Mike D'Antoni's influence on our resurgence

amazinz5

Benchwarmer
if you dont get the analogy i have a feeling you'll never accept the importance of a pg. MTA = wide recievers. toney douglas = jared lorenzen.
 
if you dont get the analogy i have a feeling you'll never accept the importance of a pg. MTA = wide recievers. toney douglas = jared lorenzen.

When did these guys play a season together? I never said a PG wasnt important. To go 8-15 while missing one component means you're incapable of adjusting...
 

amazinz5

Benchwarmer
When did these guys play a season together? I never said a PG wasnt important. To go 8-15 while missing one component means you're incapable of adjusting...

hey i was dead on. if you really need a qb+wrs that played together to understand the connection i'll try to think of a similar situation. melo is the only one of the 3 players youre referring to that can create offense and he hasnt been healthy. amare and tyson is not an offense.
 

amazinz5

Benchwarmer
mike vick. really good weapons. maclin, avant, desean, celek. he'd probably be really good at a different position, like toney may be a great sg if that was all he had to do. unfortunately vick is not a good qb and their weapons went to waste. is that realistic enough for you? as much as i love to shit on andy reid he is not able to get those guys the ball, especially in a position to score.
 
hey i was dead on. if you really need a qb+wrs that played together to understand the connection i'll try to think of a similar situation. melo is the only one of the 3 players youre referring to that can create offense and he hasnt been healthy. amare and tyson is not an offense.

Why cant plays be run to create offense? Back picks. Post ups. Back door cuts. It doesnt take much to get an offense to gel when you have the talent the Knicks have. Instead we were shooting the first available open shot, and we dont have the shooters to do that...
 
mike vick. really good weapons. maclin, avant, desean, celek. he'd probably be really good at a different position, like toney may be a great sg if that was all he had to do. unfortunately vick is not a good qb and their weapons went to waste. is that realistic enough for you? as much as i love to shit on andy reid he is not able to get those guys the ball, especially in a position to score.

Mike Vick didnt have an offensive line which is much more important than WRs. In the NFL games are won in the trenches. Thinking about it in the NBA games are also won in the trenches...
 

amazinz5

Benchwarmer
Mike Vick didnt have an offensive line which is much more important than WRs. In the NFL games are won in the trenches. Thinking about it in the NBA games are also won in the trenches...

lol maclin, mccoy, avant, desean, etc and its okay for them cause theyre not complete. but stat and tyson have to do it themselves.
 

lilman_bklyn

Rotation player
if anyone thinks D'amntoni, had any influence with whats going on right now, they've been smoking for the last 3 years. This guy sleep walked through his entire term as knicks coach. I read someone say, the team wasn't trying in the past, well that starts from the coach. This guy was pulling shit out his ass, and for the last five games, he's found a diamond in Lin.

MDA is by far, one of the worst coaches that i've seen. as someone stated earlier, There is no reason why Jefferies should be allowed to take 1 three point shot, EVER. I dont care if he hit 15 in a row in practice. But a coaching strategy that gives free reign to anyone to shoot multiple threes is disturbing. He instills that mentality as the coach, so the players feel they could just go and shoot threes, who cares if they are under 40% or 30% just continue shooting because you are open. The guy is a dick. Even though the verdict is still out for with Lin in my opinion, the fact of the matter is, his play is the ONLY reason why the knicks have had this recent streak.. Period!
 
lol maclin, mccoy, avant, desean, etc and its okay for them cause theyre not complete. but stat and tyson have to do it themselves.

STAT and TC were rarely in the trenches where the should be while we were going 8-15. If they were I doubt we would have started so bad. That's the analogy you should make.

Trying to compare Vick with no Oline and STAT and TC when they're supposed to be the Oline is insane...
 

amazinz5

Benchwarmer

STAT and TC were rarely in the trenches where the should be while we were going 8-15. If they were I doubt we would have started so bad. That's the analogy you should make.

Trying to compare Vick with no Oline and STAT and TC when they're supposed to be the Oline is insane...

Now the o line is supposed to produce.. Interesting.
 

KBlack25

Starter
What 2 perennial all stars did Riley have? Or JVG?

Ask yourself. Would the Knicks have an 8-15 record with the talent MDA has if Riley coached them? Would JVG?

What am I not fair about in regards to MDA? I've never said anything that was wrong I dont think.

And yet you continue to skirt the issue.

Again, it's simple: If you are fair about MDA how does saying "if he brings a championship I MIGHT consider laying off him" make you at all fair?

He would give the ultimate prize back to NY, the best possible outcome of the season, a championship in NY. And you MIGHT CONSIDER laying off of him. Not "I will lay off him" or "I would tone down the criticism", but "MIGHT CONSIDER" it.

That's not fair.

And if you are think you are fair, you are blind.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
if anyone thinks D'amntoni, had any influence with whats going on right now, they've been smoking for the last 3 years. This guy sleep walked through his entire term as knicks coach. I read someone say, the team wasn't trying in the past, well that starts from the coach. This guy was pulling shit out his ass, and for the last five games, he's found a diamond in Lin.

MDA is by far, one of the worst coaches that i've seen. as someone stated earlier, There is no reason why Jefferies should be allowed to take 1 three point shot, EVER. I dont care if he hit 15 in a row in practice. But a coaching strategy that gives free reign to anyone to shoot multiple threes is disturbing. He instills that mentality as the coach, so the players feel they could just go and shoot threes, who cares if they are under 40% or 30% just continue shooting because you are open. The guy is a dick. Even though the verdict is still out for with Lin in my opinion, the fact of the matter is, his play is the ONLY reason why the knicks have had this recent streak.. Period!


:agreed::agreed::agreed:

DamnPhoney!!!
 
Mike D'Antoni is one of the 5 best offensive coaches in the NBA.

He's also top 5 in coach-player relationships, I've never heard of a player who doesn't want to play for D'Antoni.

From members of Team USA, to NBA All-Star Game members to Free Agents, every player I listen to has nothing but praises for D'Antoni.

He's well respected among his colleagues too, from JVG to POP to coach K.

I like his demeanor in interviews too, he's always positive has a good sense of humor and likes to throw a pinch of irony in from now and then.

I don't love him or idolize him, my favourite coach in the NBA is JVG, but I hold no grudges against him either. I hated our defense last season and ever since he took over, but this season we're pretty good on defense and I have to give him, Tyson and coach Woodson credit for that.

Our players really seem to like and support him and when they buy into his system, we win as the last couple of games demonstrated.

D'Antoni is a decent coach and has a unique ability to get the most out of mediocre players or turn good players into superstars.

His offense doesn't suit every player though that's why a guy like Melo doesn't look too good under D'Antoni, but that's not D'Antoni's fault.

When a mechanic works for Chevrolet and his boss tells him to replace a Corvette dashboard with a Ford Bronco dashboard it's not his fault that those parts don't fit, it's his bosses fault for giving him the wrong piece and not understanding that a Covertte and a Ford Bronco dashboard don't fit together.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
And yet you continue to skirt the issue.

Again, it's simple: If you are fair about MDA how does saying "if he brings a championship I MIGHT consider laying off him" make you at all fair?

He would give the ultimate prize back to NY, the best possible outcome of the season, a championship in NY. And you MIGHT CONSIDER laying off of him. Not "I will lay off him" or "I would tone down the criticism", but "MIGHT CONSIDER" it.

That's not fair.

And if you are think you are fair, you are blind.


ha ha ha ha Dantoni winning a NBA championship is like diving off a 20 story
buiding head first hitting concrete and living to talk about it ha ha ha ha ha
Dantoni's flawed coaching wouldnt last a half a season in the NCAA...
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Mike D'Antoni is one of the 5 best offensive coaches in the NBA.

He's also top 5 in coach-player relationships, I've never heard of a player who doesn't want to play for D'Antoni.

From members of Team USA, to NBA All-Star Game members to Free Agents, every player I listen to has nothing but praises for D'Antoni.

He's well respected among his colleagues too, from JVG to POP to coach K.

I like his demeanor in interviews too, he's always positive has a good sense of humor and likes to throw a pinch of irony in from now and then.

I don't love him or idolize him, my favourite coach in the NBA is JVG, but I hold no grudges against him either. I hated our defense last season and ever since he took over, but this season we're pretty good on defense and I have to give him, Tyson and coach Woodson credit for that.

Our players really seem to like and support him and when they buy into his system, we win as the last couple of games demonstrated.

D'Antoni is a decent coach and has a unique ability to get the most out of mediocre players or turn good players into superstars.

His offense doesn't suit every player though that's why a guy like Melo doesn't look too good under D'Antoni, but that's not D'Antoni's fault.

When a mechanic works for Chevrolet and his boss tells him to replace a Corvette dashboard with a Ford Bronco dashboard it's not his fault that those parts don't fit, it's his bosses fault for giving him the wrong piece and not understanding that a Covertte and a Ford Bronco dashboard don't fit together.

yeah yeah yeah.....all the 2010 star FA was knocking down the Knicks door.
young headcoach Del Negro and headcoach Byron Scott prove Dantoni isnt
worthy to be their assistant coach assistant.
Wake-up....this is 2012 in New York MSG, its no longer
2005-6 Nash/Marion/Stat Phoenix Suns daze
 

Red

TYPE-A
Don't get it twisted

This is amazing...

Posters arguing about high & low % shots:

As if we haven't had front row seats to the chuck fest in prior games. Keeping it simple (for all my non-ball players), do you recall games when we shot 30+ 3's? Do you recall how up and down we were; how even when we made them at high %'s we lost...recall? It was not an anomaly. We know this because a) it has happened frequently in the past b) it continued although we were struggling.

That was coaching!

Players right under our noses:

Please recall Anthony Randolph, Marbury, and Mozgov (to name a few). What do they have in common? They all had talent, all had what we lacked, all over-looked. Recall Mozgov in particular. Remember why he got extended minutes. Remember what our defensive ratings were, rebound rankings, and the toll it took on players like Stat forced to play out-of-position.

Mozgov like Lin are PROOF that Mike sold you guys a bill of goods, yet had no clue. If he did, those instances wouldn't be. This is furthered by the fact that Mike overlooked many quality draft picks. Hard to be an offensive genius when you are a novice talent evaluator.

Jeremy Lin:

The statistics say, since Lin we have increased our scoring, increased our scoring in the paint (high %), gotten Tyson involved more and shot way less threes.

Because of the FACTS listed above (high vs low % shots, inaccurate talent evaluation) there is too much evidence that leads to the conclusion that coach is not what he seems.

We had trouble playing fundamentally sound; poor passing, poor defense, unable to exploit our strengths. Forcing and making poor decisions like Toney Douglas' minutes, 40+ three pointer, neglecting minutes for viable big man options in Jerome Jordan in favor of small line-ups...

Until a player came/played that superseded this. Like Chauncey Billups, Lin knows ball, knows how to play inside out. It was because of him and him alone that we are finally winning by playing fundamentally sound. Drive and kick, reduce the threes, draw fouls.

ANYONE WHO CANNOT ADMIT THIS, WHO TRIES TO GIVE THIS CREDIT TO COACH ARE EITHER:

1. Clueless and really have not watched the games or

2. In denile

That being said, I am still willing to give coach some credit. But I know the deal. Its evident and obvious. If coach were who some make him out to be, we wouldn't be here having this discussion.

The lucky, fortunate ascention of Jeremry Lin is what we can attribute this rise toward. His fundamentally sound style has superseded coach's philosophical approach. To think any different is Linsane.

Sabermetrics can't tell me what my eyes and years of observation can. We are winning inspite of D'Antoni, not because of.
 

fender0577

Rotation player
The only thing that's changed for me, is i don't want him fired, until the end of the year.That's it, he's still a terrible coach.:peace:
 

KBlack25

Starter
ha ha ha ha Dantoni winning a NBA championship is like diving off a 20 story
buiding head first hitting concrete and living to talk about it ha ha ha ha ha
Dantoni's flawed coaching wouldnt last a half a season in the NCAA...

To be clear, nobody is saying he will win the title (except for Red in the other thread lol). I am saying that C&P clearly stated IF MDA won a title (so assume he wins the title), he MIGHT CONSIDER toning down his criticism.

If he won an NBA Championship (as long a shot as you think those odds are, assume for a second it happened) - there's no reason to criticize him, and if you DO feel that way then you are coming from a biased place that really kills whatever momentum or strength your argument has.
 

amazinz5

Benchwarmer
How can someone say its all one person and not another? Would lin have set scoring records with any system, for any coach? The only reason were getting into the paint and getting high % shots is because we now have someone capable/willing to get into the paint and get high % shots.


since some of you obviously chose to skip over the logical parts of this thread, i feel it necessary to paste this here:
unless you have significant samples of lin with dantoni, lin with another coach, and dantoni with another pg, you cannot draw conclusions as far as who is responsible for the success strictly from the box score. the truth is they BOTH deserve credit, but i can understand those simple-minded or mentally lazy people needing a simpler explanation like 'its x or its y'
 
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