Mike Woodson to lean on stars

Kiyaman

Legend
Mike Woodson First!

Headcoach Mike Woodson will spend more time in the next couple of weeks working with
our bench-players, getting 3 or 4 bench-players to gell in a lineup using a real system
that involves cutters, slashers, jump-shooters, with alot of movement without the
ball to set double screens. This all involve timing.

Our two assistant coaches (call them what u like) but 9 out of 10 both will be working
on the same system (which involves defense), and the same plays with our Starters,
plus let the starters add their own plays according to oponents weak areas.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Lol @ people on here.

Paying more attention to politics than the actual team.

I guess MDA's decision to force the man who is considered our most talented player...to fit into his system, and make not a single ****ing adjustment, when it wasn't working...was what...good coaching?

Then when Melo, who hasn't been coached by MDA virtually his entire career like Amar'e, shows signs of frustration, and I can reasonably assume he also spoke to Mike about it....we look at Melo like "yo, what gives? BUY IN!!"

Another media term bandied about that people pick up, and regurgitate like a bulimic getting rid of that food.

I'm sorry...when you're doing exactly what you're told...and it's not working, at what point do you say "nah, let's try something else."

As much as people don't wanna hear it, or agree with it...that's actually more of a sign of leadership as apposed to some slap dick asshole that's gonna be a yes-man with the "ok, mhhmm, yep, you want me to....yeah, ok, no problem, yep, ahhhh well if it doesn't work I'll just do it again, yea, fine, no prob."

A star player not being utilized properly in the offense for the sake of an ideology, and "system"; yet he's somehow wrong to be upset...because...I dunno...he's either not meeting some contrived standard that's been set only in the minds of a small faction of people, or because the media keeps saying "let's talk about Carmelo?" So you get people ranting about his FG% without the slightest idea of what's causing the drop in FG% other than "his shots aren't falling, and I can't believe he's not buying in"

Like it or not, you gotta build your team around your stars. When you acquire a star, there's a reason why it's called a "franchise changing move." Hell, the best coaches just switch it up on the fly to accommodate the talent they have, like Greg Popovich. Spurs went from a defensive stalwart, to an up tempo, 3-point shooting, juggernaut last year.

Rosters cultivate your team's philosophy, and identity. You might have your own beliefs, and want to run a different kind of system, but if you don't have the players for it, you have to work with what you have -- even if that means changing your MO for the time being.

Melo is one of, if not the most important component on the roster, once you have him, love it or not, you gotta work with what you have -- not despite what you have.

MDA has his MO, philosophy, and team identity set before he even has his roster. That's ass backwards.



Great Post....:agreed::agreed::agreed:
 

Scipio

Benchwarmer
Great Post....:agreed::agreed::agreed:

Me too. Agreed.

You could see how Dumbphoney wasn`t interested in changing anything by the way he would sub players. what I mean is that he didn`t coach the actual game that was taking place in front of him.

He had his sub patterns and minutes for the players worked out before the game already had started. Every game it was the same no matter what was happening in the actual game. `Melo would always play all the first quarter then sit at the start of the second and so on.

Surely your substitution of players should depend largely on what is happening in the game. He waouls sit players when they were hot and keep players in despite the fact that they were playing terribly. This was because he had already decided on his sub patterns before the game and no matter what happened he never deviated from his pattern which shows what a terrible coach he was. What kind of coach doesn`t actually coach the game in front of him?
 

NYCLakerfan

Rotation player
Lol @ people on here.

Paying more attention to politics than the actual team.

I guess MDA's decision to force the man who is considered our most talented player...to fit into his system, and make not a single ****ing adjustment, when it wasn't working...was what...good coaching?

Then when Melo, who hasn't been coached by MDA virtually his entire career like Amar'e, shows signs of frustration, and I can reasonably assume he also spoke to Mike about it....we look at Melo like "yo, what gives? BUY IN!!"

Another media term bandied about that people pick up, and regurgitate like a bulimic getting rid of that food.

I'm sorry...when you're doing exactly what you're told...and it's not working, at what point do you say "nah, let's try something else."

As much as people don't wanna hear it, or agree with it...that's actually more of a sign of leadership as apposed to some slap dick asshole that's gonna be a yes-man with the "ok, mhhmm, yep, you want me to....yeah, ok, no problem, yep, ahhhh well if it doesn't work I'll just do it again, yea, fine, no prob."

A star player not being utilized properly in the offense for the sake of an ideology, and "system"; yet he's somehow wrong to be upset...because...I dunno...he's either not meeting some contrived standard that's been set only in the minds of a small faction of people, or because the media keeps saying "let's talk about Carmelo?" So you get people ranting about his FG% without the slightest idea of what's causing the drop in FG% other than "his shots aren't falling, and I can't believe he's not buying in"

Like it or not, you gotta build your team around your stars. When you acquire a star, there's a reason why it's called a "franchise changing move." Hell, the best coaches just switch it up on the fly to accommodate the talent they have, like Greg Popovich. Spurs went from a defensive stalwart, to an up tempo, 3-point shooting, juggernaut last year.

Rosters cultivate your team's philosophy, and identity. You might have your own beliefs, and want to run a different kind of system, but if you don't have the players for it, you have to work with what you have -- even if that means changing your MO for the time being.

Melo is one of, if not the most important component on the roster, once you have him, love it or not, you gotta work with what you have -- not despite what you have.

MDA has his MO, philosophy, and team identity set before he even has his roster. That's ass backwards.

Great ****ing post especially the part about Melo showing signs of leadership by not blindly following MDA's system, you really think Kobe or Jordan would try to adjust their games to a system that they don't trust of feel comfortable in I know Melo isn't either of them but thats where he wants to be so it's good he's showed that mind state.
 

kinein

Benchwarmer
Carmelo's statements on his teammate Jeremy Lin this morning. :beer:

Woodson's new offense should give Carmelo Anthony more opportunity to operate in the post, meaning fewer shots for Lin. But Anthony thinks it's premature to predict the end of Linsanity.

"Lin is Lin. I don't think Lin is paying attention to any of that stuff that is going on right now. Lin is about winning. Lin is about this team. Lin is about doing things to help this team win," Anthony said. "As far as the Linsanity thing goes, it's still there. That's not going nowhere."


:gony:


source: http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/sto...jeremy-lin-remain-new-york-knicks-starting-pg
 
Lol @ people on here.

Paying more attention to politics than the actual team.

I guess MDA's decision to force the man who is considered our most talented player...to fit into his system, and make not a single ****ing adjustment, when it wasn't working...was what...good coaching?

Then when Melo, who hasn't been coached by MDA virtually his entire career like Amar'e, shows signs of frustration, and I can reasonably assume he also spoke to Mike about it....we look at Melo like "yo, what gives? BUY IN!!"

Another media term bandied about that people pick up, and regurgitate like a bulimic getting rid of that food.

I'm sorry...when you're doing exactly what you're told...and it's not working, at what point do you say "nah, let's try something else."

As much as people don't wanna hear it, or agree with it...that's actually more of a sign of leadership as apposed to some slap dick asshole that's gonna be a yes-man with the "ok, mhhmm, yep, you want me to....yeah, ok, no problem, yep, ahhhh well if it doesn't work I'll just do it again, yea, fine, no prob."

A star player not being utilized properly in the offense for the sake of an ideology, and "system"; yet he's somehow wrong to be upset...because...I dunno...he's either not meeting some contrived standard that's been set only in the minds of a small faction of people, or because the media keeps saying "let's talk about Carmelo?" So you get people ranting about his FG% without the slightest idea of what's causing the drop in FG% other than "his shots aren't falling, and I can't believe he's not buying in"

Like it or not, you gotta build your team around your stars. When you acquire a star, there's a reason why it's called a "franchise changing move." Hell, the best coaches just switch it up on the fly to accommodate the talent they have, like Greg Popovich. Spurs went from a defensive stalwart, to an up tempo, 3-point shooting, juggernaut last year.

Rosters cultivate your team's philosophy, and identity. You might have your own beliefs, and want to run a different kind of system, but if you don't have the players for it, you have to work with what you have -- even if that means changing your MO for the time being.

Melo is one of, if not the most important component on the roster, once you have him, love it or not, you gotta work with what you have -- not despite what you have.

MDA has his MO, philosophy, and team identity set before he even has his roster. That's ass backwards.

+1,000,000 rep
 

TheChosen1

Benchwarmer
Shouldnt it have always been this way? Why get Superstars and not focus the offense around them? Doesn't make sense. Im not going to get carried away until a few more games under Woodson. But he has been saying all the right things and his approach is so much more different than Dantoni. When it comes down to it. If our Stars are happy then our team plays better and we WIN games. Period.
 

red32

Benchwarmer
BUT, wasn't Melo playing PG before he got hurt? So he was the focus of the offensive/running the offensive, right? And how did that turn out? So are we saying that he's been unhappy ever since he got here? Hmm... Could this whole thing just be a case of the post-purchase rationalization?
 

nuckles2k2

Superstar
BUT, wasn't Melo playing PG before he got hurt? So he was the focus of the offensive/running the offensive, right? And how did that turn out? So are we saying that he's been unhappy ever since he got here? Hmm... Could this whole thing just be a case of the post-purchase rationalization?

These are the posts I'm talking about...what's going on around here?

Melo was asked to play point forward...but he's not a point forward. Then when Lin emerged and he got back, he was asked to space the court by hanging out on the perimeter, near the 3-point line, and be ready to catch and shoot.

Not one off-ball screen was set for him, he had no plays called for him in the post. When he got the ball, Isoed, and observed the floor as he likes to do...no one was moving, because it wasn't the play call, the play is for him to catch and shoot. He stood there looking at everyone, and everyone stood there looking at him, at that point in time they're expecting to either walk or run back up the court off of a made basket or transition D.

MDA looked at this, and said "shoot the ball, come on, lets go lets go lets go lets go" as opposed to "maybe I should work some scripted isolations into the game plan for Melo."

Post-purchase rationalization assumes that we've never seen Melo at Syracuse, Denver, or with Team USA, and we can't identify the strengths and weaknesses of his game.

Ask yourself this: maybe some people were constantly rationalizing his being misused in this offense.

I'm cool with those who question his effort, defensive awareness (these silly fouls have to stop), and I guess you can throw body language in there...I dunno how much his teammates are saying "god damn...Melo is sagging his shoulders dawg..." but I guess it's a bad look to have in front of fans.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
BUT, wasn't Melo playing PG before he got hurt? So he was the focus of the offensive/running the offensive, right? And how did that turn out? So are we saying that he's been unhappy ever since he got here? Hmm... Could this whole thing just be a case of the post-purchase rationalization?

Lebron left Cleveland for that main reason
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Me too. Agreed.

You could see how Dumbphoney wasn`t interested in changing anything by the way he would sub players. what I mean is that he didn`t coach the actual game that was taking place in front of him.

He had his sub patterns and minutes for the players worked out before the game already had started. Every game it was the same no matter what was happening in the actual game. `Melo would always play all the first quarter then sit at the start of the second and so on.

Surely your substitution of players should depend largely on what is happening in the game. He waouls sit players when they were hot and keep players in despite the fact that they were playing terribly. This was because he had already decided on his sub patterns before the game and no matter what happened he never deviated from his pattern which shows what a terrible coach he was. What kind of coach doesn`t actually coach the game in front of him?


Alright, another Great Post....:agreed:
u got Dantoni's game-coaching down-pact :agreed:
 

red32

Benchwarmer
These are the posts I'm talking about...what's going on around here?

Melo was asked to play point forward...but he's not a point forward. Then when Lin emerged and he got back, he was asked to space the court by hanging out on the perimeter, near the 3-point line, and be ready to catch and shoot.

Not one off-ball screen was set for him, he had no plays called for him in the post. When he got the ball, Isoed, and observed the floor as he likes to do...no one was moving, because it wasn't the play call, the play is for him to catch and shoot. He stood there looking at everyone, and everyone stood there looking at him, at that point in time they're expecting to either walk or run back up the court off of a made basket or transition D.

MDA looked at this, and said "shoot the ball, come on, lets go lets go lets go lets go" as opposed to "maybe I should work some scripted isolations into the game plan for Melo."

Post-purchase rationalization assumes that we've never seen Melo at Syracuse, Denver, or with Team USA, and we can't identify the strengths and weaknesses of his game.

Ask yourself this: maybe some people were constantly rationalizing his being misused in this offense.

I'm cool with those who question his effort, defensive awareness (these silly fouls have to stop), and I guess you can throw body language in there...I dunno how much his teammates are saying "god damn...Melo is sagging his shoulders dawg..." but I guess it's a bad look to have in front of fans.

I understand the offense was different after he rejoined the team, fine. What about before that? Melo handled the ball, and he was the focus of the offensive, but yet, it didn't really go anywhere.

If you do take a look at the whole time when he was in Denver, how much did they go in the playoffs? And really, what does team USA have anything to do with anything? It was a all-star team.

Just how much adjustment does a team have to make for ONE player for that player to perform?!

I'm not taking D'Antoni's side. Really I'm not. I'm just saying that let's do take a look at this player, with what we "paid" to get him, maybe, and maybe, we paid way too much for a player that's just not really that good (OK, if you will, under performed), and we are trying to make excuses for the decision (purchase)?
 

nuckles2k2

Superstar
I understand the offense was different after he rejoined the team, fine. What about before that? Melo handled the ball, and he was the focus of the offensive, but yet, it didn't really go anywhere.

If you do take a look at the whole time when he was in Denver, how much did they go in the playoffs? And really, what does team USA have anything to do with anything? It was a all-star team.

Just how much adjustment does a team have to make for ONE player for that player to perform?!

I'm not taking D'Antoni's side. Really I'm not. I'm just saying that let's do take a look at this player, with what we "paid" to get him, maybe, and maybe, we paid way too much for a player that's just not really that good (OK, if you will, under performed), and we are trying to make excuses for the decision (purchase)?

Still not playing to his strengths, so it's the same situation. Asking a player who isn't a point forward...to play point forward, is not playing to his strengths.

It's not a situation where people are making excuses, it's a situation where we know what Carmelo does well, and he was not afforded the opportunity to do those things...because of the schematics of the offense.

It's like taking Dwight Howard out of the paint, and wondering why he isn't performing. Well...he's a center, he operates in the paint...if he's not in the paint...he's not playing to his strengths.

When Melo isolates, he needs movement off the ball to create driving angles, passing angles, etc.

IMG_0361.jpg


What is the rest of the team doing right there? Why is everyone looking at Melo? Notice the shot clock, 12 seconds have elapsed, so that's not a quick, heat check shot.

12 seconds went by, Melo got the ball behind the 3-pt line....why is he still behind the 3 point line 12 seconds into the possession? Why is everyone else is on the same side of the court, save for Bibby who's in the corner.

If your analysis of that play is that "he should have hit the shot" then we're not even reading the same book, so we're definitely not on the same page.
 

red32

Benchwarmer
Still not playing to his strengths, so it's the same situation. Asking a player who isn't a point forward...to play point forward, is not playing to his strengths.

It's not a situation where people are making excuses, it's a situation where we know what Carmelo does well, and he was not afforded the opportunity to do those things...because of the schematics of the offense.

It's like taking Dwight Howard out of the paint, and wondering why he isn't performing. Well...he's a center, he operates in the paint...if he's not in the paint...he's not playing to his strengths.

When Melo isolates, he needs movement off the ball to create driving angles, passing angles, etc.

IMG_0361.jpg


What is the rest of the team doing right there? Why is everyone looking at Melo? Notice the shot clock, 12 seconds have elapsed, so that's not a quick, heat check shot.

12 seconds went by, Melo got the ball behind the 3-pt line....why is he still behind the 3 point line 12 seconds into the possession? Why is everyone else is on the same side of the court, save for Bibby who's in the corner.

If your analysis of that play is that "he should have hit the shot" then we're not even reading the same book, so we're definitely not on the same page.

Well, it's just that. How much do we have to do for him? Not this. Oh not that either.

I was saying that he was handling the ball, so he could easier get to his comfort place, ISO, and whatever. You can't say that he wasn't getting enough touches or not getting the ball.

Your screen cap shows a lot - when you ISO, what happens most of the time is other players would just fan out (to give you room). What happens? They become bystanders. And why is he shooting a 3-pt w/12 sec left on the clock?!

No, I'm not saying that "he should've hit the shot." It's his playing style and the overall salary-to-performance ratio that I'm questioning.

I do hope that he starts playing, or start playing better, now that D'Antoni is gone, and the Knicks get back on track. Assuming that Woodson doesn't get to be the head coach next year, and we get Jackson or whoever as the new head guy. I don't wanna hear the same old song about he's playing under another new offensive system when he's not performing.
 

DrB

Benchwarmer
When I see the members with 3000 plus posts POSTING

Great Post....:agreed::agreed::agreed:

I see the knowledgeable guys here who get it posting....WELL SAID ALL...
Big away game tonight..We win I am a believer...DrB
 

LA KNICKS GUY

Benchwarmer
If Stat and Melo can put up all-star numbers, I don't really care what type of system Woodson deploys.
That's the issue many posters are ignoring in this thread. Our "stars" haven't been playing like stars. And when that is pointed out, these people bring up Melo and Stat's past accomplishments. What matters is now and the future.
 

CA7

Scoring Champ
That's the issue many posters are ignoring in this thread. Our "stars" haven't been playing like stars. And when that is pointed out, these people bring up Melo and Stat's past accomplishments. What matters is now and the future.

Up to this point they've been forced to be role players which was a big problem
 

VeryGundy

Benchwarmer
That's the issue many posters are ignoring in this thread. Our "stars" haven't been playing like stars. And when that is pointed out, these people bring up Melo and Stat's past accomplishments. What matters is now and the future.

I am almost positive that Melo would bounce back and dominate again. I can't say the same about Stat. He seemed to have lost some of his explosiveness.
 
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