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Thread: The Incredible Mismanagement Of Stephon Marbury

  1. #61
    Superstar richtree's Avatar
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    Firstly,

    You tried to copy the way I responded to you and you did a bad job.

    Secondly, you just re-wrote everything that is un-factual. Just because you write something down doesn't make it true.

    Then you actually defended Larry Brown, Q-Rich, and Isiah Thomas. In your response you listed mostly opinions and false statements.

    Here they are:

    Marbury refused to play in the system Brown had installed. (False)
    You wanted him to get along with Isiah, who will probably go down as the worst coach in NBA history. (crazyness)

    It was evidenced when he said that he basically did not want to play for Mike D'Antoni. (never said that/and he played in the PRE_SEASON)

    He feuded with him, Malik Rose, Tim Thomas, Jamal Crawford. (Losers that never lived up to any of their potential, never lifted a weight, never did anything positive, Scrubs!)

    No, he said BEFORE THE SEASON that he was going to collect the $20 mil due to him. (Find me the Quote, plus he was playing in the PRE-Season)

    Sources are coming out now from people not named Mike D'Antoni and Donnie Walsh that Steph asked to talk to the Celtics before training camp began. Read something. (Show me -- you are lying here / and you don't think the NY Media would have found this ? )

    You got ethered, you are wack, you are wrong....deal with it.

    (You need to through that in there to make you look tuff because you written word is weak).


    Bottom line in Steph was a good player, many of the Knicks didn't get along with him because Steph wanted to win more than they did. Steph loved the Knicks more than they did. Steph couldn't stand by quietly and watch Larry Brown, Isiah, and the management ruin the team he loved.

    Why did it take a new coach for all these players to realize this ?


    All the good players in the league respect Steph.

    You like every other weak-minded Knick fan are looking for someone to blame for the last 8 years....

    Your owner, GM, and weak supporting cast were the problem.

    Its very easy to say Marbury because you don't want to accept that he was a really good palyer on a bad team, in the worst situation.

  2. #62
    The Gold Mac MSGKnickz33's Avatar
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    Team Starbury is back at it...we might not be the majority but theres too much talent in this group....we got me, metro, rich tree, akamu, goknicksDLee, ABCD

    you other posters need to throw in the towel

    posters like Getreal and LJ4ptplay are shock posters. They intentionally view everything with the most negative perspective they can think of...They sit at their computers laughing as they hate on Marbury. Its not worth responding to their posts. I dont know about Getreal, but I know that LJ4ptplay knows that Marburys not as bad as he makes him out to be in his posts.

  3. #63
    Veteran JayJ44's Avatar
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    How did this thread go from mainly one about the history of the Knicks organization, to people having to defend Marbury? SMH at people taking every opportunity to bash Marbury.

  4. #64
    The Gold Mac MSGKnickz33's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by TunerAddict
    You're comparing Jordan to Stephon?



    I see we have a jokester in the house.
    prime Marbury >> Jordan

    MJ would be like Vince Carter if he played in todays game, A prime Vince Carter would take Mgay to school.

  5. #65
    Veteran TunerAddict's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by MSGKnickz33
    prime Marbury >> Jordan

    MJ would be like Vince Carter if he played in todays game, A prime Vince Carter would take Mgay to school.

    Jordan has 6 rings...Marbury doesn't even have a playoff series win. Can't compare the two. They played during the same time. Jordan at the end of his career is equal to the best years Steph ever had.


    STEPHON MARBURY CAREER

    <table class="statsHeader" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="742"><tbody><tr><td class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid" width="738">Career Season Averages
    </td> <td width="2"></td> </tr></tbody></table> <table class="playerStatTable careerAvg" border="1" bordercolor="#cccccc" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr class="title"> <td class="year">Year</td> <td class="team">Team</td> <td>G</td> <td>GS</td> <td>MPG</td> <td>FG%</td> <td>3P%</td> <td>FT%</td> <td>OFF</td> <td>DEF</td> <td>RPG</td> <td>APG</td> <td>SPG</td> <td>BPG</td> <td>TO</td> <td>PF</td> <td>PPG</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">96-97</td> <td class="tm">MIN</td> <td>67</td> <td>64</td> <td>34.7</td> <td>0.408</td> <td>0.354</td> <td>0.727</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>1.9</td> <td>2.7</td> <td>7.8</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>0.3</td> <td>3.13</td> <td>2.40</td> <td>15.8</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">97-98</td> <td class="tm">MIN</td> <td>82</td> <td>81</td> <td>38.0</td> <td>0.415</td> <td>0.313</td> <td>0.731</td> <td>0.7</td> <td>2.1</td> <td>2.8</td> <td>8.6</td> <td>1.3</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>3.12</td> <td>2.70</td> <td>17.7</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">98-99</td> <td class="tm">MIN</td> <td>18</td> <td>18</td> <td>36.7</td> <td>0.408</td> <td>0.205</td> <td>0.724</td> <td>0.9</td> <td>2.5</td> <td>3.4</td> <td>9.3</td> <td>1.6</td> <td>0.3</td> <td>3.06</td> <td>2.40</td> <td>17.7</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">98-99</td> <td class="tm">NJN</td> <td>31</td> <td>31</td> <td>39.8</td> <td>0.439</td> <td>0.367</td> <td>0.832</td> <td>0.6</td> <td>1.9</td> <td>2.6</td> <td>8.7</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>3.52</td> <td>2.60</td> <td>23.4</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">99-00</td> <td class="tm">NJN</td> <td>74</td> <td>74</td> <td>38.9</td> <td>0.432</td> <td>0.283</td> <td>0.813</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>2.4</td> <td>3.2</td> <td>8.4</td> <td>1.5</td> <td>0.2</td> <td>3.65</td> <td>2.60</td> <td>22.2</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">00-01</td> <td class="tm">NJN</td> <td>67</td> <td>67</td> <td>38.2</td> <td>0.441</td> <td>0.328</td> <td>0.790</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>2.3</td> <td>3.1</td> <td>7.6</td> <td>1.2</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>2.94</td> <td>2.20</td> <td>23.9</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">01-02</td> <td class="tm">PHO</td> <td>82</td> <td>80</td> <td>38.9</td> <td>0.442</td> <td>0.286</td> <td>0.781</td> <td>0.9</td> <td>2.3</td> <td>3.2</td> <td>8.1</td> <td>0.9</td> <td>0.2</td> <td>3.46</td> <td>2.30</td> <td>20.4</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">02-03</td> <td class="tm">PHO</td> <td>81</td> <td>81</td> <td>40.0</td> <td>0.439</td> <td>0.301</td> <td>0.803</td> <td>0.7</td> <td>2.6</td> <td>3.2</td> <td>8.1</td> <td>1.3</td> <td>0.2</td> <td>3.25</td> <td>2.50</td> <td>22.3</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">03-04</td> <td class="tm">PHO</td> <td>34</td> <td>34</td> <td>41.6</td> <td>0.432</td> <td>0.314</td> <td>0.795</td> <td>0.6</td> <td>2.9</td> <td>3.4</td> <td>8.3</td> <td>1.9</td> <td>0.2</td> <td>2.85</td> <td>2.20</td> <td>20.8</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">03-04</td> <td class="tm">NYK</td> <td>47</td> <td>47</td> <td>39.1</td> <td>0.431</td> <td>0.321</td> <td>0.833</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>2.3</td> <td>3.1</td> <td>9.3</td> <td>1.4</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>3.23</td> <td>2.10</td> <td>19.8</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">04-05</td> <td class="tm">NYK</td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>40.0</td> <td>0.462</td> <td>0.354</td> <td>0.834</td> <td>0.6</td> <td>2.4</td> <td>3.0</td> <td>8.1</td> <td>1.5</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>2.84</td> <td>2.30</td> <td>21.7</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">05-06</td> <td class="tm">NYK</td> <td>60</td> <td>60</td> <td>36.6</td> <td>0.451</td> <td>0.317</td> <td>0.755</td> <td>0.4</td> <td>2.5</td> <td>2.9</td> <td>6.4</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>2.62</td> <td>2.40</td> <td>16.3</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">06-07</td> <td class="tm">NYK</td> <td>74</td> <td>74</td> <td>37.1</td> <td>0.415</td> <td>0.357</td> <td>0.769</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>2.4</td> <td>2.9</td> <td>5.4</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>2.42</td> <td>2.50</td> <td>16.4</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">07-08</td> <td class="tm">NYK</td> <td>24</td> <td>19</td> <td>33.5</td> <td>0.419</td> <td>0.378</td> <td>0.716</td> <td>0.7</td> <td>1.8</td> <td>2.5</td> <td>4.7</td> <td>0.9</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>2.00</td> <td>2.40</td> <td>13.9</td> </tr> <tr class=""> <td class="yr">08-09</td> <td class="tm">BOS</td> <td>2</td> <td>0</td> <td>12.5</td> <td>0.444</td> <td>0.000</td> <td>0.000</td> <td>0.0</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>2.5</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>0.0</td> <td>2.50</td> <td>2.00</td> <td>4.0</td> </tr> <!-- Check if career stats are null first --> <tr class="career"> <td class="col_1">Career</td> <td class="col_2">--</td> <td>825</td> <td>812</td> <td>38.2</td> <td>0.434</td> <td>0.326</td> <td>0.785</td> <td>0.7</td> <td>2.3</td> <td>3.0</td> <td>7.8</td> <td>1.2</td> <td>0.1</td> <td>3.05</td> <td>2.40</td> <td>19.7</td> </tr> <!-- Check if all stats are null first --> <tr class="career"> <td class="col_1">All-Star</td> <td class="col_2">--</td> <td>2</td> <td>0</td> <td>16.5</td> <td>0.500</td> <td>0.400</td> <td>0.500</td> <td>0.0</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>5.0</td> <td>0.0</td> <td>0.0</td> <td>2.50</td> <td>1.00</td> <td>8.0</td></tr></tbody></table>
    MICHAEL JORDAN CAREER

    <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="742"><tbody><tr><td class="gSGSectionTitleStatsGrid" width="738">CAREER SEASON AVERAGES
    </td> <td width="2"></td> </tr></tbody></table> <table class="playerStatTable careerAvg" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr class="title"> <td class="year">Year</td> <td class="team">Team</td> <td>G</td> <td>GS</td> <td>MPG</td> <td> FG%</td> <td>3P%</td> <td> FT%</td> <td> OFF</td> <td> DEF</td> <td> RPG</td> <td> APG</td> <td> SPG
    </td> <td>BPG
    </td> <td>TO</td> <td> PF</td> <td> PPG</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1984-85</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>38.3
    </td> <td>.515</td> <td>.173</td> <td> .845</td> <td> 2.0</td> <td>4.5</td> <td>6.5</td> <td>5.9</td> <td>2.4</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>3.55</td> <td> 3.50</td> <td> 28.2</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">1985-86</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>18</td> <td>7</td> <td>25.1</td> <td>.457</td> <td>.167</td> <td> .840</td> <td> 1.3</td> <td>2.3</td> <td>3.6</td> <td>2.9</td> <td>2.1</td> <td>1.2</td> <td>2.50</td> <td> 2.60</td> <td>22.7</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1986-87</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>40.0</td> <td>.482</td> <td>.182</td> <td> .857</td> <td> 2.0</td> <td>3.2</td> <td>5.2</td> <td>4.6</td> <td>2.9</td> <td>1.5</td> <td>3.32</td> <td> 2.90</td> <td>37.1</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">1987-88</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>40.4</td> <td>.535</td> <td>.132</td> <td> .841</td> <td> 1.7</td> <td>3.8</td> <td>5.5</td> <td>5.9</td> <td>3.2</td> <td>1.6</td> <td>3.07</td> <td> 3.30</td> <td>35.0</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1988-89</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>81</td> <td>81</td> <td>40.2</td> <td>.538</td> <td>.276</td> <td> .850</td> <td> 1.8</td> <td>6.2</td> <td>8.0</td> <td>8.0</td> <td>2.9</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>3.58</td> <td> 3.00</td> <td>32.5</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">1989-90</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>39.0</td> <td>.526</td> <td>.376</td> <td> .848</td> <td> 1.7</td> <td>5.1</td> <td>6.9</td> <td>6.3</td> <td>2.8</td> <td>0.7</td> <td>3.01</td> <td> 2.90</td> <td>33.6</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1990-91</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>37.0</td> <td>.539</td> <td>.312</td> <td> .851</td> <td> 1.4</td> <td>4.6</td> <td>6.0</td> <td>5.5</td> <td>2.7</td> <td>1.0</td> <td>2.46</td> <td> 2.80</td> <td>31.5</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">1991-92</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>80</td> <td>80</td> <td>38.8</td> <td>.519</td> <td>.270</td> <td> .832</td> <td> 1.1</td> <td>5.3</td> <td>6.4</td> <td>6.1</td> <td>2.3</td> <td>0.9</td> <td>2.50</td> <td> 2.50</td> <td>30.1</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1992-93</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>78</td> <td>78</td> <td>39.3</td> <td>.495</td> <td>.352</td> <td> .837</td> <td> 1.7</td> <td>5.0</td> <td>6.7</td> <td>5.5</td> <td>2.8</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>2.65</td> <td> 2.40</td> <td>32.6</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">1994-95</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>17</td> <td>17</td> <td>39.3</td> <td>.411</td> <td>.500</td> <td> .801</td> <td> 1.5</td> <td>5.4</td> <td>6.9</td> <td>5.3</td> <td>1.8</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>2.06</td> <td> 2.80</td> <td>26.9</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1995-96</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>37.7</td> <td>.495</td> <td>.427</td> <td> .834</td> <td> 1.8</td> <td>4.8</td> <td>6.6</td> <td>4.3</td> <td>2.2</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>2.40</td> <td> 2.40</td> <td>30.4</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">1996-97</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>37.9</td> <td>.486</td> <td>.374</td> <td> .833</td> <td> 1.4</td> <td>4.5</td> <td>5.9</td> <td>4.3</td> <td>1.7</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>2.02</td> <td> 1.90</td> <td>29.6</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">1997-98</td> <td class="tm"> Chicago </td> <td>82</td> <td>82</td> <td>38.8</td> <td>.465</td> <td>.238</td> <td> .784</td> <td> 1.6</td> <td>4.2</td> <td>5.8</td> <td>3.5</td> <td>1.7</td> <td>0.6</td> <td>2.26</td> <td> 1.80</td> <td>28.7</td> </tr> <tr> <td class="yr">2001-02</td> <td class="tm"> Washington </td> <td>60</td> <td>53</td> <td>34.9</td> <td>.416</td> <td>.189</td> <td> .790</td> <td> 0.8</td> <td>4.8</td> <td>5.7</td> <td>5.2</td> <td>1.4</td> <td>0.4</td> <td>2.70</td> <td> 2.00</td> <td>22.9</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="yr">2002-03</td> <td class="tm"> Washington </td> <td>82</td> <td>67</td> <td>37.0</td> <td>.445</td> <td>.291</td> <td> .821</td> <td> 0.9</td> <td>5.2</td> <td>6.1</td> <td>3.8</td> <td>1.5</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>2.11</td> <td> 2.10</td> <td>20.0</td> </tr> <tr class="career"> <td class="col_1">Career</td> <td class="col_2"> </td> <td>1072</td> <td>1039</td> <td>38.3</td> <td>.497</td> <td>.327</td> <td> .835</td> <td> 1.6</td> <td>4.7</td> <td>6.2</td> <td>5.3</td> <td>2.4</td> <td>0.8</td> <td>2.73</td> <td> 2.60</td> <td>30.1</td> </tr> <tr class="odd"> <td class="col_1">All-Star</td> <td class="col_2"> </td> <td>13</td> <td>13</td> <td>29.4</td> <td>.472</td> <td>.273</td> <td> .750</td> <td> 1.7</td> <td>3.0</td> <td>4.7</td> <td>4.2</td> <td>2.8</td> <td>0.5</td> <td>3.23</td> <td> 2.40</td> <td>20.2</td></tr></tbody></table>
    Lets compare Jordan's final year, when he is in his late 30s to that same year of Stephon's, where he was in his prime.

    JORDAN

    MPG 37 FG% 44.5% 3p% 29% 6.1 RPG 3.8 APG 1.5 SPG 20 PPG



    STEPHON

    40 MPG 43.9% 30% 3.2 RPG 8.1 APG 1.3 SPG 22.3 PPG

    Jordan shot a higher percentage from the field and rebounded more, more steals, 2 ppg fewer in 3 mintues less a game.

    This was in Steph's prime and one of the Jordan worst years.

    Same league, same time. So obviously the argument that Jordan would suck in this league now skill wise is inadequate because Stephon put up better number in that same league that you said was inferior to today's league.

  6. #66
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by richtree
    Marbury refused to play in the system Brown had installed. (False)
    Stephon Marbury on playing in Larry Browns system, during the season: "So, what do I do now, as far as the way I play? I go back to playing like Stephon Marbury, aka Starbury. I haven't been Starbury this year. I've been some other dude this year." - Brown wanted Steph to play PG a certain way, Steph refused. Right there.

    You wanted him to get along with Isiah, who will probably go down as the worst coach in NBA history. (crazyness)
    1) Rick Pitino is the worst coach in NBA History
    2) I never said I wanted him to get along with Isiah, I said him feuding with Isiah hurt the team

    He feuded with him, Malik Rose, Tim Thomas, Jamal Crawford. (Losers that never lived up to any of their potential, never lifted a weight, never did anything positive, Scrubs!)
    What does the fact that they never lived up to their potential have to do with the fact that STEPHON FEUDING WITH THEM HURT THE TEAM?!?!?!? Note: I forgot to throw in Kurt Thomas as guys he feuded with

    No, he said BEFORE THE SEASON that he was going to collect the $20 mil due to him. (Find me the Quote, plus he was playing in the PRE-Season)
    "Marbury, apparently, believes he "earned that money" and will not take a penny less." - [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    "Marbury refuses to take a buy out because he claims he’s “earned” his money." - [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    "He should really consider a comedy career after basketball. He seriously thinks he earned and deserves his $22+ million ("not a penny less")" - [Only registered and activated users can see links. ] (reviewing an interview from Marbury)

    "The best thing for both parties is a buyout, but Marbury needs to be willing to back off his “not a penny less” demands" - [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    " But to be fair, Marbury wants to 100&#37; face value of his current contract and not a penny less,"- [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    "Marbury initially said he would take "not a penny less" in a buyout than the entire amount owed to him." - [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    "Marbury was defiant, saying he wanted the full $22 million he was owed — “not a penny less” — if he was cut. " -http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/26/sports/basketball/26knicks.html

    Sources are coming out now from people not named Mike D'Antoni and Donnie Walsh that Steph asked to talk to the Celtics before training camp began. Read something. (Show me -- you are lying here / and you don't think the NY Media would have found this ? )
    " Stephon Marbury reportedly asked Knicks general manager Donnie Walsh if he could talk to the Celtics prior to training camp this season, an idea that the franchise didn't warm to at all. Walsh had told Marbury it was possible he could be waived at that time, but definitely not a certainty. After the point guard asked for permission to speak with Boston, Walsh informed Marbury that he would report to training camp because team owner James Dolan reportedly didn't want him playing for a rival." - [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]



    Was that enough for you? Or do you want more?

  7. #67
    The Gold Mac MSGKnickz33's Avatar
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    KBlack...this was in response to your post

    Originally Posted by MSGKnickz33
    For numbers 1 to 3, is there any strong evidence that suggests that Marbury started the feuds? Because i see just as much evidence as for the opposite.

    I dont see how you can bring up Larry Brown. Lets get the situation straight. Marbury had very little of a supporting cast that year. If you look at the 2 biggest names playing alongside of Marbury, you can see what Im talking about. Eddy Curry and Jamal Crawford.

    What were the chances of the Knicks winning 30 games with that roster? Very slim, to none.

    Of course Marbury would get the blame, with him being the star player but is that fair to do? Look at Paul Pierce, who struggled all those years in Boston by himself. KG couldnt do it in Minnesota by himself.

    Now, onto Isiah. There are several conflicting reports as to what happened on that plane going to Phoenix, so is it fair to hold that against Marbury? Isiah destroyed that team with bad decision making...had he never chosen to bench Marbury, who knows what our situation would be now.

    Last, Mike D'antoni. Im suprised a poster like you would even bring this up. It couldnt be more clear that D'antoni held a grudge against Marbury from the Phoenix days.

    #4 The only teammate to recently speak about Marbury was Q-Rich. David Lee summed up what I have been saying for a while...

    "I never had an issue with Steph. From my experiences, I think a lot of things were blown out of proportion . . . In our minds, we've sort of moved on. Not in a bad way or a good way, but just the issue is dead."

    #5 Like i said, theres several conflicting stories about what happened in Phoenix when Marbury "left the team." Its unfair to make an opinion on this.

    #6 And why should he? Marbury is one of the most charitable athletes in all of sports, more money made = more money to donate

    And also, look at the way the whole team betrayed him. After Mike D told Q-Rich that Marbury wasnt gonna play in the opening game of the season, Richardson told the rest of the team. Everyone on that team knew Marbury wasnt going to play....except Marbury. Thats betrayal in the purest form brother. Marbury sat there on the bench waiting for his number to be called in front of the home crowd...and as we know, that never happened. Must have been very embarrassing, think of all his friends and family members that were watching.

    #7 So Mike D'antoni says the Knicks are moving in a different direction without Marbury, that the team has "moved on." And lets not forget what i just said in number six about how the whole team betrayed him. So then crawford and z-bo get traded, and they need Marbury to play. They asked him to play, but he says his jersey wasnt even in his locker. Mike D'antoni and Donnie Walsh never denied that.

    #8 I dont blame him to asking to speak with other teams, he had been told that he might get bought out. What do you expect any player to do when they're told they might get bought out?

    _______________________

    Originally Posted by TunerAddict
    Jordan has 6 rings...Marbury doesn't even have a playoff series win. Can't compare the two. They played during the same time. Jordan at the end of his career is equal to the best years Steph ever had.


    STEPHON MARBURY CAREER



    MICHAEL JORDAN CAREER



    Lets compare Jordan's final year, when he is in his late 30s to that same year of Stephon's, where he was in his prime.

    JORDAN

    MPG 37 FG% 44.5% 3p% 29% 6.1 RPG 3.8 APG 1.5 SPG 20 PPG



    STEPHON

    40 MPG 43.9% 30% 3.2 RPG 8.1 APG 1.3 SPG 22.3 PPG

    Jordan shot a higher percentage from the field and rebounded more, more steals, 2 ppg fewer in 3 mintues less a game.

    This was in Steph's prime and one of the Jordan worst years.

    Same league, same time. So obviously the argument that Jordan would suck in this league now skill wise is inadequate because Stephon put up better number in that same league that you said was inferior to today's league.
    Marbury got better since then, Michael Jordan would be a role player in todays game. And he wasnt old, lets not forget all the years he took off after killing his dad and then retiring in 98.

    Jordan fouled out 10 times in his career, and not once after 1992.

    Scottie Pippen did all the dirty work, he always defended the best player on the other team.

    Starbury >>>>>>>>>>>> Mgay

  8. #68
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    For numbers 1 to 3, is there any strong evidence that suggests that Marbury started the feuds? Because i see just as much evidence as for the opposite.

    I dont see how you can bring up Larry Brown. Lets get the situation straight. Marbury had very little of a supporting cast that year. If you look at the 2 biggest names playing alongside of Marbury, you can see what Im talking about. Eddy Curry and Jamal Crawford.

    What were the chances of the Knicks winning 30 games with that roster? Very slim, to none.
    Look, a lot of players have problems with Larry Brown. I was responding to the claim that Marbury has never been a detriment. I'm not saying he's responsible or not, I'm saying that the fact that he is at least partially to blame (Steph could have kept his mouth shut and not blasted the coach in the media). Because he is at least partially to blame for the feud, he is partially to blame for the detriment.

    Now, onto Isiah. There are several conflicting reports as to what happened on that plane going to Phoenix, so is it fair to hold that against Marbury? Isiah destroyed that team with bad decision making...had he never chosen to bench Marbury, who knows what our situation would be now.
    Like I said, I'm not blaming Marbury, I'm saying that the feud that he, if he didn't start, he at least perpetuated, was a detriment to the team.

    Last, Mike D'antoni. Im suprised a poster like you would even bring this up. It couldnt be more clear that D'antoni held a grudge against Marbury from the Phoenix days.
    Because D'Antoni felt that Marbury quit on him, why should D'Antoni, a guy whose offense revolves around the PG, be forced to play a PG who he didn't get along with last time around.

    #4 The only teammate to recently speak about Marbury was Q-Rich. David Lee summed up what I have been saying for a while...

    "I never had an issue with Steph. From my experiences, I think a lot of things were blown out of proportion . . . In our minds, we've sort of moved on. Not in a bad way or a good way, but just the issue is dead."
    Tim Thomas also spoke out against him, as well as Kurt Thomas. D-Lee seems like a nice dude, not to say that what he says about Marbury isn't true, but Marbury was involved in several feuds, all of which hurt this team.

    #5 Like i said, theres several conflicting stories about what happened in Phoenix when Marbury "left the team." Its unfair to make an opinion on this.
    The following fact though is undisputed: Marbury left the team without saying much to anyone on the team or any executive. That's just not excusable from a leader.

    #6 And why should he? Marbury is one of the most charitable athletes in all of sports, more money made = more money to donate

    And also, look at the way the whole team betrayed him. After Mike D told Q-Rich that Marbury wasnt gonna play in the opening game of the season, Richardson told the rest of the team. Everyone on that team knew Marbury wasnt going to play....except Marbury. Thats betrayal in the purest form brother. Marbury sat there on the bench waiting for his number to be called in front of the home crowd...and as we know, that never happened. Must have been very embarrassing, think of all his friends and family members that were watching.
    I understand Marbury was hurt, but here's the facts. Take Marbury's name out of it, take D'Antoni's name out of it. There's a player, we'll call him Player, who has had a controversial past but is a good talent who has made 2 all star teams. He shows up at training camp. His coach, call him Coach, doesn't necessarily see what he likes from Player in practice and preseason, for whatever reason. He keeps Player on the squad, but gives him a minimal role, putting him at the end of the bench. Of course Player is going to be angry, but it's up to COACH not PLAYER to determine who gets to play when. Player is just another guy on the roster, just as susceptible to being the end of the bench or not active as the next. No one would have a problem with a Coach determining who he is going to play.

    #7 So Mike D'antoni says the Knicks are moving in a different direction without Marbury, that the team has "moved on." And lets not forget what i just said in number six about how the whole team betrayed him. So then crawford and z-bo get traded, and they need Marbury to play. They asked him to play, but he says his jersey wasnt even in his locker. Mike D'antoni and Donnie Walsh never denied that.
    Jersey is inconsequetial. The team flies with extra jerseys, even if Marbury had to wear a different number and they had to sew the name on in the locker room, it would have gotten done. It's just an excuse.

    #8 I dont blame him to asking to speak with other teams, he had been told that he might get bought out. What do you expect any player to do when they're told they might get bought out?
    To not do that before training camp.

  9. #69
    Huge Member smokes's Avatar
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    MSG, you are a good poster, but these comparisons of old NBA legends vs todays players are just ridiculous. You cannot compare them in the sense you are comparing them, they were the best players of their era, just like Lebron and Kobe are the best of this era. You want to say Stephon = Kobe? If so it's either stupidity or ignorance

  10. #70
    The Gold Mac MSGKnickz33's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    Look, a lot of players have problems with Larry Brown. I was responding to the claim that Marbury has never been a detriment. I'm not saying he's responsible or not, I'm saying that the fact that he is at least partially to blame (Steph could have kept his mouth shut and not blasted the coach in the media). Because he is at least partially to blame for the feud, he is partially to blame for the detriment.

    Like I said, I'm not blaming Marbury, I'm saying that the feud that he, if he didn't start, he at least perpetuated, was a detriment to the team.
    I partially agree but any time you have a losing team theres gonna be problems. Larry Brown spoke about Marbury a couple times to the media too, and it really wasnt marburys fault that the Knicks were losing. I dont think he was playing his best that year, as a matter of fact i didnt even like him then. But he didnt exactly have that much help, and Larry Browns system was terrible for that team, being young and not having many good defenders.

    Maybe he should have kept his mouth shut, but I can see where it would be hard when looking at all the circumstances involved. I was more upset with Marburys on court actions then off court actions, but I realize now that it just wasnt the right system for the team.

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    Because D'Antoni felt that Marbury quit on him, why should D'Antoni, a guy whose offense revolves around the PG, be forced to play a PG who he didn't get along with last time around.
    That was like 6 years ago. People change, I think most people mature alot from the age of 25-26 to 31. Marburys clearly a different person now then he was then.

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    Tim Thomas also spoke out against him, as well as Kurt Thomas. D-Lee seems like a nice dude, not to say that what he says about Marbury isn't true, but Marbury was involved in several feuds, all of which hurt this team.
    I said recent...Tim Thomas and Kurt Thomas were 4 years ago now. That makes Quentin Richardson the only one to speak against him...David Lee is a nice dude, but why would Lee try to defend Steph if he didnt like him? Sounds like he was keepin it real to me...

    "I never had an issue with Steph. From my experiences, I think a lot of things were blown out of proportion"

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    The following fact though is undisputed: Marbury left the team without saying much to anyone on the team or any executive. That's just not excusable from a leader.
    I have seen different versions of that. There was even a rumor that a punch was thrown. I cant find the article but Marbury spoke to the newspapers late last season and said that he would never leave his team. I cant remember what he said happened, and I have been unsuccessful in finding that article.

    There was also a report saying that he left the team because of the death of his basketball mentor Lou Williams, he wanted to be with his family to mourn the death of a loved one.

    "Isiah gave him permission to leave the team"
    "Isiah didnt give him permission to leave the team"
    "there was a punch thrown"
    "there wasnt a punch thrown"
    "He left the team to be with Mr. Lou's family"

    you see what im saying? And then theres the other article, the one that i cant find.

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    I understand Marbury was hurt, but here's the facts. Take Marbury's name out of it, take D'Antoni's name out of it. There's a player, we'll call him Player, who has had a controversial past but is a good talent who has made 2 all star teams. He shows up at training camp. His coach, call him Coach, doesn't necessarily see what he likes from Player in practice and preseason, for whatever reason. He keeps Player on the squad, but gives him a minimal role, putting him at the end of the bench. Of course Player is going to be angry, but it's up to COACH not PLAYER to determine who gets to play when. Player is just another guy on the roster, just as susceptible to being the end of the bench or not active as the next. No one would have a problem with a Coach determining who he is going to play.
    I disagree...people at the knicks training camp said it was clear that Marbury was the best player on the court. It was actually a marbury hater from this site that even admitted that, I cant remember who though.

    I dont think theres any reason why Marbury should have not been played. Theres no way Crawford or Duhon is better then him. Anthony Roberson even saw some minutes...hes not a whole lot better then me

    He didnt want to play Marbury for the following reasons:

    1) Because Marbury wont be here next year
    2) Because he didnt like him from Phoenix
    3) He wanted to give the young players those minutes (robinson, collins, etc.)

    The biggest reason had to be because it was personal. The other reasons just dont make enough sense.

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    Jersey is inconsequetial. The team flies with extra jerseys, even if Marbury had to wear a different number and they had to sew the name on in the locker room, it would have gotten done. It's just an excuse.
    I cant prove that there was no jersey for Steph, but can you prove what you said? The fact that what Marbury said was never denied makes me believe him.

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    To not do that before training camp.
    Thats your opinion, but i cant respect that...im not disrespecting you, just that particular opinion. What kind of a team would tell a player that they might buy him out, after he worked hard all summer and did what was asked of him? All Starbury wanted was a fresh start, but D'antoni was too much of a grudge holder to let that happen.

  11. #71
    The Gold Mac MSGKnickz33's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by smokes
    MSG, you are a good poster, but these comparisons of old NBA legends vs todays players are just ridiculous. You cannot compare them in the sense you are comparing them, they were the best players of their era, just like Lebron and Kobe are the best of this era. You want to say Stephon = Kobe? If so it's either stupidity or ignorance
    none of the above, i just think its funny to do that. It annoys me the way old timers talk about some of the players from back then. I dont think theres a single player from before Michael Jordan that would be as good as he was back then today...Wilt would never score 100 points now, and even Magic Johnson wouldnt be the same player...but both of them would still be great though. Theres stronger, faster players now that could slow them down.

    I think in some ways, basketball is at its best right now. We just need two or three more elite teams...

  12. #72
    Huge Member smokes's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by MSGKnickz33
    none of the above, i just think its funny to do that. It annoys me the way old timers talk about some of the players from back then. I dont think theres a single player from before Michael Jordan that would be as good as he was back then today...Wilt would never score 100 points now, and even Magic Johnson wouldnt be the same player...but both of them would still be great though. Theres stronger, faster players now that could slow them down.

    I think in some ways, basketball is at its best right now. We just need two or three more elite teams...
    Yeah of course you're right in that sense, but that is because the quality of athletes is always improving, thus the quality of the competition improves and the standards that players need to reach to get into the NBA increases. That's why world records are always getting quicker/higher whatever. Though I think if you put a 28 year old MJ against a 28 year old Steph, Steph would get schooled haha.

  13. #73
    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    He didnt want to play Marbury for the following reasons:

    1) Because Marbury wont be here next year
    2) Because he didnt like him from Phoenix
    3) He wanted to give the young players those minutes (robinson, collins, etc.)

    The biggest reason had to be because it was personal. The other reasons just dont make enough sense.


    I think it was because of the Boston game in the pre-season. That seemed to be the last straw. D'Antoni saw the same ol' Starbury and had enough. So it's definitely personal from years back. Plus how he & Walsh handled it was ridiculous- no plan what so ever!

    Why is no one mentioning this?

    The back and forth soap opera on this site...smh ya'll stated your cases over and over, keep repeating the same sh*t and can't agree to disagree? Both have valid points but can't understand why the other isn't giving in...damn.

    BTW I think he's good- not top 3 $20mil good.

  14. #74
    Superstar th3realicon's Avatar
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    Comparing Marbury to his airness is like committing a crime against humanity. Seriously dudes need to move on and enjoy life without the most cancerous player to ever don a Knicks uniform. Sorry MSG but you just don't compare a **** like Marbs with the Man himself.

  15. #75
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by MSGKnickz33
    I disagree...people at the knicks training camp said it was clear that Marbury was the best player on the court. It was actually a marbury hater from this site that even admitted that, I cant remember who though.

    I dont think theres any reason why Marbury should have not been played. Theres no way Crawford or Duhon is better then him. Anthony Roberson even saw some minutes...hes not a whole lot better then me

    He didnt want to play Marbury for the following reasons:

    1) Because Marbury wont be here next year
    2) Because he didnt like him from Phoenix
    3) He wanted to give the young players those minutes (robinson, collins, etc.)

    The biggest reason had to be because it was personal. The other reasons just dont make enough sense.
    1 and 3 sort of go hand-in-hand, but I feel like you are missing the bigger picture. Look, Mike saw what happened to Brown, saw what happened to Isiah in this town. And yet, he still signed up for this job. But then, to force D'Antoni to play Steph, a PG for whatever reason he didn't trust, or the team didn't trust (a trainer was quoted as saying you could tell there was hatred towards Steph in the locker room) is just unfair. Would you tell Joe Girardi who he had to play and where he had to play them?

    D'Antoni was brought in to do a job, to turn around the NY Knicks. For whatever reason he felt that he could not do it with Steph at the helm. It's not fair to force him to play Steph, especially when his offense revolves so fundamentally around the Point Guard. If this team failed, if D'Antoni failed, he would be the latest casualty in a NY sports war that has destroyed Larry Brown, Isiah Thomas and even guys like Joe Torre. D'Antoni DID NOT WANT TO BECOME A CASUALTY. In NY, you win or you're out. For D'Antoni, he had to turn this team around, and he has done a pretty decent job so far.

    Would the team have been better with Steph at the helm this year? Maybe, it's tough to say. Basketball is such a team sport, it's possible that teams would have keyed down on Marbury, forcing him to make bad passes and frustrating the offense from even getting started. Duhon would have not been keyed in on, and thus allowing him the time and space to get a pass off. Not to mention, though Marbury can pass, it's possible he wasn't making the RIGHT pass. At any given time on the court there's a load of different passes you can make, perhaps Steph wasn't making the looks D'Antoni wanted. I don't know, I wasn't there. Fact is Steph is off the team, and without him the team is playing well. I don't see the problem.

    Not to mention, MSG, think about it this way. You need a team of people to defend Stephon on this board. If you need a team of people to defend a person, if there are so many instances where it's arguable that Steph did/did not cause a problem, is that a guy you REALLY want leading your team? Wouldn't you prefer someone who has never even been rumored to argue with coaches and players and never has been rumored to leave his team in the midst of a road trip? Why would you want someone you have to try so hard to defend to be the leader of your franchise?

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