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Thread: New York Knicks vs Indiana Pacers 11/20/2013 7:00PM

  1. #121
    Veteran mafra's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by groundpilot
    Hey Mafra, you are a great poster and i respect your opinion, but how was it not Shumperts fault?
    Everybody knows that you can not faul a 3 point shooter. Shump touched his elbow and it was a clear faul. Now if he made that shot it would have been 4 point play and it wouldnt even go into OT.
    Woodson made a mistake by not fauling before the shot was taken, and if they made 2 free throws we were 3 points ahead and still would have been 1 point ahead with only 2 or 3 sec. left.
    Woodsons decision not to foul cost us this game, but Shump made a stupid mistake by fouling 3 point shooter and thats the end of the story.
    Hey man, I cannot argue with anything you just wrote. Spot on. Ultimately, that was a foolish thing to do. And YES, technically that's a foul. You absolutely can not touch the elbow, even if ever so slightly. And with the way the refs cut us little slack, you're just begging the ref to screw us. But this is why we have coaches. We have a low bball IQ team. Coach has to realize this and take the decision away from them. Sort of like vs HOU when Woodson failed to alert the team to the rule that you cannot employ hack-a-Howard under 2 minutes. Melo was the moron then, and Shump now. But if the coach did his job, Melo would have been told not to foul and Shump wouldn't have been in that position b/c we would have already fouled West. I realize "studies" say do not foul until about 4-6 seconds left. That 10 is cutting it close. And we do miss a lot of key free throws. But we already gave up a prayer 3 at the end of the first half... We are in the midst of a losing streak... As a coach, I get proactive there and try to ensure we nail down that victory.

  2. #122
    Veteran mafra's Avatar
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    Then again... Maybe you're even more right than I gave you credit for. Maybe Woody told Shump to foul or at least contest shot without fouling... And, game had ended b/c he missed the shot... so perhaps not fouling was shrewd, because 8-10 seconds is too long. From the POST:"Woodson instead praised referee Joey Crawford, perhaps deciding it was time to play nice with the officials in an attempt to get better calls in the future.
    Woodson said it was discussed with Shumpert to possibly foul George intentionally before the shot once he got the handoff. Woodson said Shumpert played it “lazily.’’ Then he was too aggressive.
    “The worst that can happen is he hits a 3 over you and it goes into overtime like it did,’’ Woodson said. “But you can’t foul him. I looked at the tape and he got him on the elbow and Joey made the correct call.’’
    “I contested the shot,’’ Shumpert said. “It doesn’t matter what I think. They called a foul. They can’t change the call now. It’s over.’’

  3. #123
    Veteran mafra's Avatar
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    AND from the DAILY NEWS: "Shumpert was supposed to foul George before he went into the act of shooting, just as James Harden had done last week when the Rockets expertly played the Knicks’ last possession against Anthony. In that same game, Anthony had screwed up a late defensive stand when he purposely fouled Dwight Howard after Mike Woodson didn’t want to employ that strategy. Howard’s foul shots proved to be the difference.
    Now it was Shumpert making a doozy of an error as he failed to follow through on Woodson’s orders. “He kind of lazily played it," Woodson said."
    Well, I'm wondering if coach hardly played Hardaway b/c they are trying to showcase Shump as much as possible before we trade him in a few weeks?

  4. #124
    Super Moderator RunningJumper's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    AND from the DAILY NEWS: "Shumpert was supposed to foul George before he went into the act of shooting, just as James Harden had done last week when the Rockets expertly played the Knicks’ last possession against Anthony. In that same game, Anthony had screwed up a late defensive stand when he purposely fouled Dwight Howard after Mike Woodson didn’t want to employ that strategy. Howard’s foul shots proved to be the difference.
    Now it was Shumpert making a doozy of an error as he failed to follow through on Woodson’s orders. “He kind of lazily played it," Woodson said."
    Well, I'm wondering if coach hardly played Hardaway b/c they are trying to showcase Shump as much as possible before we trade him in a few weeks?
    Who knows, the coach is random. Hardaway was in at the end of regulation instead Beno, which made no sense. Beno was shooting well, even aside from the very difficult shots.

  5. #125
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    Just got done watching that Joey Crawford special DVR style. No way that was a three shot foul. Shump contested that shot, but you can't award 3 shots right there with the game on the line. Unless of course you are Joey and crew and u are paid off by Vegas. I just saw Melo get beat to death and HIT a three, all to get waived off, but u gift wrap the game for the Pacers on that should be non call?? C'mon man

  6. #126
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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Stop sucking Paul George off.
    Real talk Metro I'm tired of troll already

  7. #127
    Veteran bigapple's Avatar
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    I will 100% believe that if that shoot would be MELO there would be no call. This is where NBA @ MSG happens

    all time against Knicks

    now look @ this

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

  8. #128
    Veteran bigapple's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    Not Shump's fault. You have to foul when you have 3 point lead and under ten seconds to go. You cannot lose if the other team shoots two free throws and you have a 3 point lead. Recall what HOU did. Woodson went to college, he should understand simple math. Once again, tonight is proof we play 82 road games. We get no home calls for our star. 50/50 calls should always go in your star's favor at home. How is it Melo gets two quick off fouls but Hibbert runs over Bargs and it is a blocking foul?

    Knicks lost again for same old reasons... Coaching and guards are sub-par. Just not good enough. For the life of me, when JR is rated as one of the worst shooters in the NBA this season... Why he's spotting up for a three late when Melo dished out on one of our few fast breaks? And JR has gall to bicker with Prigs for a bad pass, when this druggy-dufus commits the worst sin a passer can do in hoops: try to save ball by throwing it to middle of floor.

    We lost bc we failed to build a 40-18 lead early. Indy was flat and we failed to take advantage.... And, of course, once again Carmelo chokes and misses a shot that can win it. I cant recall an instance he's actually hit a buzzer beater for us? We didn't lose bc of Anthony, but the usual stuff: highly inefficient and failed to make shots and score in the fourth. One made basket in the second half!

    Then Woody won't foul, or play Hardaway. And this iso offense is on the verge of unwatchable.

    Bad coaching, poor guard play, Melo shooting 8-26 or something again... Refs give Indy twice as many Free Throws. Another loss.

    At this point, if our draft puck is lottery protected.... Tank the season and get Wiggins or Parker.

    Totally disagree only in 1st when u have 5,2 to go and 3 pt lead u r putting strong D on dude who got the ball u are even triple teaming him till he is not able to pass the ball 5.2 secod is enough to stop him and force travelling

    Knicks done a lot worse there was no D and Shumpert should just cover his eye vision to basket this game was very winable due Pacers played poor game.

    Agree with MELo that again poor shooting but his should ended buzzer properly or pass ball to some1 else.

  9. #129
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    Clearly Shumpert's foul on George was ill advised, but it was likely "accidental" that he grazed George's elbow. In any event, it should not have happened. However, I am disgusted with Woodson for throwing Shumpert under the bus and praising Crawford. Woodson added to the ill advised foul the assertion that Shumpert was instructed to foul before a shot and that he was initially lazy in defending George and thus too late. I did not notice laziness when I saw the play and I have not seen a re-play. But there was a lot of picking. In any event Woodson should have kept his mouth shut. Shumpert cannot be happy with the result and does not need Woodson to add publicly what perhaps should not even have been imparted privately. It suggests that the rumors of Dolan's dissatisfaction with Shumpert are accurate. Woodson is playing to the boss. I have now had enough of Woodson.

  10. #130
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    Originally Posted by Oldtimer
    Clearly Shumpert's foul on George was ill advised, but it was likely "accidental" that he grazed George's elbow. In any event, it should not have happened. However, I am disgusted with Woodson for throwing Shumpert under the bus and praising Crawford. Woodson added to the ill advised foul the assertion that Shumpert was instructed to foul before a shot and that he was initially lazy in defending George and thus too late. I did not notice laziness when I saw the play and I have not seen a re-play. But there was a lot of picking. In any event Woodson should have kept his mouth shut. Shumpert cannot be happy with the result and does not need Woodson to add publicly what perhaps should not even have been imparted privately. It suggests that the rumors of Dolan's dissatisfaction with Shumpert are accurate. Woodson is playing to the boss. I have now had enough of Woodson.
    Woodson is in a hot sit now and by throwing Shump under the bus, he is letting everyone know, including his boss, that last play was not his fault, it was Shumperts fault. But he is not smart enough to realize that you cant do it to your player publically, even if he is not your favorite player.
    Woodson might lose not only Shump by doing this but the whole team as well if he didnt already.

  11. #131
    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    My .02

    1. So now I'm supposed to blame Shump for a feather touch foul when we began the game on an 11-0 run?

    2. Is it me or is this team the stupidest team when it comes to late game situations? Really? Still?

    Well, as you know I don't do excuses.

    3. Even when we started 11-0 I knew we would lose. When we made a stop and Melo passed up court to JR... I knew we would lose.

    4. Really... so Hibbert jumping into Melo is an offensive foul and so is Shumps feather touch?

    Get ready for the false positive when we win on this next road trip.

  12. #132
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    Originally Posted by Red
    My .02

    1. So now I'm supposed to blame Shump for a feather touch foul when we began the game on an 11-0 run?

    2. Is it me or is this team the stupidest team when it comes to late game situations? Really? Still?

    Well, as you know I don't do excuses.

    3. Even when we started 11-0 I knew we would lose. When we made a stop and Melo passed up court to JR... I knew we would lose.

    4. Really... so Hibbert jumping into Melo is an offensive foul and so is Shumps feather touch?

    Get ready for the false positive when we win on this next road trip.
    Are you gonna sit here and act like Paul George didn't get fouled on his late drives(4th qrt) to the basket with no calls? In particular the one where Melo winds up to swing and rakes him totally across the wrist?

    Take off the Rose Colored Glasses and stop crying
    Last edited by 3G4G; Nov 21, 2013 at 17:39.

  13. #133
    Veteran bigapple's Avatar
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    now Knicks r goin for road game

    Wizards and Nuggets are beatable Igoudala is now in GSW NENE in Wizards Brewer in T'Wolves n they r 4-6
    +new coach.

  14. #134
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    Originally Posted by Red
    My .02

    1. So now I'm supposed to blame Shump for a feather touch foul when we began the game on an 11-0 run?

    2. Is it me or is this team the stupidest team when it comes to late game situations? Really? Still?

    Well, as you know I don't do excuses.

    3. Even when we started 11-0 I knew we would lose. When we made a stop and Melo passed up court to JR... I knew we would lose.

    4. Really... so Hibbert jumping into Melo is an offensive foul and so is Shumps feather touch?

    Get ready for the false positive when we win on this next road trip.
    Yep I forgot about Melo's "offensive foul" with Hibbert off of the ground... Um um um.. When Lebron James or Harden or Durant get fouls called on them like that I will believe it until then...Joey Crawford and crew were paid off by Vegas just like the MNF football crew that picked up that flag with the Panthers being 3 point favs...

  15. #135
    Veteran bigapple's Avatar
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    exaclty


    and i saw reaction of Woody he was like sweet jesus WTF .This is why where always @ MSG happens

    refsa always against Knicks

    this should be pointed on court and Stern should have nightmares for rest of his live he is key for rigged games.

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