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Thread: We're Better Without N8!

  1. #1
    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Default We're Better Without N8!

    I can't hate on N8 but... as a team we are better without him. I've said it for a while now- it's hard to explain but although he brings energy and scoring off the bench, we achieve more without him. Add Lee to that assesment also. I'm not going to [continually] bash them for what they don't do b/c obviously they're talented but both are equally limited. My point is "I believe a team becomes dependent on certain players- and if those players are core players with difficiencies then the team becomes married to those difficiencies and never gets a chance to see the light". In N8's/Lee's case we keep trying to "work around" their short comings hoping: N8 would mature, or lead, or pass effectively etc... -or- Lee would grow a pair, or learn to jump or add a solid jumper and all the while we ACTUALLY become dependent on the small list of things they do well like: rebounding and scoring. In short I hope we realize this sooner than later. Good players don't nec.' make good team-mates. I won't blame N8 & Lee for ANYTHING but... They had more than enough chances to prove (which they did) that they're limited period. I didn't agree w/ resigning them b/c it was pointless for many reasons (except trading them). Can anyone tell me why a team can get better by eliminating some of their "good" players?

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    Veteran p0nder's Avatar
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    I guess you answered your own question. "Good" is a relative term. These players are "good" compared to the rest of the knicks roster, but not necessarily the rest of the league. I've cooled on nate and lee because of lack of development in their games. While I think Harrington has developed into something very worthwhile for any team.

    Unfortunately i believe that N8 is just here to sell jerseys and tickets and pump up the crowd. He's not really an option to lead the offense and thus limited as a pg, he's not tall enough to guard SG's and so where does that leave him? Exactly where he is; Burried on our bench BEHIND duhon. I am still happy that we signed N8. He does still bring the energy to the game and has his moments. Plus he's the reigning dunk champion. Maybe poking at lebron's competitive edge will draw him to NY where we would LOVE to have him come and dethrone nate as the dunk champ.

    Lee is actually a really good second option for a lot of teams at the 4 and in a pinch, or when teams want to go small, at the 5. I could see as we draw closer to the trade deadline playoff bound teams looking to beef up their bench with a player like Lee. That offers us a good chance to package him with JJ or Curry and make more room for 2 max FA's in the off season.

    While overall I enjoy watching these players play, I do not think that they fit into the 2010 plan very well and I do not expect to see them back here next season (without taking MAJOR pay cuts). Its not that I don't like these guys, but I think I'll be happier when they move on to other teams and we make more headway into the 2010 market. They are "Good" in relative terms in certain roles and may flourish with another team. they are not helping the Knicks all that much right now however.

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    Veteran nyk_nyk's Avatar
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    I wouldn't say we're better without Nate. Dantoni has the team passing and driving to the basket more (things that were suggested numerous times on this site) since benching him, so it looks as though playing without him makes the team better. Most teams have a guy they bring off the bench for instant offense. You may be thinking that's Al's role but Harrington is not a bench player and the amount of minutes he plays proves it.

    Basically what I'm trying to say is, the team has been playing good lately but that's only because Dantoni smartened up and realized his initial strategy for this team didn't fit. Are we better without Darko and Hill too?

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    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    ^ Not sure what u mean: Are we better w/o Darko & Hill too? I guess u mean we've been o.k. w/o them so that means we are better? But with Darko & Hill it remains to be seen since unlike N8, they haven't logged major minutes yet to tell. With N8 & Lee it's "addition by subtraction" trust me. It's like they say: it's better to either be a top teir team or at the bottom; mediocre teams suffer the most. Well N8 & Lee are mediocre... thus we should just call a spade a spade and move on. They will never be what we need. And too much "perfect situational" hopefulness should be the indication- cut your loses!

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    Veteran Paul1355's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Red
    I can't hate on N8 but... as a team we are better without him. I've said it for a while now- it's hard to explain but although he brings energy and scoring off the bench, we achieve more without him. Add Lee to that assesment also. I'm not going to [continually] bash them for what they don't do b/c obviously they're talented but both are equally limited. My point is "I believe a team becomes dependent on certain players- and if those players are core players with difficiencies then the team becomes married to those difficiencies and never gets a chance to see the light". In N8's/Lee's case we keep trying to "work around" their short comings hoping: N8 would mature, or lead, or pass effectively etc... -or- Lee would grow a pair, or learn to jump or add a solid jumper and all the while we ACTUALLY become dependent on the small list of things they do well like: rebounding and scoring. In short I hope we realize this sooner than later. Good players don't nec.' make good team-mates. I won't blame N8 & Lee for ANYTHING but... They had more than enough chances to prove (which they did) that they're limited period. I didn't agree w/ resigning them b/c it was pointless for many reasons (except trading them). Can anyone tell me why a team can get better by eliminating some of their "good" players?
    Without Lee and Nate, it might not be a difference seeing that Douglas and Hill can be just as good with some more playing time.

    They were resigned because no one really wanted them and they had good seasons last year. I do feel that they can be traded at the trade deadline because it does not seem like we are going to be above .500 anytime this season.

    I dont see them coming back next year.

    I honestly don't think that anyone with a one year deal except Harrington and Hughes actually have a shot of being resigned.

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    Member BlackH20's Avatar
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    Default Give me Nate, Douglas, over Duhon 37 min 7 pts?

    Originally Posted by Red
    I can't hate on N8 but... as a team we are better without him. I've said it for a while now- it's hard to explain but although he brings energy and scoring off the bench, we achieve more without him. Add Lee to that assesment also. I'm not going to [continually] bash them for what they don't do b/c obviously they're talented but both are equally limited. My point is "I believe a team becomes dependent on certain players- and if those players are core players with difficiencies then the team becomes married to those difficiencies and never gets a chance to see the light". In N8's/Lee's case we keep trying to "work around" their short comings hoping: N8 would mature, or lead, or pass effectively etc... -or- Lee would grow a pair, or learn to jump or add a solid jumper and all the while we ACTUALLY become dependent on the small list of things they do well like: rebounding and scoring. In short I hope we realize this sooner than later. Good players don't nec.' make good team-mates. I won't blame N8 & Lee for ANYTHING but... They had more than enough chances to prove (which they did) that they're limited period. I didn't agree w/ resigning them b/c it was pointless for many reasons (except trading them). Can anyone tell me why a team can get better by eliminating some of their "good" players?
    Take him over Duhon any day, take Douglas over Duhon. Run one stat or combo stat where Duhon beats any guard in the NBA and I will be shocked, except in minutes ppg.

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    Veteran DontForgetDerekHarper's Avatar
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    better with out nate.

    yes we are

    better if we trade nate for a bigger backcourt player

    yes we are

    4-1 without nate

    yes we are

    all I can say well

    yes we are

    haha

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    TYPE-A Red's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DontForgetDerekHarper
    better with out nate.

    yes we are

    better if we trade nate for a bigger backcourt player

    yes we are

    4-1 without nate

    yes we are

    all I can say well

    yes we are

    haha
    Yup... "Addition by Subtraction"m we know trades will be made. Trying to figure out D'Ant & Walsh is a whole nother' ballgame. I'd say: 1) Acquire a quality Big- everyone is expendable 2) Get a First rounder * Why is it taking so long for D'Ant to realize who to put into the rotation is a bit puzzling?!?

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    Veteran GetRealistic's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by BlackH20
    Take him over Duhon any day, take Douglas over Duhon. Run one stat or combo stat where Duhon beats any guard in the NBA and I will be shocked, except in minutes ppg.
    I'm pretty sure BlackH20 is Nate Robinson. Hes posted on 3 threads that Robinson should be playing instead of Duhon. We get it dude your another uninformed fan who is fooled by Robinsons inflated stats and highlight reel.

    Duhon does suck but Robinson not only is an average player but he hurts the team in other ways. Incase you haven't been paying attention our best stretch of the season 4-1 against for the most part good teams has come with Nate sitting on the bench.


    My favorite backcourt at this moment is Hughes running the point with Douglas at the two. They both can handle the ball and the perimeter defense those two bring is top notch.

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    Veteran LJ4ptplay's Avatar
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    Interesting...

    The Knicks are 7-6 when Nate Robinson plays less than 15 minutes. That includes the games in which he's been injured and/or received DNP-CDs (such as the last four contests). When Robinson plays more than 15 minutes the team is 0-15.

    [Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

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    Veteran DontForgetDerekHarper's Avatar
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    the announcers continue to talk about how well nate is handling all of this and how he is saying all of the right things; personally I believe that right there is the issue, he should be demanding a trade right now, or kicking up a stink to get out of NY some how. I say this not because I believe that negative type of response is okay, but I believe that nate isnt complaining because he actually loves all of this. It is more attention to fill his ego, the crowd chanting his name, he is painting himself as a martyr right now where he does not get it. he should be doing one of two things

    openly admitting during interviews that he is pissed about the situation
    or openly admitting during interviews that he is sorry for playing selfishly and he completely gets why he is getting no burn.

    Instead he is like I dont know why im not playing, but coach knows what he is doing, that is like sarcasm at its best, and typical NATE napoleonic complex robinsons ego is constructed.

    ship him out

    he never was a team player.

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    Veteran LJ4ptplay's Avatar
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    Amazingly, Nate is being more mature than Mebury was.

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    Veteran nyk_nyk's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DontForgetDerekHarper
    the announcers continue to talk about how well nate is handling all of this and how he is saying all of the right things; personally I believe that right there is the issue, he should be demanding a trade right now, or kicking up a stink to get out of NY some how. I say this not because I believe that negative type of response is okay, but I believe that nate isnt complaining because he actually loves all of this. It is more attention to fill his ego, the crowd chanting his name, he is painting himself as a martyr right now where he does not get it. he should be doing one of two things

    openly admitting during interviews that he is pissed about the situation
    or openly admitting during interviews that he is sorry for playing selfishly and he completely gets why he is getting no burn.

    Instead he is like I dont know why im not playing, but coach knows what he is doing, that is like sarcasm at its best, and typical NATE napoleonic complex robinsons ego is constructed.

    ship him out

    he never was a team player.
    I disagree. I can tell that Nate is very unhappy about the situation but he has to say the right things and be supportive of the team because he is working on a 1yr deal. Any good agent will tell his client to just keep cool and say the right things. In Nate's case, he knows teams dont like distractions (Marbury/AI) so why would he act up knowing he doesn't have a guaranteed contract after this season?

    He doesn't have to apologize for anything to the general public. What he's beeen saying so far is just fine. It doesn't make the team or the coaching staff look bad so he's doing the right things.

    The things your suggesting would cause the media to have a field day with him. Right now he's not a huge topic of discussion for the media and that's how it should be until he gets back on the court.

  14. #14
    The One and Only KING~POETIQ's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by DontForgetDerekHarper
    the announcers continue to talk about how well nate is handling all of this and how he is saying all of the right things; personally I believe that right there is the issue, he should be demanding a trade right now, or kicking up a stink to get out of NY some how. I say this not because I believe that negative type of response is okay, but I believe that nate isnt complaining because he actually loves all of this. It is more attention to fill his ego, the crowd chanting his name, he is painting himself as a martyr right now where he does not get it. he should be doing one of two things

    openly admitting during interviews that he is pissed about the situation
    or openly admitting during interviews that he is sorry for playing selfishly and he completely gets why he is getting no burn.

    Instead he is like I dont know why im not playing, but coach knows what he is doing, that is like sarcasm at its best, and typical NATE napoleonic complex robinsons ego is constructed.

    ship him out

    he never was a team player.
    Lmao. WOW. You are reaching way too much on this one. Try again.

  15. #15
    The One and Only KING~POETIQ's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nyk_nyk
    I disagree. I can tell that Nate is very unhappy about the situation but he has to say the right things and be supportive of the team because he is working on a 1yr deal. Any good agent will tell his client to just keep cool and say the right things. In Nate's case, he knows teams dont like distractions (Marbury/AI) so why would he act up knowing he doesn't have a guaranteed contract after this season?

    He doesn't have to apologize for anything to the general public. What he's beeen saying so far is just fine. It doesn't make the team or the coaching staff look bad so he's doing the right things.

    The things your suggesting would cause the media to have a field day with him. Right now he's not a huge topic of discussion for the media and that's how it should be until he gets back on the court.
    Good post.


    Why the hell would nate want to cause problems that will hinder his career beyond this year. Nate is doing the smart thing.

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