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Thread: We need a Big Man more than anything!

  1. #1
    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Default We need a Big Man more than anything!

    I know this is over-stating the obvious but my question is who and how do we acquire a quality big man?

    I no longer blame D'Antoni, Walsh, Duhon whoever because we cannot compete without a quality big man.

    It doesn't matter if we have guys like Marbury or N8 breaking you down off the dribble, penetrate etc...

    Doesn't matter we can hit threes and have a double double man in Lee...

    Doesn't matter that we acquired Walsh or D'Antoni, or even our mid-season roster changes...

    because...

    We have no QUALITY big man.

    I'm not mad or blaming last nights loss to the Heat to this, I'm just saying:

    Playing without a quality big is like forming a fist without the thumb. It's incomplete, and lacking the most important part.

    Yes, over a "superstar" like Wade or LBJ on the wing a big man is all important to the consistent competitiveness of a franchise.

    I've heard the "but the Pistons won w/o argument" which I totally disagree because Rasheed and Ben Wallace were formidable down low and that team was a very good defensive team and illustrates something else...

    By "quality" I'm not ruling out primary defenders/rebounders (even if they cant score) like Ben and Rodman etc...

    A superstar Sg/Sf gets buckets, creates shots etc and is next in priority to success IMO but a big is the key. Scoring, drawing fouls, rebounds, blocks/alters, wears down the opposition, demoralizes, draws the D and gets
    the ball to open shooters etc..

    But this is all stuff you guys know.

    My question is IF you agree then who and how do we get them. Thabeet, Griffin, Bosh whoever? Do we play Gallo more, Duhon less, maybe force Curry to play knowing we will suck and get a higher pick (I know I already mentioned tanking in another thread), right now I see us as the tenth worse team in the NBA- closer to the bottom than the top, so a high pick in the draft is realistic. Or trade players/picks next season for a quality CENTER?Re-sign Wilcox (for depth)? How do we get a quality big?

    I'm tired of blame threads (including from myself) when the issue is obvious. I don't want to have to cut/paste mad stats because again it's obvious. No more Fire D'Antoni, Walsh sucks, Duhon sucks, Hughes sucks, N8 is inconsistent, Lee's numbers are inflated, we should of played Marbury etc... It doesn't matter without a big!

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    Veteran LeFlume's Avatar
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    I agree. You win this game from the inside and out. We desperately need a defensive stopper in the middle. We need an Emeka Okafor type of player.

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    The Knicks should have drafted Brook Lopez, but Mike D'Antoni has a fetish for Italian basketball players.

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    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by abcd
    The Knicks should have drafted Brook Lopez, but Mike D'Antoni has a fetish for Italian basketball players.
    I wouldn't say fetish- Gallo is o.k., he can obviously shoot but he needs work where Brook Lopez could've helped out immediately ,and I'm not sure if that was D'Antoni or Walsh.

    You consider Lopez a "quality" big man?

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    Veteran TunerAddict's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Red
    I know this is over-stating the obvious but my question is who and how do we acquire a quality big man?

    I no longer blame D'Antoni, Walsh, Duhon whoever because we cannot compete without a quality big man.

    It doesn't matter if we have guys like Marbury or N8 breaking you down off the dribble, penetrate etc...

    Doesn't matter we can hit threes and have a double double man in Lee...

    Doesn't matter that we acquired Walsh or D'Antoni, or even our mid-season roster changes...

    because...

    We have no QUALITY big man.

    I'm not mad or blaming last nights loss to the Heat to this, I'm just saying:

    Playing without a quality big is like forming a fist without the thumb. It's incomplete, and lacking the most important part.

    Yes, over a "superstar" like Wade or LBJ on the wing a big man is all important to the consistent competitiveness of a franchise.

    I've heard the "but the Pistons won w/o argument" which I totally disagree because Rasheed and Ben Wallace were formidable down low and that team was a very good defensive team and illustrates something else...

    By "quality" I'm not ruling out primary defenders/rebounders (even if they cant score) like Ben and Rodman etc...

    A superstar Sg/Sf gets buckets, creates shots etc and is next in priority to success IMO but a big is the key. Scoring, drawing fouls, rebounds, blocks/alters, wears down the opposition, demoralizes, draws the D and gets
    the ball to open shooters etc..

    But this is all stuff you guys know.

    My question is IF you agree then who and how do we get them. Thabeet, Griffin, Bosh whoever? Do we play Gallo more, Duhon less, maybe force Curry to play knowing we will suck and get a higher pick (I know I already mentioned tanking in another thread), right now I see us as the tenth worse team in the NBA- closer to the bottom than the top, so a high pick in the draft is realistic. Or trade players/picks next season for a quality CENTER?Re-sign Wilcox (for depth)? How do we get a quality big?

    I'm tired of blame threads (including from myself) when the issue is obvious. I don't want to have to cut/paste mad stats because again it's obvious. No more Fire D'Antoni, Walsh sucks, Duhon sucks, Hughes sucks, N8 is inconsistent, Lee's numbers are inflated, we should of played Marbury etc... It doesn't matter without a big!
    I agree. All great teams have great big men.

    The era of Russel and Chamberlain
    The era of Walton, Abdul-Jabbar, Moses Malone, Hakeem Olajuwon.
    The era of Shaquille O'neal, Karl Malone

    ****, the micheal jordan era even had good big men when he won. They weren't star players, but he had great roleplaying bigs, and I'm not even counting the greatest rebounded in NBA history, Dennis Rodman.

    Shotblockers can change a game. IT isn't just about blocks. Blocks help. but Blocks do not equal defense. They are only a part of it. Preventing ppl from driving is another part of it. Changing shots of those who do drive is another part. Forcing worse shots is another part of it. The defensive influence of a big man is unmeasurable.

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    Originally Posted by abcd
    The Knicks should have drafted Brook Lopez, but Mike D'Antoni has a fetish for Italian basketball players.
    Brook Lopez was the best player available at the 6th pick....Gallo would've been picked real late in this draft and his rights would've been sold for cash on draft night.

    The way Dantoni is using Wilcox is showing that he is not a Bigman coach.
    Plus it was obvious in Phoenix first round sweep (5 games) that coach Dantoni did not have a clue on how to make Shaq affective at the center position.
    So our coach Dantoni....plays a big-part in why we dont have a Bigman
    (he dont know how to coach a bigman).

    Having Nate the great on our roster with double-double Lee, plus having scoring from either AL, Chandler, and Gallo, we do need a shotblocking Bigman to make this Knick team a complete .500 season team.

    Next season half the players on our roster (now) will not be here....we made room for 3 empty spots on our roster this season but the way coach Dantoni is going with Larry Hughes averaging 30 mpg in the last 3 games....and Wilcox averaging 5 mpg in the last 3 games....show we not only have a missing bigman problem we also are missing a Bigman-coach which is a Big-Problem...

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    I've been saying this for the longest, everyone here knows that. Like Red has said, a great big is key in this league. You rarely win a title, unless you have a great big. Just look up all of the NBA's championship teams, from the past 20 years. I've already said that with Jamal, Marbury, we can't really be so cynical of their play, when, if they were ever beat off the dribble, they'd have no one to, as tuner said, alter shots, make layups uncomfortable, etc.

    As for Gallo, he might turn out to be a good player. However, I don't think he fit our particular needs, at this time. Brook has been putting up seriously good numbers 12 ppg, 51% FG, 2 blocks per game. And anyone who's watched him knows he has potential for more, already has an array of moves in the post, and is very fast for a big man.

    Bottom line, when it comes to Gallo, is I would have been happy with him, if we had had the #18 or 20 pick. At #6, with our lack of a big man, we had to have gone for a big. I think that, with Brook on our team, with Zach, Mal, Steph and Chandler, with Lee and Nate leading the second unit, we would have had a very formidable team. That's the difference a big can make. If you don't believe me, just ask Gasol's Lakers or Howard's Magic, two teams lifted up by their acquisition of great bigs.

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    Member JRG3's Avatar
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    I think the best way to confront this problem id threw the draft this year. we will have a lotterry pick and we have to use on the best center/pf available. we cannot go for anymore bull****. last year we took gallinari but this year we cant do the that the coach likes him crap. A good bigman is the only thing stopping us from being a playoff team. People think if we get Lebron we will just be good but thats not true because There is always a awsome center on teams that win the NBA championship.

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    Originally Posted by Red
    I wouldn't say fetish- Gallo is o.k., he can obviously shoot but he needs work where Brook Lopez could've helped out immediately ,and I'm not sure if that was D'Antoni or Walsh.

    You consider Lopez a "quality" big man?
    Yes, I've seen Brook Lopez play. I get MSG and YES! Network for free, since I live in New York.

    Brook Lopez is a complete player. He can rebound, block shots, and score in a variety of ways(has a hook shot, can shoot jump shots, and can dunk).

    He plays very similar to Zydrunas Ilgauskas and Pau Gasol.

    Danilo Gallinari reminds me of Tim Thomas. His game is one dimensional. All he has is a jump shot. He has no post up game, no shot blocking, and no rebounding. His ball handles also need improvement, because he does get called a lot for traveling violations.

  10. #10

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    lee in a sign and trade for oden.i could see this happen cause, as it's been said before here, portland has a hard on for lee.and oden is always on the injured list.

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    Default Need a Presence in the Paint

    The Knicks are plainly lacking a presence in the paint, particularly defensively. In retrospect, and for this year surely, Lopez would have been a more productive pick than Gallinari. But we do not get do-overs, so let's think about the future instead of dwelling on the past. I am hopeful that Gallinari will develop. He needs to get stronger, but there is more than a mere possibility that he will be a force in the future.

    But now we need a big man. Mullens could fall to us. He is big. Perhaps we can trade up in the draft with Lee and our draft pick. Monroe or Thabeet would be great. However, Lee is unlikely to want to play for a team at the top of the draft and he will be a restricted free agent. It is not going to be easy to get a quality big man. Portland is not going to trade Oden.

    We have no second round pick this year. I believe that is the result of acquiring Curry. And we will have no first round pick in 2010. That is the result of acquiring Marbury.

    We also need a point guard for the future. Duhon is not the answer.

    What the hell is wrong with Curry's knee? We will never get rid of him without some sign of life during at least the tail end of this season.

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    Veteran JayJ44's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Oldtimer
    The Knicks are plainly lacking a presence in the paint, particularly defensively. In retrospect, and for this year surely, Lopez would have been a more productive pick than Gallinari. But we do not get do-overs, so let's think about the future instead of dwelling on the past. I am hopeful that Gallinari will develop. He needs to get stronger, but there is more than a mere possibility that he will be a force in the future.

    But now we need a big man. Mullens could fall to us. He is big. Perhaps we can trade up in the draft with Lee and our draft pick. Monroe or Thabeet would be great. However, Lee is unlikely to want to play for a team at the top of the draft and he will be a restricted free agent. It is not going to be easy to get a quality big man. Portland is not going to trade Oden.

    We have no second round pick this year. I believe that is the result of acquiring Curry. And we will have no first round pick in 2010. That is the result of acquiring Marbury.

    We also need a point guard for the future. Duhon is not the answer.

    What the hell is wrong with Curry's knee? We will never get rid of him without some sign of life during at least the tail end of this season.
    I think we have at least 1, if not 2, 2nd round draft picks this year. We got one as a result of the Balkman trade. But you can buy draft picks anyway.

    The problem with Curry's knee is that he's a fatass. Too much weight=too much pressure on the knees. It's all from being overweight. If he ever gets in shape (which is a big if), he should be fine.

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    Default 2nd Round Draft Picks 2009

    According to Draft Express, the Balkman trade produced a 2010 2nd round pick, not a 2009 pick. Denver had the right to swap its pick with the Clippers. The Knicks get that right. Portland has our 2009 2nd round pick trough Chicago. I do not think we have a 2nd round pick in 2009.

    Second round picks are generally not worth much and JayJ44 is right that they are easily moved about. Portland has plenty of picks it does not need. Every once in awhile, a second round pick becomes a star, e.g., Boozer and Arenas.

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    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Default Knicks take Stephon Curry in Mock draft

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    They have us taking PG ironically named Stephon Curry in the draft. Your thoughts?

    If we do get him, he will be good but, I see the same problem popping up. We still need a big man. That said unless no service-able bigs are on the board then a PG is o.k. with me. IMO a Big MAN is needed!

  15. #15
    Member Knicker23's Avatar
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    As much as we need a big man I think Curry is going to be real good. he's def one the best shooters coming up right now. would be nice to have him, see how he does in nba

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