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Thread: The 2010 Plan... 2 Piece and a Biscuit

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    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Default The 2010 Plan... 2 Piece and a Biscuit

    After watching our team get abused and be the laughing stock of the league (and the playoffs) I have surprisingly developed a sense of optimism. Looking forward I envision a young, competitive franchise back on the map, and here's why...

    At first I couldn't figure Walsh/D'Antoni's thinking with some decisions such as Marbury being benched, Duhon being overused, keeping Mobley after recognizing his heart condition etc... But now the picture is clearer and it's logical.

    We weren't going anywhere last or this year due to our past mismanagement and my conclusion was either someone doesn't know what they're doing (Isaiah) or doesn't care (Dolan) which to me were both illogical. Anywhoo we got Donnie and to most [being that we were so used to malfeasance] some moves were questionable at best and the "2010 plan" definitely not supported if only for the impatience of some including myself, probably wanting instant gratification. Today I see the "2010 plan" and everything is going perfect!

    Walsh knew we weren't going to win in at least another 2 years and thus everyone became expendable, his only goal to get under the cap by 2010 to sign free agents (plural), field enough players to get through the season, build a young nucleus, scout our current talent and reverse the culture. Very hard things to do all at once in a new position during your first year.

    By clearing cap space for two Max's we are at least guaranteed an allstar. Some want LBJ some want Wade whatever, it doesn't matter considering both (plus more) are the best we've had since forever!!

    By developing Wilson and hopefully Gallo we will have at least two, young competent shooters who can defend on the wings -whom at the least are cheap, productive and can be used for a trade if necessary.

    By playing Jeffries and whipping Curry into shape we increase their value.

    Our immediate issues include no big man, no go to guy. Sh*t we were competitive with this group so imagine. I agree especially after watching Cleveland lose that LBJ isn't the only piece or the savior. But the supporting cast is not far from in place. Another point about LBJ is will he defect or not?
    One Ny paper says if Cleveland wins he will leave (he's fulfilled his obligations) one paper says if Clev. loses he will leave (his supporting cast sucks). Both result in the same thing... LBJ a Knick if Clevland wins Championship or not.

    But Walsh isn't banking on that, he wants to build a contender from within regardless. He knows we really can't lose in this draft. Not because we're so stacked but because we could use almost any good player and we have assets to move up. I see he's targeting moving up for Thabeet.

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

    "It is why Walsh is so intrigued with Hasheem Thabeet, UConn's 7-3 junior shotblocker. Walsh interviewed Thabeet during the Chicago NBA Draft combine Wednesday and is the only prospect he views worthy enough to give up a decent asset to move up from No. 8 in the draft. The Knicks were last in shotblocking the past two seasons."

    I have read more than once that Walsh recognizes our lack of interior defense and need for a big (duh!). Now I'm not stuck on this rumor but what I see is Walsh will acquire the best big man available by the start of 2010 so there's no rush.

    I see KO.com posters mostly want the best guards (or pf) available from
    Rubio on down to Lawson etc... and as long as this pick has some talent and isn't complete garbage we can't go wrong imo. Basically we need the Best Player Available so scouting is key but once again Walsh seems to know what he's doing, we need to get back to being used to that!

    For those who want instant gratification I feel your frustration and impatience but we can no longer sacrifice long term solutions for short term results. We just are not in a position to afford that luxury. A consistent playoff team can take those types of chances when on the cusp.

    For those who don't believe or like Chandler. I say I think his talent is evident but to put things into perspective he isn't an allstar or all NBA player but is rounding into a very good compliment. I can't endorse Gallo because realistically speaking his conditioning or physical condition (back) makes his shooting prowess unimportant. But potentially I guess he's our Turkgaglu (spelling?) or Ginobli.

    Duhon looked o.k. when healthy (numbers wise) and I'm convinced he's a stop gap maybe bench player by 2010 at best if he's here.

    Lee and Nate are assets now due to the fact all in all they're expendable as far as we're concerned. This comment by Walsh says it all "they're good at the right price". Basically we're not putting our eggs into that basket. We've seen their value and the league will determine their market value which at this point is really no issue. Donnie will only do what's most beneficial for our team period. If Nate does stay and perform at his peak (maybe) during the playoffs he will be considered a BEAST. Lee I really feel is expendable so whatever happens happens.

    All in all I can almost guarantee we get two stars by the start of 2010 thus the "2 piece". We're just looking for the "Biscuit(s)". Out of all the guys we have Rookie pick, expiring contracts this and next year, Chandler/Gallo- getting those complimentary players is all but cemented in stone.

    Now about D'Antoni to put it simply I don't like his style and lack of consistent defense but to be fair we can't play good defense without the right components. Walsh knows this and will supercede D'Antoni's SSOL by adding solid defenders no matter what by 2010.

    Yup everything is looking up- thats Lebron or not. We just want to remain competitive throughout and into the post season and I feel we're well on our way. We really weren't that far. 40 wins? Anything can happen in the playoffs with matchups and circumstances etc... The hardest thing to do now is be patient and wait for a whole year in anticipation. For now we will debate who we want, where we went wrong, who we like and don't. But c'mon please, please don't hate on Walsh until the start of the 2010 season.

    ***I know he [Walsh] should of gotten Brook Lopez and Gordon and Camby and disrespected Marbury and on and on but you can't rate any move until the deadline- Tip off 2010 to be fair.

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    Great post...I agree wholeheartedly. I have been calling for patience since the 2010 plan was the clear goal. We have been the worst run franchise in ALL of sports for almost a decade. We can trace all our problems to the Ewing/Glen Rice trade. Since that point we have been short sided trading for overpaid names hoping they will magically become a superstar in a Knick uniform. We traded away picks and young gunz as well. Thank you Donnie for finally bringing sanity and a long term plan back to NYC.

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    i love chandler, but depending on who donnie drafts he may be expendable.
    (always go bpa) say donnie drafts derozan, what happens to chandler? chandler for mike taylor and deandre jordan? that fills two spots for this team.
    a young pg, and a young c.derozan's midrange game along side gallo's 3 pt shooting, and lee's post game, would give this team awesome offensive versatility, along with his ridiculous athleticism. look at what taylor and jordan get paid. [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
    taylor
    derozan
    gallinari
    lee
    jordan
    lineup sounds wonderful to me.

    taylor highlights, I'm sure some of you saw this game.
    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]
    taylor to jordan.
    <object width="425" height="344">


    <embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/OPQNbuLSjVQ&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></object>

    i love il wil, but i'd do that trade in a hearbeat.

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    Great post Red.

    Rome wasn't built in a day and anyone expecting such is an idiot.

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    Nyk Logo We are lowering our Salary Cap the wrong way

    Wow Red....all this on the day after Lebron gets swept in the ECF.

    Knicks went straight down hill after Firing G.M. Ernie Grunfield in 1998-99 season. It is 2009 a decade away from the 99 FINALS.

    The Knicks decade of different management (3) all have/had one thing in common....to get rid of the Knicks entire 15 man roster.
    Each Knick manager came up with a better reason and idea than the last manager "to get rid of the Knicks entire 15 man roster".
    Donnie Walsh reason (to get rid of the Knicks entire 15 man roster) had to be different and better than the last two previous managers....whom both kept the Knicks at the highest paid salary cap team in the NBA.

    When we can establish teammates which like and trust one another through consistent comunication u have winners, and that's in any sport.
    Teammates form a friendship bond that gets closer together through time.
    All good teammates dont get playingtime in a 9 man rotation.

    When u have a Knick team where every player is suspect to be traded (except for Gallo) in the offseason or traded during the regular season (for playing well), or just to be used for one season then kicked to the curb....
    Players are people too....they have likes and dislikes (in the 4th quarter).

    If we Knick-Fans have not learned anything from the change of character and performance of our favorite Patrick Ewing after the trade of Oakley & Starks....then we need to look at coach Dantoni winning Phoenix team after Marion was traded. Or take a real good look at Donnie Walsh winning Indiana Pacer team after Ron Artest was traded.

    The 2010 Plan (lowering salary cap) was thrown out the window by the selection in the 2008 draft, and the trade of two defensive players Renaldo Balkman then Mardy Collins, they were rookie contract players that never had a chance or a role under Isiah Thomas.

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    Default 2010

    Excellent post by Red. However, as matters now stand we will have a problem getting two free agent stars in 2010.

    Assuming that the cap is about $60M, and it is likely to be less, we will not have much room even if we eliminate Curry and Jeffries and take back very little 2010 salary in return.

    As matters now stand, we are committed to about $26M in 2010 contracts for 5 players -- Curry, Jeffries, Gallo, Chandler and this year's pick. The max we can pay a player with 7 or more years of experience is 30&#37; of the cap. Less than 7 years is 25%. LeBron will cost at least $18M. Another real star will be at least $15M. That would put us at $59M, right at the cap, but for only seven players. Each of the necessary additional 5 -- it may be 6 --will have a cap number of almost $500,000. Note I have included neither Lee nor Nate.

    If we jettisoned both Curry and Jefferies without absorbing any 2010 salary, we save $18M. That will take care of one star, e.g., LeBron. With him, but without Curry and Jefferies, we would be at about $26M, but with only 4 players. If we get another "star" at $15M, we will be over $40M, with less than $20M of the cap remaining and we will still need another 7 or 8 players to fill out the roster.

    My conclusion is that the 2010 plan is to get only one major star or perhaps two very solid players.

    An aside, Tyson Chandler's 2010 player option contract is for $12.75M.

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    I think getting Thabeet is key. As great as the Cavs team was, it always helps to have a big man to protect the paint. The Cavs have no shot blockes besides James, The Lakers did not look good until their big men started to protect the paint. The Magic? We all know why they're in the Finals.

    If we draft someone like Thabeet. I think It makes it easier for us to build a team Imagine Amare Wade or James along with Chandler Gallo and Thabeet. That line up will smash tha current Cavs line up.

    Man if we can get him, I think we'll be set.

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    Nyk Logo Lebron is looking for a supportive cast of Contenders

    Originally Posted by Oldtimer
    Excellent post by Red. However, as matters now stand we will have a problem getting two free agent stars in 2010.

    Assuming that the cap is about $60M, and it is likely to be less, we will not have much room even if we eliminate Curry and Jeffries and take back very little 2010 salary in return.

    As matters now stand, we are committed to about $26M in 2010 contracts for 5 players -- Curry, Jeffries, Gallo, Chandler and this year's pick. The max we can pay a player with 7 or more years of experience is 30% of the cap. Less than 7 years is 25%. LeBron will cost at least $18M. Another real star will be at least $15M. That would put us at $59M, right at the cap, but for only seven players. Each of the necessary additional 5 -- it may be 6 --will have a cap number of almost $500,000. Note I have included neither Lee nor Nate.

    If we jettisoned both Curry and Jefferies without absorbing any 2010 salary, we save $18M. That will take care of one star, e.g., LeBron. With him, but without Curry and Jefferies, we would be at about $26M, but with only 4 players. If we get another "star" at $15M, we will be over $40M, with less than $20M of the cap remaining and we will still need another 7 or 8 players to fill out the roster.

    My conclusion is that the 2010 plan is to get only one major star or perhaps two very solid players.

    An aside, Tyson Chandler's 2010 player option contract is for $12.75M.

    The above is the Reality response to our Knick situation for the so-call 2010 Plan (lowering the Salary Cap), while being instrumental in getting rid of all Isiah Thomas Players.

    Oldtimer....response (above) show the correct percentage of the Knicks being able to get two Star-Players in the 2010 FA market. Which still does not look good if we are able to complete this goal (What is the percentage of Eddy Curry being in a sign and trade to get one of the 2010 star FA?).

    How many seasons will it take after the 2010-11 season will it take to forfill the (two star puzzle) roster with a suportive cast just to make it to the second round in the playoffs?

    Here is another look at the Players (below) inwhich Donnie Walsh 2010 plan of "Tanking two seasons" to go after.
    First keep in mind the players below have another year to decide whether they will resign with the team they are on (some of these players maybe traded to a team they like this year).

    The list of potential free agents in 2010 is deep and spectacular.

    There are superstars:
    Lebron James, [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ] and [Only registered and activated users can see links. ].

    There are perennial All-Stars:
    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], Manu Ginóbili, [Only registered and activated users can see links. ] and [Only registered and activated users can see links. ].

    And there are high-level role players:
    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], [Only registered and activated users can see links. ], and [Only registered and activated users can see links. ].

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    Nyk Logo What was Layden and Isiah missing as managers?

    What Layden & Isiah lacked as President/managers was their ability to have a vision of the type of team to build through the trade market.
    And the comunication between President, manager, coach, and players were never on the same-page to complete one task....a .500 season.

    The last decade the big money $Knicks$ needed a President, G.M., and Headcoach (all on the same-page) with the same vision of building a team through draft, trade, and the FA market. Three heads is better than one (ask any woman).

    Every G.M. in the NBA wanted Isiah Thomas position in 2003-4 on the Knicks to trade for players at any expense to build a winning team (which was so easy to do being Portland was persistent in wanting to trade Rasheed Wallace for the Knicks Mcdyess). We had Mutombo, Kurt Thomas, KVH, and Houston, trading for Rasheed Wallace would've put us in the 2nd round of the playoffs.
    Alot of good draft picks stayed in college rather than come out in the Lebron, Carmelo, D.Wade, and Bosh draft class. And what did Isiah do his 2nd month on the job? he traded our first round draft pick....we needed a President or G.M. that knew how to trade for players that fit our defensive "puzzle".

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    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Kiyaman
    What Layden & Isiah lacked as President/managers was their ability to have a vision of the type of team to build through the trade market.
    And the comunication between President, manager, coach, and players were never on the same-page to complete one task....a .500 season.

    The last decade the big money $Knicks$ needed a President, G.M., and Headcoach (all on the same-page) with the same vision of building a team through draft, trade, and the FA market. Three heads is better than one (ask any woman).

    Every G.M. in the NBA wanted Isiah Thomas position in 2003-4 on the Knicks to trade for players at any expense to build a winning team (which was so easy to do being Portland was persistent in wanting to trade Rasheed Wallace for the Knicks Mcdyess). We had Mutombo, Kurt Thomas, KVH, and Houston, trading for Rasheed Wallace would've put us in the 2nd round of the playoffs.
    Alot of good draft picks stayed in college rather than come out in the Lebron, Carmelo, D.Wade, and Bosh draft class. And what did Isiah do his 2nd month on the job? he traded our first round draft pick....we needed a President or G.M. that knew how to trade for players that fit our defensive "puzzle".
    Your memory is ridiculous. Let's agree to leave things in the past. What's done is done. Let's move forward. Everyone seems to feel we still won't be able to afford 2 stars by 2010. Maybe we can find a diamond in the rough i.e... Chandler, Gallo or *gulp Curry can materialize into a star?!? On another note I think LBJ not congratulating and showing up at the press conf. was a b*tch move. Not cool.

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    Originally Posted by Red
    Your memory is ridiculous. Let's agree to leave things in the past. What's done is done. Let's move forward. Everyone seems to feel we still won't be able to afford 2 stars by 2010. Maybe we can find a diamond in the rough i.e... Chandler, Gallo or *gulp Curry can materialize into a star?!? On another note I think LBJ not congratulating and showing up at the press conf. was a b*tch move. Not cool.

    Your right, yesterday is gone and done with lets get up the spilt milk and keep it moving.
    When Donnie Walsh made his first open speech comment as President of the Knicks with a 2010 (solution) plan focusing his listeners optimistic minds by keep repeating the sentence of Lebron James as a Knick.
    I was laughing so hard at the great "con-game" that he was giving in this speech....I had to hand Donnie Walsh his "Player-Player-Card" for Macking such a great speech.

    I am not an accounting.....but what I got out of Walsh first speech was he will reduce a $100M salary cap by 70% to 80% at the beginning of his 3rd offseason to be able to give Lebron James more money than the next team.
    Whatever....the next person got out of it is on them.

    I go to about 10 to 15 games a year b/c I no longer live on the Lower East Side....but this past season I only went to 4 games and next season will be less than that (the prices in MSG has risen for next season).

    I will be buying NBA TV to watch the next teams compete in proffessional B-Ball untill Walsh could establish a starting-5 unit which could play decent B-Ball. And Danilo Galinari is a 6th pick JOKER....that wont be playing in this Knick Summer League Games. His past season speaks alot about our new regime.

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