STOUDEMRE for BARGNANI?

tiger0330

Legend
Some of you have short memories when Woody went big against the Pacers with Melo back at SF with Kmart. That didn't work out so well and had everyone second guessing Woody about why he abandoned that small ball lineup.

And we didn't do great last season with Stat, Melo and TC at their natural positions. Melo plays the 4 better than Stat imo and until we get a better PF or Stat is resurrected Melo may be at the 4 for the rest of the time he's with the Knicks. And don't blame it on the coach because D'Antoni was here last year and Woody this year.
 

Kidd Karma

Benchwarmer
:agreed::agreed::agreed:

Melo TRIED to be the PF and the Point-foward this season .. RIDICULOUS!

I recall the Denver Nuggets having a couple of season-injuries to Nene & Kenyon Martin, which somehow Melo became Denvers PF .. Im sure u recall Denver lineups of Camby & Melo, or K-Mart & Melo, or Nene & Melo, or Birdman & Melo as Denver two bigmen in a lineup.
It was Chauncey Billups that made Melo go back to the SF spot for one season, when they sign Birdman, and both Nene & K-Mart became healthy with Billups at the point running the entire show.
Melo wanted to prove he could play the PF in our weak small-ball eastern conference, which was all good in the regular season.

Denver ran out a combo of Elson, Evans, Najera when Nene or KMart were both unavailable. I doubt Melo had much time as a PF those couple years when Nene missed the season nor KMart the next season. If he did you didn't see him there more than 5 minutes a night, I think Karl would have thrown Kleiza, Ruben Patterson at the 4 first before he put Melo in that spot. Woodson put Melo at the spot, I doubt Melo cares where he plays as long as he's getting his minutes and shots.
 

MSGhobo247

Rotation player
If you move Melo back to the SF spot then you MUST have a consistent inside threat to balance the offense since you're moving him away from the basket. The downside of going with Martin and Chandler is that although your defense is going to be solid your offense is going to consist a lot of standing around and moving bodies out of the way for Melo(plus Melo working too hard all season long). You neeeeeeeeed to keep the defense honest so it doesn't just stay home on shooters or clog the paint. If they stay at home on shooters then that's when our inside game needs to take over a la Stat or someone else(not sold on Stat's post game just yet)... or they clog the paint and Melo+ punishes them. A combo of K-Mart and TC doesn't scare anyone come playoff time and is looked at more as a weakness then strength.

Now we can ask Chandler to develop some go to moves but they won't be natural by next season so we need a more consistent and offensively sound PF to go with him(maybe Andrea MAYBE a Pau Gasol....Hmmmm idk). We can't have a center who defends(TC) and a PF who defends(K-Mart) or a PF who kinda defends and is just now learning to post up(Amar'e) and a defensive center(TC). PLUS neither can pass well.

The combo Denver had of K-Mart and NeNe is more sound then a TC and K-Mart or TC and Amar'e. Those front courts work in the regular season but not in the post. We can't go small like MIA cause Lebron is Lebron but think of Indiana's structure and add Melo instead of Paul George at the SF and Indy is 10x scarier then what they are now. Indy just happens to have a nice combo of A PF and C who have post up games, rebound and defend. I'm just not sold yet on Amar'e being our lone post guy and hoping he stays healthy all year next year plus postseason.

Now if we do trade Amar'e for another PF i'd rather it be a Pau Gasol type. Strictly back to the basket with eyes open for shooters and TC on the weak side. THAT's movement and THAT's balance.
 
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Rob Low

Rotation player
We need a Ryan Anderson type 4 for the Melo-Tyson lineup to be at it's full potential. If we could somehow get Anderson,Ilyasova,Milsap,Aldridge,or Love that would be the final piece of a championship puzzle.
 

metrocard

Legend
We need a Ryan Anderson type 4 for the Melo-Tyson lineup to be at it's full potential. If we could somehow get Anderson,Ilyasova,Milsap,Aldridge,or Love that would be the final piece of a championship puzzle.

Tyson and Melo don't play enough defense to have Anderson play the 4 and expect us to be success. We'll get raped by Indiana again.

We got to beat them with defense.
 

KnicksFan4Life

Benchwarmer
What's funny is that Melo is better defensively at the 4 than he is at the 3...he's a good post defender, just has JR Smith moments at the perimeter. If we can somehow keep Martin and get another PF to hold us down(I rather spend 5 mil on Tiago Splitter over JR Smith), we would really help out Melo's game...this team should be built around Melo, but Melo building himself around this team. Melo is a SF PG(hopefully Schroeder or Larkin) Shumpert Anthony Martin/Splitter Chandler/Splitter Amare...don't see him getting traded so he'll add to our "depth" nor will Felton...so hopefully we can use Felton in a Jarett Jack role...don't think Felton is suited to run the PG position as a starter...he plays best when Melo isn't dominating the shot attempts. Felton is a solid scorer, average passer...does nothing great. Best to see him go up against the reserves of the opposition. Defense is the priority, so this lineup makes most sense PG - Prigioni (so underrated in many ways. his 2nd NBA season he will be HUGE since he's adjusted) SG - Shumpert (Going to break out and average 17-18 points) SF - Anthony PF - Martin (best defender on the team in the 2013 season...he's earned the PF role, no one played harder than Martin) C - Chandler (I would bench him for Splitter if he doesn't get back to form) with a bench of 1. Felton (Spark plug off the bench, total oppositie of Prigioni, will confuse the defense. Prigioni is a change up, Felton is a fastball) 2. (Drafted PG Schroeder/Larkin) 3. Copeland (2nd season in the NBA, just like Shumpert and Prigioni, you can only expect BIG THINGS) 4. Stoudimire (A lot of hope here) 5. Splitter (two way big man who can do everything except shoot) Novak/Kidd can be the 11th and 12th men. 13, 14, 15 should go to younger players with energy and quickness. We got enough vets.
It's not like the Knicks have choice on how to spend that 5M. JR is the only player they can offer that 5M to because they have his bird rights.
 

tiger0330

Legend
Looks like the Knicks will be asked by Ujiri if they want Bargnani. Now do the Knicks want Bargnani for Stat, I think the answer is the Knicks don't want Bargnani unless he comes with Ross or Amir Johnson and Ujiri doesn't want Stat.

 

johnk812

Rookie
Since I can't (or don't know) how to post a new topic in the forum, and we are discussing trades...

Tyson Chandler and 2015 1st round pick for DeAndre Jordan and Eric Bledsoe.

Clippers get their have won/win now C in Tyson, a guy who played in the Olympics with CP3, and a guy I'm SURE CP3 would love to have around a young Blake and Co. If the Clips have legit concern about keeping Paul, this would help.

Knicks get younger, and less experienced. However, they are a little more cap friendly, and the lineup is one man deeper:

PG- Bledsoe
SG- Shumpert
SF- Melo
PF- Amare
C- Jordan

Felton can be used as a trade piece for a 6th man, or maybe in a S+T somewhere....

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mkfuy7y

If they can pull that off and then somehow shed one of the 3 brutal contracts (Kidd Novak Camby) I think they will be OK.

Thoughts?
 

skisloper

Starter
Since I can't (or don't know) how to post a new topic in the forum, and we are discussing trades...

Tyson Chandler and 2015 1st round pick for DeAndre Jordan and Eric Bledsoe.

Clippers get their have won/win now C in Tyson, a guy who played in the Olympics with CP3, and a guy I'm SURE CP3 would love to have around a young Blake and Co. If the Clips have legit concern about keeping Paul, this would help.

Knicks get younger, and less experienced. However, they are a little more cap friendly, and the lineup is one man deeper:

PG- Bledsoe
SG- Shumpert
SF- Melo
PF- Amare
C- Jordan

Felton can be used as a trade piece for a 6th man, or maybe in a S+T somewhere....

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=mkfuy7y

If they can pull that off and then somehow shed one of the 3 brutal contracts (Kidd Novak Camby) I think they will be OK.

Thoughts?


Bledsoe and Jordan are worth more then Chandler and a draft pick.
I think Tyson hurt is value a little with his poor playoff performance......
I also think a few teams would offer up a lottery pick for Bledsoe...


with that said I think a sweeter package .....Chandler/Felton ( paul needs a back-up) and 2014/2015 first rounders for Bledsoe and Jordan.....

We are not winning anything next year no matter what,,,,,,,,,,,,so assuming Melo extends in Feb.....then the goal is to have a Finals team in 2015/2016 season.....hoping Jordan, Beldsoe and Shump continue to expand their games...

Bledsoe
Shump
Melo
??????
Jordan

the ???????? could be filled with a semi-superstar whenwe trade amares final year of his contract. ( would need some money to extend shump and bledose)
 

Oldtimer

Rotation player
Trade assets

We have no first round pick in 2014. We gave that up as part of the Melo trade. We cannot trade a 2015 first round pick because the CBA does not permit trades of picks in consecutive years. And Denver has the right to switch first round picks with us in 2016. With the exception of Melo, Shump and to some extent Chandler and perhaps Felton, we have no trade assets. Given Amare's injuries, uninsured contract and apparently diminishing skills he will be impossible to trade. Melo is going nowhere. And Shump is a keeper.
 
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mafra

Legend
While I don't love trading away (more) future draft picks, especially for something that is far from a proven asset/commodity... and while I do think this is a (desperate) reax move to what happened over in BKLYN... With that, I still approve of this move.

Sure, Grunny is rolling the dice here... but what choice did we have?

1) We went all-in last season, and signed Novak-Camby to horrible contracts. We gave them too much money, too many years. But felt we had few options so we went in that direction. BOTH WERE DNP-CD in the playoffs. WTF! We had to get rid of this junk from our roster. I think Camby was misused, and I do think we need his size, rebounding, shot-blocking ability... But Woody wouldn;t play him and we didn't need the dead weight. Novak proved it twice, that he isn't built for the playoffs.

2) A new regime in TOR meant Bargnani was a goner. There were a few interested teams. Sure, we overpaid for him... But we wanted to act and strike quickly. Unless Melo opts out after next season, that 2016 pick will be practically worthless.

3) Bargnani is a player that fits well with 'Melo, more so then both Chandler & Amar'e. He can shoot, and he allows Anthony to have the blocks. He probably has nothing to offer... maybe he'll never regain his former offensive self, or perhaps he cannot stay healthy... STILL... Novak-Camby were worse then unnecessary... they were dead weight.

4) If Bargnani can score 18 a game, and Amar'e stays healthy and drops in his 17 a game... Knicks will have a potent offensive front court. If 'Melo, Amar'e & TC cannot work, well... sprinkling in Bargs may not either... But... again, we are a better team with Bargs then Camby/Novak.

5) Bargnani might actually have value... We might be able to flip him at the trade deadline.
 
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