Carmelo Anthony is not an elite player

Oldtimer

Rotation player
Meolo for Gallinari???

Gallinari is not half the player Melo can be -- at least on offense. Probably no one here would endorse a straight up trade even if possible under Denver's current cap position. But putting aside cost, cap positions and the possibility of a subsequent flip of Melo by Denver, I would be willing to bet that Denver would not take the trade.

There is no doubting Melo's capacity, but the article in the opening post of this tread was both dead on and prescient. Melo, though extraordinarily talented, is too much a prima donna on offense who demands the full stage. On defense he is too often no better than an observer in the audience. He simply does not improve a team that has other decent working parts.

Call me a hater or whatever you wish, but I fantasize a trade of Melo to one of the LA teams. I say LA because I do not think Melo would mind that and Dolan would never want to see him in Brooklyn. At the same time any trade is likely a fantasy. The Clippers have CP3, but Sterling still owns the team and would not enjoy paying Melo his contract price. The Lakers -- well could Kobe and Melo possibly thrive together? Moreover, I doubt Dolan has the guts to do it

I am not too happy with Amare' either. His defense has not improved at all. NBA League Pass had the Spurs' feed. Sean Elliott commented negatively on Amare's defense in last night's game several times. At one point he said that on defense Amare' might as well be a mannequin. How can a player who is so athletic be so abysmal on defense?
 

NY17KNICKS

★Melo Mafia★
Carmelo isnt used to this system yet.

- Carmelo Anthony?s postgame behavior was as puzzling as his recent oncourt play.

The Knicks forward scored 6 points in a 2-of-12 disaster and sat and watched the second unit nearly steal a win over the defending champion Mavericks. As a capper, Anthony bolted the locker room early, heading for the bus, saying to a reporter, ?Not tonight.?

Fifteen minutes later, Anthony returned to the locker-room area to speak to a small group of writers and admitted adjusting to the new alignment has him confused on the court.

The Knicks fell to the Mavericks, 95-85, last night to go 2-4 since Anthony returned to a new structure created by Jeremy Lin, whose emergence stoked a 7-0 spurt with Anthony missing most of those games with a groin injury.

?I think any time you go from the early part of the season and having the ball and distributing and now waiting for it to come to me, it?s quite an adjustment for myself,?? said Anthony, a minus-18 and 0-for-3 from 3-point range.




http://m.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/anthony_points_admits_he_lost_hgsDHf0yGr8atovZ0PQoQK

Carmelo just isn't used to this system yet. You probably don't wanna hear this but when we have a REAL offseason it will give him a chance to get acustom. If not then obviously we, ust trade him.
 
Why trade him B4 getting rid of the coach? we flipped this team too many times for his cluless ass...

Get us a coach that will slow the game down so our players can actually see and think about whats actually happening on the floor, a coach that will teach and show how defense is more important than offense, A coach that will design some actual plays for his players.

The coach is always responsible for the results of his team. D'Ant has no control, no heart/fire, no game plan, no respect from his players. Can his ass and we all will see how good this team really is.

I dispise coaches that need players to make them look good. I mean, wtf is he there for?
 

nyk_nyk

All Star
The coach was hired to bring his then highly valued system here.

Fire the people who hired the coach and/or the people who traded for a max. player who doesn't fit into the system of a coach who was specifically hired to bring his system to New York.

I hate to dwell on it guys, I really do but as long as Dolan and several short term GMs are planning our present AND future we're forever stuck in a dead end.

Melo, Amare etc. they're all good players, but they only work well in specific constellations:

- Amar'e needs a great pick and roll PG with experience, he needs to play center to outmaneuver people and he needs SSOL to be a beast on offense.

- Melo needs the ball about 90% of the time, a lot of iso plays and a lot of dirty work guys who play defense for him, make all the hustle plays and sacrifice themselves for him, so he can be that deadly scorer that he once was and probably still is in the right system for him.

Melo's system
bd0d5f08997b7a4ad8598963f7e50231.png
Amare's system.

That's why they both look worse together than they look apart. Both good players on their own, just not made to play together.

Might be different if we had drafted them both and developed to play side by side....who knows, we never really had our draft picks around 2002-2004.

And D'Antoni: Good coach, but he needs a franchise PG like Nash, Williams, Paul, maybe Kidd AND a lot of great shooters. He never had that in New York, add the fact that Melo doesn't fit into his system and he looks pretty bad coaching wise.

Our front office has to be the worst in the NBA over the last 12 years or so, I mean all those stupid trades under Scott Layden like Camby and Nene for an injury prone Dice (who played 5 games or so in 2 years for us).

Spree for Keith Van Horn :countdown: etc.

Then Isiah took over and pissed away our next 5-6 years, all well documented.

Finally we hired a good GM in Donnie Walsh, but they didn't give him any time (2 years are a damn joke to rebuild a franchise). He did a pretty good job, but wasn't allowed to finish his project and the work he did in 2 years was thrown out of the window in one night.

And this is where we are now. Grunwald has done a decent job this season, kudos to him, but all he can do is try to make minor tweaks and fix some things here and there. He can't correct our 'trinity of death' Melo-Amar'e-D'Antoni. Those 3 aren't made for each other.

One has to go, that much is obvious, if it's D'ANtoni we as fans should ask the question why he was hired in the first place. I mean I never was a fan of his philosophy in Phoenix and I still don't think it'S right for the Eastern Conference and New York in particular now, but why on earth did we hire him in the first place?

Everybody knew what D'ANtoni was all about!? Why did we hire him and then didn't give him the right players for his system?
Imo we can't blame D'Antoni, you can't buy a Playstation and then expect to play XBox games on it, but that's pretty much what we the fanbase and our beloved owner do and did over the last couple of seasons.

If we wanted players like Melo etc. why did we sign D'Antoni?
And why did we sign him anyway to a team that plays in a city where defense and hustle are valued most and more than 120 points a night.

I actually have to give him (D'Antoni) some credit, he tried to adjust his system and abandoned SSOL after the Melo trade, unfortunately he'S a one trick pony and the only trick he knows well is SSOL and how to win with it, BUT that was known in 2008 for christ's sake?!

So again: Why did we sign him? And why didn't we trade for Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Chris Paul etc. and sign Joe Johnson, Shawn Marion or keep Gallo like he wanted?

It's stupid to sign a coach and then not provide him with his kind of players.

On the other hand: If he was only signed as a fill-in to play some entertaining ball in 2008 and 2009 until Lebron etc. arrive, why on earth did we keep him beyond 2010?

Atrocious job by the Knicks, the whole rebuilding plan is just a bad joke, we don't have a philosophy at all.

Donnie had one, I'm sure but he was sent away before he could finish the job.

It's unfair to blame one guy, it's not D'Antoni's fault or Melo's fault or Amare's fault.

They're all good assets in the right constellations, but throwing them all together to hope it's gonna work is amateurish behavior, as if some of us on here did it and not renowned managers and businessmen.
You'd expect better from a professional sports franchise.

James Dolan is the type of guy who buys a good car let's say a Jaguar, but he's not satisfied with it, because he wants a Maybach or RR Phantom, so he trades his Jaguar, but all he ends up with in the end is a Honda Civic with custom paint and $20k rims.

Looking good on the outside, but just a Civic on the inside, with rims who don't help the cars acceleration and speed....
Cut the shit man. Your ranting about Dolan and whoever else in the front office is getting really old. We're dealing with NOW and right now we have a team that isn't successful under this "system" you so highly value.

We have the players we have and that won't change before a new coach is brought in. Can't believe you took up all that space to basically (ONCE AGAIN) GIVE Antoni a pass. What is your love affection with this guy??? Even pro Antoni posters have eventually admitted that a coaching change is most likely needed.

Stop living in the past!

Oh and in case you didn't know: A coach who needs "his type of players" to be successful is not a good coach. Antoni is the only coach in the league who needs a grocery list of players.

There are plenty of coaches that have been successful on different teams where the structure was different based on personnel.
 

CA7

Scoring Champ
1. James
2. Paul
3. Kobe
4. Rose
5. Howard
6. Wade
7. Durant
8. Anthony
9. D.Williams
10. Love
 
Cut the shit man. Your ranting about Dolan and whoever else in the front office is getting really old. We're dealing with NOW and right now we have a team that isn't successful under this "system" you so highly value.

We have the players we have and that won't change before a new coach is brought in. Can't believe you took up all that space to basically (ONCE AGAIN) GIVE Antoni a pass. What is your love affection with this guy??? Even pro Antoni posters have eventually admitted that a coaching change is most likely needed.

Stop living in the past!

Oh and in case you didn't know: A coach who needs "his type of players" to be successful is not a good coach. Antoni is the only coach in the league who needs a grocery list of players.

There are plenty of coaches that have been successful on different teams where the structure was different based on personnel.


You obviously didn't get the point or didn't read the whole post.

I don't understand your hate towards me.

And your false accusations are just unneccessary, I don't know why you bring them up all the time.

I don't 'love' D'Antoni like you said and my post wasn't made to plead a case for him.

Like I said, you probably didn't understand the post or didn't read it entirely.

Sometimes you gotta look back to understand problems in the present. The Knicks are a classic case for that.

You wanna hear a short term, right now-solution?

Ok here it is:

- Fire D'Antoni and splash the cash on Jackson in an attempt to lure him to New York.

- If we don't have immediate success trade either Melo or Amar'e.

- Pray things work out.

That would be the typical Knicks way of doing things since Dolan took over.
 

nyk_nyk

All Star
You obviously didn't get the point or didn't read the whole post.

I don't understand your hate towards me.

And your false accusations are just unneccessary, I don't know why you bring them up all the time.

I don't 'love' D'Antoni like you said and my post wasn't made to plead a case for him.

Like I said, you probably didn't understand the post or didn't read it entirely.

Sometimes you gotta look back to understand problems in the present. The Knicks are a classic case for that.

You wanna hear a short term, right now-solution?

Ok here it is:

- Fire D'Antoni and splash the cash on Jackson in an attempt to lure him to New York.

- If we don't have immediate success trade either Melo or Amar'e.

- Pray things work out.

That would be the typical Knicks way of doing things since Dolan took over.
That's the best case scenerio. What's the problem with that? Our current coach is not under contract past this year so going in another direction would be fine IMO. You can't deny that this team is underachieving.
 

GordonGecko

Benchwarmer
You can't deny that this team is underachieving.

Absolutely. No matter how much respect you have for D'Antoni's abilities - for whatever reason he's just not getting the job done. The roster is no longer an excuse, something's got to give and it's going to be him
 

Weissenberg

Grid or Riot
1. James
2. Paul
3. Kobe
4. Rose
5. Howard
6. Wade
7. Durant
8. Anthony
9. D.Williams
10. Love

LMAO, at this point Lamelo isn't even close to the TOP 10, take him out of your list and add Griffin or Bynum or Westbrook...
 

petescud

Starter
I agree. From what i've seen of him this/last year, i'd say a top 10-15 player, but not top 5.....


He plays with no heart. When his shoots are not falling like this year, he is useless because he doesn't do anything else to help the team. He is so far from elite, it's not even worth a mention.
 

CalBunny

Rookie
Lin,JJ,TC,SHUMP,NOVAK,BD,JR...love them or hate them, they do give their effort. You can't blame or hate a player when they are giving their 100%. Is that too much to ask for our 2 so call ELITE players? When you see Melo and Amare taking a nap on the court, you just want to throw your remote at the TV. Amare shows some emotions sometime. Melo just don't give a sh1t. He is not even in the top 100 right now.
 

skisloper

Starter
Lin,JJ,TC,SHUMP,NOVAK,BD,JR...love them or hate them, they do give their effort. You can't blame or hate a player when they are giving their 100%. Is that too much to ask for our 2 so call ELITE players? When you see Melo and Amare taking a nap on the court, you just want to throw your remote at the TV. Amare shows some emotions sometime. Melo just don't give a sh1t. He is not even in the top 100 right now.

Amare may just not be capable....but MELO there is no excuse....he has turned on when he wants to........LALA must be so turned off.....Maybe she was cheating on him and he out of sorts....
 

iSaYughh

Starter
Amare may just not be capable....but MELO there is no excuse....he has turned on when he wants to........LALA must be so turned off.....Maybe she was cheating on him and he out of sorts....

A good point.

You get the sense Amare may just be physically incapable at this point in time; his actual skills and physical capabilities look eroded.

This isn't the case for Melo.
 

munco

Benchwarmer
A good point.

You get the sense Amare may just be physically incapable at this point in time; his actual skills and physical capabilities look eroded.

This isn't the case for Melo.

^^this. Amare seems to have lost a step and a lot of his athleticism.

Melo seems capable of playing harder on defense and with urgency but we rarely see it. It came out against Lebron and the Heat, but aside from that he just doesn't seem to play hard on D or even focus on D most nights. Most of the top players in the league also impact the game on defense too.
 
That's the best case scenerio. What's the problem with that? Our current coach is not under contract past this year so going in another direction would be fine IMO. You can't deny that this team is underachieving.

No, absolutely not. You're spot on with that and I was not trying to deny that. Maybe a sloppy attempt at analyzing things by me, call me a fake journalist, I don't know :smokin:

It was more of an attempt to analyze things and why we are where we are (which is nomansland, atleast it feels like nomansland). 7 good games are succeeded by 4 or 5 bad games...then the cycle repeats it seems.

If D'Antoni has to go - he has to go. I don't have a problem with that.

But let's part ways in a civilized way with him. I don't think he's a horrible coach, an idiot or the sole person to blame for our struggles.
I think with the right roster he can still have success, maybe not a championship but winning a division, maybe even a conference can be possible with him in charge.

Let'S fire him, I don't have a problem with that, but let's say "Thank you for your services, it just didn't fit. The best for the future."

Rather than: "**** off you clueless half italian idiot. You're not fit to coach in this league and SSOL sucked from day one."

I think he doesn't deserve treatement like that, because he didn't pull an Isiah. :teeth:
 

pat

Starter
Even pro Antoni posters have eventually admitted that a coaching change is most likely needed.

Stop living in the past!

Eventually they will fire him. Mark my words: we will not be more successful without him. This team is poorly crafted. Firing the coach is always the easiest options. If you want to be a hands-on owner, you need to know your stuff. Dolan isn't that knowledgeable. We are stuck with him. When Melo was out with that groin injury, we were winning. It is always a sure sign of an ill-designed team if addition by subtraction is working.
 
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