Originally Posted by abcd
Does the Bible downgrade women or treat them as if they were inferior persons?
Gen. 2:18: "Jehovah God went on to say: ‘It is not good for the man to continue by himself. I am going to make a helper for him, as a complement of him.’" (The man is not here described by God as being a better person than the woman. Rather, God indicated that woman would possess qualities that would complement those of man within God’s arrangement. A complement is one of two mutually completing parts. Thus women as a group are outstanding in certain qualities and abilities; men, in others. Compare 1 Corinthians 11:11, 12.)
Gen. 3:16: "To the woman [God] said: ‘ . . . your craving will be for your husband, and he will dominate you.’" (This declaration after Adam and Eve had sinned was not a statement of what men should do but of what Jehovah foreknew they would do now that selfishness had become part of human life. A number of Bible accounts thereafter tell of the very unhappy situations that developed because of such selfish domination by men. But the Bible does not say that God approved of such conduct or that it is an example for others to follow.)
Is the assigning of headship to men demeaning to women?
Being under headship is not in itself demeaning. Headship contributes to the handling of matters in an orderly arrangement, and Jehovah is "a God, not of disorder, but of peace." (1 Cor. 14:33) Jesus Christ is under the headship of Jehovah God, and he finds great satisfaction in that relationship.—John 5:19, 20; 8:29; 1 Cor. 15:27, 28.
A relative headship is also assigned to man, particularly in the family and in the Christian congregation. God has not given to man absolute authority over woman; man must answer to his head, Jesus Christ, and to God for the way that he exercises such headship. (1 Cor. 11:3) Furthermore, husbands are commanded "to be loving their wives as their own bodies" and to ‘assign honor’ to their wives. (Eph. 5:28; 1 Pet. 3:7) The sexual needs of a husband are not put above those of his wife in God’s arrangement for married couples. (1 Cor. 7:3, 4) The role of a capable wife, as outlined in the Bible, emphasizes her value to the household and the community. It allows a broad field in which she can use initiative while demonstrating her appreciation for her husband’s headship. (Prov. 31:10-31) The Bible commands children to honor not only their father but their mother as well. (Eph. 6:1-3) It also gives special attention to caring for the needs of widows. (Jas. 1:27) Thus among true Christians, women can find great security, true appreciation for themselves as individuals, and personal satisfaction in their activity.
The dignity of woman’s position in God’s arrangement is further shown by the fact that Jehovah refers to his own organization of loyal spirit creatures as a woman, his wife, the mother of his sons. (Rev. 12:1; Gal. 4:26) Also, the spirit-anointed congregation of Jesus Christ is spoken of as his bride. (Rev. 19:7; 21:2, 9) And from a spiritual standpoint there is no distinction between male and female among those called to share in the heavenly Kingdom with Christ.—Gal. 3:26-28.
But you're wrong, Cush and Put were the start of the african race, no canaanites were black. Therefore, blacks were not cursed into slavery.
Originally Posted by abcd
Originally Posted by abcd
Should women be ministers?
Those charged with oversight of a congregation are described in the Bible as being males. The 12 apostles of Jesus Christ were all males, and those later appointed to be overseers and ministerial servants in Christian congregations were males. (Matt. 10:1-4; 1 Tim. 3:2, 12) Women are counseled to "learn in silence with full submissiveness" at congregation meetings, in that they do not raise questions challenging the men in the congregation. The women are ‘not to speak’ at such meetings if what they might say would demonstrate lack of subjection. (1 Tim. 2:11, 12; 1 Cor. 14:33, 34) Thus, although women make valuable contributions to the activity of the congregation, there is no provision for them to preside, or to take the lead by instructing the congregation, when qualified men are present.
may women be preachers, proclaimers, ministers of the good news, outside the congregation meetings?
At Pentecost of 33 C.E. holy spirit was poured out on both men and women. In explanation, the apostle Peter quoted Joel 2:28, 29, saying: "‘In the last days,’ God says, ‘I shall pour out some of my spirit upon every sort of flesh, and your sons and your daughters will prophesy and your young men will see visions and your old men will dream dreams; and even upon my men slaves and upon my women slaves I will pour out some of my spirit in those days, and they will prophesy.’
" (Acts 2:17, 18) In like manner today, women properly share in the Christian ministry, preaching from house to house and conducting home Bible studies.
—See also Psalm 68:11; Philippians 4:2, 3.
Originally Posted by abcd
Comparing worldly discrimination to the arrangement of God is pretty bold. As brought out above, God really does not promote discrimination towards women, he prom otes love and respect. But he can still have forms of headship that govern such love and respect. ALL ONE WOULD NEED TO DO IS RESPECT HIS ARRANGEMENT TO FULLY UNDERSTAND AND BENEFIT FROM IT.
While you have not twisted the quotes any, your application of them comes from your imperfect human philosophical viewpoint, and not the bibles
Originally Posted by abcd
Had you delved more deeply into the bible, you would have recognized that the slave arrangement laws basically meant a slave was to be looked at in ways of extended family, or higher, rather than less than human as most people think of concerning a slave. Also remember at that time slavery was common, it was just the way life was. It was telling though How God viewed how even slaves should be treated. Look at the laws in place for slaves of the Hebrew nation.
Laws governing slave-master relationships. Among the Israelites the status of the Hebrew slave differed from that of a slave who was a foreigner, alien resident, or settler. Whereas the non-Hebrew remained the property of the owner and could be passed on from father to son (Le 25:44-46), the Hebrew slave was to be released in the seventh year of his servitude or in the Jubilee year, depending upon which came first. During the time of his servitude the Hebrew slave was to be treated as a hired laborer. (Ex 21:2; Le 25:10; De 15:12) A Hebrew who sold himself into slavery to an alien resident, to a member of an alien resident’s family, or to a settler could be repurchased at any time, either by himself or by one having the right of repurchase. The redemption price was based on the number of years remaining until the Jubilee year or until the seventh year of servitude. (Le 25:47-52; De 15:12) When granting a Hebrew slave his freedom, the master was to give him a gift to assist him in getting a good start as a freedman. (De 15:13-15) If a slave had come in with a wife, the wife went out with him. However, if the master had given him a wife (evidently a foreign woman who would not be entitled to freedom in the seventh year of servitude), she and any children by her remained the property of the master. In such a case the Hebrew slave could choose to remain with his master. His ear would then be pierced with an awl to indicate that he would continue in servitude to time indefinite.—Ex 21:2-6; De 15:16, 17.
Hebrew slaves. Certain special regulations applied to a female Hebrew slave. She could be taken as a concubine by the master or designated as a wife for his son. When designated as a wife for the master’s son, the Hebrewess was to be treated with the due right of daughters. Even if the son took another wife, there was to be no diminishing of her sustenance, clothing, and marriage due. A failure on the son’s part in this respect entitled the woman to her freedom without the payment of a redemption price. If the master sought to have a Hebrewess redeemed, he was not permitted to accomplish this by selling her to foreigners.—Ex 21:7-11.
and privileges. The Law protected slaves from brutalities. A slave was to be set at liberty if mistreatment by the master resulted in the loss of a tooth or an eye. As the usual value for a slave was 30 shekels (compare Ex 21:32), his liberation would have meant considerable loss to the master and, therefore, would have served as a strong deterrent against abuse. Although a master could beat his slave, the slave, depending upon the decision of the judges, was to be avenged if he died under his master’s beating. However, if the slave lingered on for a day or two before dying—this indicating that the master had not intended to kill the slave but to discipline him—he was not to be avenged. (Ex 21:20, 21, 26, 27; Le 24:17) Also, it would appear that for the master to have been considered free of guilt the beating could not have been administered with a lethal instrument, as that would have signified intent to kill. (Compare Nu 35:16-18.) Therefore, if a slave lingered on for a day or two, there would be reasonable question as to whether the death resulted from the chastisement. A beating with a rod, for example, would not normally be fatal, as is shown by the statement at Proverbs 23:13: "Do not hold back discipline from the mere boy. In case you beat him with the rod, he will not die."
Certain privileges were granted to slaves by the terms of the Law. As all male slaves were circumcised (Ex 12:44; compare Ge 17:12), they could eat the Passover, and slaves of the priest could eat holy things. (Ex 12:43, 44; Le 22:10, 11) Slaves were exempted from working on the Sabbath. (Ex 20:10; De 5:14) During the Sabbath year they were entitled to eat of the growth from spilled kernels and from the unpruned vine. (Le 25:5, 6) They were to share in the rejoicing associated with the sacrificing at the sanctuary and the celebration of the festivals.—De 12:12; 16:11, 14.
Originally Posted by abcd
We won't really end up in a tie. Reason being is Jehovahs witnesses only lean on Jehovah's word the bible to explain itself
, while everyone else leans on their own intelligence and philosphy to explain the bible. Philosophyis a dangerous thing when trying to concern it with the word of God. Why?
The word philosophy is derived from Greek roots that mean "love of wisdom." As used here, philosophy is not built on acceptance of belief in God, but it tries to give people a unified view of the universe and endeavors to make them critical thinkers. It employs chiefly speculative means rather than observation in a search for truth.
Prov. 1:7; Ps. 111:10: "The fear of Jehovah is the beginning of knowledge . . . [and] of wisdom." (If the universe were not the product of an intelligent Creator but only of some blind, irrational force, then no unified view of the universe would be possible, would it? Nothing that would qualify as wisdom could result from a study of something that was itself irrational, could it? Those who attempt to understand the universe or life itself, while endeavoring to leave God and his purpose out of account, meet with constant frustration. They misinterpret what they learn and misuse facts that they glean. Leaving out of account belief in God destroys the key to accurate knowledge and makes impossible any truly consistent framework of thought.)
How can any of us acquire true knowledge and wisdom?
What is the origin of human philosophies?
Prov. 2:4-7: "If you keep seeking for it as for silver, and as for hid treasures you keep searching for it, in that case you will understand the fear of Jehovah, and you will find the very knowledge of God. For Jehovah himself gives wisdom; out of his mouth there are knowledge and discernment. And for the upright ones he will treasure up practical wisdom." (Jehovah provides needed help through his written Word and his visible organization. An earnest desire and personal effort, including the use of one’s thinking ability in a constructive manner, are also necessary.)
Is it realistic to expect to find absolute truth from this Source?
2 Tim. 3:16; John 17:17: "All Scripture is inspired of God." "[Jesus said to his heavenly Father:] Your word is truth." (Is it not reasonable that the Creator of the universe would have full understanding of it? In the Bible he has not told us everything about the universe, but what he has had recorded there is not speculation; it is truth. He has also stated in the Bible what his purpose is for the earth and for mankind and how he will accomplish it. His almighty power, superlative wisdom, flawless justice, and great love guarantee that this purpose will be fully accomplished, and in the best possible manner. His qualities thus assure us that his statement of purpose is completely dependable; it is truth.)
come from people who have limitations: The Bible informs us: "It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step." (Jer. 10:23) History testifies that trying to ignore that limitation has not produced good results. On one occasion, "Jehovah proceeded to answer Job out of the windstorm and say: ‘Who is this that is obscuring counsel by words without knowledge? Gird up your loins, please, like an able-bodied man, and let me question you, and you inform me. Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell me, if you do know understanding.’" (Job 38:1-4) (Humans by nature have limitations. Additionally, their experience in life is relatively brief and is usually confined to one culture or one environment. The knowledge they possess is thus restricted, and everything is interconnected to such an extent that they constantly find aspects that they had not adequately considered. Any philosophy that they originate will reflect these limitations.)
are developed by humans who are imperfect: "All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God." (Rom. 3:23) "There exists a way that is upright before a man, but the ways of death are the end of it afterward." (Prov. 14:12) (Because of such imperfection, human philosophies often reflect a basic selfishness that leads perhaps to momentary pleasure but also to frustration and much unhappiness.)
are influenced by demonic spirits: "The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one." (1 John 5:19) "The one called Devil and Satan . . . is misleading the entire inhabited earth." (Rev. 12:9) "You at one time walked according to the system of things of this world, according to the ruler of the authority of the air, the spirit that now operates in the sons of disobedience." (Eph. 2:2) (Philosophies that encourage people to disobey God’s wholesome and upright requirements reflect such an influence. No wonder that, as history testifies, human philosophies and schemes have often brought grief to large segments of humankind.)
Why is it an evidence of clear thinking to study the teachings of Jesus Christ instead of human philosophy?
Col. 1:15-17: "He [Jesus Christ] is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and upon the earth . . . All other things have been created through him and for him. Also, he is before all other things and by means of him all other things were made to exist." (His intimate relationship with God enables him to help us to learn the truth about God. Furthermore, as the one through whom all other things were made, Jesus has a full knowledge of the entire created universe. No human philosopher can offer any of this.)
Col. 1:19, 20: "God saw good for all fullness to dwell in him [Jesus Christ], and through him to reconcile again to himself all other things by making peace through the blood he shed on the torture stake." (Thus Jesus Christ is the one through whom God has purposed to bring all creation back into harmony with himself. To Jesus, God has also entrusted rulership over all the earth, as shown at Daniel 7:13, 14. So our life prospects for the future depend on getting to know him and responding favorably to his instruction.)
Col. 2:8: "Look out: perhaps there may be someone who will carry you off as his prey through the philosophy and empty deception according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary things of the world and not according to Christ." (What a sad mistake it would be to choose such deceptive human philosophy in preference to acquiring true wisdom as a disciple of Jesus Christ, the second-greatest person in the universe, next to God himself!)
does God view the "wisdom" offered by human philosophy?
1 Cor. 1:19-25: "It is written: ‘I will make the wisdom of the wise men perish, and the intelligence of the intellectual men I will shove aside.’ Where is the wise man? Where the scribe? Where the debater of this system of things? Did not God make the wisdom of the world foolish? For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through its wisdom did not get to know God, God saw good through the foolishness [as it appears to the world] of what is preached to save those believing. . . . Because a foolish thing of God [as the world views it] is wiser than men, and a weak thing of God [as the world may see it] is stronger than men." (Such a viewpoint on God’s part is certainly not arbitrary or unreasonable. He has provided in the Bible, the most widely circulated book in the world, a clear statement of his purpose. He has sent his witnesses to discuss it with all who will listen. How foolish for any creature to think that he has wisdom greater than that of God!)