Derrick Rose to the KNIcKs????

Kiyaman said:

Once upon a time we were a losing 37 win season team, we added Phil Jackson into management to become LOSERS!
What part of losing to LOSERS should i be optimistic about?
During the season coach Fisher took a healthy Grant out of the rotation, and during the same time Fisher stop giving Rolo playing time in the 4th quarter and the Knicks took off to a long skid of losing night after night playing small-ball. We KO members watch a 6.5 defensive guard Grant and 7.0 defensive Rolo sit on the bench in the 4th quarter watching a "Knicks 22-22 record go to a 28-43 record".




In the past 5 seasons Rose played the most games last season (66 games), Rose 66 games did not make the playoff.
The 2010 MVP Rose has been MIA for 5 seasons .. No righteous team would have took Rose off of the Bulls hands without receiving a first round draft pick plus being able to dumb their GARBAGE players off to the Bulls in the trade.
The same with the Bargaini trade .. look what happen to Toronto after dumping Bargaini off on the Knicks.
I can literally say now that the Chicago Bulls are a Playoff team next season. Rookie Grant season showed he is twice a better player than our old Shumpert who been to the FINALS twice plus has a RING.

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you make a good point.. The knicks gave up grant who was a first round pick last year and a serviceable big in lopez to get rose, a player the bulls were dying to get rid of. the bulls dumped a player they didn't want to resign and ended up getting a young player and a center in exchange...

as you said teams were not beating the bulls door down to get rose.. and we know that because of what they took from the knicks to make the deal happen...

Broadway said:

Had Mike Conley been signed to a Max Contract what would have been your narrative?

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I would've been apprehensive actually. Conley has been solid but I've never felt him to be a max contract player. 2nd Tier PG who has been 3rd or 4th best player on his team for the last 4 years. Would it have been an upgrade..heck yeah! But just like the addition of Rose, it would've required a lot more than just him to bring us out of the situation we are in.

He's only played more than 70 games 5x in his career and averages have dipped the past couples seasons ....Again a lot of similarities to Rose!

the expectation level of him compared to Rose, and smaller the market he played in has kept his value from being affected by recent play and injuries, like it has Rose.

I'd take Rose (injuries and all) with a one year deal, over a long term commitment to Conley! No doubt about it, Conley will be the most overpayed player this off season...glad it isn't us signing the check for once!

So, had we signed him to a max deal,my narrative would've been "Solid signing" "we need more"," hope he plays well for the duration of his contract" "we probably overpaid him"

Teams weren't beating down the door for rose bc every team in the NBA had a better starting point guard, and 1/3 of the teams had better backup PGs that were better than NYK's starting PG.

Lopez is now on his 5th or 6th team so 1/6 of the NBA have already let him walk out the door.

Grant may or may not be any better than a fledging D-league type PG... Maybe he's not a fit for our system?

Sure, there is risk that Rose stinks and Grant is a serviceable player.
Yeah, Lopez is a solid big man who defends and rebounds... But, he is replaceable in this summer's free agent market... More so than finding a PG.

CHI turned an expiring contract into a BIG who'll replace Paul & Noah (and they control at 15 mil for 2 years) and they roll the dice in Grant.

But... 50/50 bet Holliday is better NBA player next 5 years than JG? Who knows.

It's one thing not to like this trade, or to not want Rose here... But it's ridiculous to act like NYK next season is worse off today...

Our PG play has been atrocious for years. Grant showed now signs he could be a starter next season. With Melo and 30 mil to spend... It's the right call to roll the dice on Rose now, even if that meant sacrificing Lopez.

Maybe we "heard" that Conley wasn't coming here; perhaps ATL declined our overtures for Teague... Not much left after that... This is 10 times better than a mega deal for Rondo... It also keeps us in the game for Paul or Westbrook next season.

tiger0330 said:

No sarcasm, I'm sure PJ would love to sign him for the vets minimum but he put up better numbers than Rolo who is making 13M and with the cap going up I could see Pau getting 20M. I just don't see anyone giving him a long term deal because he's 35.

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If Pau wants 20 million at this point in his career he has lost his mind! He signed for MLE money 3 years ago (in other words at age 33) no way he gets 20 million! I think he's worth 24 million over 2 years, maybe 3 years 37 million...Rolo got paid more due to less mileage on him!

I don't think Pau has ever gotten 20 million per, it's crazy to think he would now!

NYK got a former MVP still in his prime, who proved last season he could play 65 games in a season... He's playing for a contract and has some chemistry with Melo already.

Don't forget about Holiday either... A much better shooter than Grant.

But, this is just the first of a series of moves. Maybe this allows us the flexibility to eat a contract to pick up a first rounder tonight; maybe this is the first step in our pursuit of Durant.

Good news: if it doesn't work out... Rose ain't here next year.

After all, maybe CHI regrets giving up on Holiday in 3 years.

mafra said:

NYK got a former MVP still in his prime, who proved last season he could play 65 games in a season... He's playing for a contract and has some chemistry with Melo already.

Don't forget about Holiday either... A much better shooter than Grant.

But, this is just the first of a series of moves. Maybe this allows us the flexibility to eat a contract to pick up a first rounder tonight; maybe this is the first step in our pursuit of Durant.

Good news: if it doesn't work out... Rose ain't here next year.

After all, maybe CHI regrets giving up on Holiday in 3 years.

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Rose refuse to be at FA Melo interview with the Bulls a couple years ago.
The Knicks could only win 32 games last season bc NO-DEFENSE players Calderon/Affalo/Melo/and Porzingis got the majority of playing time in the 4th quarter .. Rose n Holiday are NO-DEFENSIVE players too

The argument is the fact that Rose has not been the 2010 MVP Rose the past 5 seasons, plus in the 2014-15 playoff Rose was shut down by Shumpert n Dellavedova .. And rookie Grant athleticism n b.ball IQ are better than Shump n Della

I don't like the trade but I don't hate it ether. I understand it. In business you've got to take calculated risks and that's just what Phil & Steve did. Lopez is good & Calderon is finished. There's a chance that Rose will be a bust due to injury but we've got to remember he's only 27. If he can be a distributor and get a couple of mid range shots (more like a Jason Kid) I think the trade is worth it. If not, we cut him lose next year. No harm no fowl. Signing Noah would make me feel better about this situation.

Tkf said:

you make a good point.. The knicks gave up grant who was a first round pick last year and a serviceable big in lopez to get rose, a player the bulls were dying to get rid of. the bulls dumped a player they didn't want to resign and ended up getting a young player and a center in exchange...

as you said teams were not beating the bulls door down to get rose.. and we know that because of what they took from the knicks to make the deal happen...

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Real talk the only reason Grant was a throw in was to sell tickets and appease the large Domer(Notre Dame) alumni Bulls season ticket holders during Bulls rebuild mode On Chief

You guys are beyond clueless if you think this was a bad trade. Its a win win situation. We clear a terrible player off our cap, a overpaid Lopez and in return get a 21M expiring contract that is actually a good player with Derrick Rose. Noone is saying he will be a MVP again but whether you want to admit it or not hes the best guard on our team and will be leading our team during the season. If he plays great this year, awesome lets try to resign him. If he doesn't play so good and is often injured, lets just not resign him. Stop being so stubborn and arrogant and saying this trade is terrible because it clearly is not.

I love this trade. Although I'm sad to see Lopez go, not only are there free agent big men, two of them have played with Rose. Rose only has one year left. Hopefully he comes back after this season as I'm a big fan. The Knicks will have money to spend.

Instead of being happy we got a PG (a former MVP at that), the same negative fans are back at it again. Here how it goes with those of you.

If we got Conley:

They overspent, he's been injury prone.

If got Rondo: They overspent, he's a headcase.

We got Rose:

Knicks got an old man. We'll be lucky to see him even play. Horrible trade.

Some of you (Broadway, not to single you out, for example) need to just fess up. Every move will be crap until Melo is gone. That Melo. How dare he actually work on his game and change it this past season. Even when the Knicks went down hill after that good stretch he didn't try to play "hero ball" and start going iso. He actually was pretty consistent in his new approach, but no, Melo can do no right. Phil can't do right either now, after all, he's the evil master mind who gave Melo that contract.

The Knicks should trade Melo, whether we get a good PG or not, hope the Knicks get a good player and/or pick out of it, and wait until the Warriors and other team's windows close in another decade because anything is better than Melo.

Melo has had some down times with the Knicks, but he tried and did change, and the Knicks have made some ridiculous trades in the past, but this is not one of them.

WE GOT A PG
HIS CONTRACT ONLY HAS ONE YEAR
WE HAVE OPTIONS FOR OTHER GOOD CENTERS WHO BRING THINGS ON BOTH ENDS OF THE COURT
WE HAVE CAP SPACE

Porzingis actually LIKES what Melo is doing to help him in his career. First some of you want Porzingis come off the bench, which is reasonable, but you also want this to be a rebuild as if that's supposed to be good for him too. This team could be on the verge of a team made up of a few big time veterans and young players that has at least a few years to it unlike the 2011-2012 team in which there were guys on the verge of retirement.

Do you people even LIKE this team? When the hell is the last time this team had a league MVP?! Don't bring me that he's not the same anymore bull****. No ****ing kidding. Oh but the Bulls didn't want Rose because he's not worth it anymore. Yeah, that's the same team that benched Noah and let go of Thibodeau.

"Phil should have waited"

People also said he doesn't care and waits too long to do anything.

Whatever. I'm looking forward to this season. We gotta make bold moves to compete with the powerhouses in this league. The goal is a championship, not just a 50+ regular season and be competitive to reach the ECF.

DERRICK ROSE

Love this trade, always been a d-rose fan and I'm glad that it looks like we are finally making big decisions. We are receiving a former mvp that is still young and can have a lot of upside. The best part about this trade is that it has a low risk. What will be interesting now is seeing what moves follow this being that we have a hole at sg and center.

DRose intro presser at the top of the hour

Knicks needed a quality point guard badly since forever. if healthy, and it looks like Rose is headed in the right direction, DR is one of the top 5 PGs in the league and exactly the kind of player Coach Horn likes for his fast offense. PJ struck gold with DRose trade, as Knicks did not have to pay max dollar for Conley or Rondo and wipe out their salary cap this year, instead they have MORE money to go after C, SG and backup PGs. If Rose does not deliver, the Knicks payroll is wide open next year, when the best PGs in the league are free agents. if he does deliver, Knicks have the right to resign him. win win situation.

OK, giving up Rolo was tough, and puts the onus back on Phil 'n Mills to get a center, instead of a PG. IMHO, centers are easier to come by than quality PGs. Was Rolo really THAT great that he can't be replaced? With Spanish Willy coming over, KOQ signed, Seraphin re-signing (you know he will), and Porzingis able to play the 5, a formidable center should do the trick.

Regarding loss of PGs Jerian Grant and Tony Wroten... who knows if Grant will ever be great or if Wroten has truly healed? Getting rid of Calderone? genius move that had to be done.

PJ 'n Mills will most likely NOT be going after another max salary this year, instead spreading it out like last year to get quality, hi bball IQ players to complement the signed core. Let's hope Knicks get DWill, Lance and Gallo back in the fold. Derrick Rose, Knickerbocker. hot damn!

mafra said:

The truth is Caldron making 8 mil was a killer... Dumping that one is terrific.

Lopez is a nice player but he's certainly replaceable. And moving him allows KP to play C.

Rose is still better than any G we've had in this team in years... Our G play was pathetic...

Now, using our best trade chip of Lopez and Grant might've been better spent... But maybe we offered them to ATL for Teague and were rebuffed?

Grant may turn out to be something. If so, this trade will blow up in our faces... But he could also just be another Shump type stinker.

Now, the cache of having Rose, to help lure free agents, that might be were his real value helps. And, he is still young enough to hope for a halfway decent season next year.

Not giving up a pick, getting a pick, upgrading at PG while allocating cap space in a better way... All make this trade worth taking.

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excellent post, agree 100 percent

CoolClyde said:

Knicks needed a quality point guard badly since forever. if healthy, and it looks like Rose is headed in the right direction, DR is one of the top 5 PGs in the league and exactly the kind of player Coach Horn likes for his fast offense. PJ struck gold with DRose trade, as Knicks did not have to pay max dollar for Conley or Rondo and wipe out their salary cap this year, instead they have MORE money to go after C, SG and backup PGs. If Rose does not deliver, the Knicks payroll is wide open next year, when the best PGs in the league are free agents. if he does deliver, Knicks have the right to resign him. win win situation.

OK, giving up Rolo was tough, and puts the onus back on Phil 'n Mills to get a center, instead of a PG. IMHO, centers are easier to come by than quality PGs. Was Rolo really THAT great that he can't be replaced? With Spanish Willy coming over, KOQ signed, Seraphin re-signing (you know he will), and Porzingis able to play the 5, a formidable center should do the trick.

Regarding loss of PGs Jerian Grant and Tony Wroten... who knows if Grant will ever be great or if Wroten has truly healed? Getting rid of Calderone? genius move that had to be done.

PJ 'n Mills will most likely NOT be going after another max salary this year, instead spreading it out like last year to get quality, hi bball IQ players to complement the signed core. Let's hope Knicks get DWill, Lance and Gallo back in the fold. Derrick Rose, Knickerbocker. hot damn!

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Nice post CoolClyde. You should visit more frequently.

With only 5 guys signed I think PJ has to spread the wealth this year, I think DRose is going to be the only marquee name added this year.

Tommy Dee:

"When listening to Derrick Rose speak at his press conference, you can sense a lot of Lebron James mindset in the former Chicago Bulls point guard. Rose, like James, was selected No. 1 overall in the 2009 draft, and having grown up in Chicago, the pressure to win for his family and friends was something Rose seemed like a huge burden in the same way it was for James.

Lebron, as we know, decided to take his talents to South Beach six years ago in what he justified as leaving the coup to grow as an individual, and Rose hopes the trade to the Knicks can free him from the mountains of expectations placed upon him in the Windy City. Chicago isn't leaving his heart, however. It will remain with him every minute here, which is why he decided to change his number.

"Chicago is more than just a home it's grown me into the man I am today," Rose said yesterday during his introductory press conference at Madison Square Garden. "All my family and friends are back there. That's one of the reasons I changed my number to 25, it's like I'm playing in NY but I'm bringing something from Chicago with me."

While James has gone on to be a three-time champion, Rose's career has sputtered in large part due to injuries. Catastrophic injuries. Today's dribble-drive-and-kick game was once perfectly tailored for Rose, who became the NBA's youngest MVP ever when he won the award in 2011. While he's seen a decline in production over the last few years while trying to bounce back, Rose is still an elite driver of the basketball, finishing 8th in the NBA last year in points off the bounce.

"All of the congratulations I got I hope I'll be able to play the rest of my career here, but like I said this is a business, I guess we'll have to see how this one year goes," Rose said. "I'm putting my all into this and I've been working my butt off in terms of my work ethic and we'll have to see."

Good move for the Knicks, we own his bird rights and if he has a bounce back year we can still get all the free agents we want and then go over cap for him in best case scernio...worst case he gets hurt and we dumped bad contracts and a player in Grant who i liked but never had a chance.

Rose makes us look more attractive no matter what anybody says, he still has a big name and only 27 give people hope he will return to atleast an allstar type form...he averaged almost 17 ppg, and he is the best PG we have had in a decade

Paul1355 said:

Good move for the Knicks, we own his bird rights and if he has a bounce back year we can still get all the free agents we want and then go over cap for him in best case scernio...worst case he gets hurt and we dumped bad contracts and a player in Grant who i liked but never had a chance.

Rose makes us look more attractive no matter what anybody says, he still has a big name and only 27 give people hope he will return to atleast an allstar type form...he averaged almost 17 ppg, and he is the best PG we have had in a decade

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Well it's slightly positive if Rose was to have a good yr but heading into next summer his cap hit is going to be massive...Like $30mil+ range massive

New York Knicks: Phil Jackson Knows What He’s Doing

Calm down, New York Knicks fans. Team president and 13-time NBA champion Phil Jackson knows what he’s doing.
Calm down! I dont think Phil could FLUNK three off-season in a row as president .. Calm down!
LMAO

Broadway said:

Well it's slightly positive if Rose was to have a good yr but heading into next summer his cap hit is going to be massive...Like $30mil+ range massive

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the point is that we won this deal for the short term, the long term we wont know...it really depends on how well Grant develops but he was not being used the right way with Fisher and Rambis who suck at coaching.

Kevin Durant admitted that Rose makes them look better, and thats because players know how good Rose still is.