KnicksFan4Realz dropping some real ****.
Schools as I said should be made to teach one,the profession, not just an overall generalized formal education. General education from K-8...9-12 all high schools will be career specialized. And I do mean all of them...so this means parents will have to grow their kids up much faster but in many black houses this already happens only difference now would be placing them in a better position for their careers.
Schools should have the following designations...
6.) Political Science/Government/Economics
These are pretty much all specific enough for many to be better prepared into the profession after college.
Giving them a stronger background. Now for some that still do not know what they wish to do with their lives...you keep only a handful of "General H.S.'s" around...they point being you want to discourage this...and of course these schools would comply directly with State requirements for graduation and such with a regular HS Diploma.
In addition to these core courses at these specialized schools...you have what I call "reality courses" these as well being mandatory classes.
1.) Critical Thinking/Ethics/Morality
2.) Public Speaking
3.) Basic Automotive repair
4.) Effects of Credit/Loans...how these things work
5.) Business Etiquette/Ethics
6.) Sex Education/Health/Fitness/Nutrition
7.) Relationships/Racism/Sexism/ And the ethics involved in them
Athletics will be encouraged and anyone on such team will fill their fitness requirements...but not their sex education/health/nutrition requirements.
All these schools should look like mini-college campuses, especially where space is available. And just like college the students stay on campus and return home only when the semester is over, break them out of the habit of running to mommy or daddy to solve problems. They have to learn how to get along with people, because if they plan to go into the service or college this is going to be necessary, it's vital.
Teachers and administrators would be required to be on campus as well during the semester. So they are becoming one unit, connected by the desire to learn and to aspire to great things. Now this would take some use to more so from the parents than the students...parent would be allowed to visit during specified times...or stop by just like any other college does currently. Students only of same sex will be roommates...male and female dormitories will be on opposite sides of the campus...of course you'd have your Resident Advisor's....
Then people are going to bring up the sex issue between the teens...of course it would not be condoned...room checks will happen randomly...however as a part of teaching them "reality" condoms and contraceptions will be made available...and there will be campus police. Most times nothing will happen, but can't predict everything.
KnicksFan4Realz dropping some real ****.
interesting stuff but maybe a lil off topic
I read these posts everyday even though I seldom join in on the action, but I must say that this is the MOST intelligent convo that you cats ever had...
Keep thinking of the masses!!!
All Power to the People!!!
could you post the url to that
what the hell is going in this thread?
I'm Cuban- don't get me started on politics fellas lol
Everyone is droppin jewels here. Nice!
If the convo started with why can't nike make their profits, etc etc. isnt capitlolism good etc etc.
Capitolism also fueled the crack epidemic of the 80's. (Very little goverment help in reducing the amount of drugs entered in the country)
When an entire generation of crack babies, and how devastating it was to poor neighborhoods, the goverment at least started to get more involved in slowing the flow of drugs here.
Capitolism has no morals, its bare essense is to be a hustler. Even if its illegal. Rich capitolists break monopoly and business ethics laws and dont feel an inch of heat.
Goverment has to monitor capitolism simply becuase it knows no bounds, capitlism has great as u may see it, only survives thru exploitation. Its the methods and means of exploitation that shifts. (think of timeline, 1st indians,then slaves, then chinese rail road workers, then south americans, then global labor exploitation.
But ya, nike and jordan should be more socially conscience and not blood sucking greedy $150 wh*res
Still not seeing the fact of socialism or communism being perfect from greed or abuse.
Once again with capitalism it is more possible to gain a lot and coming from nothing. Can't have that under any of the other systems. I still no viable link between capitalism and evil. Because in my view, what I have gone through, people do evil ****, people do evil things, people are greedy. Not an economic system, and economic system is only ran and controlled by the people who run them in the first place.
I don't think people in society who contribute nothing should get anything back from society, I'm not quite sure if it is the job of society to take care of those whom cannot take care of themselves...I'm not saying it would not be a higher cause not to take care of those folks who can't do for themselves...just not sure that it is each citizens responsibility.
Being your brother's keeper is one thing, wiping his ass for him constantly and pulling his weight for him is another.
I think the only people that should benefit from the system are the ones who put into the system. Period. You put in nothing you should get nothing. Just being born in my view doesn't entitle you to anything. Nothing in this world is free, there is always a cost somewhere to someone.
I think society's role should be to educate a person, give them an equal and fair chance...but like life it's chance not a guarantee at success...big difference in my view.
I still think capitalism even with it's cons is a better system than any of the others because one should benefit from their hard work and labor...and be allowed to make as much as they can from their ideas, their work, their discipline, their sacrifices. I should not have to share my success with someone who doesn't do jack ****, or doesn't contribute, or doesn't work as hard as I do.
We all as humans may very well be fundamentally equal, but it's not practical equality. Is the skill of the janitor worth more than the doctor? The skill of the computer programmer worth the same as the customer service agent? The skill of the baker worth more than the skill of the soldier...NO none of them are NOT equal to each other practically, because each has a different functional skill that is worth more than the other depending on the circumstances.
You don't send bakers or programmer's to fight a war...you don't ask janitor to perform heart surgeries, you don't ask English teachers to fix an automobile.
2. We live in a society where markets set the standards, so its ok for A-rod to make 252mil and a social worker/polic officer/nurse/ etc can all make less than 50k a year? plz its pathetic fundamentally and morally. There is no justifying that. Thats the reason why you see soo many inner city kids focusing on playing sports than focus in the classroom, its easier to try and make it in the NBA than to get an education. Again, capitolism sets this mark.
2) So what if A-Rod is making 252 million dollars? How is that his fault?
That teacher making 50,000 a year...let's look at her job...She is paid whether those kids pass or fail regardless. She has the best months off of work...namely, Half of June, ALL July, ALL August, and some of September, in most states...there are no performance bonuses built into her contract.
Because teachers won't allow that...teachers actually having their pay being determined how well their kids do on state exams? Ha...that will cause such an uproar...especially if you got a room full of dumbassess. Then who would she blame if say she is a HS teacher...The JHS they came from? The Elementary? The parents?The students themselves for not being smart enough? Herself for not giving extra help to those who need it? The state for not providing her enough resources? The taxpayers? The community...the dollars the go to each school is determined by the income of the community the school is in...so if School A is producing $5million, and School B producing $2million...school A has a bigger pool of resources. That's how dollars for education are alloted by district. So if you teach in a poor community...you're ****ed. Plain and simple. It's why so many leave the inner city schools because of this formula.
I'm tired of folks blaming capitalism, you know what a teacher's salary is before you even get into the field. Guess what, if it is too low? DON'T WORK IN THAT FIELD. Find something better to do, find a better school to teach at...choose another profession. That's the freedom capitalism allows. When take on a job, and they tell you the salary..YOU ARE AGREEING TO WORK AT THAT NUMBER. If you feel it's underpaid...YOU HAVE THE FREEDOM TO QUIT mostly anytime you wish...**** it no one is going to chase after you saying you must work in this field in this job. It doesn't happen.
I joined the Service, so I can have my college education paid for...after that I took engineering/construction in college...I was more interested in music...but I like money and having more than enough of it to feed and clothe my family. So being good at math and science...I used my most valuable skill...my brain and determined this is what is best economically for myself and my family. That's all...I don't why folks this day and age can't seem to think about the choices they make....
No one owes you anything in this world. It has to be earned. Don't bring morals into this it has nothing to do with it. Absolutely nothing at all. If someone offers me $1 million dollars a year to design a building, and the mailroom clerk is only getting say $24,000 a year...how the **** is that my fault he's only getting 24k?
I put myself into a position to make that kind of money...I don't know what you personally do for a living but if someone offered you a $2 million a year salary...and there is a market base to pay for that...THE FANS...you wouldn't take it based on moral grounds? Give me a break...you'd take that money...and take care of you and yours. End of story. Because that's all that matter's the education.
Athletes you see their ****-ups on the field or arena of play...you don't see that with teachers. She could have 6 classes of 30 students each thats 180...say 150 pass...and 30 fail...and her counterpart has the same amount of students...and only 100 pass...and 80 fail...should they not be paid differently based on performance?
You can't pay teachers all the same amount because you should not...not all of them have the same great teaching skills. You have to weed out the ones who do it for a paycheck and really don't give a **** about teaching. I've had plenty of teachers like that in the NYC public school system....and I've had a handful of great one's and 90% I had them 1 yr in..the next they left to go to the suburbs...they didn't owe me anything than to do their job to the best of their ability. Not everyone is equal, and everyone should not be paid equally. Period.
You don't like what your job is paying you quit, find a better paying one. Period.
The market determines pay as it should..I make a very good living...I'm good at what I do..why should my income be capped because someone else didn't go and get themselves the education necessary and acquire the necessary skills to place them in proper position?
Like I said you fix the education received at the basic levels...but after that there comes a point when you are responsible for you.
The reason why inner city kids focus on sports and not other fields mainly is because, yes the money is obvious but who wouldn't? But 2....the culture. I'm out here in PHX, mostly white kids ask them what they want to do with their lives...you get answers of lawyer, doctor, nurse, cop, scientist...go to the black communities, hispanic communities...you get sports athletes, actors, rappers.......
Why? Because the parents emphasize the wrong ambitions...parents are the reason why the kids gravitate towards those fields 99% have no realistic shot at attaining. A lot of folks don't go to community college even to get better skills, they waste their money on lotto tickets..hoping they'll hit to fix all their problems in one fell swoop.
You have to fix society well before you start screwing with the economic system. Everyone is not equal, so I know I why I believe everyone should not be paid equally.
I was in the Army served in Iraq and Afghanistan, I served for just a little over 5 years...I should have gotten paid more than any teacher anywhere in this country, more than any janitor, more than any engineer...my ass was literally on the line every single say...and not only that I had other people's lives directly in my hands...when I started I was barely making $1,100 a month....I knew the pay was not the reason I was joining...but I'm just making a point...you talk about morality, the person getting shot at in defense of his country for the benefit and security of others in this nation should get paid more than EVERYONE ELSE. REGARDLESS. You teach 8th graders...don't even sit and tell me your job is as dangerous as mine. You pick up trash...give me a break.
Last edited by KnicksFan4Realz; Jul 19, 2007 at 10:52.
There are examples in which u "gain what u earn" the flaw in that statement is that you would be correct if the field was even. What are the foundations of your system and philosophy? Exploitation.
Clearly you dont "gain what u earn" when you create the idea of an inferior race solely for economic reasons. This nation has taken yrs to be "equal" (which unfortunately if you look at it from a means of definition, the utter fact that there needs to be a law in order to uphold a natural given right to be equal than the race who wrote the laws further shows that racism still exists.) If it didnt, there wouldnt be any laws to proctect colored people.
AS a vet, u should have learned that the military isnt about the individual, becuase u chose to join as u said, by joining you are in clear support of ur administrations policy. Maybe u should write a letter to bush to give u a lil bit more piece of their Haliburton Pie. I dont know what ur beliefs are but i dont buy the gotta stay on offense debacle, its been worse than ever, and that was exactly what the goverment wants so that they can continue the infringment of our natural rights in the constitution thru the Patriot Act.
Capitolism breeds ways to exploit that will shock ur imagination and its been done for centuries. Some people notice, some dont.
The system of education we have now is one of the worst in the world. a system that breeds social disorders? Have u looked at the murder rates in this country than others? its nothing to be proud of. Gun rates? highest in the world.
Theres no coincedence that a school in Harlem is in worse shape (whether physically, grades, conduct etc) than a school in Hamptons, LI. And u say equality. U should visit these schools for urself..
Wow, it's been a few days sense I posted on this topic. You guys are covering a variety of issues. All good points. My point was more toward the Starbury vs Nike subject. I fully understand the basic principles of economics, supply and demand and ext, but there's a point when the consumer is being or feels ripped off. Kids typically don't have the intelligence to understand that they are being ripped off any my point is Nike, like the Oil industry is ripping of it's consumers. I understand this is a matter of opinion. I'm not saying that Nike or Oprah shouldn't make a certain amount of money because we live in a free society and you should make as much as you can. The problem as I stated before is capitalism is fueled by greed. The purpose of business is to make money by any means, legal or illegal if you can get away with it. We see this all the time in politics. Nike would love to sell their shoes for $500.00 and they can and should be able to do that. The problem runs so much deeper than Nike. It's subliminal advertising. Nike spends millions a year convincing kids that they must have their product. Here's where the lack of ethics comes in. Nike doesn't give a **** about the poor families that can't afford the product. But they specifically target the lower economical market. Through subliminal ads, these shoe companies create a culture in which kids are social outcasts if they don't have certain things. Cloths, cars, shoes ext. And it's not just Nike. This is a problem through out the country but it hits as specially hard to the inner city. This isn't a problem for any of us I don't think but it hits hard for the less privileged and less educated, which is a huge chunk of America and the world. So what's the answer? Education? But who's education? GiantsKnickFan pointed out that public or as I call it, government education has failed miserably. How do you change a culture? Viacom controls 3/4 of the music outlets which feeds kids B.S. messages and NBA players are young them selves so they are thinking 'I'm just tryin to get paid'. This to me is why I think what Marbury is doing is so important. He's a business man with ethics. He takes a stand where he can make profits and create American jobs. Stephon Marbury is capitalist with a soul which is rare in capitalism.
Ohh cry me a river. I went to PS. 76 MS. 135 Bergtraum HS. Then the US Army...got out then went to Virginia Tech. I have a degree in Mechanical Engineering and B.S. Philosophy. I grew up right there in the Bronx 666 Adee Ave...White Plains Road.
People have the power to make their own choices. Period. Yeah yeah advertisements, advertisements. I go to the store, I need water, I need toilet paper, I need cereal, I need juice, I need underwear..etc..etc. I walk through the aisles...some products cost more than others...also some products are of better quality than others. But I as a consumer can choose which products wish to buy. Period. No one cartoon character, or great thematic song, influences my purchasing habits. I base it off of what I believe is better quality, and a good fair price. Most shoppers shop this way..but you have that few no matter what the price...have to get said product because it is "a name" I grant you that point.
However, if they do not watch their financial bottomline whose fault is that? No one tells you to spend the extra .40cents a roll to get Quilted Northern over Charmin...no one tells you to buy Rocawear jeans at $80 a pair..over say Ralph Lauren that costs $65 bucks a pair. People make choices, and people are responsible for their own choices. Period. It's not the governments job to come in and help folks balance a check book..I would agree it's in government's best interest to show you how to balance a check book....but that's the limit. Once I show you how to do something, I'm taking the training wheels off...how you choose to ride your bike is up to you 100%..and if you fall, after I've made you aware of the dangers...that is your own fault.
My statement was not ignorant it's true. I lived in the projects for 17 years...can't no one tell me anything about life in the projects I lived it...a lot of people there...are there because they made f'd up choices plain and simple. I can recall a handful of older people than me...talking mid-20's whom I say everyday come in and out going to college...most folks in there...don't give a damn...and are only interested in living "ghetto fabulous" period. Some get out, most don't, and you have many who are happy to be there. Yes it does beat living on the street and being homeless but that's not saying much.
People need restraint, but they also need to learn to take responsibility for their own actions. I see society moving away from this, and wanting to constantly blame other people, or systems, or institutions, for their ****ed up decision making. What ever happened to personal responsibility? I mean seriously it's like a dirty concept now, especially in the communities that need more of it...and the greatest area it is needed is the BLACK COMMUNITY. That's a fact. We need to put more foot to ass and draw some lines of what acceptable and what is not.
I never said every single person of color is ignorant or stupid, but ALOT ARE. Stop denying that point. If every single person of color was that smart, alot of them would not be where they currently are in life. So obviously something needs to change. Sure PS.76, MS.135, even Bergtraum being in the financial district and all..was not an equal education to the one say in Larchmont, White Plains, Hartsdale etc...they had better resources than in the inner city. I've already explained how those dollars are calculated...but if you have people dropping out, cutting class...and not even trying to attempt to get and use the education they are getting...it's never going to work.
I don't care how many schools you revamp...how much more you make them more conducive to learning and provide safety, how many great teachers you woo with great salaries and benefits..if you do not have the internal desire to take your ass to class, that's not one's fault but your OWN. PERIOD. My social studies teacher...said something one time...and it's been apart of my life ever since...
"If you fail to prepare, then prepare to fail" and he was a Jamaican emigrant...if the black community continuously fails to adopt this mantra...we will never escape the cycle many of our "lost" one's are in...tough love and compassion is needed YES, but we mustn't forget to hand out strong discipline as well.
The kids don't have the desire is that the parent fault? Is that the rapper's fault? Is that the school's fault? So far pointing all those fingers...the kids are going to have to point them at themselves in the end sum of things. The world is/does not want to hear excuses of why you did not make it...because when you look back on your life only you.
Parents are the first line of defense in their child's future, PERIOD. I take my daughter and nephew to museums, science fairs all the time...most times we are the only black faces...I go take them to see the Suns/Knicks or a Cardinals game...not tons of black faces..but certainly more at those events..something is wrong with that picture! And it should be a great ****ing shame to the black community. We for the most part come from people who endured slavery, that would have died and did die and get beaten for wanting to learn and read a book...any book...and now **** please...parent's don't even bother to read to their children...and don't give their busy at work...I come from a single father household...my father worked 12-16 hr days..and HE WAS A REAL MAN, AND REAL PARENT AND MADE TIME.
I'm just tired of all these EXCUSES, in my people. I really am, and it makes me sick.
As far as the government monitoring is concerned..you people think you really have it bad here? If this government was truly oppressive you would not be here expressing your dissent right now... go to Iraq..Afghan...say something against whomever is in charge see what happens to you...go to China...see if they don't put your nuts in a ringer about voicing a bad opinion about government or Taiwan. People here complain about nothing. I've seen what real oppression looks like first hand, America is nowhere near close to that...people need to really stop exaggerating that point. I tell people, especially civilians all the time...you think you have it that bad here...go overseas and experience it for yourself...and I don't mean France or England...go tour some of the more oppressive countries like Libya..and you tell me how bad you have it here again!