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Thread: What if the Knicks lose out on Woodson in the offseason waiting for Phil Jackson?

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    Veteran knicksin60's Avatar
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    Default What if the Knicks lose out on Woodson in the offseason waiting for Phil Jackson?

    I know it's still too early to be talking about what will go down in the offseason and we still have to see what the Knicks would do under Woodson in a playoff series, but if Phil Jackson takes a long time to make a decision on whether he is never going to coach in the NBA again or whether he is going to come out of retirement to coach the Knicks do you think that there is a great chance that the Knicks miss out on Woodson due to another team snatching him up throughout this waiting process?

    The last thing that the Knicks would need is for them to wait on Phil Jackson, lose out on giving Woodson a contract and then get turned down by Phil. A number of things need to happen in order for this terrible scenario to take place. But if the Knicks continue to play good basketball in the regular season and at least play one competitive playoff series the only way that they should choose to go in the direction of Phil Jackson is if he agrees to coach the Knicks within a couple of weeks after they get eliminated from the postseason.

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    Veteran p0nder's Avatar
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    My prediction is that the knicks win all the games left on the schedule, sweep through the playoffs, wins the championship and re-sign Woodson as reigning HCotY. Woody goes on to coach the knicks to 12 straight titles and supplants PJax as best ever.. Dolan then sells Woody the team and as overseer of the entire blueprint manages the knicks into the most successful sports franchise of all time. The team dominates the competition in every game, going on Globetrotter like streaks. But that's just how I see it going down.

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    2010: LeBron! King! WE WANT BRON! WE WANT KING! - Knicks landed Amare
    2011: CP3! PAUL! CHRIS! NY BIG THREE! - Knicks landed Tyson
    2012: PHIL! JAX! THE CHAMP! END WHERE IT ALL STARTED! - Knicks extend Woody

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    Originally Posted by p0nder
    My prediction is that the knicks win all the games left on the schedule, sweep through the playoffs, wins the championship and re-sign Woodson as reigning HCotY. Woody goes on to coach the knicks to 12 straight titles and supplants PJax as best ever.. Dolan then sells Woody the team and as overseer of the entire blueprint manages the knicks into the most successful sports franchise of all time. The team dominates the competition in every game, going on Globetrotter like streaks. But that's just how I see it going down.
    That doesnt seem too farfetched! could totally seeing it happen as long as jeffries injury doesnt last too long.

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    Heh I think its funny how mediocre coaches like Woodson and Doc Rivers get so much credit because of their players. Woodson is basically running a slightly modified version of the same Dantoni offense. Our "star" players are just more motivated now as is what happens with many coaching changes.

    He is my OPINION. Woodson is a great coach for getting our players motivated and actually trying to win again. He is not a brilliant playmaker or tactician. What is the difference? Coaches like Woodson are great for underachieving teams. Coaches like Phil Jackson are great for mature teams having to play chess with the opposing coach in a brutal 7 game playoff stretch.

    Playoffs are where great coaches make a difference. The adjustments a coach makes as well as counters to the opposing coaches moves are all vital to winning a close playoff game.

    So my conclusion?

    Woodson is great for us right now in the regular season to rally our players, but he needs very strong assistant coaches (like Doc Rivers did) to make a mark in the playoffs. Don't ride the wave into thinking he's our long term solution quite yet though. Remember Avery Johnson with the Mavs? Thats EXACTLY whats happening with us. Avery got players motivated in the regular season, but got toasted in the finals. Rick Carlisle is the one who out-coached the opponents into winning the championship.

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    Originally Posted by iJoe
    Heh I think its funny how mediocre coaches like Woodson and Doc Rivers get so much credit because of their players. Woodson is basically running a slightly modified version of the same Dantoni offense. Our "star" players are just more motivated now as is what happens with many coaching changes.

    He is my OPINION. Woodson is a great coach for getting our players motivated and actually trying to win again. He is not a brilliant playmaker or tactician. What is the difference? Coaches like Woodson are great for underachieving teams. Coaches like Phil Jackson are great for mature teams having to play chess with the opposing coach in a brutal 7 game playoff stretch.

    Playoffs are where great coaches make a difference. The adjustments a coach makes as well as counters to the opposing coaches moves are all vital to winning a close playoff game.

    So my conclusion?

    Woodson is great for us right now in the regular season to rally our players, but he needs very strong assistant coaches (like Doc Rivers did) to make a mark in the playoffs. Don't ride the wave into thinking he's our long term solution quite yet though. Remember Avery Johnson with the Mavs? Thats EXACTLY whats happening with us. Avery got players motivated in the regular season, but got toasted in the finals. Rick Carlisle is the one who out-coached the opponents into winning the championship.
    i see your point about adjustments being important, but have you been watching the same games lately. Is there a more radical adjustment than sitting tyson chandler for the entire fourth quarter ?

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    ^You are saying Rick Carlise is a better coach then Woodson? but in the same breath, coaches get too much credit for the players on the floor?

    I thought Woodson has taken d'antoni's offense and has given it light and direction. Including much better clock management and sophisticated situational half court offensive sets. He has been implementing his defense from the start of the season but you see the commitment to D that STAT and Melo are exerting now. Woodson is doing all of the right things to win, including the things it will take in the post season to bring us to the promised land. He has this team in playoff mode right now and if they keep this level of play and focus going they can win it all. I support the coach and see no reason to go looking for his replacement just yet.. seeing how he hasn't lost a game and all.

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    Originally Posted by p0nder
    ^You are saying Rick Carlise is a better coach then Woodson? but in the same breath, coaches get too much credit for the players on the floor?

    I thought Woodson has taken d'antoni's offense and has given it light and direction. Including much better clock management and sophisticated situational half court offensive sets. He has been implementing his defense from the start of the season but you see the commitment to D that STAT and Melo are exerting now. Woodson is doing all of the right things to win, including the things it will take in the post season to bring us to the promised land. He has this team in playoff mode right now and if they keep this level of play and focus going they can win it all. I support the coach and see no reason to go looking for his replacement just yet.. seeing how he hasn't lost a game and all.
    You missed my point. I basically said coaches like Woodson are great for underachieving teams in the regular season. Coaches like Carlisle are great for getting teams over the hump in the playoffs. There is a big difference when you're in a 7 game grind playing the same team over and over. The players don't change, the coaching adjustments do.

    By no means am I saying Woodson is a bad coach. He is perfect for us now, but in my opinion he's not necessarily the best long term.

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    The thing is this team has no excuse to be underachieving. In all honesty this roster is STACKED. Apparently $$$ weren't enough motivation to get these guys playing. I just want to see if Woodson can keep up the good work. Let's just see what they can do in the playoffs.

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    Mediocre coach is how to describe D'Antoni. Good coaches should lead, good coaches should motivate, good coaches should make in-game adjustments, all stuff I see from Woody.

    I hope Dolan has an open mind and doesn't get caught up in the trap of bringing in a celebrity coach like PJ and give him a 5yr/50M deal and ignore what Woodson has done so far in turning around this team. If Woody wins the division and gets us to the 2nd round it should be his job to keep.

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    The Knicks don't need Phil Jackson. Jackson is another celebrity coach. Jackson had the best talent in the world, when he won those championships.

    Mike Woodson is turning Anthony into a point forward and Stoudemire into an aggressive player on both ends(two things I thought was not possible).

    I think Woodson must have done a lot of yelling in the lockeroom to get the team to respond like this.

    The Knicks now have a legitimate big 4: Lin(Starbury 2.0), Anthony, Stoudemire, and Chandler

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    Originally Posted by abcd
    The Knicks don't need Phil Jackson. Jackson is another celebrity coach. Jackson had the best talent in the world, when he won those championships.

    Mike Woodson is turning Anthony into a point forward and Stoudemire into an aggressive player on both ends(two things I thought was not possible).

    I think Woodson must have done a lot of yelling in the lockeroom to get the team to respond like this.

    The Knicks now have a legitimate big 4: Lin(Starbury 2.0), Anthony, Stoudemire, and Chandler
    He's turning Anthony into a point forward?

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    The point you are making iJoe seems to be that Carlise is a better coach then Woody. Or that Woody wouldn't be able to coach our team to a chip, but a PJax or a Rick Carlise or a Gregg Popps might.

    I disagree and it's because of the talent Woody has dealt with vs. the talent Rick works with. If you compare Woody's Hawks team to Carlise's Mav's team the differences in personnel are glaring, yet woody always coached a competetive group in ATL with sub-par talent. Rick wasn't the difference in the Mav's getting the chip. Tyson Chandler was (ask Dirk).


    I don't understand your motivation for a coaching change in the midst of a 5 game winning streak and a rejuvenated effort from the players? I think we should give Woodson every opportunity to fail us and if he doesn't then why would we ever get rid of him? Do you honestly not believe that woody could win it all with this group? I could see that argument with D'ant's "system" coaching but with a true game manager on the bench I believe this group is poised for greatness.

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    Okay, I think we should all contact Dolan and threaten him to keep Woodson!!

    Or, we can all contact MSG, and threaten them!!


    Seriously, here's their contact info:

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    Originally Posted by p0nder
    The point you are making iJoe seems to be that Carlise is a better coach then Woody. Or that Woody wouldn't be able to coach our team to a chip, but a PJax or a Rick Carlise or a Gregg Popps might.

    I disagree and it's because of the talent Woody has dealt with vs. the talent Rick works with. If you compare Woody's Hawks team to Carlise's Mav's team the differences in personnel are glaring, yet woody always coached a competetive group in ATL with sub-par talent. Rick wasn't the difference in the Mav's getting the chip. Tyson Chandler was (ask Dirk).


    I don't understand your motivation for a coaching change in the midst of a 5 game winning streak and a rejuvenated effort from the players? I think we should give Woodson every opportunity to fail us and if he doesn't then why would we ever get rid of him? Do you honestly not believe that woody could win it all with this group? I could see that argument with D'ant's "system" coaching but with a true game manager on the bench I believe this group is poised for greatness.
    Never said we should change coaches now. In fact, I think that's a terrible idea. However, down the line, we might need another refresher to get us "over the hump" when it comes to actually competing for the championship. I'm not convinced that Woody is a great coach until I see how he makes adjustments in the playoffs.

    I'll admit that I'm a bit biased because I absolutely HATED how the Hawks used to play. Their game was so ugly and based completely on athleticism and lots of ISOs. I'll be willing to admit I'm wrong in the future, but for now I'd say its foolish to put all our eggs in one basket so early.

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