Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 32

Thread: A couple of Knicks talking points on BS Report

  1. #1
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    2,668
    Rep Power
    13

    Default A couple of Knicks talking points on BS Report

    Was listening to BS Report with ESPN writer Bill Simmons and NBA Analyst Marc Stein and they brought up a couple of things about the Knicks that I sort of wanted to share:

    1) "I don't know how you can blame D'Antoni for not winning on a team that wasn't trying to win." - Marc Stein, in response to Simmons saying the NY media wants to run D'Antoni out of town.

    There's been a lot of debate on this board about this, and I wanted to share just one person's, who is closer to the NBA than a lot of us, take on it.

    2) Rumor: Phil Jackson to NY.

    This sort of brought up the "Why fire D'Antoni" thing. Stein said that D'Antoni's whole reason for being here was to attract guys here. But Simmons claims he heard floating rumors that Phil Jackson would consider NY, and NY obviously would consider Phil Jackson. Now, I've said it's pointless to fire D'Antoni, but I think we can all agree if Jackson was a possibility we would waive bye to D'Antoni in less than 1 second. Stein thinks you have to let D'Antoni do what he was brought here to do, attract players. If the Knicks strike out, then make a move.

    3) Toronto will NOT do a sign-and-trade involving David Lee and Chris Bosh.

    Good points made here, Toronto would lose Bosh and make their front-court two guys that should be playing PF and two guys that are not big time defensive bruisers (or offensive bruisers, for that matter) in Andrea and David. I think I've seen this opportunity floated around here, but I don't think it makes much sense for Toronto.

    4) Walsh and D'Antoni are not getting along. Simmons claimed each has used media people to sort of bash the other one. I'm not sure exactly what he is talking about, but the rumor is that the NY media wanting to run D'Antoni out of town is based at least partially in stories floated by Walsh. I haven't seen much evidence of this, and some on this board like abcd have not erroneously suggested that the two are attached at the hip at least, and Walsh is D'Antoni's slave at the worst.

    5) Eddy Curry to LAC for Baron Davis.

    Simmons would not say where he heard it, or even if he heard it, but he make a couple of points about this trade. Donald Sterling is cheap as hell. This saves the LAC $3 million next year (even in the NBA, that's not small shakes) and gets rid of a disgruntled Baron Davis and his contract that runs PAST next year. The Knicks get a PG who thrives in front of big crowds, and will be more than happy to switch coasts to run in D'Antoni's system (I would think). I'm sure support will come in droves on this board for the moving of Eddy Curry for anything, but this solves our PG problem in a quick way, and gives us a guy to possibly attract a good free agent. I'm not sure how Baron is regarded in NBA circles amongst the players, but the chance to play with a pretty good PG is better than what we have now.

  2. #2
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    2,795
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    If LAC wants to save money, would they accept a Kaman's expiring for Curry trade?

  3. #3
    Newbie CoolGuyC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    38
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Would it be possible to get both Baron Davis and Chris Kaman?

  4. #4
    Veteran nyk_nyk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    3,529
    Rep Power
    15

    Default

    Yeah you CAN put some of the blame on a coach for a team that wasn't trying to win. If you can't motivate your team to play harder then you need to be replaced by someone who can. I know talent was somewhat limited but they didn't play hard every night and that's a fact.

    A coach is one of the last reasons why guys sign to a team. This isn't college basketball (where that decision could help you reach the NBA). If the money is good and the city is appealing to them or their family then its most likely a good fit for a player. A team that's already competitive also holds weight since most star players feel like they will be that missing piece. Most players feel they can play at a high level no matter who is coaching the team IMO so it just doesn't seem logical to pick a rebuilding team because of a coach when you can be a part of a team on the rise.

    I haven't heard anything about Walsh and D butting heads. That could just be media driven... Or it could be true. We'll see.

    EC for Baron would work for me. I know Baron is still owed a bunch of money but he would immediately become the best PG we've had in years. I'm sure he's still capable of 17 and 8.

  5. #5
    Hannibal Lecter TR1LL10N's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Dark side of the Moon
    Posts
    2,743
    Rep Power
    12

    Default

    Originally Posted by nyk_nyk
    Yeah you CAN put some of the blame on a coach for a team that wasn't trying to win. If you can't motivate your team to play harder then you need to be replaced by someone who can. I know talent was somewhat limited but they didn't play hard every night and that's a fact.

    A coach is one of the last reasons why guys sign to a team. This isn't college basketball (where that decision could help you reach the NBA). If the money is good and the city is appealing to them or their family then its most likely a good fit for a player. A team that's already competitive also holds weight since most star players feel like they will be that missing piece. Most players feel they can play at a high level no matter who is coaching the team IMO so it just doesn't seem logical to pick a rebuilding team because of a coach when you can be a part of a team on the rise.

    I haven't heard anything about Walsh and D butting heads. That could just be media driven... Or it could be true. We'll see.

    EC for Baron would work for me. I know Baron is still owed a bunch of money but he would immediately become the best PG we've had in years. I'm sure he's still capable of 17 and 8.

    No, a coach can only do so much. Curry has gone through many coaches and none of them were able to jolt him out of his sluggish soft ways. Further you had a bunch of mismatched players with ZERO stake in the Knicks future. They cared about one thing...their next contract and it lead to individuals hoisting up shots instead of a cohesive team. Having selfish veterans who could care less about our franchise outweighs anything a coach could do.

    Contrast that to the team D'ant coach in Phoenix and you saw a well oiled finely tuned machine firing on all cylinders. They all gave max effort so it's clear the blame can't be laid on D'ant for a lack of effort with this group of losers. The culture here was and is horrible and will only change when a dominant alpha male player joins our team and inspires through example like an MJ or Lebron can do. 90% of our team mailed this season in before it started...hence our terrible start.

  6. #6
    Superstar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    683
    Rep Power
    11

    Default Baron Davis for Curry

    Baron Davis's contract runs for thre more years at $10.050M in 2010-11, $13.950M for 2011-12, and $14.850M for 2012-13. Curry's expiring contract for next year is $11.276. Davis turned 31 years old on April 13, 2010.

    Sterling will save an awful lot of money in a straight up trade. Davis is disinterested with the Clippers, but with Griffin and a lottery pick this year, they will have a pretty good team going forward.

    For the big $$ savings, we should get more than Davis straight up for Curry. Perhaps a draft pick in 2011 or 2012. Perhaps DeAndre Jordan.

    Jordan has a quality that that some of the best big men have had , Shaq, Howard, Ben Wallace, -- they all miss free throws. Jordan shoots them at about 38%.

    If Curry for Davis were to happen, it would surely mean that we did not get LeBron. We are going to have to wait until a few things shake out after July 1, 2010.


  7. #7
    Hannibal Lecter TR1LL10N's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Dark side of the Moon
    Posts
    2,743
    Rep Power
    12

    Default

    BTW, I really do not want Baron Davis on the Knicks. His contract and knees blow. He is old and would be a great piece only if we intend on competing in the next 1-2 years. Bring him here is the last move to solidfy our team..not the centerpiece.

  8. #8
    Member ibraheim718's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    111
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    Was listening to BS Report with ESPN writer Bill Simmons and NBA Analyst Marc Stein and they brought up a couple of things about the Knicks that I sort of wanted to share:

    1) "I don't know how you can blame D'Antoni for not winning on a team that wasn't trying to win." - Marc Stein, in response to Simmons saying the NY media wants to run D'Antoni out of town.

    There's been a lot of debate on this board about this, and I wanted to share just one person's, who is closer to the NBA than a lot of us, take on it.

    2) Rumor: Phil Jackson to NY.

    This sort of brought up the "Why fire D'Antoni" thing. Stein said that D'Antoni's whole reason for being here was to attract guys here. But Simmons claims he heard floating rumors that Phil Jackson would consider NY, and NY obviously would consider Phil Jackson. Now, I've said it's pointless to fire D'Antoni, but I think we can all agree if Jackson was a possibility we would waive bye to D'Antoni in less than 1 second. Stein thinks you have to let D'Antoni do what he was brought here to do, attract players. If the Knicks strike out, then make a move.

    3) Toronto will NOT do a sign-and-trade involving David Lee and Chris Bosh.

    Good points made here, Toronto would lose Bosh and make their front-court two guys that should be playing PF and two guys that are not big time defensive bruisers (or offensive bruisers, for that matter) in Andrea and David. I think I've seen this opportunity floated around here, but I don't think it makes much sense for Toronto.

    4) Walsh and D'Antoni are not getting along. Simmons claimed each has used media people to sort of bash the other one. I'm not sure exactly what he is talking about, but the rumor is that the NY media wanting to run D'Antoni out of town is based at least partially in stories floated by Walsh. I haven't seen much evidence of this, and some on this board like abcd have not erroneously suggested that the two are attached at the hip at least, and Walsh is D'Antoni's slave at the worst.

    5) Eddy Curry to LAC for Baron Davis.

    Simmons would not say where he heard it, or even if he heard it, but he make a couple of points about this trade. Donald Sterling is cheap as hell. This saves the LAC $3 million next year (even in the NBA, that's not small shakes) and gets rid of a disgruntled Baron Davis and his contract that runs PAST next year. The Knicks get a PG who thrives in front of big crowds, and will be more than happy to switch coasts to run in D'Antoni's system (I would think). I'm sure support will come in droves on this board for the moving of Eddy Curry for anything, but this solves our PG problem in a quick way, and gives us a guy to possibly attract a good free agent. I'm not sure how Baron is regarded in NBA circles amongst the players, but the chance to play with a pretty good PG is better than what we have now.
    Just a couple of comments on the items in bold:

    Phil Jackson to Ny to me seems highly improbable. First Jackson has health issues and is on the tail end of his coaching career. Of course if we were to land 2 max F/A Phil would probably be inclined to coaching a couple of more years with another stacked team. IMO as a MIke D supporter would find that scenario unfair to Mike. You convince him to come here instead of chicago and because things went just like how many thought it would go badly you can him before he gets the chance to coach a team he was hired to coach. It would seriously be a slap in the face and Walsh would not come out looking good.

    Now about Toronto. They really are not in a position of power. First if they were to agree to any sign and trade Bosh would have to agree to the trade. And if he doesn't he is just going to walk and leave Toronto empty handed. So all it would take is for Bosh to say look I will only accept a trade to NY and if not I will just opt for free agency and there is nothing Toronto can do about the matter.

    And about the proposed Curry trade. Baron Davis would not be the Ideal player I would trade for Curry. But if that is the best you can get before the season are we really going to get better at the trade deadline? Or is it just going to be this same trade scenario revived? But if Walsh believes he can do better that's just a chance I guess he would have to take. Hmmmm.... To me it depends on how long his contract is and if we can perhaps get a younger player or a draft pick.

  9. #9
    Member ibraheim718's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    111
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Originally Posted by nyk_nyk
    Yeah you CAN put some of the blame on a coach for a team that wasn't trying to win. If you can't motivate your team to play harder then you need to be replaced by someone who can. I know talent was somewhat limited but they didn't play hard every night and that's a fact.

    A coach is one of the last reasons why guys sign to a team. This isn't college basketball (where that decision could help you reach the NBA). If the money is good and the city is appealing to them or their family then its most likely a good fit for a player. A team that's already competitive also holds weight since most star players feel like they will be that missing piece. Most players feel they can play at a high level no matter who is coaching the team IMO so it just doesn't seem logical to pick a rebuilding team because of a coach when you can be a part of a team on the rise.

    I haven't heard anything about Walsh and D butting heads. That could just be media driven... Or it could be true. We'll see.

    EC for Baron would work for me. I know Baron is still owed a bunch of money but he would immediately become the best PG we've had in years. I'm sure he's still capable of 17 and 8.
    If I'm not mistaken wasn't Phil Jackson coming back to LA part of the reason Kobe resigned?

  10. #10
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    2,845
    Rep Power
    12

    Default

    Baron & Kaman? I'll personally fly to Donnie Walsh and be his personal cigar-lighting bitch.

    Curry + Walker + 2011 1st

    they allow Deandre to take over the reigns at C. Speaking of...I'd almost prefer Deandre > Kaman, specially if we can keep Chandler or walker.

    Unless we get CP3 there isn't a Pg on horizon that makes more sense for us. We still have te young and dynamic Serg in wings too.
    That said:

    pg Baron The Great
    sg JoeJohnson
    sf Gallo
    pf Lebron
    c Kaman
    6th Douglas
    Fantasy, but can you
    imagine...if walsh can get kaman and baron...

    If Joe Johnson doesn't like the smell of championships we go for the 1st choice play anyways for the bigman @ SG hybrid:

    pg Baron
    sg Bron
    sf Gallo
    pf Lee
    c Kaman
    bench: Douglas, Chandler, Serg(unreal bench!!!)

    There isn't a conceivable team in the leauge that would make
    more sense for Lebron.

    Baron Davis and Kaman change everything. Alters our entire selling pt.

    Curry + Walker + Future 1st. Honestly, we néed to seriously
    begin devaluing our perception of what draft picks mean to us at this point.
    Last edited by iSaYughh; Apr 29, 2010 at 18:58.

  11. #11
    Veteran Paul1355's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
    5,497
    Rep Power
    14

    Default

    Let's stop dreaming...Phil jackson to NY??? He is going to leave Kobe and the best team in the NBA for the Knicks and their problems??? Come on

    Walsh and D'Antoni might not be kissing butt after these two seasons, and Mike D knows he is fired if they have another losing season(finally) but they are not talking trash about eachother.

    Each one knows who is going if the team does bad...the coach.

    Bosh for Lee...It's poitnless to me because Lee cheaper is beter than Bosh for more money.

  12. #12
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    2,845
    Rep Power
    12

    Default

    N.b. We can get Barron for 2-3yrs and still make serious play for rubio...Chandler + Serg + 2012 1st

    Eggs? Meet Basket.

  13. #13
    Veteran Starks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Bronx
    Posts
    1,472
    Rep Power
    12

    Default

    No way Phil comes here. He doesn't want his reputation to be tarnished. He's only going to use us for money when it comes down to him leveraging a deal with the Lakers. He's an LA guy and won't even go back to the Bulls.

    And I will say this. PHIL JACKSON is the most overrated coach in the NBA. He wouldn't have done any better than Mike D this season and we all know its true. Maybe +3 to 5 games at most.

  14. #14
    Veteran Paul1355's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
    5,497
    Rep Power
    14

    Default

    Originally Posted by Starks
    No way Phil comes here. He doesn't want his reputation to be tarnished. He's only going to use us for money when it comes down to him leveraging a deal with the Lakers. He's an LA guy and won't even go back to the Bulls.

    And I will say this. PHIL JACKSON is the most overrated coach in the NBA. He wouldn't have done any better than Mike D this season and we all know its true. Maybe +3 to 5 games at most.
    If we pay Mike D 6 million just imagine what Jackson would ask for....atelast 12 mil a year...please I'd rater have Patrick Ewing in here for cheap.

  15. #15
    Veteran
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    2,795
    Rep Power
    10

    Default

    We're not getting Davis AND Kaman...

    I'd rather get Kaman than Davis though. Kaman is young and he could be a pretty good player for at least the next 5-6 years. Davis on the other hand is already on the wrong side of 30.

Similar Threads

  1. Knicks @ Celtics 23/02/10
    By smokes in forum NY Knicks
    Replies: 45
    Last Post: Feb 24, 2010, 10:39
  2. Bucks @ Knicks 22/02/10
    By smokes in forum NY Knicks
    Replies: 121
    Last Post: Feb 23, 2010, 18:39
  3. Cavs @ Knicks 11/25 7:30 PM ET
    By jpz17 in forum NY Knicks
    Replies: 65
    Last Post: Nov 26, 2008, 21:10
  4. Game 2: Knicks @ 76ers 10/31
    By MSGKnickz33 in forum NY Knicks
    Replies: 118
    Last Post: Nov 01, 2008, 18:36
  5. Lampe signs with NY Knicks
    By KnickFan2080 in forum NY Knicks
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: Jan 28, 2008, 00:17

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •