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Thread: Stat have to leave?

  1. #16
    Veteran nyk_nyk's Avatar
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    STAT isn't going anywhere. WE all know that. IF he is healthy next season, then Woody will have to fit him into the starting lineup. I doubt Dolan wants a player averaging 20 min while making $20 MIL. Amare is just a sad story but hopefully we can get something out of him since he is clogging up the cap.

  2. #17
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    Originally Posted by donchris
    Fans forget that one of the reasons Melo landed here was because of the presence of Stats. Loyalty aside, buying him out doesn't make much sense. I get freeing up the cap space but there is not an abundance of dominate big men out there waiting to be signed.

    Playing Melo at the PF position was a bad idea.
    Sure it worked for a lot of games during the regular season, but Melo is not a post up player. Nether is Chandler. This is where a healthy Amare can be particularly useful. Maybe Amare is finished, but we should allow him one injury free season to see if the experiment works. As long as Melo isn't jacking up 40 shots per game there's no reason that they can't play together since Chandler doesn't need the ball to be effective, as long as he's not paying against a much younger and more athletic center.

    I'm beginning to question Woody's judgement.
    Good coach, no doubt. He bought the team further than we've been in 13 years. But giving the keys to JR is something that I don't get. Again, like letting Melo run wild at the PF position, it worked and the Knicks made a nice run out of it. But just because you can rob banks and get rich doesn't make it a good idea. One of Melo's gifts is he's an oversized small forward. Putting him up against larger, stronger PFs regularly took its toll.

    I love the addition of Martin. Get him, Chandler and Shumpert on the floor at once seems like a great move defensively. JR reminds me of Jamal Crawford. Great shooter that sometimes makes poor decisions. If his time is limited he can be very effective. But you don't give him 34 mins per game and let him go 5 for 17. Woody should have pulled him after his 8th or 10th miss in a row.
    Agreed 100%, Melo playing the 4 was a huge mistake. Woodson was playing the regular season instead of developing playoff scenarios. It's nice to win and get a good seeding, but not at the expense of exposing your weaknesses which was rebounding. Does that mean you go with KMart/Copeland or outside the organization for a legit 4. Either way that needs to be addressed, going with a more standard lineup with Felton and Shump in the backcourt. Don't know how the 4 spot will be addressed without the MLE, assuming that goes to JR on his reported 4 year deal.

  3. #18
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    Originally Posted by uber
    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    Interesting article on our "big 3".

    And no, i don't want him to leave. Would love to see a healthy season of Melo, STAT and Tyson and for them to actually co exist on the floor.
    Problem is his health, get healthy from training camp day and work the chemistry.

  4. #19
    Member BananaSauce's Avatar
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    stat likes to chase that unicorn. he's got to play and think like this guy stat needs to become a defensive and rebound monster is the only way the big 3 can coexist. that dream shake wont help the chemistry.

  5. #20
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    I don't even understand how this is a topic.

    He's here to stay.

  6. #21
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    there are still a few ways to move Stat, if the Knicks play their cards right...

    1. Stat would get that extension to his final two years in a rework deal, the team would pony up a sizable signing bonus while adding two additional years to lower his annual salary... Makes it more appealing for another team to take a chance on him in a trade...

    2. In any trade the Knicks would have to pony up cash incentives to move Amare's large unreasonable contract...

    I can see the first one being done, b/c it seems more viable that a team like San Antonio, or Cleveland could utilize him to where they have a need for depth at that position...

  7. #22
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    GMF1369

    Everything you are suggesting cannot be done and will not be done....no team wants amare for 40 million over the next 2 years no matter what,,,,The NBA makes it very simple to understand.......

    Amare gets paid approx 20 million each of the next 2 years,,,,,,period. No matter what team has him.

  8. #23
    Lurker BoogerSykes's Avatar
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    Amare isn't going anywhere, has no trade value what so ever, he's hogging up all the funds, and he won't retire regardless of what his body is telling him. We have to just hope he does well next year, and put him on the market and see if we can get ay offers.

  9. #24
    Veteran bigapple's Avatar
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    no one will want some1 who dont play D

  10. #25
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    Can we close this thread. I can't do a summer of this

    Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

  11. #26
    Veteran Wargames's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by knicksince 93
    Can we close this thread. I can't do a summer of this

    Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2
    agreed nothing good will come from this exercise in futility

  12. #27
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    In my opinion, the issue is the coaching and leadership. The leadership has to make everyone on the team feel like they are an important piece to the puzzle. If the Knicks learn to function as a team, trust each other to put in the work, then there should be no problems in team work between the people we have. The Knicks are going to have to learn how to make their offensive system work because it seems like we are stuck with the players we have. Woody should allow Stat be a starter and finally let Melo, Felton, Tyson, Stat, and Shump to mesh together. Once the offense becomes free flowing they will be naturally cohesive on defense as well. For some people its hard to be motivated to play defense when you feel that you're not trusted on the offensive scheme of things. Players are motivated to play on both ends of the court when they are rewarded with trust in the offense. Some players take it for granted and other players lose morale because its like, "why should I break my back on D when the other dude gets to chuck up 18 shots and miss 85% of the time without worrying about losing their offensive role on the team and also when they don't put much into defense themselves". A lot of players will obviously get offended and will lose motivation. The whole team's morale will go down. Melo wants JR back but I don't think JR should come back because he doesn't seem serious about winning a chip. Stat and Tyson along with everyone else will play better D in my opinion when the leadership knows how to be fair to all the players and get everyone involved in the offensive scheme of things. When there are players who are only depended on offense, and others who are only depended on defense, the team morale will be skewed. If you look at the winning teams everyone is depended on playing offense AND defense. It ain't fair for someone like JR to have free reign on offense and have others out there only for defense. First of all, whoever isn't getting a chance to contribute offensively will lose morale. Secondly, the offense will be too predictable and will make players like Melo and JR resort to making those impossible shots. Even though they might be good at making those kind of shots, the Knicks will never be taken seriously that way. If Melo don't learn quick that it takes more than trusting in his own or JR's abilities to win a championship were in for some more depressing seasons to come. I don't question Stat's ability to contribute on both ends of the floor, although I do question his durability. He will be more inclined to contribute on defense if Woody learns how to incorporate everyone on offense. I mean EVERYONE. Tyson needs to be getting his looks, Felton needs to score, Melo needs his lions share but needs to know how to trust others and pass when its obviously the better choice. Stat needs to get his too. He needs a lions share too. Him and Melo need to find a way to trust each other and pass the ball out to make the offense flow better. These past few years they haven't had much of a chance to gel much but the leadership needs to step up and allow them to get things to flow whether any particular player likes it or not. We have our pieces and now we need to trust them. The organization is throwing down too much money to not trust the pieces we have. We need to let JR go. Him going out and getting drunk late during the playoffs should piss every knick fan off. He has the talent to be a superstar but doesn't have the discipline. Stat gets paid much more and deserves the role that JR received.
    Last edited by NewYork; May 23, 2013 at 20:20.

  13. #28
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    Originally Posted by knicksince 93
    Explain to me how 2 people can run an iso play... That would be a pick and roll.... Stat def did iso in phoenix and he iso'd here in ny too. Not like melo does but your beloved role players are supposed to understand when his defender goes to double he cuts and melo will find you. If no one doubles melo takes it himself. Once he beats his initial defender then when the help defense comes he dishes it. He's willing to do all that but if our guards aren't cutting the whole system is jacked up... How many times has kidd cut through when his man doubled melo? Zero

    Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

    Being u know so much about offense ....
    The Knicks average close to 100 offensive-possession per game .. over 90% were ISO an 3-Ball.
    30 3-ball shots per game .. was over doing it.

    Tell me, what the hell is ISO?
    its two touches on offense, its holding the ball to get double-team, its forcing a shot over two defenders, its walking the ball for a halfcourt individual-offense

    Woody let us become the WORST fastbreak team in the NBA.
    Woody's 48 min games always had either Melo or JR on the court to control a system of walking the ball for a halfcourt individual ISO or 3-ball shot.

    Nash always had Amare moving without the ball, Amare fame came from slashing & rebounds.

  14. #29
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    Originally Posted by NewYork
    In my opinion, the issue is the coaching and leadership. The leadership has to make everyone on the team feel like they are an important piece to the puzzle. If the Knicks learn to function as a team, trust each other to put in the work, then there should be no problems in team work between the people we have. The Knicks are going to have to learn how to make their offensive system work because it seems like we are stuck with the players we have. Woody should allow Stat be a starter and finally let Melo, Felton, Tyson, Stat, and Shump to mesh together. Once the offense becomes free flowing they will be naturally cohesive on defense as well. For some people its hard to be motivated to play defense when you feel that you're not trusted on the offensive scheme of things. Players are motivated to play on both ends of the court when they are rewarded with trust in the offense. Some players take it for granted and other players lose morale because its like, "why should I break my back on D when the other dude gets to chuck up 18 shots and miss 85% of the time without worrying about losing their offensive role on the team and also when they don't put much into defense themselves". A lot of players will obviously get offended and will lose motivation. The whole team's morale will go down. Melo wants JR back but I don't think JR should come back because he doesn't seem serious about winning a chip. Stat and Tyson along with everyone else will play better D in my opinion when the leadership knows how to be fair to all the players and get everyone involved in the offensive scheme of things. When there are players who are only depended on offense, and others who are only depended on defense, the team morale will be skewed. If you look at the winning teams everyone is depended on playing offense AND defense. It ain't fair for someone like JR to have free reign on offense and have others out there only for defense. First of all, whoever isn't getting a chance to contribute offensively will lose morale. Secondly, the offense will be too predictable and will make players like Melo and JR resort to making those impossible shots. Even though they might be good at making those kind of shots, the Knicks will never be taken seriously that way. If Melo don't learn quick that it takes more than trusting in his own or JR's abilities to win a championship were in for some more depressing seasons to come. I don't question Stat's ability to contribute on both ends of the floor, although I do question his durability. He will be more inclined to contribute on defense if Woody learns how to incorporate everyone on offense. I mean EVERYONE. Tyson needs to be getting his looks, Felton needs to score, Melo needs his lions share but needs to know how to trust others and pass when its obviously the better choice. Stat needs to get his too. He needs a lions share too. Him and Melo need to find a way to trust each other and pass the ball out to make the offense flow better. These past few years they haven't had much of a chance to gel much but the leadership needs to step up and allow them to get things to flow whether any particular player likes it or not. We have our pieces and now we need to trust them. The organization is throwing down too much money to not trust the pieces we have. We need to let JR go. Him going out and getting drunk late during the playoffs should piss every knick fan off. He has the talent to be a superstar but doesn't have the discipline. Stat gets paid much more and deserves the role that JR received.

    Melo demands to touch the ball on practically every offensive-possession .. who's going to deny Melo the ball? not Woodson, he likes his job.

  15. #30
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    Look at the top scorers of this season. Melo is the lowest at 2.6 assists per game. 1.6 assist in the post season. Durant is at 4.6 assists in the reg season and 6.3 at the post season. Lebron is more consistent at 7.3 and 7.6 assists. The only way I see the Knicks becoming a legitimate threat in the post season is if Melo learns to become more efficient as a basketball player and knows how to utilize his teammates. If Melo can bring his assist average up to about 5 Assists per game the Knicks offense will become more well rounded and less predictable. Melo will have to let go of his Scoring but the team will become much better as everyone will be more involved in the game and more willing to move around and put effort into defense. We have such a good team on paper, Melo, Stat, Shump, Felton, Tyson. If these guys can come together and trust each other on offense and make that extra pass, I truly believe things will come together on the defensive end. Not that things should be predicated on offense or that things should be started by our offense but I mean at least in training camp, if they learn to play off each other rather than having the "gotta get my own" mentality, the whole team will be willing to buy into the defensive scheme and be willing to put that extra effort into it. Amare can score too and can demand double team attention but Carmelo has that extra level within him to be better. To get to that extra level is not by scoring more, he already maxed out in that area. It's by passing. That's the only way his name will even be considered next to the names of Lebron or Kobe. Kobe averaged 6 assists per game this season. These are the types of players that make their team better. Carmelo needs to take a page of their books.

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