TRADES GOOD OR BAD??

[NYKnicks15]

let the guy do his job. what has he done wrong? clogged a payroll that was already up the ass prior. i guarantee you NO GM would last in NY or do what you want by trading away everyone to clear salary space its not going to happen. its a lost cause.

the houston trade was weak. we did get rid of a old not producing PF/C and a bench warming PG that didnt produce for a overpaid PF. Who cares. Hell just sit on the bench just like Baker and Norris.

But trading away Nazr was nothing big literally. hes 6'10. Kurt Thomas is 6'9 and plays better C. Nazr was originally billed as a PF. He had no strength and couldnt defend against bigger guys. I like the San Antonio trade very much and im very fond of Malik Rose. and further more the 2 draft picks.

Why do we need guys we are familiar with? Big names dont make great players. Did you know of HS Tracy McGrady before Isiah picked him and made him a household name? Did people have faith in Isiah when he traded Dale Davis to Portland for 2 year bench warmer Jermaine O'Neal? cmon give the guy a chance. yea yea im sure you could do better someone who didnt even know who Mo Taylor was until he looked him up when he was the Houston Rockets starting PF for a year or two. lets see what he does and lets take it for what it is. by my count since the trade deadline we are 2-0 and have won by atleast 10. mo taylor played 4 minutes and scored a bucket. Malik scored a basket and had 8 rebounds in 9 minutes.

[NYKnicks15]

yes all centers are undersized in the east except for Miami and a few others like he said. Can you name one dominant Center in the east thats over 6'9 or over?? three Shaq, Iglauskas and Wallace (and wallace IS 6'9)
If he would of said dominant centers hed be correct...so a little mistake there. shame

no offense but you have to do your research past last years draft. ill just name a few late1st round/2nd round picks....

Josh Howard of Dallas #29
Kyle Korver and Willie Green of Philly #41 & #51
Teyshaun Prince of Detroit #23
Carlos Boozer of Utah #35
Gerald Wallace of Charlotte #25
Jamaal Tinsley of Indiana #27
Tony Parker of SA #28
Gilbert Arenas Washington #31
Mehmet Okur #38 from Utah'
Morris Peterson of Toronto #21
Primoz Brezec of Charlotte #27
Marko Jaric of LA #30
Michael Redd #43 of Milwaukee
AKirilenko #24 Utah
Gordan Giricek #40 Utah
Emanuel Ginoboli #57 San Antonio

just name a few and that only goes back to 1999, and #20 or deeper 8)

[mdelton]

You make some good points. And i have to say the more I look at the Mohammed for Rose and two draft picks, that could be a great deal for the Knicks becasue though small I do like KT in the middle and Rose at the four.

But the Houston trade was horrible! I do not care about Brewer or Baker, but taking back more $$$, and giving away a second, that rade made no sense. And I certainly know who Mo Taylor is, the guy can play serious offense, but he struggles to stay in a lineup because he play no D.

By the way, I never prosposed that we should be cutting the cap and getting rid of players to get under it. Doing that does not work for anyone who doubts this look up Chicago and Atlanta. And do not think that it worked in Denver. Denver's saving grace was that they drafted a guy named Carmello and the one FA they were able to sign was Andre Miller. They did have enough cap space to force the Nets to trade Martin, but getting under the cap to sign FA's has never really worked. The clsoest one came was Orlando and becasue of Grant Hill's injuries that took him out for three years, it never really worked their either.

[NYKnicks15]

no no MDelton that wasnt directed to you...knick fan knows what im talking about its a long on going discussion between us haha sorry bout not making that clear....

yea the San Antonio trade was a major plus. youll see that after the draft and even before then when seeing the ability, defense, hustle and grittyness of Malik if your not familiar with his work.

yes most definetely. the houston trade was disgustingly bad. its not the money that bothers me. frankly because without him wed still be way over the cap and i dont sign his paychecks. Dolan does...i could care less about Baker or Norris BUT there expiring contracts would of been more important elsewhere. but it is what it is and were stuck with it. heres the thing i found funny was Thomas flat out said the most coveted thing about Taylor is his expring contract...so dont expect him to be here too long or a big minute player.

[Knicker Bocker]

I cannot agree more with you mdelton

[mdelton]

One thing that fans who say "Clear Cap" forget is that when you look at Rose's deal and what remains, you would have had to sign Mohammed for at least that much at the end of this season. So in that deal one could argue that the Knicks did not really take back any additional salaries. Also, Rose's deal expires when he is 34, so we will not be paying him into his way past prime years as we obviously are with A. Houston. But that last one was A Scott Layden mistake.

[DownUnderKnick3]

That's a very good point that we probably would of had to pay Muhammed the same or more then what Rose gets and if we didn't he could walk for nothing.

[mdelton]

The more I look at this Mohammed for Rose and draft picks trade the more I like it. I don't expect a 6:7 (I hope he is really that tall, I keep getting flashbacks of Clarence Weatherspoon 6:7 really only 6:5) power forward to be our savior. However, it may be a little ealry to tell, but Rose may bring that much needed locker room and floor leadership. That has been missing since the days of Charles Oakley. We had it for a short while after that during our playof run in 98 with Terry Cumming and Buck Williams, it is an intangible that makes a difference. K Thomas, who I love and is a more talented player than Rose, however, is not a floor leader.

[NYKnicks15]

good point of view. and hes right to a tee. Malik Rose by no means is a savior. nor is he going to probably start anytime soon. BUT he brings experience. and I know your saying we have people on the team playing longer than he has. YES but no one has been on a team quite like the San Antonio Spurs nor have won 1 let alone 2 rings. As much as I dislike the Spurs they are equipt in every aspect. They know how to play good fluid ball with dignity and more importantly they know how to play D. This guy will give us a great boost off the bench and more importantly give us a good boost in morale/locker room attitude. And I dont care if the mans paid 750k or 15 million aslong as they bring energy and hardwork to this team im all for it...the 2 picks dont hurt either

[mdelton]

actually I kind of like him starting along side KT. He is better at this stage of his career than Sweetney and better offesively than Jerome Williams. And Mo Taylor can't even spell D.

[a knick fan]

the difference between malik rose and nazr mohammad is that rose is a power forward and mohammad is a center. we already have enough power forwards. we dont have any legitmate centers.

still, i dont really mind this trade, because i like that we got 2 draft picks back, and its not like mohammad was a perennial all star.

but i am furious about the houston trade. i dont get it. maurice taylor??? first of all, even if isiah sees something in him, that guy will never get any real minutes because of clog at his position. so even if hes got some talent (and at 29 i think he would have already achieved some success by now already), hes never gonna get a chance to produce. why would we give up a draft pick and two expiring contracts for him????

[a knick fan]

nyknicks15, its funny how you pointed out all those draft picks late in the draft. i've been a big advocate all along of getting players from the draft!! i loved all those players you pointed out - thats exactly what im saying...you definetely CAN find good players in the draft, even after the first 15 picks. and isiah does seem like a good talent evaluator, so maybe he will find some gems in there. you were the one that was saying its gonig to be a "weak" draft and there's "no point in trying to build out of the draft".

thats why im pissed that isiah traded away expriing contracts AND a 2nd rd. draft pick for MAURICE "yet another overpaid underproducing big man on the knicks roster" TAYLOR. we got trevor ariza in the 2nd rd. would you trade ariza for taylor? i wouldnt. i have no idea what isiah was thinking on this one. it leads me to believe that he has become desperate and lost his practical sense is DEFINETELY being influenced by the media and feels a need to "do something now or else people will really get mad at me". he should be a head talent evaluator/scout for a team in my opinion, not the GM.

[mdelton]

I think any succesful team can not do it through the draft alone, but must have established players. Having an Ariza and an Sweetney and adding another good young player to mix in with the vets is the way to go.

Ido have to say when I look at Mohmmed's performane game by game, this is a guy who is a 18 and 9 guy one night, 2 and 4 the next. He surprised epople by how well he has done in the NBA, but candidly, he has made no progressive improvement in his game. And very week on D even if he is 6:10.

He is serviceable as a center a best. He would do well in a system where he has a strong 3 and 4 along side.

[DownUnderKnick3]

I think any succesful team can not do it through the draft alone, but must have established players. Having an Ariza and an Sweetney and adding another good young player to mix in with the vets is the way to go.

Ido have to say when I look at Mohmmed's performane game by game, this is a guy who is a 18 and 9 guy one night, 2 and 4 the next. He surprised epople by how well he has done in the NBA, but candidly, he has made no progressive improvement in his game. And very week on D even if he is 6:10.

He is serviceable as a center a best. He would do well in a system where he has a strong 3 and 4 along side.

Which is why theres a good chance he could flourish along side Timmy Duncan out in Texas.

[Peach_NYK_21]

there's a very good chance, also Rasho Nesterovic has to step up his game now and get tougher, or he could be backing up nazr