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  1. #1
    12th man
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    Default Knicks = playoff team if...

    We drafted this man? (Stressed byOG Knicks)








    People say the slow footed Lopez wouldn't fit in this offense.

    Well, really?

    Is he really that slow footed?

    I mean the guy is 7 foot and 260...how many guys at that size you know that is as agile as Lopez? (Lopez is pretty agile, and runs the floor very well for his size.

    Peep this rookie perspective from DRAFTEXPRESS:


    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]




    Part 1: Scoring
    Then:

    “Stanford is relying on Lopez to score more this season, especially on the low block, where Lopez’s results have been mixed. Inside five feet, Lopez looks nearly automatic, showing good touch and the strength to finish over pretty much anyone at this level. He shows solid footwork and will use drop-steps, spin moves, and mini-hooks to score. When he wants to, Lopez does an excellent job establishing deep position and sealing his man off down low.”
    NCAA Weekly Performers, 1/25/08- Part Two

    Now:

    Lopez obviously isn’t being relied upon anywhere near as heavily by the New Jersey Nets as he was by Stanford last year. He’s asked to shoulder less offensive responsibility, which has made him quite a bit more efficient from the field, upping his percentages from 46.8% to 51.3%. He’s much more of a finisher now, cutting off the ball, playing pick and roll with his guards, and taking catch and shoot jump-shots—as opposed to his role on Stanford—where he was asked to catch the ball in the post and grind with his back to the basket on nearly every possession.



    Part Two: Pick and Rolls/Finishing
    Then:

    “Lopez also has shown a strong knack for finishing on rolls to the basket off pick-and-roll situations, using his size, touch, and good hands to consistently catch and finish at the rim. He also has improved his rebounding this year, showing a good pursuit of the ball and a consistent tendency to box out his man strongly.”
    NCAA Weekly Performers, 1/25/08- Part Two

    Now:

    The pick and roll is a staple of most NBA offenses –especially for teams that have quick, talented point guards. The Nets have one of the quickest and most talented young guards in the game in Devin Harris, and he's certainly very dangerous in pick and roll situations. As good as Harris is, having a solid and skilled big man setting screens for him has helped him put up the numbers he has this season. With Brook Lopez, the Nets drafted a perfect complement to Harris and they can be a deadly one-two punch for years to come for a New Jersey team that has historically ran the pick and roll effectively.

    There are several things that make Lopez such a reliable target in these situations. He has great hands and shows it nightly by catching touch passes from Harris or Vince Carter in traffic and laying the ball gently off the glass. They would be reluctant to pass him the ball if he didn't finish –something he excelled at in college and has done well enough this season to earn their respect. He's fundamentally sound at the rim, never dipping the ball or putting it on the ground unnecessarily when he rolls. His outstanding length (possessing a tremendous 7-5 wingspan and 9-5 standing reach) helps him a great deal in that regard, as combined with his size (7-0.5 in shoes) and strength, he’s able to fluidly finish around the basket with relative ease.


    Lopez also has a solid basketball IQ. He reads defenders well –knowing when to slip a screen, when to hold the screen for an extra second, and when to pop. The suddenness with which he jumps out to the top of the key from the block to set screens make him even more effective as his man is often a step behind him and late to help out on Harris or recover back to the block.

    Most of Lopez’s offense in fact comes as a finisher—whether off cuts, pick and rolls, offensive rebounds, or running the floor in transition. On the season, he’s making 165/277 or just under 60% of his non-post-up attempts around the basket –which is an outstanding rate that already puts him amongst the NBA’s elite big men.

    The success that he's had shows that Lopez really understands the game. It's not easy for a player to adjust to a whole new system and find a way to be productive when he's not the first or even second option after being the focal point on every other team he's played on. However, he's managed to do just that, and the way he's thrived and adapted to the offense helped the Nets stay in the playoff hunt.


    Part Three: Mid-Range Jump-Shot

    Then:

    “Possessing range out to college three point line, he was able to open up the floor for his brother Robin with his ability to score from the perimeter. We had the chance to observe Lopez this summer during an open gym session at the LeBron James Skills Academy, where we were surprised to see that he can even shoot the ball with consistency out to the NBA three point line. His capability to stretch the defense and create one on one opportunities for teammates will only help him in the eyes of NBA scouts. ”
    Top NBA Draft Prospects in the Pac-10 (Part One: #1-#5) - September 18, 2007

    Now:


    At the collegiate level, the only time you would see Lopez taking jump-shots was in warm-ups prior to the game. It’s easy to understand why, as he was so much bigger and stronger than his opponents that his coach probably felt he’d be letting his opponents off the hook by allowing his prized big man step out to the perimeter. Still, it wasn’t hard to see that the potential was there, if you actually did get to see Lopez attempt a few jumpers.

    Lopez has really stood out in his rookie season with his ability to face up and make jump-shots from the high post. He has a very nice stroke for a big guy, and displays adequate form as he holds the ball high over his head, making him difficult to block. His touch is obviously terrific—not only does he make 82% of his free throws, but he’s converted on 30/63 or 47% of his field goal attempts from 17 to 20 feet, according to Synergy’s quantified player report. He may not always shoot quite that well as the sample size increases, but it’s very evident that he has terrific potential in this area, which will open up the paint significantly for the likes of Devin Harris and Vince Carter to slash to the rim, and force the defense to adjust accordingly.


    Part Four: Rebounding/Athleticism

    Then:

    “Lopez is blessed with excellent physical attributes-- including a legit seven foot body, outstanding wingspan, and above average leaping ability for a center prospect. His frame is not carrying anything close to its maximum weight, as it could stand to gain another 20 pounds or so easily. The big man does a nice job running the floor, often filling the wings in transition and beating opposing centers down the floor for easy buckets.”
    Top NBA Draft Prospects in the Pac-10 (Part One: #1-#5) - September 18, 2007

    Now:

    Lopez is a fundamentally sound player and pays great attention to detail, and this is never more evident than when he is cleaning the glass. He does an outstanding job of boxing out, driving his man away from the basket and keeping him on his back. Establishing the same strong base when boxing out that he does in the paint offensively, he is not afraid to be physical. The toughness he displays often allows him to get a hand on the ball even when he isn't in ideal position to do so.

    Lopez's great build doesn't hurt him either –standing over 7-feet tall, with a superb wingspan and weighing in at 260 pounds, he had an NBA body even before his name was called on draft night. Lopez uses his frame extremely well, and this is especially apparent in his rebounding numbers, given the fact that he isn't a great leaper. He stands tall and always pursues the ball with two hands, therefore never getting the ball knocked away or getting stripped by guards coming in from behind. He shows his great hands when rebounding and is often coming down with boards in traffic –a clear sign of a good rebounder. There's definite reason to believe Lopez will be a double-double guy down the road, even if it did not appear that way at all when he first arrived at the college level.

    He's currently averaging 8 rebounds per game in just under 30 minutes, which translates to 11 rebounds per 40 pace adjusted –a very impressive stat—and somewhat surprisingly, identical to his numbers as a college sophomore. His work ethic and perseverance also have a lot to do with these numbers. He never gives up on a rebound no matter how out of reach it may be. With more experience and added minutes, Lopez will regularly be among the NBA's top rebounders. On a team that's been looking for the right fit at center for what seems like the last decade, Lopez has to be a breath of fresh air for the Nets.

    Lopez is a deceptively good athlete for someone of his size, especially considering his reputation. His athleticism is almost hidden in a way because of his awkwardness on the offensive end and the fact that he won't dazzle anyone with a play or a move. With that said, he's one of the better running big men in the game today, regularly beating opposing big men down the floor thanks in large part to his huge stride-length and great stamina. He's recorded countless follow up dunks this year and has been the recipient of many alley-oops on Nets fast breaks.

    Part Five: Defense

    Then:

    “On the defensive end, Lopez has done a good job this season, showing versatility and a lot of potential as a defender. In man-to-man situations in the post, Lopez plays a strange style of defense, never using a hand or forearm on his opponent, rather keeping his hands outstretched in the air and just using his body to stay in front of his man by moving laterally. This throws many players off, forcing them into travels or offensive fouls, and also allows Lopez to contest anyone who tries to shoot over him, but it also leaves him prone to being backed down when someone with his strength shouldn't be. Laterally, Lopez is definitely above average for a seven-footer, looking competent when forced out on the perimeter, and also doing a good job defending pick-and-rolls with his mobility. He does show some problems reacting to quick moves by agile forwards in the post, though. As a weakside shot blocker, Lopez is very aware and focused, and is solid contesting and blocking shots in the lane in a very controlled manner, not committing foolish fouls.”
    NCAA Weekly Performers, 1/25/08- Part Two


    Now:

    Lopez has been terrific on this end of the floor. He's very active and always in tune to what's going on around him. He currently ranks 5th in the league in blocked shots, with 1.9 per game. While that is an impressive stat, the way Lopez records those blocks is equally impressive; often keeping the ball in play to spark the Nets high powered fast break. He does a great job of staying in his stance for whole possessions as well. He'll often dip down into an athletic position when the ball is on the perimeter and muscle his man out of the paint. He's able to do this and stay out of foul trouble –a truly uncommon characteristic of most young centers in the NBA today. He doesn't leave his feet a lot or over commit, showing good discipline in standing his ground and getting his hands up to alter shots with his giant standing reach.

    Despite his average lateral quickness, Lopez does a fairly good job against quicker big guys who like to play away from the basket due in large part to his fundamentals. He keeps one hand up and in his man's face, using his great length to contest shots while leaving a cushion to deny penetration. He shouldn't be left alone often on the perimeter with quicker players, but Lopez can hold his own against many players his size by being smart and not being too aggressive.

    Lopez uses that same awareness to make his presence felt as a weak side defender, acting like a wall when guards try to penetrate. At times he can be a little too stiff as he's reluctant to foul, making it easy for players to finish around him. The one thing that can never be questioned about him is his effort. He contests all shots, and even on possessions where he's late to recover and has no chance of blocking the shot, he'll sprint out and do whatever he can to bother the shooter. He also does a nice job hedging out on screens to slow up the opposing guard before rotating back to his man with his hands in the air to deflect any pass coming his way. Despite his lack of lateral quickness, it is clear that he's well-schooled in how to compensate for it on the defensive end.
    When defending the block, he works hard to front or three-quarter front his man to make for a difficult post entry pass. When his man does get the ball, he uses his strong upper body to make it difficult for his man to back him in as he bodies up with his chest as he did in college. He’s been somewhat foul prone at times, but should be able to improve in this area as he gains more experience.


    Part Six: Intangibles

    Then:
    “Following a freshman season where Brook Lopez posted good numbers despite coming off back surgery, many were expecting more big things from him this year. So it was obviously disappointing when Lopez missed the first nine games of the season due to academic ineligibility. To Lopez's credit, his response to the situation has been as mature as one can expect from a college sophomore. Lopez has publicly blamed himself for Stanford's early-season loss to Siena, a game in which he was unable to participate. He also called the ineligibility “an embarrassment to me and my family.” Lopez claims the time off has helped him grow, giving him an improved work ethic, which definitely is showing, as his production is up noticeably across the board.”
    NCAA Weekly Performers, 1/25/08- Part Two

    Now:

    When the Nets drafted Lopez, they drafted a high character player with an outstanding pedigree. Although somewhat unusual with his off the court interests (comic books, the Disney franchise) he's very popular with his teammates. His work ethic is obviously top notch, and that is evident by his receptiveness to his coaches and his willingness to learn. Effort is the one constant with him, which has earned him a great deal of playing time very quickly under the highly demanding Lawrence Frank. This is not something you can teach, and with the foundation that Lopez has he will be in the League for a long time. While it will depend greatly on continued improvement and player movement in the future, it is not unfathomable to think that Lopez could sneak onto a few All-Star teams without being his team's first option. Considering his size, the position he plays and where the Nets picked him (shockingly finding him available at 10) he is clearly looking like the biggest steal of the 2008 draft.





    So taking that into perspective...we could of been

    Robinson
    Hughes
    Harringon
    Lee
    Lopez

    Sounds playoff legit.

  2. #2
    Quiet Storm New New York's Avatar
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    They say hindsight is 20/20!

    Now being that we had Curry and Zach plugging up our frontcourt it wouldnt have seemed logical at the time, but, this is a classic case of drafting the best player available and worrying about where they fit later!

    I really am hoping Danillo comes on strong next year just so we don't feel as if we got totally burnt this year like we did in taking Frye over Bynum.

    The funny thing is that I heard Isiah wanted Eric Gordon, not a bad pick either.

    I really wanted DJ Augistine!

    Again I just hope Danillo helps us save face next year! But to his credit if this is him only playing at "70%" then there is reason to be optomistic....I hope!

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    The One and Only KING~POETIQ's Avatar
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    of course we would have had a better chance to make the playoffs with the way lopez is playing now. he would have added an inside presence that we clearly lack with Lee/Jeffries. Seeing Lee play defense by just putting his hands up is unbearable. No physicality.

    At the same time, many things factored into the Knicks decision to not select brook on draft night. us having eddy and randolph, plus Gallo having the most "potential" out of the remaining lottery picks.

  4. #4
    Veteran quiggle's Avatar
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    Gallinari is Dantoni's pet so we might have gotten Lopez if Mark Jackson was the coach.

  5. #5
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    Default Bad Picks

    In retrospect, Brook Lopez would have been a very good pick. But we did not take him. Lets get over it and hope that a healthy Gallinari in the future will justify our pick.

    Take a look at NBA draft history. There have been, in retropsect, numerous bad picks by everyone.

    In 2006 we could have taken Rondo over Balkman and Balkman still would have been available when we took Collins. When we took Frye in 2005, Bynum and Granger were still available. When we took Sweetney in 2003, West, Diaw and Barbosa were still available. When we took Frank Wlliams at 25 in 2002, Salmons and Boozer were still available. And, of course, when we took Weis in 1999, Ron Artest was still available.

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    Veteran nyk_nyk's Avatar
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    I'm not sure but is Gallo or Chandler being groomed to be our future starting SF? Also, if Walsh gets what he wants and acquires Lebron it won't really matter at that point. It just seems like one minute Chandler is being talked about then then next its Gallo depending on whos playing good at the time.

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    Enlightened OGKnickfan's Avatar
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    Thanks for the mention, metro. Really, there were a few cats on here, before I even joined and was just reading posts as a guest, that were calling for a drafting of Lopez, Metro was one of those. He just supported Gallinari, when we got him, and was optimistic about it.

    I, on the other hand, had seen this guy, Lopez, play for Stanford, and he was clearly a gifted player. His rebounds seemed low, but that was because his brother was allowed to get the boards, while he would lay back and try to run the floor for inside buckets. He also was clearly an agile big man, with an array of moves. I saw it, like many of you, but our front office did not, it seems like to me.

    Lopez, by the way, was projected, at first, to be the number one overall pick. Hist stock fell, for a few different reasons. Right now, he's really impressing a lot of people. In fact, I recently saw an ESPN poll, where NBA fans had voted him as the most impressive rookie of the draft season.

    Ideally, had we been smart, I would have liked Walsh to have kept all of our guys from last year, except for Rose, Curry, and James. I know people on here hate Crawford and Marbury, and they're certainly not perfect, but, just because you're not perfect, or a Kobe or Lebron, does not make you worthless. With a big man to help them, which has been a missing piece, since the days of Ewing, only interrupted for a brief moment of success, when we had Nazr Mohamed and Kurt Thomas, our guys would have done okay, just as in the case of an inconsistent player by the name of John Starks.

    The Mohamed and Thomas squad was really looking good, by the way, and Craw wasn't as good as he would later be, in those days: 2003, approximately. Craw's not perfect, but with a good center to pick up penetrators and discourage them, as well as to rebound and draw and kick for open shots, he and Star child would have really impressed us all.

    This team, IMO, would have been a playoff team with the capacity to shock a team or two in the playoffs:

    Marbury
    Crawford
    Chandler
    Randolph
    Lopez

  8. #8
    KnicksonLIN.com
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    I agree that Brook Lopez would have helped the Knicks make the playoffs. He's an excellent defender, and he can score in a variety of ways. Like I said before, his game is very similar to Zydrunas Ilgauskas' and Pau Gasol's. Lopez has the potential to be an All Star. And even if he doesn't become an All Star, he'll be known as a top 10 center in the NBA like how Emeka Okafor and Andrew Bynum are considered.

    1).A lineup of
    PG Marbury
    SG Crawford
    SF Chandler
    PF Randolph
    C Lopez

    bench: Duhon, Robinson, Lee, Jeffries

    Would have been a 7th seed in the east.

    2)A lineup of
    PG Duhon
    SG Robinson
    SF Chandler
    PF Lee
    C Lopez

    bench: Marbury, Hughes, Harrington, Jeffries

    would have been an 8th seed in the east
    Last edited by abcd; Mar 19, 2009 at 16:48.

  9. #9
    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    David Lee, at 6-9, was overmatched against 7-foot rookie Brook Lopez, as it gets more and more painfully obvious how much this team desperately needs a legit big man down low. Lee had two early fouls and did put up much more than the old two-handed surrender against any and all Nets who got near the rim.

    Lee had 13 points, 6 rebounds and 5 turnovers in 31:47. Lopez had 23 points and eight assists in 35:09. Lopez is noticably slow and methodical, but he knows what to do with the ball when he gets it and his size makes him a difficult matchup for the much smaller Lee, who tried to defend his performance after the game.

    "I thought I defended him well on the post," Lee said. "What he was getting a lot of it on was off the pick-and-rolls when we would double Vince and he would roll into the post. It's hard enough for me to wrestle with, but when he gets on one of our smaller guys and he can kind of duck in and get some easy buckets that way; and they were also dropping it off to him and then he would get the ball -- Where he was most effective tonight was tossing it to guys that were cutting and getting assists that way."


    Yeah Lee thats what big men do...smh!!!!

    Hopefully this teaches Walsh/D'Antoni a lesson for next season.
    Successful teams have Real big men--no homo.
    We don't.

    Defense wins games & championships.
    Improve our D and we improve our record.

  10. #10
    Veteran jpz17's Avatar
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    so what? it didn't happen and theres nothing to do now

  11. #11
    Evacuee Crazy⑧s's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by abcd
    I agree that Brook Lopez would have helped the Knicks make the playoffs. He's an excellent defender, and he can score in a variety of ways. Like I said before, his game is very similar to Zydrunas Ilgauskas' and Pau Gasol's. Lopez has the potential to be an All Star. And even if he doesn't become an All Star, he'll be known as a top 10 center in the NBA like how Emeka Okafor and Andrew Bynum are considered.

    1).A lineup of
    PG Marbury
    SG Crawford
    SF Chandler
    PF Randolph
    C Lopez

    bench: Duhon, Robinson, Lee, Jeffries

    Would have been a 7th seed in the east.

    2)A lineup of
    PG Duhon
    SG Robinson
    SF Chandler
    PF Lee
    C Lopez

    bench: Marbury, Hughes, Harrington, Jeffries

    would have been an 8th seed in the east
    assumptions like this really don't mean a thing ABCD. You know that.

  12. #12
    KnicksonLIN.com
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    Originally Posted by Crazy8s
    assumptions like this really don't mean a thing ABCD. You know that.
    Assumptions? I was saying facts.

    Every team that made the playoffs, in the 2007-2008 season had a center that could play defense, in case you were wondering. And when I say every team, I mean every team. Even the Atlanta Hawks and Denver Nuggets(the 8th seeds of last year) had a good defensive center(Al Horford and Marcus Camby).

    It is a fact that most unsuccessful NBA teams either don't have a good center, or they don't have a good defensive team.

  13. #13
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    Nyk Logo Common-Sense

    If the Knicks new regime was really serious about the 2010 Plan than the best available player at the 7th pick was Brook Lopez....there are no centers available in the 2010 FA.

    NBA History has showed repeatedly the best way to rebuild a team is to start at the top with a Center. Brook Lopez was not a H.S. draft player he was proven to be the best offense/defense Center in the draft.
    Were the Knicks in the rebuilding-mode with the 7th pick of the 2008 draft?
    Then why did the Knicks get "BOOOED" at their selection at the draft?

    Was Shaq the reason why Dantoni got swept in the first round last season (5 games is the same as 4)?
    Coach Dantoni had all his success in the NBA without the use of a Center.


    Why the Knicks dont show an interest in making the 2008-9 playoffs?

    It has more to do with the new regime than the Knick players (New Regime=80% compared to Knick players=20%).

    1) If management intentions was to buyout Marbury at the start of the season....why not let him play untill he act up or do something negative within the team and make him a big sample to all future Knick players.
    It does not look good to our management that hours after the buy-out of Marbury the Championship Boston Celtics was there to sign him.

    2) Knick Management deserve some props for trading 3-DNP players for 1-DNP player to make room for 2 roster spots.
    The playoff picture is dead b/c the Knick coach is giving the new DNP player 35 minutes of playingtime each game and his offensive performance in each game shows why he was DNP on his previous team.

    3) What was the reason why we traded our DNP veteran bench-player-coach Malik Rose for young Wilcox if we are not going to give him any playingtime to rebound, block, defend, and commit 6 fouls?

  14. #14
    Veteran LeFlume's Avatar
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    I never thought Brook Lopez could have this much of an impact. I really had my doubts about his pro game when he got drafted. I didn't see many "West Coast Duke" games on TV but those I saw he was awful in. Now he have turned into Bill Russel light. Damn, he would have been perfect for us.

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    Truth be said....if the Knicks (Dantoni) wanted Gallinari in the draft they could've traded Renaldo Balkman on draft night to get him.
    Not waste a 7th pick on him.

    Who think Gallo would've played this season or next season for the next team?
    All the teams in last season draft were looking for picks to contribute this season....except for the Knicks...

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