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Thread: a couple of things about trading up for a "point guard"

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    Veteran ANU's Avatar
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    Default a couple of things about trading up for a "point guard"

    lets be realistic for a moment.rubio and curry are very good young players; but i don't remember a point guard, much less a great one, winning a championship by his lonesome(maybe magic, but all he had to do was win one game in the finals without kareem).only the bulls have actually won championships without a great center, and they had jordan.

    it would be great to get either of these guys, but not if it means gutting the team.if you're going to trade everything for a young player, he better be a pf or a center.so it better be griffin, or hope hill falls to us.

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    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    It's a fair point, but good PG play is critical to winning a championship. Tony Parker, Stockton played on some amazing teams, as did Nash and even when you look at last year's Celtics, while they had the big 3, Rondo had some big time games for them. The Hornets were immediately made better by the presence of CP3.

    The Bucks were a contender a ways back, Big O's play put them over the top.

    Maybe traditionally a PG hasn't "carried" a team to the finals, but I bet on most championship teams you'd find the PG had a critical role...

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    Veteran ANU's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    It's a fair point, but good PG play is critical to winning a championship. Tony Parker, Stockton played on some amazing teams, as did Nash and even when you look at last year's Celtics, while they had the big 3, Rondo had some big time games for them. The Hornets were immediately made better by the presence of CP3.

    The Bucks were a contender a ways back, Big O's play put them over the top.

    Maybe traditionally a PG hasn't "carried" a team to the finals, but I bet on most championship teams you'd find the PG had a critical role...
    agreed.but I'd hate giving up say chandler the 8th pick, lee, and mobley's contract for the second pick. for griffin, i'd do that in a heartbeat though.

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    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by ANU
    agreed.but I'd hate giving up say chandler the 8th pick, lee, and mobley's contract for the second pick. for griffin, i'd do that in a heartbeat though.
    I agree, esp. in a draft deep with guards...and in a draft where the guard I want (Rubio) has his stock falling...

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    Originally Posted by ANU
    agreed.but I'd hate giving up say chandler the 8th pick, lee, and mobley's contract for the second pick. for griffin, i'd do that in a heartbeat though.
    This is ridiculous. Chandler is an easily replaceable asset the NBA is full of wing players and Chandler's ceiling is low, and always been low. Just because a guy is athletic doesn't mean he's the next T'Mac or has an unlimited ceiling. Chandler has a timid demeanor and doesn't go to the free throw line enough...he's a soft SF who isn't physical enough, despite having a strong physique. Please get over Chandler, thanks.

    Plus, **** Wilson Chandler. He doesn't have a position. Gallinari is holding down the SF spot forever. Chandler is too soft to play PF and isn't a good shooter/ball handling to play SG...I say let him go so another team can figure him out. He's not efficient at scoring either...the only reason why he's hype because the Knicks rarely get young players...when a young dude scores, MSG goes crazy. Remember the Lavar Postell days? Chandler isn't that good. He will be a 9 - 13 ppg guy for most of his career...Bobby Simmons status.

    Rubio will be better than Griffin. Griffin is an elite big man, but he can't make his teammates better like Rubio does. That will always be the difference between the two and you can't ever deny that now, today, tommorow, or forever.

    Trading for Rubio would be the smartest thing this franchise does.
    If Evans is available at 8...Knicks don't really need to trade for Rubio...but it would be awesome if we had a 1-2-3 of Rubio/Evans/Gallinari

    wow...

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    I thought Memphis already made it open that they had no interest in Wilson Chandler. Besides what are they going to take at #8 if Jordan Hill is gone? They aren't going to trade down with the Knicks to take another guard. I've been saying this for a while..don't trade for Rubio. Trade for Conley instead.

    If Memphis is as cost conscious as people say they are, they would rather trade Conley then than Rubio right? Rubio, after being drafted is signed cheaply for 4 years. Conley is a restricted FA in 2 years.

    There is little to no chance that the Knicks can trade for Rubio since the only player that would interest them David Lee can not be traded on draft day. We all agreed that if Jordan Hill is gone before the Knicks pick then Memphis will have no interest in the #8 pick. They also have no interest in Chandler. So, I have no idea why this Rubio - Knicks talk still exists.

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    I think Chris Duhon is not that good, but he's good enough: he can pass, move the ball around and hit an open shot.

    I'm not a big believer in point guards being the main players on teams. If you look at teams that have put all their stock into a point guard, in recent times, they've never gone to the next level. CP3 is the current example, Nash has been one, so have countless others.

    Like Anu said, you don't win, in this league, without a very good big man. Kobe proved this more than anyone. His teams were trash, until he got Gasol.

    As for Rubio, everyone knows how I feel: he's overrated.

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    Originally Posted by dave2138
    I thought Memphis already made it open that they had no interest in Wilson Chandler. Besides what are they going to take at #8 if Jordan Hill is gone? They aren't going to trade down with the Knicks to take another guard. I've been saying this for a while..don't trade for Rubio. Trade for Conley instead.

    If Memphis is as cost conscious as people say they are, they would rather trade Conley then than Rubio right? Rubio, after being drafted is signed cheaply for 4 years. Conley is a restricted FA in 2 years.

    There is little to no chance that the Knicks can trade for Rubio since the only player that would interest them David Lee can not be traded on draft day. We all agreed that if Jordan Hill is gone before the Knicks pick then Memphis will have no interest in the #8 pick. They also have no interest in Chandler. So, I have no idea why this Rubio - Knicks talk still exists.
    And i've been saying this for a while as well: Memphis aint trading Conley.

    We can S&T lee after draft day, although i do not know if that is likely at all.

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    There are franchise PGs in this draft, but not really any big men. Thats why we take a guard.

    Draft the Best Player Available. When you draft for a need you get Kwame Brown and the Kandyman.

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    Yeah drafting for a need gets you Sam Bowie. The Knicks do need a big man, but in a draft where there are future all-star PGs and not too many big men who will carry a team, it's not worth it. We have to get the best player we can, and it just so happens that this is a draft with a lot of talented guards (and though big men are important, we need guards too).

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    This is ridiculous. Chandler is an easily replaceable asset the NBA is full of wing players and Chandler's ceiling is low, and always been low. Just because a guy is athletic doesn't mean he's the next T'Mac or has an unlimited ceiling. Chandler has a timid demeanor and doesn't go to the free throw line enough...he's a soft SF who isn't physical enough, despite having a strong physique. Please get over Chandler, thanks.

    Plus, **** Wilson Chandler. He doesn't have a position. Gallinari is holding down the SF spot forever. Chandler is too soft to play PF and isn't a good shooter/ball handling to play SG...I say let him go so another team can figure him out. He's not efficient at scoring either...the only reason why he's hype because the Knicks rarely get young players...when a young dude scores, MSG goes crazy. Remember the Lavar Postell days? Chandler isn't that good. He will be a 9 - 13 ppg guy for most of his career...Bobby Simmons status.

    Rubio will be better than Griffin. Griffin is an elite big man, but he can't make his teammates better like Rubio does. That will always be the difference between the two and you can't ever deny that now, today, tommorow, or forever.

    Trading for Rubio would be the smartest thing this franchise does.
    If Evans is available at 8...Knicks don't really need to trade for Rubio...but it would be awesome if we had a 1-2-3 of Rubio/Evans/Gallinari

    wow...
    For an elite poster you say the most stupid things. "LET ANOTHER TEAM FIGURE HIM OUT"? Chandler has a much higher ceiling than ariza, and look where he is now. As a sophomore chandler went from 7ppg to 14 ppg, averaged 1 block, 1 steal, 5 rebs and 2 assists. His freethrow percentage went up from a low 60 to about 80% in one season. This speaks to his work ethic. You cant say he isnt a good shooter either, because once again, ariza was a horrid shooter in new york. a jump shot can be twerked, adjusted and made better. Lebron is just falling into his jumpshot 5 years after his draft date. Your 2 guard isnt responsible for ball handling, even tho chandler is smart and careful with the rock and has never averaged 2 or more turnovers in his short career. Bobby Simmons is a career 9 ppg...gtfo
    Rubio will be better than griffen? lmao....ok then.....so is ur power forward responsible for making others better? griffen only has to draw doubleteams and he will assist his team.
    i soooo wish rubio wasnt a spaniard....maybe we would get an unbiased opinion from metrosexual

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    Originally Posted by StreetDreams21
    And i've been saying this for a while as well: Memphis aint trading Conley.

    We can S&T lee after draft day, although i do not know if that is likely at all.
    Why wouldn't they trade Conley? Rubio has the higher ceiling and will be signed for 4 years. Conley can be a restricted FA in just 2 more years.

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    Ariza has a higher ceiling than Chandler...Ariza is one of the NBA's elite defenders and top intangibles guys. Look at how he flourished under LA. Ariza plays with heart and a passion to win. Chandler a lion with no heart.

    Chandler stats don't really tell me anything except that we're a bad team. Chandler is as average as it gets. He was given an opportunity to average 17-18 ppg in this system, but his timid style of people and efficient production kept him as a 13-14 ppg scorer...thats who he will be forever, gurantee. Dude, you were wrong about everything on this site, you were one of the elite Isiahsexuals, I turned out to be right about the Knicks, and you turned out to be completely wrong. You should have a little trust in my word by now. I already explained Chandler isn't needed on this roster, we have Gallo, the superior player.

    Knicks were 14-14 (.500) in the 28 games Gallo played.
    The Knicks won only 16 out of 54 games (.296).

    Gallo makes the Knicks play harder...makes the game easier for eveyone, offense looks more smooth and intensity on defense increases.

    Chandler doesn't have that passion on the court. Sure he can dunk and glide, but he's just an individual player...playing for individual stats.

    Haven't you learned from Isiah indivudual players, unless its Kobe, Lebron etc that class group, don't lead to winning results?

    Curry
    Crawford
    Francis
    Tim Thomas
    Mo Taylor

    etc etc etc.

    Chandler doesn't have Gallinari's intangibles and we would be wasting time with Chandler off the bench because he doesn't play at 100% intensity...he could never be a spark plug like Nate...you always see Wilson half assing it most of the time. Dude is lame, and is an Isiah product. A real Knick fan want nothing to do with anything related to Isiah. You've proven on this site many times you don't fit the category of a true Knick fan. Still true to Isiah.

    Elite PF's can make other players better.
    Gasol
    Duncan
    Garnett
    Malone
    Barkley
    etc

    Griffin will be in the Boozer group...those PF's that score/rebound...and it ends there. He will never be a shot blocker or defender based on what we saw in college.

    Stop predicting things you don't know...If JRue Holiday/DeRozan display they don't have good handles...its illogical to say they will develop them in the NBA when you have no clue on their work ethic or other aspects that will get them there...you're just going purely based on a hope and prediction...just like you did with Isiah, and look how foolish you turned out to be.

    Negro, I'm not from Spain.
    I just happen to like elite skilled and ready for the NBA talent.
    Rubio is one of them.
    If Ty Lawson Dominican/Puerto Rican from the Bronx?
    No.
    But I still favor him because I see him doing big things in the NBA. Not average things like Chandler.



    Throw Chandler away, because his value won't ever get higher.
    I said this about Curry, and people got mad at me.
    Look at us now.

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    The thing about Chandler though is that he is cheap for another 2 seasons. Everything is focused around 2010, and you have a player good enough to be a starter/6th man making only 2 mil/year.

    He'll never be an elite player, but you can't say hes reached his peak at 22..If anything you have a decent offensive player and a great defender with the ability to play 3 positions.

    Not something the knicks should just throw away especially when his trade value isn't that high. He's worth more to the Knicks now than he is in a trade.

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    Get rid edy curry throw him to lion in bronx zoo

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