would lie.

    The farce of the anti-MDA movement is almost identical in its core to the anti-Gallo movement that paraded around here for so long. It's just mushroomed with MDA, and there's much more wiggle room for logical fallacies and misinformation and false perspective with coaches than players.

  4. #34
    Veteran KingofNy's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by iSaYughh
    ^^ Are you kidding me?

    Those articles say *nothing*! Like, *nothing*. These are the articles that back up all this "backetball knowledge" and nuance into how offenses are run, and systems are run?

    I'm sorry. But, everywhere.

    Those articles are just tell-nothing superfialities, and statements about the ultimate wet dream for MDA haters -- "if we lose to Denver, surely Dolan will fire MDA".

    If anything, the articles actually *touch* upon an actual discussion which would support MDA -- which is STAT being at his best in an up tempo, free flowing offensive system, with a decent starting PG who can be molded to play in such an environment.

    Kinda like how STAT became a lock all-star player, even with injuries, being groomed outta highschool by MDA; and how MDA took an ok starter and made him an all-star level player in Felton, and took a middle of the road all-star in Nash, and made him a multi-MVP and lock HOF'er. Not to mention the other talents who *flourished* under MDA, as his sytem went to work....Not unlike how it was already taking hold last year.

    Those articles don't say anything, though. It's just more of the same ol' mantra and chanting that's overspewing in this forum. Except it's bundled in a weak, watered down, journalistic package.

    Look, I guess if this is type of knowledge, and depth of analysis, you base your opinions on; which is clearly is, as aside from these articles, it's basically on the same plane with what 90+% of anti-MDA people say over and over again anyways....

    Then yes, you are all absolutely right about MDA, and there is nothing that can be said -- or done -- that can pierce that bubble and shake that perspective.

    Outside of maybe a championship. But we all know that won't do it, either. As the following year if there are problems or we fell short of a repeat, we surely know where the blame would lie.

    The farce of the anti-MDA movement is almost identical in its core to the anti-Gallo movement that paraded around here for so long. It's just mushroomed with MDA, and there's much more wiggle room for logical fallacies and misinformation and false perspective with coaches than players.
    Say whatever you want, MDA is most likely going to be gone after tonight's loss... Watch and see.

    You've been all over D'Antoni's nuts for years now and you've been dead wrong. I'm just posting the stories I see off of twitter. I'm not going to go into the same issues on every single thread supporting the thousands of reasons it's way past time for MDA to go. I know you're ***** hurts, but calm down bro, it's gonna be alright.

  5. #35
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    Why can't people just except this guy is not a good coach, he doesn't pass the eye ball test.Just watch him on the sideline when were good or bad, he looks clueless, i'm sorry.

  6. #36
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    Let's not forget all the ridiculous benching and non-use of players since day ONE.

  7. #37
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    It's simple really: If the offense is too complicated for this team, then why bother running it?

    D'antoni got a taste for their talents last season. He had the entire lockout to devise some simplified offensive scheme to amplify his players' talents.

    Granted: He was hoping players like Fields & Douglas would improve (not go backwards).

    STILL...

    Did DENVER try to make Tebow fit the Orton offense? NO WAY. On the fly, they crafted an offense Tebow could succeed in. It's called coaching.

    Simply the SSOL for this season. Maybe slowly getting more sophisticated. Fully implement the offense next year, with a complete camp & a new PG.

    ALSO... Coach has to pull the rookie on some nights when he's shooting 19 shots. Come on, right.

    Plus, NYK is about 2nd in 3-point shot attempts, & like 25th in 3-point makes. Why are we forcing those shots when we do not have shooters?

    Still, I think a lot of the blame goes on Amar'e Stoudemire. He looks like half of what he was last season. No fire. No heart. No kicking & throwing things in the locker room.

    I also blame Douglas-Fields. Did they even practice in the offseason? At least TD was returning from an injury. What's LF's excuse?

    Finally, this 5-game losing streak is atrributed to 'Melo's poor shooting. A slightly more efficient CA & we're probably 3-2. He gets a sorta pass b/c the slump came when he injured his wrist.

    We'll see where this team is headed. If they miss playoffs, or end up with 7-8 seed and get blown out of the gym by MIA or CHI in the 1st round... DISASTER folks.

    We can only hope Baron Davis returns and gets things going, the team stats to gel, we add a piece before the deadline, and get the 4-6 seed. Win a 1st round and then battle in the 2nd round.

    I think tonight vs DEN will be the turnaround.

  8. #38
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    Originally Posted by KingofNy
    Say whatever you want, MDA is most likely going to be gone after tonight's loss... Watch and see.

    You've been all over D'Antoni's nuts for years now and you've been dead wrong. I'm just posting the stories I see off of twitter. I'm not going to go into the same issues on every single thread supporting the thousands of reasons it's way past time for MDA to go. I know you're ***** hurts, but calm down bro, it's gonna be alright.
    I ain't the one bleeding over this forum almost every day like I got a 24/7 menstrual cycle, bro....

    You act like Coach D'antoni banged and impegranted your mother. Which would at least explain how emo you are on here.

    Truthfully, your raging hard-on for MDA is the only shred of masculinity you display.

    Keep shaking your pom poms, tho; insofar as occasionally laughing at you and swatting down some of your more painfully inaccurate statements, I couldn't care less.

  9. #39
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    Originally Posted by fender0577
    You keep saying the offense we run, but were aren't running it, and he holds no one accountable, he just sits there like he's giving up.The players see him doing this and they do the same thing, that's my problem with this coach.

    You can't argue with SSOL defenders. Since when is it smart to rely on, and base an offense on, the lowest pct shot imagineable. Quality always trumps quantity. It's not about theiry... it's about what's practical.

    Sure, a dollar and a dream is a great investment if you win lottery, but most people need to work hard & invest smartly if they want to earn a living.

  10. #40
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    I mean, we don't even run SSOL. Not even close...SSOL would probably be more effective than this constant iso-**** we've been doing all season long.

    Actually, no, I take that back. Toney Douglas running SSOL would be the saddest thing of all time.

  11. #41
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    You can't argue with SSOL defenders. Since when is it smart to rely on, and base an offense on, the lowest pct shot imagineable. Quality always trumps quantity. It's not about theiry... it's about what's practical.

    Sure, a dollar and a dream is a great investment if you win lottery, but most people need to work hard & invest smartly if they want to earn a living.
    Dude, i see what your saying, they are really crazy, but i'm done.

  12. #42
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    Anyone can coach this team better.

    Mike Woodson wouldn't get us far because if he is our defensive coach then i don't see a huge improvement. We need a whole new staff.

    The Mike D experiment has failed.

  13. #43
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    You can't argue with SSOL defenders. Since when is it smart to rely on, and base an offense on, the lowest pct shot imagineable. Quality always trumps quantity. It's not about theiry... it's about what's practical.

    Sure, a dollar and a dream is a great investment if you win lottery, but most people need to work hard & invest smartly if they want to earn a living.
    I stumbled here bc I noticed that KingofNY neg repped me (lul).

    But I have to respond to this.

    You are looking at the 3 (and SSOL) wayyyyyy too simplistically.

    1) It keeps defenses honest and spreads the flow. It has positive ramifications besides the % of the shot itself.

    2) Most importantly: you are just incorrect in stating it is not a quality shot. In fact, the corner 3 is the most quality and efficient shots in basketball.

    I'll say that again: the corner 3 is perhaps the most quality shot in the NBA, that carries the highest "point rate"/"win rate" for a shot.

    It's %, which may be "lower" than a non-3, doesn't matter; it's a logical fallacy to assume it is not a quality shot because of that.

    I'll close with something I've said more and more regarding the analysis people (generally speaking, not everyone) who are against MDA, with those who support him:

    Old-School Baseball Analysis vs Moneyball-style analysis.

    Right down the climate of hatred and group-fervor that exploded against Moneyball.

    SSOL also isn't necessarily predicated upon the 3. Moreso, it is about spacing and timing, speed and flow.

    Having some people with range is definitely important (when is that not for a team?).

    But actually, the freedom to take the 3 -- and the reason it then is a frequent shot in a well-run SSOL team -- is because the SSOL style creates great 3 pt taking opportunities.

    So going back to my previous point about what a quality, winning shot the 3 can be.....

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