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Thread: ESPN Ranks Melo 15th BP In The League

  1. #31
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    Originally Posted by JaYnYcE
    It was good to see Melo going for a triple dub last night. 22, 9, 7


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    When you shoot as bad as he did last night he was inclined to do other things to make his stat line look good. Melo knows how to keep em close to the vest.

    It makes you wonder why he doesn't play like this more often....Oh Wait reminder to self..."he doesn't care to play any different producing sustainable all-around results."

  2. #32
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    ^^^^This dude shouldn't even be entertained. Just ignore him until he goes away. There's no way anyone believes Griffin is better than Melo I refuse to believe that.

  3. #33
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    Originally Posted by Rob Low
    ^^^^This dude shouldn't even be entertained. Just ignore him until he goes away. There's no way anyone believes Griffin is better than Melo I refuse to believe that.
    This. Shouldn't feed them.

  4. #34
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    I'm done with dude

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    Just because Melo is a Knick doesn't mean you have to defend him by default. I mean it's not like he's elevated his play from when he was in Denver, since being here....Player comparisons are what they are and often times it can come down to preferences. I want a player who does more than one thing well on the court and Blake does more things for the benefit of a team than Melo and the number says that he does.

    But to switch gears as so many think Melo is the greatest thing since sliced bread here's where I ultimately judge him....Against competition that matters

    From Basketball Reference Dot Com

    Playoffs As A Knick:
    Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
    Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5

    That's a mediocre 6-6 record and in half the games he plays like trash offensively(his supposed strength)

    Playoffs As A Nugget:
    Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
    Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24

    That's still a mediocre 22-41 record and in half the games he plays like trash offensively(his supposed strength)

    In 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them. Does Melo have somewhat of a clutch gene...yeah in comparison to the league he's one of the best at it, although those who are clutch still fail far more often that they succeed. Also the last time I checked players/teams don't win Championships clutching their way through most of the playoffs. I'd wager to say most tight games won in the clutch during the playoffs is probably somewhere between 5-10% if that, of all games played IN THE HISTORY OF THE NBA.


    Nevertheless great players.... those who are considerd all-time greats.... the greater majority of them ELEVATE their play in the post-season. Melo has yet to do this in his career over any stretch of sustainable games. You can't pay a guy asking for $26-28mil/yr, who's never even come close to doing so. Stop looking at objective criticism of Melo as hate and accept it for what it is....HE JUST NOT THAT GOOD

  6. #36
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    Originally Posted by 3G4G
    Just because Melo is a Knick doesn't mean you have to defend him by default. I mean it's not like he's elevated his play from when he was in Denver, since being here....Player comparisons are what they are and often times it can come down to preferences. I want a player who does more than one thing well on the court and Blake does more things for the benefit of a team than Melo and the number says that he does.

    But to switch gears as so many think Melo is the greatest thing since sliced bread here's where I ultimately judge him....Against competition that matters

    From Basketball Reference Dot Com

    Playoffs As A Knick:
    Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
    Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5

    That's a mediocre 6-6 record and in half the games he plays like trash offensively(his supposed strength)

    Playoffs As A Nugget:
    Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
    Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24

    That's still a mediocre 22-41 record and in half the games he plays like trash offensively(his supposed strength)

    In 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them. Does Melo have somewhat of a clutch gene...yeah in comparison to the league he's one of the best at it, although those who are clutch still fail far more often that they succeed. Also the last time I checked players/teams don't win Championships clutching their way through most of the playoffs. I'd wager to say most tight games won in the clutch during the playoffs is probably somewhere between 5-10% if that, of all games played IN THE HISTORY OF THE NBA.


    Nevertheless great players.... those who are considerd all-time greats.... the greater majority of them ELEVATE their play in the post-season. Melo has yet to do this in his career over any stretch of sustainable games. You can't pay a guy asking for $26-28mil/yr, who's never even come close to doing so. Stop looking at objective criticism of Melo as hate and accept it for what it is....HE JUST NOT THAT GOOD
    i dont think melo is the greatest thing since sliced bread but i do think he is the greatest knick since pat and thats a loooong time ago. so i give him his respect... posters are saying let him walk but being that it took us this long to get anyone of this caliber i ask let him walk and bring in who? build through the draft with...with what picks? or keep him with is the best course to go. keeping him gives us more options then losing him unless he is traded and thats not happening so dont mention it. so you keep him, bank on shump developing and us landing a player next year or the year after through free agency to build with a declining melo in 2 years.idk who is on deck to be a free agent, maybe the get steph curry, he was supposed to come anyway. yall get tunnel vision and think melo is the last person to be a knick like our gm isnt thinking about the future just like we are. and i have news for those gms also have the same ideas as we as far as making the team better. its a reason everybody contract comes of the books in 2 years. we can sign whoever to add to a declining melo. when he is 35 he wont be relied upon like he is now.

  7. #37
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    Originally Posted by 3G4G
    Just because Melo is a Knick doesn't mean you have to defend him by default. I mean it's not like he's elevated his play from when he was in Denver, since being here....Player comparisons are what they are and often times it can come down to preferences. I want a player who does more than one thing well on the court and Blake does more things for the benefit of a team than Melo and the number says that he does.

    But to switch gears as so many think Melo is the greatest thing since sliced bread here's where I ultimately judge him....Against competition that matters

    From Basketball Reference Dot Com

    Playoffs As A Knick:
    Melo shoots +40%: Knicks are 5-1
    Melo shoots -40%: Knicks are 1-5

    That's a mediocre 6-6 record and in half the games he plays like trash offensively(his supposed strength)

    Playoffs As A Nugget:
    Melo shoots +40%: his teams are 15-17
    Melo shoots -40%: his teams are 7-24

    That's still a mediocre 22-41 record and in half the games he plays like trash offensively(his supposed strength)

    In 66 playoff games Melo has failed to shoot over 40% in 34 of them. Does Melo have somewhat of a clutch gene...yeah in comparison to the league he's one of the best at it, although those who are clutch still fail far more often that they succeed. Also the last time I checked players/teams don't win Championships clutching their way through most of the playoffs. I'd wager to say most tight games won in the clutch during the playoffs is probably somewhere between 5-10% if that, of all games played IN THE HISTORY OF THE NBA.


    Nevertheless great players.... those who are considerd all-time greats.... the greater majority of them ELEVATE their play in the post-season. Melo has yet to do this in his career over any stretch of sustainable games. You can't pay a guy asking for $26-28mil/yr, who's never even come close to doing so. Stop looking at objective criticism of Melo as hate and accept it for what it is....HE JUST NOT THAT GOOD
    good points but that clutch comment was way off. clutch isnt just the last second at the buzzer shot. i would go as far to say its the opposite of what you said and not 10 but the rest, the 90 percent of games are decided through clutch performances and shots in regards to the playoffs. shumps 3s that kept us alive in game 6 all clutch, ,melos 4th quarter all clutch. its the playoffs games are tighter more on the line no blowouts, redefine your definition of clutch as it pertains to pressure and the reg season vs post season. i hate when people bring up his post season failures in denver into a melo debate. when they were the lower seeded team they lost. when he was a higher seed they. battling against the mavs,lakers,spurs, those suns teams, and rockets it was super hard to get a higher seed.

  8. #38
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    Originally Posted by knicksince 93
    good points but that clutch comment was way off. clutch isnt just the last second at the buzzer shot. i would go as far to say its the opposite of what you said and not 10 but the rest, the 90 percent of games are decided through clutch performances and shots in regards to the playoffs. shumps 3s that kept us alive in game 6 all clutch, ,melos 4th quarter all clutch. its the playoffs games are tighter more on the line no blowouts, redefine your definition of clutch as it pertains to pressure and the reg season vs post season. i hate when people bring up his post season failures in denver into a melo debate. when they were the lower seeded team they lost. when he was a higher seed they. battling against the mavs,lakers,spurs, those suns teams, and rockets it was super hard to get a higher seed.

    You're being overly technical on the clutch point. Yes I understand clutch can have varying situations such as inside 5min 4min 3min 2min etc etc. I'm speaking in general cases of being clutch 1 possession games, hence I qualified more fine tunely.

    As far as playoff failure...I could tolerate Melo's All-Time losing record amongst current players and I believe he's at the top in history, but that wasn't the main point of my last post. It was to point out whether he won or lost his offensive production was more futile than the overall record. I could see if he was efficient in the greater majority of those games and still lost but he wasn't. Which goes to show those who feel he's been on bad teams to the degree he's suffered from overall playoff record can't then give him credit for making the playoffs 11 straight yrs because he's been playing with similar players throughout his career. They deserve credit too. Isn't that the reason fans are upset at Smith and Chandler? For not elevating their play or regressing in post-season last year? Well Melo has done the same.... the greater majority of his playoff career.

    Oh and btw the yr he got out of the second round for the first time in his career Billups elevated his play while Melo essentially stayed the same. Check the 2008-2009 stats between the two and you'll see what I'm talking about.

    Billups
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    Carmelo
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    .....hence Billups finishing 6th in MVP voting and Melo didn't even place, not even cracking Top 12. So this isn't some unfound hate on the dude, get real.
    Last edited by 3G4G; Oct 25, 2013 at 16:48.

  9. #39
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    Originally Posted by 3G4G
    You're being overly technical on the clutch point. Yes I understand clutch can have varying situation such inside 5min 4min 3min 2min etc etc. I'm speaking in general cases of being clutch 1 possession games, hence I qualified more fine tunely.

    As far as playoff failure...I could tolerate Melo's All-Time losing record amongst current players and I believe he's at the top in history, but that wasn't the main point of my last post. It was to point out whether he won or lost his offensive production was more futile than the overall record. I could see if he was efficient in the greater majority of those games and still lost but he wasn't. Which goes to show those who feel he's been on bad teams to the degree he's suffered from overall playoff record can't then give him credit for making the playoffs 11 straight yrs because he's been playing with similar players throughout his career. They deserve credit too. Isn't that the reason fans are upset at Smith and Chandler? For not elevating their play or regressing in post-season last year? Well Melo has done the same.... the greater majority of his playoff career.

    Oh and btw the yr he got out of the second round for the first time in his career Billups elevated his play while Melo essentially stayed the same. Check the 2008-2009 stats between the two and you'll see what I'm talking about.

    Billups
    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    Carmelo
    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    .....hence Billups finishing 6th in MVP voting and Melo didn't even place, not even cracking Top 12. So this isn't some unfound hate on the dude get real.
    Billups and his mvp season was for what he did in Detroit and that is obvious by Detroit playing worse after he left. I don't even know this debate about him being ranked 15th this season has to do with him and billups and everything else that we're discussing

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  10. #40
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    Originally Posted by knicksince 93
    Billups and his mvp season was for what he did in Detroit and that is obvious by Detroit playing worse after he left. I don't even know this debate about him being ranked 15th this season has to do with him and billups and everything else that we're discussing

    Sent from my SPH-L720 using Tapatalk 2
    No that's not why Billups got high MVP consideration. The point of bringing Billups up is to prove to you throughout Melo's career he hasn't been thought highly of by other critiques/analyst/media cover guys, hence him not finishing high in MVP voting in many seasons and not making ALL-NBA First Teams and whatnot.

    Therefore when you see an ESPN list of Player Rankings, don't be shocked when he's not Top 10. Contrary to what many of us Knick fans feel and players like Blake could rank ahead of him.

    Once again he finished lower than 12 in the season he advanced the furthest in his career....Now let me ask you do you think...


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    All these guys were more deserving of finishing ahead of Melo. If you answer Yes doesn't matter if you answer no once again it doesn't matter because they did finish higher and guess what ESPN doesn't control MVP results. This season Melo finished 3rd and maybe he's earned such high consideration but not all look at Melo the way we do, or should I say the way you do....


    This is no different than John Wall receiving a Max Extension from the Wizards? We all know he's not worth that kind of coin. We can reason why the Wizards felt compelled to offer all the money he was entitled to but it doesn't make the decision a wise one. Melo is not worth 5yrs $130mil and he's not a Top 10 player....so who cares who finishes ahead of him on media ranking outlets?
    Last edited by 3G4G; Oct 25, 2013 at 19:15.

  11. #41
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    Originally Posted by 3G4G
    No that's not why Billups got high MVP consideration. The point of bringing Billups up is to prove to you throughout Melo's career he hasn't been thought highly of by other critiques/analyst/media cover guys, hence him not finishing high in MVP voting in many seasons and not making ALL-NBA First Teams and whatnot.

    Therefore when you see an ESPN list of Player Rankings, don't be shocked when he's not Top 10. Contrary to what many of us Knick fans feel and players like Blake could rank ahead of him.

    Once again he finished lower than 12 in the season he advanced the furthest in his career....Now let me ask you do you think...


    1[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
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    All these guys were more deserving of finishing ahead of Melo. If you answer Yes doesn't matter if you answer no once again it doesn't matter because they did finish higher and guess what ESPN doesn't control MVP results. This season Melo finished 3rd and maybe he's earned such high consideration but not all look at Melo the way we do, or should I say the way you do....


    This is no different than John Wall receiving a Max Extension from the Wizards? We all know he's not worth that kind of coin. We can reason why the Wizards felt compelled to offer all the money he was entitled to but it doesn't make the decision a wise one. Melo is not worth 5yrs $130mil and he's not a Top 10 player....so who cares who finishes ahead of him on media ranking outlets?
    My only objection to that list could be yao ming. But that was then and this is now. Melo is a top 10 player in my book. Knick or no knick.

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