View Poll Results: Who will win the matchup at Center?

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  • Dwight Howard

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  • Curry lost

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Thread: New York Knicks vs Orlando Magic Game Thread

  1. #46

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Arroyo > Robinson/Collins. Arroyo is an average defender, Nate went 2-8 against Los.
    Nate right now, is better then Arroyo in my opinion and has a much bigger upside, given his age, athletic ability and skillset. Arroyo's probably better then Mardy Collins but I'd rather find out about Collins and give him an opportunity. Arroyo is weak defensively which is why he has had trouble getting consistent minutes from Van Gundy, Brown and Sloan. I know he's one of your favorite players but you have to be fair.

    One thing I'll say for certain is that considering Isiah isn't giving Nate or Mardy minutes I'd much rather have Arroyo running the point then Crawford or Fred Jones.

  2. #47
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    Originally Posted by Eddy Currys House Special
    Nate right now, is better then Arroyo in my opinion and has a much bigger upside, given his age, athletic ability and skillset. Arroyo's probably better then Mardy Collins but I'd rather find out about Collins and give him an opportunity. Arroyo is weak defensively which is why he has had trouble getting consistent minutes from Van Gundy, Brown and Sloan. I know he's one of your favorite players but you have to be fair.

    One thing I'll say for certain is that considering Isiah isn't giving Nate or Mardy minutes I'd much rather have Arroyo running the point then Crawford or Fred Jones.
    You're wrong once again.

    Arroyo is a superior player to Robinson. Most Orlando fans will tell you Arroyo has been the best PG in Orlando. Arroyo has the best CHEMISTRY with the starters and the team plays best when Arroyo and Hedo are running the show.

    More experience and maturity, Arroyo has as much talent if not more than Robinson, dunking a basketball isn't really "talent", Arroyo is really one of the most flashiest PG's in the NBA, which is the reason why he doesn't start.

    Arroyo can play PG affectively with his court vision and passing skills, Robinson and Collins cannot play the PG and are really OFF GUARDS, you can't really on those guys to run an offense affectively like Arroyo can.

    You don't watch Arroyo much, at best two games. Arroyo is an average defender. He doesn't shut anyone down, but he stays in front of his man and has good footwork.

    Arroyo is a C+ level player, Robinson is C, Collins is C-.

  3. #48

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    You're wrong once again.

    Arroyo is a superior player to Robinson. Most Orlando fans will tell you Arroyo has been the best PG in Orlando. Arroyo has the best CHEMISTRY with the starters and the team plays best when Arroyo and Hedo are running the show.
    My bad I didn't realize you were right on the pulse of Orlando Fans

    If Arroyo is so good for the Magic why did Van Gundy have him out of the rotation? He only got minutes again after recent injuries to Nelson and Dooling.

    The only thing Arroyo does better then Nate is pass and hopefully with time Nate will continue to improve that part of his game. I guarantee you there is not one team in the NBA that would rather have a 28/29 Arroyo then a 23/24Nate. For once in your life be objective and dont let your opinions be clouded by the stench of your favorite players ass crack.

  4. #49

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Arroyo can play PG affectively with his court vision and passing skills, Robinson and Collins cannot play the PG and are really OFF GUARDS, you can't really on those guys to run an offense affectively like Arroyo can.
    I agree but Arroyo is what he is and he's not getting any better where as Robinson and Collins have the potential to improve. We wouldn't be going anywhere with Carlos Arroyo playing for the knicks anyway.

  5. #50
    The Gold Mac MSGKnickz33's Avatar
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    At this point Arroyo is better then Nate, i wouldnt include Mardy Collins in this discussion. You cant bring up the fact that metros an arroyo fan, he never game him too much credit. Hes clearly stated that Arroyo is a C+ player, which i agree with. And his defense is somewhere around average, occasionally every player has a bad game.

    The best way to describe Arroyo is SOLID, he knows the fundamentals of the game. You dont see players constantly driving by him like they do against crawford. Hes underrated, and clearly better then Jameer Nelson. I hope people are finally realizing that Jameer isnt what hes hyped up to be.

    Arroyos defense and playmaking>>>Nate Robinson

    I like Nates upside too, maybe he'll be better then Arroyo next year of the following year but rite now Arroyo>>>Nate Robinson.


  6. #51
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    Originally Posted by Eddy Currys House Special
    My bad I didn't realize you were right on the pulse of Orlando Fans

    If Arroyo is so good for the Magic why did Van Gundy have him out of the rotation? He only got minutes again after recent injuries to Nelson and Dooling.

    The only thing Arroyo does better then Nate is pass and hopefully with time Nate will continue to improve that part of his game. I guarantee you there is not one team in the NBA that would rather have a 28/29 Arroyo then a 23/24Nate. For once in your life be objective and dont let your opinions be clouded by the stench of your favorite players ass crack.
    I follow teams like Orlando, New Orleans, Atlanta and Sacramento because those teams have some of my fav players in the league. I read over the fan forums of each team, and its a fact Orlando fans feel Arroyo is a better PG than Nelson. Arroyo > Nelson > Robinson > Collins. I honestly would take Robinson over Nelson. Nelson would give New York a headache.

    Arroyo, Nelson and Dooling all got inconsistent minutes from Stan Van Gundy, it has nothing to do with their ability. Arroyo had 5 straight good games as a starter and hit the bench mysteriously, theres no explanation; Magic fans believe its Otis Smith playing favorites since Jameer got that extension. Similar to how Balkman doesn't play much for the Knicks. How can you ask such a stupid question when you don't follow the team? I can't believe you get more stupid with each post.

    Arroyo is starting material, Nate isn't.

    Arroyo is better at a lot of things, and you would agree too and have no argument against it.

    Experience
    maturity
    Ball handling skills
    assist to turnover ratio
    assist machine
    good size for a PG
    court vision
    can lead an offense
    pick and roll skills forwards
    solid starter
    crossover and dribble skills
    mid range shooting.

    I like Nate, so I'll list things he is better at over Arroyo; since you're way too ****ing stupid to add any detail to your post...you're like a PBS special, just mad ****ing boring, not even weed could get anyone interest in what you say.

    Vertical leap
    Quickness/explosiveness
    3pt shooting
    Penetration
    Youth
    Good bench player, poor starter.

    Isiah actually thinks Arroyo is the most underrated player in the NBA...I'll pull out the article later, so you really need to take the dildo out of your ass and go to sleep, this chat is over. Arroyo > Robinson.

  7. #52
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    i don't see enough of orlando to make a educated comment on carlos or nelson... but i do watch the knicks and imo nate is nothing more then a circus act... maybe we can trade him to ringling bros...

  8. #53

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    I follow teams like Orlando, New Orleans, Atlanta and Sacramento because those teams have some of my fav players in the league. I read over the fan forums of each team, and its a fact Orlando fans feel Arroyo is a better PG than Nelson. Arroyo > Nelson > Robinson > Collins. I honestly would take Robinson over Nelson. Nelson would give New York a headache.

    Arroyo, Nelson and Dooling all got inconsistent minutes from Stan Van Gundy, it has nothing to do with their ability. Arroyo had 5 straight good games as a starter and hit the bench mysteriously, theres no explanation; Magic fans believe its Otis Smith playing favorites since Jameer got that extension. Similar to how Balkman doesn't play much for the Knicks. How can you ask such a stupid question when you don't follow the team? I can't believe you get more stupid with each post.

    Arroyo is starting material, Nate isn't.

    Arroyo is better at a lot of things, and you would agree too and have no argument against it.

    Experience
    maturity
    Ball handling skills
    assist to turnover ratio
    assist machine
    good size for a PG
    court vision
    can lead an offense
    pick and roll skills forwards
    solid starter
    crossover and dribble skills
    mid range shooting.

    I like Nate, so I'll list things he is better at over Arroyo; since you're way too ****ing stupid to add any detail to your post...you're like a PBS special, just mad ****ing boring, not even weed could get anyone interest in what you say.

    Vertical leap
    Quickness/explosiveness
    3pt shooting
    Penetration
    Youth
    Good bench player, poor starter.

    Isiah actually thinks Arroyo is the most underrated player in the NBA...I'll pull out the article later, so you really need to take the dildo out of your ass and go to sleep, this chat is over. Arroyo > Robinson.
    First of all I am sick of arguing with you about what is obvious. MSG you need to stop sharing the same brain with Metrotard. It is hard to find you credible when there hasn't been one time where you disagree with him.

    As far as Nate and Arroyo go they are very difficult to compare because they are totally different players. Again I don't mind Arroyo I just think Nate has a better upside. Lol @ you calling Arroyo a solid starter and Nate a poor starter when Arroyo has gotten benched by every coach he's ever started for and Nate has never really gotten a chance to start and play 35 minutes until recently. Again I think Nate has a greater upside provided he continues to mature and gets the right coaching.

    I will agree to disagree with you on Arroyo vs Nate.

  9. #54

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Isiah actually thinks Arroyo is the most underrated player in the NBA...I'll pull out the article later, so you really need to take the dildo out of your ass and go to sleep, this chat is over. Arroyo > Robinson.
    Oh and since when did Isiah become a great gm whose opinion we should trust?

    You crack me up Metro. You make fun of Isiah and rightfully so call him out on being an incompetent gm but then use him and what he says to make your case for Arroyo. You're such a hypocrite.

  10. #55
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    Originally Posted by Eddy Currys House Special
    First of all I am sick of arguing with you about what is obvious. MSG you need to stop sharing the same brain with Metrotard. It is hard to find you credible when there hasn't been one time where you disagree with him.

    As far as Nate and Arroyo go they are very difficult to compare because they are totally different players. Again I don't mind Arroyo I just think Nate has a better upside. Lol @ you calling Arroyo a solid starter and Nate a poor starter when Arroyo has gotten benched by every coach he's ever started for and Nate has never really gotten a chance to start and play 35 minutes until recently. Again I think Nate has a greater upside provided he continues to mature and gets the right coaching.

    I will agree to disagree with you on Arroyo vs Nate.
    I was an isiahsexual until this year, i believe the spurs will make it to the finals (although im rootin for the Lakers)........what I wrote about Arroyo is what I think, hes a C+ player and at worst a below average defender but I believe hes an average defender. Your probally basing your opinion on one game where maybe he didnt show up defensivly. Now that I think about it you brought up how he doesnt get consistent minutes from his current/previous coaches. Coaches arent always right, even the best ones. From what I seen of Arroyo hes a solid player who should be playing about 25 to 30 minutes a game. If he was on the Knicks Id have no problem with seein him play 35 to 40 minutes.

  11. #56
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    Originally Posted by Eddy Currys House Special
    First of all I am sick of arguing with you about what is obvious. MSG you need to stop sharing the same brain with Metrotard. It is hard to find you credible when there hasn't been one time where you disagree with him.

    As far as Nate and Arroyo go they are very difficult to compare because they are totally different players. Again I don't mind Arroyo I just think Nate has a better upside. Lol @ you calling Arroyo a solid starter and Nate a poor starter when Arroyo has gotten benched by every coach he's ever started for and Nate has never really gotten a chance to start and play 35 minutes until recently. Again I think Nate has a greater upside provided he continues to mature and gets the right coaching.

    I will agree to disagree with you on Arroyo vs Nate.
    My ugly abandoned child, you're not qualified to "argue" with me, this is a lesson that you're learning. No one is going to agree with an unemployed 27 year college drop out. You haven't earned the right to agree with me, or the respect. Until you add some credible post with insight, detail and facts, you'll be the jackass of the forum. Its not just the fact that you're a boring poster with no facts, you're delusional and think we actually want you here...this forum has been garbage ever since you registered.

    Having better upside doesn't mean the better player. You're the last person in the world to determine who has better upside since you lack a lot of common sense with NBA ball and have no knowledge about NBA products, NBA players progression, and even Nate Robinson's practice/work routine that will improve him. The only thing you have is Robinson's age. "Youthier" doesn't make you better, and this is why I penciled you as a complete ****ing moron for believe that makes Nate better than Arroyo.

    Arroyo is a C+ player, C+ players get bench and start games. Arroyo is still solid, and can contribute as a starter or bench player.

    Originally Posted by Eddy Currys House Special
    Oh and since when did Isiah become a great gm whose opinion we should trust?

    You crack me up Metro. You make fun of Isiah and rightfully so call him out on being an incompetent gm but then use him and what he says to make your case for Arroyo. You're such a hypocrite.
    I smacked Isiah for his stupidity as GM, Coach, and President. I never questioned his ability to scout and understand talent in basketball. If Arroyo was on the Knicks, he's Isiah type of player; flashy player with a lot of talent but not too many dimensions; Arroyo would be getting 38 minutes a game, I'll atleast could enjoy the Knick loses better.

    You're still clueless on how to stand correct. MSG and I stand tall like Gods, take notes.

  12. #57

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    My ugly abandoned child, you're not qualified to "argue" with me, this is a lesson that you're learning. No one is going to agree with an unemployed 27 year college drop out. You haven't earned the right to agree with me, or the respect. Until you add some credible post with insight, detail and facts, you'll be the jackass of the forum. Its not just the fact that you're a boring poster with no facts, you're delusional and think we actually want you here...this forum has been garbage ever since you registered.

    Having better upside doesn't mean the better player. You're the last person in the world to determine who has better upside since you lack a lot of common sense with NBA ball and have no knowledge about NBA products, NBA players progression, and even Nate Robinson's practice/work routine that will improve him. The only thing you have is Robinson's age. "Youthier" doesn't make you better, and this is why I penciled you as a complete ****ing moron for believe that makes Nate better than Arroyo.

    Arroyo is a C+ player, C+ players get bench and start games. Arroyo is still solid, and can contribute as a starter or bench player.



    I smacked Isiah for his stupidity as GM, Coach, and President. I never questioned his ability to scout and understand talent in basketball. If Arroyo was on the Knicks, he's Isiah type of player; flashy player with a lot of talent but not too many dimensions; Arroyo would be getting 38 minutes a game, I'll atleast could enjoy the Knick loses better.

    You're still clueless on how to stand correct. MSG and I stand tall like Gods, take notes.
    Since you're so enamored with Stats from the Post today...

    ' Nate Robinson's NBA Player rating is #132, 70 slots ahead of Carlos Arroyo who slips in at #201. Nate's all important PER (player efficiency rating) is higher than 12 starting point guards and is higher than ALL THREE point guards in Orlando.
    Here is the rest of that list Mike Bibby, Kirk Hinrich, Earl Watson, Rafer Alston, Beno Udrich, Raymond Felton, and Antonio Daniels. Not only that, it is higher than both Rajon Rondo and Derek Fisher, whose Celtics and Lakers lead the Eastern and Western conferences respectively. And lest you forget, Nate has
    played the majority of this season coming off the bench, averaging only about 25 minutes per game.'

    *Takes Bow*




    Good night and good luck. *Shuts Door on Metrotards finger*

  13. #58
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    lol @ this chimp running from an old quote from Robinson's agent, he's too stupid to look up things for himself, stealing other people's material.

    Carl Landry has a PER of 24 where as Artest has one of 18, 20 spots behind Landry, who would you prefer? That stat still doesn't contradict the points I made, you still lose...you never allowed in the room(forum), stay the **** out.

    Arroyo has better shooting percentages, assist rate and better assist to turnover ratio rate and I've already proven he's the superior player.
    Originally posted by Kramer(magic fan):
    I have observed that Carlos Arroyo plays excellent defense. He is smart and does things correctly. He may not pressure the ball well but he can burst through screens and closes out on three point shooters rather well. Also isn't constantly helping like the rest of the team.
    Damn dude, did Arroyo bust a nut in your mother's ***** or is it I really piss you off?

  14. #59

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    lol @ this chimp running from an old quote from Robinson's agent, he's too stupid to look up things for himself, stealing other people's material.

    Carl Landry has a PER of 24 where as Artest has one of 18, 20 spots behind Landry, who would you prefer? That stat still doesn't contradict the points I made, you still lose...you never allowed in the room(forum), stay the **** out.

    Arroyo has better shooting percentages, assist rate and better assist to turnover ratio rate and I've already proven he's the superior player.


    Damn dude, did Arroyo bust a nut in your mother's ***** or is it I really piss you off?
    Metrotard if you're going to show yourself to be a classless twit then at least be funny when you attempt to insult me. I understand why you behave this way because time and again over the past two months I have proved you to be more style over substance when it comes to your opinions. You can't handle being wrong and instead of either, a. seeing the light or b. respectfully disagreeing, you choose to be childish and hurl insult after insult my way. This does not prove you to be a knowledgeable NBA fan. The only thing it proves is that you are an insecure, weak little man who isn't even worth being heard.

    My place in this forum is not up to you to decide. In my two months here I have never been warned, nor banned by the mods for anything I have written. This is more then I can say for you during your time here. That said I feel that you do have a right to your opinion and that you do have a good knowledge of the game. Unfortunately, your behavior towards those that dare disagree with you only undermines your intelligence, not prove it. Your behavior towards other posters who don't see things your way reminds me of a funny quote I know, "Those of you who say you know everything are irritating to those of us who actually do".

    I really hope that the way you behave here is purely tongue in cheek and not a reflection about the kind of human being you are in real life. I also hope that MSG does not continue to be influenced by your shenanigans because his passion with the game threads and for the knicks is far too great to be tainted by the likes of you.

    Nevertheless I will indulge you for what I can only hope is the final time in debate here. Not because I care about your insults but rather because you're just not worth my time and the more I go back and forth with you the more I insult my own intelligence. So here it is...

    I love how metrotard casually dismisses numbers as being nothing more then meaningless stats when they aren't in his favor. Even though you like it that way in the bedroom, in real life, you can't have things both ways. Arroyo always has been and always will be nothing more then a backup/3rd string point guard in the NBA. Nate Robinson is 23 years old and on a good team would be in the running for 6th man of the year, imagine how much he would help a team like the Pistons coming off the bench. Offensively there is not one player in the league that can stay in front of him and he is an excellent 3 point shooter. He always plays with great energy, hustle and heart. He is immature at times and needs to be more focused on the d but every year he has improved and will only continue to. Arroyo has been the same backup point guard for the past 5 seasons. There is only one thing that Arroyo does better then him and that is pass the ball but he's not even great at that. Just ask Jerry Sloan, Larry Brown and Stan Van Gundy. You couldn't even trade Arroyo for a bag of balls where as Sacramento insisted that Nate be part of any Knick deal for Ron Artest. Nate Robinson has value in the NBA Carlos Arroyo may be playing in Europe next year.

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    You have the vocabulary of a 56 year old virgin. I don't remember anyone calling someone a twit. Making a list of people who agreed with your delusional incorrect statements is like making a list of how many girls youve been with.

    Your always crying about behavior...could you be any more emotional?

    Don't worry about who I am in real life, its definately levels above when your at as a low self esteem man with no value for himself or limited knowledge of things he tries to discuss but ends up making himself look like a pendejo.

    Why are you interested in what I do in the bedroom? Not enough sex for you?

    Robinson on a good team would be running for 6th man of the year isn’t a fact. You’ve failed again to prove a logical factual statement that relates to this topic. Stop making things up, it’s the most obvious sign of desperation and defeat.

    Actually there are a couple of defenders that can easily stop Robinson, lets not make Robinson as an unstoppable force when all he is a back up PG.

    You imagine a lot, because you know little. In reality, you’re lacking in that department of knowing what is real and factual which leads to your crazy ass imagination and delusions.

    You don’t talk to Sloan, Brown, or Van Gundy…once again your delusional ass thinks you have connects to NBA coaches. Sloan is the guy who made Arroyo into a starter. Arroyo couldn’t do a lot playing behind Billups, and Arroyo has won the starting job in Orlando a lot of times, Nelson’s job hasn’t been secured this season because of Arroyo’s chemistry with the starters.

    Arroyo has high value
    Expiring contract
    Talented starting/back up PG
    Passer
    Experienced PG
    Only 28 years old.

    The primary fact that Arroyo is a matured inexperienced passing PG will always put him at a superior value level than Robinson. Combo guards are easy to find in the NBA, and the fact that Nate is 5”8 really ruins his value completely. If Nate gets injured anywhere in the lower body, he loses his vertical and it’ll make him a completely useless player because he lacks a lot of skill and experience. Arroyo has had numberous of lower body injuries and is still in the NBA playing meaningful minutes. Before the injuries Arroyo would be able to dunk and had tremendous speed, agility, and quickness. This is what seperates Arroyo from players like Robinson and allows Arroyo to be a NBA starter and limits to players like Robinson to be bench players. You don’t see Earl Boykins being a choice as a starting PG and he’s much better than Robinson.
    I like Nate on his team because he’s a cheap contract and has a good attitude. I definitely would prefer Arroyo who’s only 3-4 years older than Nate and a level above him. Arroyo went undrafted and has accomplished more in the NBA; Robinson is pretty much average at best for a first rounder. Arroyo is an international star, and a fan favorite PG in the league. He’s recognized as one of the best ball handlers in the NBA with his flashy crossovers and passes.

    Your frustrated yet?

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