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Thread: Ball movement vs. Iso melo? Question for you BALLERS in the know.

  1. #61
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    I agree, Iso-Melo should be used in the 4th quarter once all around team offense is already established in the game. Once the other players respect the offensive abilities of each an individual player, Iso Melo would be so much more effective because the defense would have to respect everyone else.

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    We need effective ball movement!! We need to stop chucking up shots when there's no more time left on the shot clock.

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    The knicks doesn't need to play melo iso at all and stick with moving the ball around in the offensive sets.The reason I say the knicks don't need no melo iso is b/c melo can score anywhere and anytime on the court.He would still get 30 points a game if they would completely do away with the melo iso. Its hard for the rest of the players to get in rythem b/c they don't have the opportunity to shoot the ball and get in rythem.Thats exactly why you don't see four or five players in double figures scoring.Run the offense like they did at the start of the season with ball movement and you will see more scoring from more guys and a lot more wins.

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    Originally Posted by WVKnickfan
    The knicks doesn't need to play melo iso at all and stick with moving the ball around in the offensive sets.The reason I say the knicks don't need no melo iso is b/c melo can score anywhere and anytime on the court.He would still get 30 points a game if they would completely do away with the melo iso. Its hard for the rest of the players to get in rythem b/c they don't have the opportunity to shoot the ball and get in rythem.Thats exactly why you don't see four or five players in double figures scoring.Run the offense like they did at the start of the season with ball movement and you will see more scoring from more guys and a lot more wins.
    Makes sense.

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    While I agree that iso-Melo all 4 quarters makes us one dimensional and easy to read, a couple of things come to mind...
    1- It is absolutely necessary for the role players to take charge in the first couple of quarters. I would like to see plays that don't even involve Melo... that are centered around Felton, Prigs and Chandler. To New York's point then the offense is well established for the iso-Melo driven late quarters (thanks to Kiman for helping me see that with Bernard and Patrick's supporting cast)
    2- Remember when Woody was playing Melo and STAT together? The first 3-4 plays in the beginning of the game were geared towards STAT to get him going early! If STAT is not going to start someone else needs to be that center of attention to get the pressure off of Melo.
    3- The supporting staff has gotta want to be part of the game. I have seen too many times the support guys just pass to Melo and stand on the corners. No movement without the ball just waiting for Melo to do his thing. This is the aspect of iso-Melo that we all hate and it doesn't have to be that way. Move without the ball, set some picks and trust that Melo will not always just take the shot. He can get his assist up as well if the supporting cast is open and looking for a shot. But they gotta want it.

    Felton get's it.... Prigs get's it. I'm not sure yet about Tyson yet but I hope tonight he does as well

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    Originally Posted by jimkcchief88
    Skisloper and fellow Melo haters(kiya,wv,drb...) We are going to have to agree to disagree, but let me give a couple of stats from Sunday's game to expose the blind "Melo-iso-Haterade". Prigioni: 0 points in 21 minutes. T Chandler: 4 points/ 3 REBOUNDS. Jason Kidd: 16 minutes, ZERO POINTS/ONE ASSIST, JR: 4/15 from the field in 33 minutes(Starks like performance at least he got to the line). Melo: 27 points/ 11 REBOUNDS. Tyson, Kmart, and JR had 11 BOARDS COMBINED. And you haters want to blame the team leader in points AND REBOUNDS for Sundays loss????? C'mon man. That's why CA7 tried to tell y'all you don't know what you are talking about. Melo-haters blind Haterade makes you blind to the FACTS. It ain't MELO's fault that outside of Feltip(who y'all didn't want in favor of Lin), the rest of the team pulled a NO-SHOW on Sunday. Pray the rest of the team shows up tonight to SUPPORT MELO instead of blindly blaming our team MVP who just won a scoring title. And I put that on CHIEF!!!!


    NOT A melo hater..........just hate that a guy of his ability just does not do the other things amd fouces too much on ISO ball......
    You amaze me........Melo could take a crap on the floor and you would praise him...

    You are right Melo is King

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    Big Chief if you will pick and choose statistics from different games then you should mention his misses 3's in game 4 and his missed foul shots to lock the Knicks in a sweep of the Celtics.....

    All we are saying is the Knicks need to move the ball.......Why are u so dead against this.......

    Now the question is .....Is Big Chief really Woody in disguise.

    BTW we all be thrilled if melo scores 50 tonight and shoots 45%......But if scores 50 and shoots 30% there is a more effeicient way to get those baskets.....

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    Originally Posted by CA7
    If anyone thinks "ISO-ball" is why we lost game 1 you have no understanding of the game of basketball

    Melo not only had the highest +/- but when he went out in the 3rd quarter the Pacers lead shot up to 16 points

    Melo had 1/3 of our rebounds, got no help on the glass, we had no help side defense and sucked in transition

    but if you guys wanna blame iso-ball then go ahead, hope it makes you feel better

    because Miami the best ball moving team in the league just lost, guess it was because of iso-ball too
    isolation ball works if you have a shooter like Curry who is lethal shooter...Carmelo can neither penetrate perfectly into the paint by himself nor can he take contested shots and make them easily...

    Carmelo missed 18 shots this game, Lebron missed 22 shots the entire first round

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    Originally Posted by skisloper
    Big Chief if you will pick and choose statistics from different games then you should mention his misses 3's in game 4 and his missed foul shots to lock the Knicks in a sweep of the Celtics.....

    All we are saying is the Knicks need to move the ball.......Why are u so dead against this.......

    Now the question is .....Is Big Chief really Woody in disguise.

    BTW we all be thrilled if melo scores 50 tonight and shoots 45%......But if scores 50 and shoots 30% there is a more effeicient way to get those baskets.....
    If Melo gets 50 and we win who cares about%%%%

  10. #70
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    Originally Posted by skisloper
    Big Chief if you will pick and choose statistics from different games then you should mention his misses 3's in game 4 and his missed foul shots to lock the Knicks in a sweep of the Celtics.....

    All we are saying is the Knicks need to move the ball.......Why are u so dead against this.......

    Now the question is .....Is Big Chief really Woody in disguise.

    BTW we all be thrilled if melo scores 50 tonight and shoots 45%......But if scores 50 and shoots 30% there is a more effeicient way to get those baskets.....
    But the Woody in disguise I will take as a compliment.....real talk tho I am happy about this team, try living in Chicago being a Knicks fan during the second Bulls run....I don't live in NYC so I don't hear all the negative stuff....I am just happy to break out my KNICKS stuff and rep...haven't won a playoff series wins in over a decade, the steph debacle...Isaiah, KNICKS fans have suffered enough

  11. #71
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    Originally Posted by skisloper
    Big Chief if you will pick and choose statistics from different games then you should mention his misses 3's in game 4 and his missed foul shots to lock the Knicks in a sweep of the Celtics.....

    All we are saying is the Knicks need to move the ball.......Why are u so dead against this.......

    Now the question is .....Is Big Chief really Woody in disguise.

    BTW we all be thrilled if melo scores 50 tonight and shoots 45%......But if scores 50 and shoots 30% there is a more effeicient way to get those baskets.....
    Saying we need to move the ball is like telling a hockey player we have to skate; it's like telling a cyclist he has to pedal; it's like telling a driver he has to steer. DUH! I mean after an analysis this is what people are coming up with? Really?

    Originally Posted by jimkcchief88
    But the Woody in disguise I will take as a compliment.....real talk tho I am happy about this team, try living in Chicago being a Knicks fan during the second Bulls run....I don't live in NYC so I don't hear all the negative stuff....I am just happy to break out my KNICKS stuff and rep...haven't won a playoff series wins in over a decade, the steph debacle...Isaiah, KNICKS fans have suffered enough
    In their support, meaning those fans that watch the game and those who've actually played, they haven't had a Melo since forever. They got use to a team of B players overachieving and before that a big-man star in Ewing where the true scoring bigs have been phased out.

    They don't know what a Melo is supposed to do nor a team with him. To them it's either iso or ball movement, both extreme. It's about balance and exploiting match-ups. So forgive them.. for they know not what they say.

    Melo he gutted it out through a serious injury. He's a warrior and that's what you want. We got another warrior trying to make it back off the shelf too, with time to heal up. I'm bout to order some hyperbaric chambers!

    Melo is the only legit shot we got at a chip. Period.

    Ask the Nuggets and Clippers.

  12. #72
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    Melo + Stat + Felton. We shouldn't be lacking on offense anymore. We just need to keep up the D.

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    I hope JR gets less time and hopefully other shooters will get a chance to see some minutes. JR can be awesome when he gets going but he's been inconsistent.

  14. #74
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    Originally Posted by Red
    Saying we need to move the ball is like telling a hockey player we have to skate; it's like telling a cyclist he has to pedal; it's like telling a driver he has to steer. DUH! I mean after an analysis this is what people are coming up with? Really?



    In their support, meaning those fans that watch the game and those who've actually played, they haven't had a Melo since forever. They got use to a team of B players overachieving and before that a big-man star in Ewing where the true scoring bigs have been phased out.

    They don't know what a Melo is supposed to do nor a team with him. To them it's either iso or ball movement, both extreme. It's about balance and exploiting match-ups. So forgive them.. for they know not what they say.

    Melo he gutted it out through a serious injury. He's a warrior and that's what you want. We got another warrior trying to make it back off the shelf too, with time to heal up. I'm bout to order some hyperbaric chambers!

    Melo is the only legit shot we got at a chip. Period.

    Ask the Nuggets and Clippers.


    Say what you may...........Minus JR's minutes it seems KIYAMAN was coaching tonight not woody....

    Today's game was a perfect illustration of how moving the ball and getting all players involved benefits Melo and therefore the Knicks......

  15. #75
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    Originally Posted by skisloper
    Say what you may...........Minus JR's minutes it seems KIYAMAN was coaching tonight not woody....

    Today's game was a perfect illustration of how moving the ball and getting all players involved benefits Melo and therefore the Knicks......
    Yep.

    We moved the ball. We bounced it. We shot it. We hugged it. We rebounded it too.

    The formula is set and simple.

    Get Melo (our star, best scorer, biggest offensive threat) going early (see: Melo comes off staggered screen, free throw extended); then everyone fills in when needed. Melo is the first priority. Without him it'll be a long night.

    And how HE wants it is how HE gets it. So if he feels like triple threat and isolating, then fine. If he catches in rhythm, fine. If they double down, kick out. If they take the option away, P&R. It's simple yet effective, but it takes parts. A break down in a part causes a domino effect. It's not ball movement or lack thereof. You saw the stats above?

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