whoa ppl lets keep it civil,as much as i like talking boutthe knicks ts nothing to get pissed ova
whoa ppl lets keep it civil,as much as i like talking boutthe knicks ts nothing to get pissed ova
as for trades for next year i only have 3,im not much ofa salary cap nba rules guy but i think in the right situation kwame brown would be serviceable(defense rebounding blocking altering shots etc)sign a back up pg in some one like damon stoudmire,and trade fora sf type that can pass like lamar odom. i dont know how thseswould work i dont what the mle is how salary matchupsbut i think these3 things plus drafting a petro(getting rid of sundov)train him. getting a young shooting/combo guard and a 3rd young pg.
[quote="dacash"]whoa ppl lets keep it civil,as much as i like talking boutthe knicks ts nothing to get pissed ova[/quote]
I agree and this is all about having a little fun; bouncing around trade ideas that for the most part, are pipe dreams. That doesn't give someone the right to curse (even if they substitute *** for the actual letters) and try to belittle someone because they don't agree with their trade scenarios. I was attacked because I said "I don't agree with..." and that is just un-called for!! So, I responded...
Now back to what this thread is about...
I stick by what I originally said:
C- Zydrunas Ilgauskas/Kwame Brown
F- Kwame Brown/Rose/Taylor/Sweets-(unless traded)
F- Harrington/Ariza/Newble
G- Crawford/Houston
G- Stephon/Snow
This will be their lineup, regardless of what combo of players they use to pull it off. They will use KT, Penny, TT and possibly sweets to make these trades. The only other factor would be their draft picks... Does the knicks pull of a trade at 0 hour of the draft? Right now Atlanta has the #2, would they want the 8th pick as well? If so, than a KT for AH is very possible. Al is in his final year of his contract and is NOT going to resign with Atlanta, he has said this publicly. So, if Atlanta is going to loose him at the end of the season, KT and the 8th pick is good compensation. But, do the Knicks feel like giving up the 8th? This is a deep draft and the 8th could bring a quality guy. I think if the Knicks feel they can still get a serviceable big guy with the 30th or with their second rounder, than I think they would give up the 8th pick. If Cleveland is going to play ball with the Knicks, they will force the knicks to take unwanted contracts, Newble and Snow's probably. So, TT and/or Penny will used to pull off this deal! How they get Kwame is still a mystery. He is a restricted free agent, so Washington could Match his contract, but.... Would they want to??? They could let him walk to the Knicks (for the mid level) and save the cash to give to Larry Hughes. See, that scenario makes more sence to me... LH is a crucial part to their running game and they DO NOT want Kwame on the team so.. The X factor wil be does Kwame sign for the mid level. He could take a 1 year and the Knicks could restructure his contract during the latter half of the season to give him the more lucrative contract.
Originally Posted by bobs3304
You forgot 1 * in whiny ass b***h. And if my IQ dropped 10 points, a drop from 138 to 128 is fine by me. You know this post alone makes YOU look like your the f****n mook
suck a dick
IF that comment doens't show this group what you're about, than nothing will!!
I think I would keep Pierce at the 2. Pierce is probably the injection this team needs! He comes to play every night but he is a ball hog. So, if we still had crawford; than between Crawford, Pierce and Steph, they would probably hoist up about 80 shots a night between them! The only difference is Pierce will play defense and that is what the Knicks need. But I think the Knicks would have to throw in Crawford to get Pierce. Miles to me is a 2 as well. He plays both the 3 and the 2 for Portland but even though he is 6'9", he's built more like a guard. He drives to the basket and plays D. Again, things the Knicks DON'T have right now. I would rather get Miles instead of Pierce. Play miles at the 2 and bring crawford off the bench. Raef's contract is killer as well as Pierce's. They both have multi years left at big bucks!! As I see it, the knicks will NEVER get under the cap, so why stop now. Raef is an interesting player. He has the offensive game of a 4 but plays the 5. If the Knicks got him, they could rotate him from the 5 to the 4. If they were to get Kwame, the could rotate both of them back and forth for match ups. Could make for some interesting ball games.Originally Posted by pyotrveliky
How about Jalen Rose??? Here is a guy who has a killer contract but who is actually talented! He can play 3,2 and the 1. He has 2 years left on his contract with an optional 3rd (I think). This is probably the 1 player that the Knicks could actually get. Think of the possibilities that Jalen would bring to the lineup. He is 6'8" and since he can play 3 slots, you could put a big linup out on the floor with him at the 2 or even 1. You can play him at the 3 and go a little smaller. You can start him or bring him off the bench and he plays D!
Hometheatre: Anyone that goes out of their way to find out what their IQ is has "issues"
About your lineup: I actually wouldnt mind that starting 5, except for the fact that Crawford shouldn't be starting. I think Zeke made that clear after the season ended. He's supposed to be our 6th Man like Starks was.
I wouldnt start Kwame at PF, I would keep him as a backup C and give him spot mins. at PF. I like having Harrington around, but I'm making 1 thing clear...Ariza is NOT gonna be traded. So I hope he's in your "longterm plans". Maybe signing Raja Bell or Antonio Daniels would solve our problem at the 2.
Personally though, I'd rather have Pierce b/c the guy can flat out ball, can play the 2 or 3, is still young, and I think it's about time he had a change of scenery (esp. since they lost by 27 points to Indy w/o Artest in Game 7)
Either plan is solid. Yours might be slightly more realistic, but I still think Big Z will resign /w/ Cle. IMO, Pierce is that second All-Star presence we need on this team. But I'd be happy if Zeke pulled off either.
So assuming we can get Daniels or Bell, our lineup might look like this:
Ilgauskus, Kwame
Rose, Sweets, Butler
Harrington*, Ariza
Bell/Daniels, Crawford
Marbury
* = I'm assuming JYD and 8th Pick for Harrington and Fut. 1st
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Edit: Jalen Rose....wtf, are you nuts. This proves you dont know what youre talkin about. The guy has an awful contract, AND PLAYS NO DEFENSE WHATSOEVER. You really need to do your homework.
Edit 2: Darius Miles....jesus christ. I had a little respect for you. But now I lost even that. Go back to counting your IQ points...stay away from basketball.
This post is starting to get ugly with the name calling and mudslinging. Lets keep it clean and keep it a discussion or I'm sure the moderator wouldn't mind turning a perfectly fine thread, into a dead one.
Isn't there a section for beef to be settled? Take it there.
Sorry for the off topic post.
YO HOMETHEATER.......IS THIS WHAT YOU'RE TALKIN ABOUT?
Trade 1: NYK & CLE
Timmy, Sweets, & 1st Rounder (2005 30th)
FOR
Ilgauskus (resigned - 4 Yr / 50 Mill), Snow
Cleveland wont want to give him that much $$ (most likely), and they have no use for Snow at this point. Plus, they don't have a 1st Rounder this year.
Trade 2: NYK & ATL
Taylor, 8th Pick
FOR
Harrington, Fut. 1st, 2005 2nd (31st)
Atlanta will be able to take Paul /w/ their 2nd Pick, and a guy like Taft or Vasquez with our 8th. Theyre still rebuilding, and Harrington isn't much use to them at this point b/c no matter what stars they put in the lineup (Sheed, Walker, Harrington), they still lose.
Trade 3: NYK & WAS
Kurt Thomas
FOR
Kwame Brown (Resigned - 4 Yr / 30 Mill)
Gives us a shotblocker, an athletic, tall bigman. Can play both the 4 and 5.
DRAFT
31st - Ronny Turiaf (tough, physical, hard-working PF/C)
54th - BPA, Overseas Project
FA
Sign Raja Bell - 4 Yr / 15 Mill
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Projected 2005-06 Lineup
C - Ilgauskus, Kwame, Turiaf
PF - Rose, JYD, Butler
SF - Harrington, Ariza
SG - Bell, Crawford, Houston
PG - Marbury, Snow
IR - Penny, 54th Pick
Originally Posted by bobs3304
My comment about Jalen Rose was based on a trade scenario that I thought was realistic and something I thought Isiah would do. Remember, and in your mud slinging you didn't seem to take note of this, I said that these were moves that I was guessing Isiah would make. These aren't moves that I would make or even want. If I was the GM, I would dump salary and make a run at Labron and a defensive 4/5. So back to what we were talkin' about. Jalen has 2 years left on his contract at super high money. I happen to like Miles and think he needs a change of scenary. U think he is in a similar situation to Kwame. Darius has tremendous ability but seems to fall short and I think the promise is worth the risk. I would aslo move him to the 2, because I feel that his game is a 2 not a three. I disagree with you on Miles, I think he is worth taking a chance on and he has a KT type contract.
Miles might be worth taking a chance on.....except have you seen his contract???
You'd be absolutely nuts to take on that type of $$ and not demand atleast a 1st Rounder in return. Plus, I don't know if you've actually WATCHED Miles play, but he is by far not a SG. The guy is 6-9. He plays mostly at SF, but sometimes at PF even. I realize the guys is quick, but it doesnt matter. Imagine him trying to guard Rip Hamilton.
I kinda agree - gettin Pierce is almost impossible esp. since we're both in the Atlantic. I like your idea of grabbing Kwame, Ilgauskus, and Harrington, simply b/c its very possible and it really helps this team out.
But there's no need to include Newble (IMO)..and I'd much prefer to sign Raja Bell to start at the 2 b/c he can hit the 3 (40% this year) and plays really good perimeter D. He's a team player too. Going by your offseason, I think our roster would look like this:
Ilgauskus, Kwame
Rose, JYD, Butler
Harrington, Ariza
Bell, Crawford, Houston
Marbury, Snow
Only 2 things worry me here - it's necessary to grab Bell to start b/c Crawford is our 6th man and H2O shouldnt even be playing, so that leaves us with 5 Guards...playing time would be an issue. The other is whether it's realistic to think that Zeke would make 3 separate trades this offseason. I actually think we shouldnt get Harrington(b/c it would be almost impossible to resign him next year). But either way, I'd be happy.
Originally Posted by bobs3304
I have seen Portland play and they have used Miles at the 2 as well as the 3. Reggie Miller is 6 9 and he's a 2. I know Miles doesn't have his shooting ability, but he also does not have the gerth to be a 4 and get's "pushed" around, allot of times, at the 3. Whereas he seems to be able to force his will on who guards him when playing the 2. I will go as far to say that I think he could guard Hamilton but most 2s have trouble guarding him so why would that be a downfall for Miles? Neble and snow aren't 2 guys that I want a part of at all, but if you have a team do a sign and trade or regular trade, alot of the time they try to force you to take back bad contracts. You can take this to the bank, if we get Z from Cleveland, he will come with 2 bad contracts.... and Isiah will make that deal!
Miller 6-9???
Um, try 6-6/6-7 dude. You really like just throwin numbers n facts around don't you. Just forget about getting Miles. He's a ****in headache, a lost talent, and he doesnt even provide outside shooting.
You are right he is listed as 6'7", and I don't just throw in numbers, besides stateing a few players heights, I don't use numbers in any of my posts. Not for Salary, nothing.. but my point was that size doesn't dictate position. Dirk is 7' should he be a center?? Also, Regie was on Howard Stern a while back and stated he was between 6'8" and 6'9". What I was saying was Miles game is a 2 not a 3. Unfortunately his outside shooting is very suspect but he drives and he is a very good defender! The last thing the Knicks need is another shooter! Like I said in the other posts, I wouldn't try to get anyone at this point; I would just keep dumping salary and try to enter the Labron sweepstakes. I also think in your haste to prove me wrong, you missed my original point, being I was guessing the moves Isiah would make, these weren't my moves. That's why I brought up Jalen Rose. I read all the articles where Isiah said he likes Jalen, and I know that alot of that was talk to get Carter, but I could see him pull off that move. He openly stated he liked Miles. That was the one guy that I actually liked that he mentioned. After he brought in Malik and Taylor, nothing would suprise me. I also was stateing that on the up side, at least Jalen has talent. If you are going to over pay for someone, why not someone who will at least put up some numbers and plays some D. I know that you are going to say Malik plays D but we could have done with out him on this team. So, my suggestions for players were solely based on moves that I projected Isiah would make.Originally Posted by bobs3304
My list of players that I want that I also considred realistic options, would be a little different and some of the same names.
1) I would go after Z... I am not a huge Fan but I would go after him and see if I could sign him to a 3 year.
2) Paul Pierce- Again, I feel Boston is ready to part ways with him, he does have a high contract and that's a major reason why Boston will entertain offers. I can live with his contract if we loose TT and PH in the process. I think we would have to use crawford to get him so I can live with his "ball hogging". Also he plays D and can take over a game. He had a bad rep for not getting along with a some team mates, but I think a change in venue will snap him back into the right direction and frame of mind.
3) Kwame Brown- This is where you and I disagree. I would play him at the 4. He played his first year at the 4 with GM and the 5 and I feel he would excel if put back to the 4.
4) I would draft Antoine Wright 8th since I feel we would have to use crawford to get pierce. He would be a young energetic player off the bench.
5) I was thinking about your Raja Bell suggestion and I have to agree with you. If we could get him for the LL or ML I think he is worth it. He could spot at the 2 and 3.
6) A backup 1 but not DS like Isiah is hinting. I would try to see who is around at 30 (as you can see my trend in the draft is for guards not big men).
Ok, fair enuff. I'll counter.
Players Zeke WILL NOT TRADE: Marbury, Craw, Ariza, Sweets
Players Zeke WON'T BE ABLE TO TRADE:Houston
Players Zeke CAN TRADE BUT SHOULDN'T:JYD, Timmy
Player Zeke CAN TRADE AND MIGHT:Rose, Taylor, Penny, 8th Pick
Players Zeke WILL TRADE W/O A DOUBT:Kurt
Ok, so that basically leaves us /w/ JYD, Timmy, Rose, Taylor, Penny, the 8th Pick, and Kurt as possible Trade Bait.
Knowing Zeke, I think he'll keep JYD b/c of the tenacity he brings on the floor. I think he'll keep Timmy atleast until the Trading Deadline. I doubt he would keep BOTH Taylor and Rose, so he'll probly shop both, most likely Taylor b/c he's new and has a smaller contract. Penny will be shopped, but ONLY teams /w/ serious cap issues will be willing to deal for him (Dallas, Minny, Philly). The 8th Pick can be used to get us another star player, but I don't know who Zeke is eyeing just yet. Kurt, w/o question, will be gone in 2 or 3 months.
Personally, combining what Zeke MIGHT do /w/ what I WOULD do, I'd look to deal Taylor, Kurt, Penny, and the 8th Pick this offseason.Toward the Trading Deadline, I'd listen to offers for Timmy and maybe Sweets(depending on how poorly he plays next season).
Just forget about Lebron, he'll be extended before we even get a chance. He's from the Cle and loves it there. Theyre doing everything they can to keep him, and he appreciates it.Originally Posted by hometheaterguy
Forget about Big Z. He's a good Center but he's not Knick caliber.
Pierce is Knick caliber, but unfortunately, I doubt he's available. My bad for thinkin he was, I was gettina hardon thinkin Zeke could deal for him, but it won't happen.
Miles would be a nice pickup, but he can't shoot and WE NEED SHOOTING BADLY. ALONG WITH DEFENSE. Why you think Zeke was interested in Wally World? B/c Houston is crippled and we have no accurate 3-point shooters on this team.
If I was Zeke, I would kidnap Pierce and get a Knicks uniform on him as fast as possible. I'd give up anyone but Ariza to get him.
The truth is, we need to get a guy in NY, a guy we can just inject into this lineup, into this ****in city, to change everything. We need the ghost of Spree back. We need that nastiness back. We need Camby's clone. We need a coach who leads us into battle in the playoffs. We need smart players, we need troublemakers on the court, not off of it. Artest is too much a gamble anyway, but he wont be available. Miles is too much a gamble and HE CANT SHOOT. I really think Pierce is the way to go, but it's really sad caz he's not gonna be available and I can't think of anyone else that could get this city back up on its feet. I guess I'll just watch the 99 vid and keep the memory alive.
Peace
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