Idiots on ESPN analyze the Knicks

KBlack25

Starter
Boston used to be the 6th worst team in the league 2 and 3 years ago.
They still have the same stupid Presdent Danny Ainge.
And the same decent coach with the same attitude & system.
How come they won a Championship lastseason???

Because they added players. Just because one team got better by adding players doesn't mean it's impossible to be better without adding players, that's a logical fallacy if I've ever heard one.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Because they added players. Just because one team got better by adding players doesn't mean it's impossible to be better without adding players, that's a logical fallacy if I've ever heard one.

You just took me back to stone age.......thinking....where the NFL, NHL, MLB, and NBA did not exist.
:barf::boohoo::barf:
 

GetRealistic

Starter
Boston had assets and the Cap room to make trades Kiya... They had the 5th pick in the draft, Al Jefferson, Delonte West, Gerald Green, and Ryan Gomes to give up, not to mention the cap space to take on Ray Allen and KG. The Knicks have two assets (Lee and Robinson) and you would cried if they were traded, and we also have no cap space to bring in any big names because all the guys we could trade that have big salaries to make the trades work have no value (Marbury, Crawford, Zach, Curry, etc).
 

richtree

Rotation player
I just listened to the Atlantic Division Preview on cbssportsline.com

and Ian Eagle says knicks are 30-31 wins this year at their best
 

GetRealistic

Starter
Who picked the Rays to be in the World Series (not saying the Knicks are even a playoff team) before the season started. Who cares about predictions, last year SI had us in the playoffs and how well did that turn out for us?

I'd rather play the role of the underdog. This team has deffinately shown they don't perfrom under pressure or scrunity so hopefully with no expectations they can suprise
 

Scribbles

Rotation player
Jalen Rose is and has always been a Knicks hater.

Even when his tired ass got shipped to NY, I still despised the guy. And he hated the team.

Dude is just mad his career went bust.

If I was Mike, I'd throw that quote up on each locker room. Nothing gets a Knicks team more rev'd up than a former Pacer or Heat talking out their ass.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Because they added players. Just because one team got better by adding players doesn't mean it's impossible to be better without adding players, that's a logical fallacy if I've ever heard one.

Were talking about the Knicks....where to many incidents involved around the player to player relationship in the last 4 years.
We are not talking about the Pistons, Mavs, and Suns whom players relationship is based on a system that gets stronger with another coach.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
What did the Knicks do in the offseason warrent anything but about the same wins as last year??? Nothing. It doesn't help to have high draft picks if you waste them. Drafting your buddy's son in the first round is a wasted pick. So essentially you march the same team out there as you did last year with a new coach that doesn't even have players to fit his system. We will be lucky to win as many games this year as last year.

Cosign!!!

Expect the worst
but plan on the best.
The new Knick outlook in 2008 Preseason.
 

jzero29

Rotation player
As a matter of fact, you two bit moron, I have watched the preseason game. The fact that these guys have no idea what is going on can be summed up very quickly in their fantasy "analysis". Crawford has looked absolutely horrendous in preseason, yet he's a sleeper. As you said, Lee looked good in preseason, and he's their "bust". You say Ewing, Grunfeld, James, Jefferies, Roberson and Houston are all non-factors. 2 of those guys are getting cut, to make room for 15. That leaves us with 11 guys NOT in your "non-factor" list, which is more than most rotations in the NBA. Don't criticize me and my opinions when yours are illogical and unfounded.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.
Yes their fanatsy analysis was ridiculous(not that you mentioned anything about fantasy in the txt I quoted. (check below)Jamaal as a sleeper does sound idiotic.
I was refering to your seemingly over the top outrage at the knicks being picked so low in the east? My point was can you blame them, They blew last year, and you duhon the key free agent, hasn't performed that good. Gallinari hasn't played. I have watched the preseaon games...they are preseason(meaningless) and besides LEE, Zach, CHandler, robinson, marbury, duhon and gallinari everyone else was on my non-factor list. I went back and counted 11 names I lumped into the non-factor catagory. I also went on to say robinson, has been ok, duhon hasn't impressed me, marbury has not rebounded to potential, gallinari hasn't played. basically saying they only have 3 players who were performing well consitently during preseason in chandler lee and zach and they play same position, forward. Everyone else was 1 a question mark(duhon,marbury, robinson, gallinari) or 2 a non factor(collins,crawford, rose, J.james, J.jefferies,Ewing jr, grunfeld, q. rich, curry, roberson, houston) I listed everybody on the roster. Go back and check it. Talk about illogic, you can't even count the basis of all logic. I only left out 6 guys and I trashed half of those 6(that equals 3) saying they haven't done anything to impress me. The team won 3 preseason games. Big deal. They still don't look good and the team just doesn't have talent that its payroll boasts. So in response to your message bashing espn for writng the knicks in last. I don't see anything to complain about. You want to take on the fantasy stuff, but you didn't mention it originally and I wasn't saying can't you blame them about that. Just their picks for knicks last place. I think is just fine, they are the same crap team as last year and chris duhon? excelent.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime?page=dime-NewYorkPreview0809

Most have them finishing last or second to last in the Atlantic and either last or second to last in the East. I wish one of these people would watch a preseason game.

Analysis Highlight:

This is uncut what Jalen Rose had to say about the team: "Who are the free agents in 2009?" That's it.

I wish ESPN would get people that did their job and watched basketball...
 

KBlack25

Starter
Yes their fanatsy analysis was ridiculous(not that you mentioned anything about fantasy in the txt I quoted. (check below)Jamaal as a sleeper does sound idiotic.
I was refering to your seemingly over the top outrage at the knicks being picked so low in the east? My point was can you blame them, They blew last year, and you duhon the key free agent, hasn't performed that good. Gallinari hasn't played. I have watched the preseaon games...they are preseason(meaningless) and besides LEE, Zach, CHandler, robinson, marbury, duhon and gallinari everyone else was on my non-factor list. I went back and counted 11 names I lumped into the non-factor catagory. I also went on to say robinson, has been ok, duhon hasn't impressed me, marbury has not rebounded to potential, gallinari hasn't played. basically saying they only have 3 players who were performing well consitently during preseason in chandler lee and zach and they play same position, forward. Everyone else was 1 a question mark(duhon,marbury, robinson, gallinari) or 2 a non factor(collins,crawford, rose, J.james, J.jefferies,Ewing jr, grunfeld, q. rich, curry, roberson, houston) I listed everybody on the roster. Go back and check it. Talk about illogic, you can't even count the basis of all logic. I only left out 6 guys and I trashed half of those 6(that equals 3) saying they haven't done anything to impress me. The team won 3 preseason games. Big deal. They still don't look good and the team just doesn't have talent that its payroll boasts. So in response to your message bashing espn for writng the knicks in last. I don't see anything to complain about. You want to take on the fantasy stuff, but you didn't mention it originally and I wasn't saying can't you blame them about that. Just their picks for knicks last place. I think is just fine, they are the same crap team as last year and chris duhon? excelent.

No, my problem is they clearly are not the worst team in the East. They weren't the worst last year, so the analysts who have them finishing last actually predict the Knicks are a WORSE team than last year. Whatever you think about the Knicks, how they'll do, there is NO WAY they are WORSE than last year (whether or not they are better is up for debate).

They look a lot better this preseason than they looked at any point last year, that's my point. So the fact that they look better, paired with the fact that they didn't lose anybody (all the same talent is basically there), with a coach who knows what he's doing and seemingly has them under control, there's no way they are worse in terms of talent than last year...
 

KBlack25

Starter
Were talking about the Knicks....where to many incidents involved around the player to player relationship in the last 4 years.
We are not talking about the Pistons, Mavs, and Suns whom players relationship is based on a system that gets stronger with another coach.

I still don't understand how that has anything to do with the fact that you basically are saying there is no way at all to get any better in any respect without adding a player or 4...
 

portega1968

El Cacique
ESPN has put up a list of the Top 10 Sophomores and Top 10 Rookies.

Yep, you guessed it, no respect for the Knicks there either.
 

portega1968

El Cacique
[I also found this in SI.com submitted by an unnamed NBA scout:]

An opposing team's scout sizes up the Knicks

I don't think the improvement in coaching by hiring Mike D'Antoni is going to make that big of a difference this year. They went into training camp still having to deal with Stephon Marbury's bull. Eddy Curry isn't going to be able to keep up with the up-tempo pace. The Knicks have a lot issues they'll need to resolve before they can start winning. They'll have to overhaul the roster to play to Mike's style.

The best player on their training camp roster is probably Marbury. Look at his skills: When healthy he can score, and if he wants to -- if -- he can defend his position; I've seen him body up. He's quick, he can push it up the floor, he can handle. He doesn't distribute it, though that may have something to do with the weaknesses of his teammates. All of that being said, they probably should have gotten rid of Marbury awhile ago. Everybody in the locker room comes into camp thinking, When is he going to leave? They can't move on while he's still there.

Bringing in Chris Duhon was almost a must. They had to have a steady, experienced point guard, somebody they could depend on to not fly off the handle. If they weren't going to stick with Marbury, they couldn't start Nate Robinson at the point -- he's a scorer, a combo guard.

Jamal Crawford isn't a bad guy at all, but can you win with him? There's no toughness there. If he's your best scorer and the guy you're looking to lead the offense, you're in trouble. Plus, he can't guard anybody. He can do other things -- he can handle it, pass it, shoot it. But he's a volume shooter.

I don't see how they can believe in Curry. He can't change ends, he doesn't rebound and he doesn't block shots. If he is under the rim -- and I mean under it -- then you can't stop him. But so often they'll throw him the ball and he opens up his body and he gets stripped. And because he's so often turning his left shoulder with the ball -- it's his predictable move -- the defense just sits and waits for him to commit the charge. He just turns and bowls over somebody, and it happens over and over.

Zach Randolph is the type of player who provides production to a losing team. I've seen him win a game by himself. But look at the circumstances of how he was sent to New York: The Trail Blazers were willing to take back Steve Francis and cut him to get out from under Zach, because they had a lot of young, impressive draft picks and they needed to get rid of this guy who was dragging everybody down. He is like the frontcourt version of Stephon.

If you're asking me whether Curry and Randolph can play together, my answer is yes. But they won't win.

Quentin Richardson is a good teammate, and it seems like he means well. Can he stay healthy? That's something he has yet to prove.

Jared Jeffries could be a contributor on a good team. He can't shoot a lick. But here's somebody who is 6-10 and they were talking about starting him at center [before he broke his leg during the preseason]. But if they needed to, they could switch him onto defending the point guard and he would not get embarrassed.

David Lee's contract is going to be an issue while they try to downsize their payroll in time for 2010 when LeBron can be a free agent. They'll probably have to sacrifice Lee for the long-term growth of the organization. As much as I like him, he's not going to lead you to the NBA Finals. He's a pretty good bench player because he's active, but he can't play small forward and he's undersized at power forward. He's a hustle player, and you need guys like that to come off the bench and change tempo and make things happen. But he averaged close to 10 [points] and 10 [rebounds] for a team that won 23 games last year, so how important was he really? They probably can't afford to pay him what he's worth in a new contract while they're trying to clear space.

Wilson Chandler has got to become a better ball handler and hit shots consistently. He's not a knockdown shooter yet. When the ball is going up and down the floor, he does pretty well for himself.

There's no telling what they might get out of rookie Danilo Gallinari until his back problems clear up.

On the one hand, the new coaching staff is going to want to win games and establish a new style, but management is going to need the next two years to clear away the bad contracts and attitudes. The way it looks right now, this is a throwaway year unless they can get something out of the draft from it.

NO RESPECT AT ALL... BUT ITS DESERVED AND ITS ON THE TEAM TO PROVE THEM WRONG
 

jzero29

Rotation player
No, my problem is they clearly are not the worst team in the East. They weren't the worst last year, so the analysts who have them finishing last actually predict the Knicks are a WORSE team than last year. Whatever you think about the Knicks, how they'll do, there is NO WAY they are WORSE than last year (whether or not they are better is up for debate).

They look a lot better this preseason than they looked at any point last year, that's my point. So the fact that they look better, paired with the fact that they didn't lose anybody (all the same talent is basically there), with a coach who knows what he's doing and seemingly has them under control, there's no way they are worse in terms of talent than last year...
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/stand...p=conference&seasontype=2&standType=standings
You are right, they weren't the worst team in the east last year, they were the second worst team in the eastern confrence last year. Look it up. Miami was the only team with a worse record and they played most of the season without their best player, So maybe they are saying it's not the knicks who got worse, because they have exactly the same team, but Miami is that much better with the addition of dwayne wade. I for one agree. SO picking them last instead of second to last, isn't that big of a deal. Considering as you put they have exactly the same team as last year, with the exception of gallinari and duhon, who both haven't impressed me in the preseason, I know gallinari didn't play, thus not impressing me. And their best scorer(crawford, not that he's good) has looked worse then usual. Looking good in preseason is different then looking good in the season and they've only looked okay. for 1, established stars like bostons big 3 don't play extended minutes in games, 2, every team still has guys on their team like grunfeld, that may see more time in a Preseason game except the knicks which brings me to 3, the knicks new coach trying to evaluate his team, lets more established players play longer trying to figure out a rotation. giving the knicks an advantage over the other teams players who probably will be without a job in two weeks.
 

KBlack25

Starter
Yes, while the Knicks didn't get better talent-wise I think a lot of others got worse. I don't think the Knicks are worse than New Jersey, I don't think they're worse than Milwaukee, nor Indiana. I think they'll probably be better than Charlotte. I also think they're still better than Miami (I think Beasley is going to be a B-U-S-T, he's immature and has a lot of off-court issues).
 

jzero29

Rotation player
No, my problem is they clearly are not the worst team in the East. They weren't the worst last year, so the analysts who have them finishing last actually predict the Knicks are a WORSE team than last year. Whatever you think about the Knicks, how they'll do, there is NO WAY they are WORSE than last year (whether or not they are better is up for debate).

They look a lot better this preseason than they looked at any point last year, that's my point. So the fact that they look better, paired with the fact that they didn't lose anybody (all the same talent is basically there), with a coach who knows what he's doing and seemingly has them under control, there's no way they are worse in terms of talent than last year...
okay, well I am not arguing the knicks are not improved, just saying, it's not a far cry to suggest they are the same talent and wade and beasly make miami better. Indiana and jersey are not the tea they were, but how far down? The knicks are just ranked on the team they had last year which is almost the same.
I'd like them to be a surprise, but I don't seen very good things for them. I'm thinking 30+ wins, i'd say 33. So that would put them better then last year.
They still need to cut guys. Uhm grunfeld...adios. Uhm hopefully they'll just buyout J.james.
 

jzero29

Rotation player
Uhm yeah Kblack, how'd they do last year?

As a matter of fact, you two bit moron, I have watched the preseason game. The fact that these guys have no idea what is going on can be summed up very quickly in their fantasy "analysis". Crawford has looked absolutely horrendous in preseason, yet he's a sleeper. As you said, Lee looked good in preseason, and he's their "bust". You say Ewing, Grunfeld, James, Jefferies, Roberson and Houston are all non-factors. 2 of those guys are getting cut, to make room for 15. That leaves us with 11 guys NOT in your "non-factor" list, which is more than most rotations in the NBA. Don't criticize me and my opinions when yours are illogical and unfounded.

Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out.
Uhm yeah kBlack how'd they do last year? yeah, great. The only thing I commented on was that it was not so off to pick them last or second to last...because I had watched last years preseason and they looked same old same old terrible. I saw the same things the analysist di and obviously you didn't.
 

jzero29

Rotation player
okay, well I am not arguing the knicks are not improved, just saying, it's not a far cry to suggest they are the same talent and wade and beasly make miami better. Indiana and jersey are not the tea they were, but how far down? The knicks are just ranked on the team they had last year which is almost the same.
I'd like them to be a surprise, but I don't seen very good things for them. I'm thinking 30+ wins, i'd say 33. So that would put them better then last year.
They still need to cut guys. Uhm grunfeld...adios. Uhm hopefully they'll just buyout J.james.
You like my prediction last year call me nostra f'n damous. they finished with 32 wins and in last in the east. I'm saying 38 this year.
Same team, just more time to get used to system, not as much big trades this year, more consistent results.
 

KBlack25

Starter
You like my prediction last year call me nostra f'n damous. they finished with 32 wins and in last in the east. I'm saying 38 this year.
Same team, just more time to get used to system, not as much big trades this year, more consistent results.

The Wizards had 19 wins.
 
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