Can We Win w/ D'Antoni

ronoranina

Fundamentally Sound
Listen Trill

We have celebrity coach Damnphony there mucking everything up. Nevermind the fact that the goal of last season was to audition players to trade them, and that fact was open and obvious to everyone in the blue and orange last year.

DAMPHONY DIDN'T PLAY DARKO!!!!! HOW CAN THIS POSSIBLY BE?!?!?! He was overall #2 draft pick and if you listen to my conspiracy theory, it was all done out of spite because Damphony wanted his Godson Gallinari, who is at best an end-of-the-bench player in this league, to be the best European on the team. Proof? WE DON'T NEED NO STINKIN PROOF!

We must sign PF/C Earl Barron otherwise our team is totally doomed. Look, just because nobody wants him (which is why he is a free agent) I know that secretly this is all a ploy to give us the next Hakeem Olajuwon.

Why do you think we had such bad defense? Because James Dolan and Stephon Marbury convinced all of our players to just stand around so that they could fire Larry Brown!!! It has nothing to do with the talent at all!

The fact that these past 2 seasons were auditions for the trade deadline to clear cap space and gain flexibility means absolutely nothing to me! We had JAMAL CRAWFORD FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! We should have been a 50-win team!!!!! Walsh and Damnphony is lying to you peoples. They don't care about winning, that's why they took on one of the most difficult tasks in the NBA, turning around the New York Knicks. All they care about is getting their celebrity and popularity up. Why do you think they keep purposely losing? To get a better contract elsewhere because Damphony is a celebrity coach (a term which I still have not defined)!!!!!! Forget the fact that when Walsh got here he said his main goal was to attain cap flexibility to rebuild via free agency (a goal which he attained), this was all a ploy to create super human robotic NBA players for his OWN franchise he is bringing to midwest basketball-starved St. Louis...can't you read between the lines!

I have more conspiracy theories if you would like to hear them.

(end Kiyaman rant)


------------

This is what you idiots sound like.


Nicely player sir.. :thumbsup:
 

Paul1355

All Star
Love how you dudes just say some stupid insult to Kiya and then you all say "good job, well said" and all this 4th grade commentary.

Look if you honestly feel that D'Antoni was not an embarissment the past two years, then you did not watch many Knick games. Plain and Simple. These arguments are like fans just watched Mike D's Suns teams and then watched a handful of Knicks games. He is overrated. That has been proven. His style players love, if they can shoot.

Sitting there game after game just watching a poorly coached, poorly played, lack of will team to want to not do anything above average for their coach. These guys were embarrassing. They did not fit Mike's style and Mike did not care and made them conform to it anyways, resulting in another F of a season. Mike benched the wrong players and over played the wrong players. The Knicks coaching staff can't teach defense and Herb Williams is a waste. Kenny Atkinson acts like a strength and fitness coach and nothing else... always talks with his only reason for wins and loses being "energy". The only guy that might be decent on this team is Phil Weber. The problem is that Mike D has that ego factor and prob won't listen to what most of his staff says concerning rotations and offense/defensive schemes.

Ego's kill players. Ego's kill teams. Unless Mike D expands this rotation, we are going to have a lot of pissed off players come mid season.
 

KBlack25

Starter
Love how you dudes just say some stupid insult to Kiya and then you all say "good job, well said" and all this 4th grade commentary.

Look if you honestly feel that D'Antoni was not an embarissment the past two years, then you did not watch many Knick games. Plain and Simple. These arguments are like fans just watched Mike D's Suns teams and then watched a handful of Knicks games. He is overrated. That has been proven. His style players love, if they can shoot.

Sitting there game after game just watching a poorly coached, poorly played, lack of will team to want to not do anything above average for their coach. These guys were embarrassing. They did not fit Mike's style and Mike did not care and made them conform to it anyways, resulting in another F of a season. Mike benched the wrong players and over played the wrong players. The Knicks coaching staff can't teach defense and Herb Williams is a waste. Kenny Atkinson acts like a strength and fitness coach and nothing else... always talks with his only reason for wins and loses being "energy". The only guy that might be decent on this team is Phil Weber. The problem is that Mike D has that ego factor and prob won't listen to what most of his staff says concerning rotations and offense/defensive schemes.

Ego's kill players. Ego's kill teams. Unless Mike D expands this rotation, we are going to have a lot of pissed off players come mid season.

Paul - how does everything you are saying fit EXACTLY into the narrative that everyone opposing you is stating?!?!

The very fact that these guys did not want to do anything above average is directly attributable to the fact that they knew (a) they were not part of the future, the plan to get under the cap was in effect, (b) anything they did well would just send them packing. How do you go about motivating a team when your motivating speech ultimately boils down to: play hard so we can trade you. Lee was the only one motivated to try his balls off (and it showed) because he knew he had the possibility of a BIG contract on the horizon.

Are you trying to argue that the lack of will to do anything, the lack of energy, had absolutely nothing to do with the fact that every single person in the locker room besides MAYBE Gallinari knew they were on the trading block? Again, your argument of lack of will is attributable, in my eyes, to the private and very public acknowledgment that the goal was to TRADE EVERYONE ON THE TEAM FOR EXPIRING DEALS!

You talk about the ego of D'Antoni, what about the egos he eradicated from the team? Stephon Marbury - egomaniac crazy person. Jamal Crawford - thinks he's hot shit because he won 6th man of the year and now wants a trade. Nate Robinson - thinks he can shoot the ball at the other team's basket and not be reprimanded. Al Harrington was sent packing as soon as his deal was done, we didn't even TRY to resign him.

All I see from D'Antoni haters is people saying "He should have done x, y and z so we could have won" and that misses the point. First of all, x, y and z are things like "Play Darko Milicic" (really, a human being is begging to see MORE Darko?), "Sign Earl Barron or we are doomed" (there's a reason this guy hasn't been signed with 6 weeks left to the season, and it ain't because he's a star in the making).

Second of all, this season was about auditions. Why do you think he played Jared Jefferies guarding the 1 every night? Because that was the best defensive matchup that gave us the best chance to win? Anyone with half a brain knows that isn't the case...it was done to showcase Jefferies' versatility so that we could trade him. Guys like Nate got benched for one simple reason: he mouthed off to the coach. Quick hint: If you want to play, stay on the coach's good side and don't mouth off when you get reprimanded for being an asshole.

I see complaints about D'Antoni not knowing how to work with centers...Pure centers on D'Antoni's teams included the likes of such superstars as Jake Voshkul and Pat Burke. The one year with O'Neal any person with one working brain cell could understand Shaq is a very specific role player that had no true place on a run-and-gun, end-to-end team. Even last year, the Cavs were more effective when they went with their small and fast lineup and had Shaq as far away as possible.

Anyone who is going to argue with me that Kurt Thomas, when on the team, could handle the likes of Tim Duncan in the West has much more problems than I can care to deal with. And the "he didn't play Thomas" narrative is WAY overstated (looking at you Kiyaman). In his time in Phoenix Thomas played in a total of 120 games and 2,619 minutes. That's 21.825 minutes per game. On his career, Thomas AVERAGED 25.6 minutes per game. IN FACT, post-Phoenix, Thomas average 18 minutes per game. That means not only did D'Antoni play Thomas close to the average # of minutes per game he played on his career and MORE than Thomas EVER played again. So, Kiyaman, word of advice: shut up with your ridiculously unfounded Kurt Thomas argument to show how "underutilized" he was by D'Antoni.

At the end of the day, not a soul on this board has answered the question, and in light of the above I believe it will be even harder:

How can you blame Mike D'Antoni for not winning with a team that was not trying to win, and openly acknowledged that they were not trying to win?
 
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smokes

Huge Member
Smokes, I appreciate this post since you are at least trying to present a rationale that is on topic but you forget two things.

1. This is a matter of conditioning and it goes both ways. Simply put, if the Knicks run this system nightly they will be in better condition then their opponents and run them ragged. You forget that there will be two teams on the court and the Knicks will be the ones controlling the pace and having the conditioning to outlast their opponent. That gives us a distinct advantage on BOTH ends of the court.

2.Citing a perceived downside to a system is very different then claiming D'ant doesn't coach or care about defense like some on this forum believe.

Yeah I don't believe he doesn't care about defense at all but he is kind of misguided to believe that with the offensive system he encourages the players can still play great defense.

Your first point I don't agree with, purely because this is the NBA. These players work out day in day out, even the least "athletic" players are still great athletes with good mental and physical stamina.

I don't think playing this system night in night out makes our team physically superior and therefore able to play both ends of the court with the amount of energy required.

It's all about balance and for the last two seasons we didn't have that balance. That's not to say we won't have something resembling it this season, but we have to run at least a 9-10 man rotation and have roleplayers doing their role as oppose to everyone playing the role of part-time scorer.
 

KBlack25

Starter
Yeah I don't believe he doesn't care about defense at all but he is kind of misguided to believe that with the offensive system he encourages the players can still play great defense.

Your first point I don't agree with, purely because this is the NBA. These players work out day in day out, even the least "athletic" players are still great athletes with good mental and physical stamina.

I don't think playing this system night in night out makes our team physically superior and therefore able to play both ends of the court with the amount of energy required.

It's all about balance and for the last two seasons we didn't have that balance. That's not to say we won't have something resembling it this season, but we have to run at least a 9-10 man rotation and have roleplayers doing their role as oppose to everyone playing the role of part-time scorer.

smokes-

I don't think anyone is here saying that D'Antoni is the perfect coach (except for maybe jpz)...but just like in any sport coaches have specialties. To me, to think that an NBA Coach, or really a coach at any meaningful level, is as clueless about half of the game as some people purport is ignorant on many levels. I just think that D'Antoni's viewpoint is that to win the game you have to score more points than your opponent. This is not the Knicks of the early 1990s that smashed teams in the paint and slowed the game down, I know that's hard to come to grips with that. But in the day and age of the hand-check foul and the general pussification of the NBA it is harder to be a smash-mouth defensive team, and much easier to be a run-and-gun speed team (as the league rules open up the offensive game).

I also think the shortened roster is over-stated. In 2005-06 and 2006-07, the Suns coached by Mike D'Antoni played EIGHT guys over 1,000 minutes on the season, and split another 1000 minutes between 4 guys...so he did essentially use a 9 man rotation. These past two seasons, as I have said over and over, were about auditioning guys and so the rotation was shortened up to showcase pieces for trade. I bet he goes back to an 8-9 man rotation (as he used in PHX) with his hand-picked guys on the roster.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Reality check

Love how you dudes just say some stupid insult to Kiya and then you all say "good job, well said" and all this 4th grade commentary.

Look if you honestly feel that D'Antoni was not an embarissment the past two years, then you did not watch many Knick games. Plain and Simple. These arguments are like fans just watched Mike D's Suns teams and then watched a handful of Knicks games. He is overrated. That has been proven. His style players love, if they can shoot.

Sitting there game after game just watching a poorly coached, poorly played, lack of will team to want to not do anything above average for their coach. These guys were embarrassing. They did not fit Mike's style and Mike did not care and made them conform to it anyways, resulting in another F of a season. Mike benched the wrong players and over played the wrong players. The Knicks coaching staff can't teach defense and Herb Williams is a waste. Kenny Atkinson acts like a strength and fitness coach and nothing else... always talks with his only reason for wins and loses being "energy". The only guy that might be decent on this team is Phil Weber. The problem is that Mike D has that ego factor and prob won't listen to what most of his staff says concerning rotations and offense/defensive schemes.

Ego's kill players. Ego's kill teams. Unless Mike D expands this rotation, we are going to have a lot of pissed off players come mid season.

Paul..... u know what gets me the most is I started the "Fire Isiah" chant in
the 2004-5 season months before Marbury's famous quote "I am the best
guard in the NBA".
I have been attending several Knick-Forums the past 8 years. And
lastseasons Game-Threads in over 10 Knick Forums were not put up the
majority of the season b/c over half of the Knick-Fans and members of each
forum had no interest in watching 41 of the 82 game season of Dantoni
coaching the Knicks. It is a shame to mention clueless Isiah Thomas
coaching had twice the interest of fans in his two seasons than Dantoni.
This KO Forum had the lowest members attending the game-thread than it
had in the past 5 years. It got so bad last season the KO Forum would go 2
to 3 Knick games without putting up a Game-Thread. We had a long list of
members to put up Game-Threads before the season, but why put up a
game-thread when only 1 or 3 members is watching/attending the game-thread?
Everyone that has visit the KO Forum in the past 3 seasons from other NBA
sites will admit the KO Forum has been putting-up the best Game-Threads on
the internet out of all the teams. Last season everyone in KO forum had a
million and one excuses for not watching or attending Knick games.
However:
The majority of members that are defending Dantoni in this thread are the
same members that predicted the Knicks will have a 38 to 45 win season in the
2009-10 season, last year at this time in September. If not in this KO
Forum in other Knick forums.
Should we believe or take their advice now???
:gony:

P.S. K.Black..... stop contradicting yourself.
The sameway David Lee went all out to have an outstanding performance to
lift his FA value, u had SG-Nate/SG-Hughes/and C-Darko wanting the same
oportunity that was given to PF-David Lee.
K-Black u are to blind to figure out the missing pieces in all of Dantoni's
lineups throughout the 2009-10 season (cap-space! cap-space! cap-space!).
I thought the awareness of a D.League product C-Earl Barron in the last 7
games with SG-T-Mac or SG-Walker alongside of PF-Lee, SF-Gallo, and PG-
Douglas wouldve woke-up your senses to a complete NBA lineup, rather than
the mystery of a Dantoni-system (SSOL). Wake The F up!!!
Everybody and their mama knew Jefferies was "only" giving playingtime to be
showcased at the start of the 1-11 record. u cant be that .....
 

KBlack25

Starter
P.S. K.Black..... stop contradicting yourself.
The sameway David Lee went all out to have an outstanding performance to
lift his FA value, u had SG-Nate/SG-Hughes/and C-Darko wanting the same
oportunity that was given to PF-David Lee.
K-Black u are to blind to figure out the missing pieces in all of Dantoni's
lineups throughout the 2009-10 season (cap-space! cap-space! cap-space!).
I thought the awareness of a D.League product C-Earl Barron in the last 7
games with SG-T-Mac or SG-Walker alongside of PF-Lee, SF-Gallo, and PG-
Douglas wouldve woke-up your senses to a complete NBA lineup, rather than
the mystery of a Dantoni-system (SSOL). Wake The F up!!!
Everybody and their mama knew Jefferies was "only" giving playingtime to be
showcased at the start of the 1-11 record. u cant be that .....

Darko was given time early and was terrible...it became clear early on that we were not going to get any value for Darko.

Nate was given time and rather than act like an adult, he talked back to the coach when he was being reprimanded for shooting at the wrong hoop. Again, word of advice: do not talk back to the coach if you want to continue to play.

Larry was given time as well, but never really "fit in" on the team and went public being upset with coach D'Antoni...

Meanwhile: Lee shut his mouth and played hard getting consistent burn. Jefferies continued to play. Al Harrington continued to get minutes.

Whether you hate him or love him, you have to be on the coach's goodside in order to play...would you rather be on your bosses good side or bad side? How quickly would your boss fire you if you messed up, he spoke to you about the issue, and you mouthed off back?

Earl Barron gave a great effort, I'm not debating that. And I agree we need a Center...but we don't need to carry 5 centers on this squad. D'Antoni, for as much as you hate every piece of ground he has ever walked on, has tried to play centers...he gave Barron some burn, he gave Darko burn early until he played himself out of a job, and when Curry is available he tries to give him burn. But right now we have solid-interior defender Turiaf, we have Mozgov, we have Jordan, we have Curry...why throw a fifth center (1/3 of our entire team) in the mix when it is unlikely for Barron to get any burn at all. I understand WHY you need a center, any person with the ability to type knows that. But you can't just stockpile your team with centers, there are other positions of need and the fact that Barron has not been signed by ANY TEAM (not just our hateful, terrible front office in NY) tells me he is more Randolph Morris than he is Shaquille O'Neal.
 

TR1LL10N

Hannibal Lecter
Yeah I don't believe he doesn't care about defense at all but he is kind of misguided to believe that with the offensive system he encourages the players can still play great defense.

Your first point I don't agree with, purely because this is the NBA. These players work out day in day out, even the least "athletic" players are still great athletes with good mental and physical stamina.

I don't think playing this system night in night out makes our team physically superior and therefore able to play both ends of the court with the amount of energy required.

It's all about balance and for the last two seasons we didn't have that balance. That's not to say we won't have something resembling it this season, but we have to run at least a 9-10 man rotation and have roleplayers doing their role as oppose to everyone playing the role of part-time scorer.

Smokes I can agree on the short rotation but Kblack basically covered all the points on that subject. I fundamentally disagree that all teams have equal conditioning and that playing in an uptempo nightly does not give a conditioning advantage over a team that doesn't. It is common knowledge around the league that D'ant's system can and does tire out the opponent. I live in Florida so I watch the Knicks with the NBA package and I can tell you this is a common talking point by almost every opponents commentators. That said, there are two teams so even if they were equally conditioned that negates your point about defense because the other team would also need to conserve energy just as you assert the Knicks do. Further D'ants system seduces opponents into playing our style and not theirs giving us yet another advantage. A run and gun offense is contagious and teams for the most part can't help but be lured into our pace.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
Darko was given time early and was terrible...it became clear early on that we were not going to get any value for Darko.

Nate was given time and rather than act like an adult, he talked back to the coach when he was being reprimanded for shooting at the wrong hoop. Again, word of advice: do not talk back to the coach if you want to continue to play.

Larry was given time as well, but never really "fit in" on the team and went public being upset with coach D'Antoni...

Meanwhile: Lee shut his mouth and played hard getting consistent burn. Jefferies continued to play. Al Harrington continued to get minutes.

Whether you hate him or love him, you have to be on the coach's goodside in order to play...would you rather be on your bosses good side or bad side? How quickly would your boss fire you if you messed up, he spoke to you about the issue, and you mouthed off back?

Earl Barron gave a great effort, I'm not debating that. And I agree we need a Center...but we don't need to carry 5 centers on this squad. D'Antoni, for as much as you hate every piece of ground he has ever walked on, has tried to play centers...he gave Barron some burn, he gave Darko burn early until he played himself out of a job, and when Curry is available he tries to give him burn. But right now we have solid-interior defender Turiaf, we have Mozgov, we have Jordan, we have Curry...why throw a fifth center (1/3 of our entire team) in the mix when it is unlikely for Barron to get any burn at all. I understand WHY you need a center, any person with the ability to type knows that. But you can't just stockpile your team with centers, there are other positions of need and the fact that Barron has not been signed by ANY TEAM (not just our hateful, terrible front office in NY) tells me he is more Randolph Morris than he is Shaquille O'Neal.

Earl Barron was given an ungaranteed contract by the Knicks when the
season ended. He wanted more plus a garanteed contract which cost him to
be in the situation he is in now. Being there is a shortage of centers in the
league Barron agent is still holding on to those same stipulation he offered
the Knicks with other NBA teams, which may pan out by training camp to
teams like Indiana or Warriors.

The Knicks first game of last season were against super star SG-D.Wade
Miami Heat. The Knicks DNP one of the NBA top 10 defensive SG-Hughes for
that first game. Absurd!
During the Preseason games we were bashed by ex-teammate Marbury for
taking 34 3-ball shots out of 68 fga in a game. We all hated to mention that
Marbury was finally right in a quotation to the press. Absurd!
The couple of minutes C-Darko receive playingtime as a Knick was in the
preseason games where he had to play alongside of player Gallo, never with
PF-David Lee who had the complimentary skills to help Darko position himself
as a center on offense/defense. Absurd!
Darko did well on the Magic as C-Howard 14 mpg backup, Darko did well on
Memphis as C-Gasol 21 mpg backup.
However, Darko was not good enough to play one minute of playingtime on a
stripped up one year rented-player Knick Team. Absurd!

Having a job and a career are two different things. Especially when one
comes with a guaranteed contract, where the rules of your contract is the
only boss to stop your pay$. Jerome James said F.U. to coach/president Isiah
Thomas and received full payment of his contract.
Who was Jerome James boss?

Larry was given time as well, but never really "fit in" on the team and went public
being upset with coach D'Antoni...
Larry was given 30 mpg in 7 games and won 4 of the 7 games, what part didnt he fit in at?
 
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KBlack25

Starter
Earl Barron was given an ungaranteed contract by the Knicks when the
season ended. He wanted more plus a garanteed contract which cost him to
be in the situation he is in now. Being there is a shortage of centers in the
league Barron agent is still holding on to those same stipulation he offered
the Knicks with other NBA teams, which may pan out by training camp to
teams like Indiana or Warriors.

Like I said, if he was worth a guaranteed deal someone would have signed him by now.

Kiyaman said:
The Knicks first game of last season were against super star SG-D.Wade
Miami Heat. The Knicks DNP one of the NBA top 10 defensive SG-Hughes for
that first game. Absurd!

Top 10 by what metric? Of current players in the NBA, according to basketball reference, Larry Hughes is not in the top FIFTY of defensive rating, nor is he in the top FIFTY of defensive win shares (an estimate of how many wins a player's defense adds). So by what metric/evidence is he top 10? GIVE A STAT THAT PROVES IT!!!!!!!! IF YOU DO NOT YOU ARE ADMITTING THIS IS A LIE AND SPECULATION! Sorry for the bold, but you tend to make claims without proof or evidence.


Kiyaman said:
During the Preseason games we were bashed by ex-teammate Marbury for
taking 34 3-ball shots out of 68 fga in a game. We all hated to mention that
Marbury was finally right in a quotation to the press. Absurd!

If you put stock into anything Marbury says I have a nice bridge in Brooklyn I would like to sell you. Just because Marbury's criticisms may have been accurate does not mean he is some basketball super-genius. More likely is that he was willing to criticize the man that, in a way, sent him packing his bags to China.


Kiyaman said:
The couple of minutes C-Darko receive playingtime as a Knick was in the
preseason games where he had to play alongside of player Gallo, never with
PF-David Lee who had the complimentary skills to help Darko position himself
as a center on offense/defense. Absurd!
Darko did well on the Magic as C-Howard 14 mpg backup, Darko did well on
Memphis as C-Gasol 21 mpg backup.
However, Darko was not good enough to play one minute of playingtime on a
stripped up one year rented-player Knick Team. Absurd!

In the games Darko played in the regular season, Darko managed to do a whole lot of nothing...do I really have to convince a human being who (allegedly) watches basketball that Darko is nothing more than a marginal player at best?

Kiyman said:
Having a job and a career are two different things. Especially when one
comes with a guaranteed contract, where the rules of your contract is the
only boss to stop your pay$. Jerome James said F.U. to coach/president Isiah
Thomas and received full payment of his contract.
Who was Jerome James boss?

So you want D'Antoni to fold up when being yelled at by players exactly like the totally inept Isiah Thomas? You want our coach to be MORE like ISiah...is that what I am getting out of this? That D'Antoni should do things the way Isiah Thomas did them? Really? Please explain what you are trying to get across with this point...I don't want to call you out for wanting D'Antoni to act MORE LIKE Isiah, because I think even you know that is an absurd request.

Kiyman said:
Larry was given 30 mpg in 7 games and won 4 of the 7 games, what part didnt he fit in at?

Again, you confuse correlation with causation...just because Larry got 30 mpg and they won 4/7 does not mean Larry's 30 mpg was the reason they won 4/7. In fact, if you want, I'll go through all the wins in which Larry Hughes was in the starting lineup...though this argument would still confuse correlation with causation:

W v. New Orleans
W v. New Jersey
W v. Phoenix (a game which, according to you Kiyaman, the Suns purposely lost)

That's it.

Three. Three wins with Larry Hughes in the starting lineup, one of which was against the worst team in the league and one of which Kiyaman himself claims is a forfeit by Phoenix. Do I have to say more?

The starting lineup with Hughes was 3-11 (that's .216 winning percentage for those of you counting at home). The same starters with Jefferies in lieu of Hughes was 11-16 (.407). I don't know how it could be more clear that Hughes was not the answer.
 
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portega1968

El Cacique
eventually, this thread will end up debating whether the Knicks miss Shandon Anderson, Vin Baker, Nazr Mohammed, Frederic Weis and Othella Harrington... I can see it reaching that point any moment.

Ah, I also forgot Michael Sweetney and Frank Robinson... man o' man do we miss those guys.

Bottom line: If Knicks get into the playoffs this year, Kiya should block himself from posting again till next season. If we don't reach the playoffs, then everyone will owe him an apology.

Knicks WILL be in the playoffs this year, fuuuuuck Earl Barron, Larry Hughes, Renaldo Balkman, Darko Milicic, Jared Jeffries, Nate Robinson, Isiah Thomas, James Dolan and Larry Brown too... take that to the bank.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
K-Black..... all that was unnessescary.
The article on Earl Barron
The Knicks initially tried to sign Barron at the end of the 09-10 season, when he averaged 11.7 points and 11 rebounds in 33.1 minutes per game in the final two weeks of the season. He was offered a non-guaranteed contract for 10-11 and turned it down, mainly because he was hoping to get something more secure - perhaps even from the Knicks - during the offseason.

Larry Hughes was a 12 yr veteran earning $12M per for his defense.
Larry Hughes defense help Lebron get to the FINALS.

Giving Darko 7 to 8 minutes of playingtime per game in just 8 games is teasing a MF

Any comment coming out of Marbury mouth about the Knicks is a joke.

Any time a player or players start yelling at a coach in public means the respect is gone.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
eventually, this thread will end up debating whether the Knicks miss Shandon Anderson, Vin Baker, Nazr Mohammed, Frederic Weis and Othella Harrington... I can see it reaching that point any moment.

Ah, I also forgot Michael Sweetney and Frank Robinson... man o' man do we miss those guys.

Bottom line: If Knicks get into the playoffs this year, Kiya should block himself from posting again till next season. If we don't reach the playoffs, then everyone will owe him an apology.

Knicks WILL be in the playoffs this year, fuuuuuck Earl Barron, Larry Hughes, Renaldo Balkman, Darko Milicic, Jared Jeffries, Nate Robinson, Isiah Thomas, James Dolan and Larry Brown too... take that to the bank.

u need to slow down wid all dat bull
and worry about what 7 players will be in the Knicks small rotation in 2010-11
 

ronoranina

Fundamentally Sound
Love how you dudes just say some stupid insult to Kiya and then you all say "good job, well said" and all this 4th grade commentary.

Look if you honestly feel that D'Antoni was not an embarissment the past two years, then you did not watch many Knick games. Plain and Simple. These arguments are like fans just watched Mike D's Suns teams and then watched a handful of Knicks games. He is overrated. That has been proven. His style players love, if they can shoot.

Sitting there game after game just watching a poorly coached, poorly played, lack of will team to want to not do anything above average for their coach. These guys were embarrassing. They did not fit Mike's style and Mike did not care and made them conform to it anyways, resulting in another F of a season. Mike benched the wrong players and over played the wrong players. The Knicks coaching staff can't teach defense and Herb Williams is a waste. Kenny Atkinson acts like a strength and fitness coach and nothing else... always talks with his only reason for wins and loses being "energy". The only guy that might be decent on this team is Phil Weber. The problem is that Mike D has that ego factor and prob won't listen to what most of his staff says concerning rotations and offense/defensive schemes.

Ego's kill players. Ego's kill teams. Unless Mike D expands this rotation, we are going to have a lot of pissed off players come mid season.

Well I already said I'm not gonna debate this topic further. I have been following the thread though and I liked Kblack's post. Nothing 4th grade about that. Post something intelligent on this here topic and I'd be inclined to give ya some props as well. Me don't discriminate.. :cool:

I must admit, that this thread continues to go on and on and you and Kiyaman STILL don't get it, and continue to argue is baffling and sorry to say entertaining, in a cringe worthy kind of way.
 

jimkcchief88

All Star
Jimqueef the Style Thief, you are a loser and everyone can see that. Keep fixating on some stupid bet all while betting AGAINST a team you claim to be a fan of. You are a sad old man acting like a prepubescent schoolboy who runs around and tries to show off his first 3 inch erection. :thumbsup:

You can't help but show your disdain for the Knicks and your inability to talk about the subject in a competent way so you resort to nonsense all while continuing to look like a d-bag hypocrite. Do us all a favor and go masturbate to Eddy Curry's pics for the 1000th time and leave this forum to the real Knick fans. Thanks!

So I am not a "real knicks fan", but I joined KO.COM a year before you did. You demonstrate your stupidity making dumb-ass comments like that. Maybe I should get some cheerleaders in my sig like you to show how "much of a fan I am" like you???? Right. Just because I'm not like the three blind mice believing that "STAT" will revolutionize the east, D'ant will be coach of the year, and GS and Carolina cast-offs won't lead us to the promised land doesn't make me less of a fan. I just keep it real. The fact you won't bet me just proves how full of **** you are. Keep trying to stunt for the rest of the board, but as soon as someone pulls your little *****-*** card, you back up like the eight-legged-crawdad-coward you are. And I put that ON CHIEF!!!!
 

KBlack25

Starter
So I am not a "real knicks fan", but I joined KO.COM a year before you did. You demonstrate your stupidity making dumb-ass comments like that. Maybe I should get some cheerleaders in my sig like you to show how "much of a fan I am" like you???? Right. Just because I'm not like the three blind mice believing that "STAT" will revolutionize the east, D'ant will be coach of the year, and GS and Carolina cast-offs won't lead us to the promised land doesn't make me less of a fan. I just keep it real. The fact you won't bet me just proves how full of **** you are. Keep trying to stunt for the rest of the board, but as soon as someone pulls your little *****-*** card, you back up like the eight-legged-crawdad-coward you are. And I put that ON CHIEF!!!!


While I disagree with your opinion on the team (I think being a Golden State cast-off is not necessarily something that is so revolutionarily horrible because Nellie is a crazy person) I do agree with the sentiment that people here are or are not "real" Knicks fans.

As someone who has been called a fake Knicks fan because I was not positive I wanted Patrick Ewing to become head coach (sidenote: I asked a friend of mind who is a Magic fan about the prospects of Ewing becoming a head coach he followed his initial uproarious laughter with the statement "Trust me, you want no part of that"), I know that it is not only a ridiculous statement, but is entirely untrue. To me it's like when somebody criticizes the war in Iraq and the right-wing calls those people "un-American" accusing them of basically hating America.

We all have differing opinions about how to get to ultimately the same goal: winning a championship. Now, on the argument I tend to align myself more with Trill - but I can't really respect an argument that revolves around not being a "true" Knicks fan. The fact that we spend all this time on the board criticizing, praising or whatever else means that we are true Knicks fans, all of us. We spent all this time on the board following a team that has been an embarassment for the past decade (I spent time on the HoopsHype Knicks board before coming here). We spend money, directly or indirectly on the team. We all want a Knicks title.

So, I'm calling out a moratorium on the "not a true Knicks fan" argument - stick to debating the actual facts. We can have different opinions, but the "not a true Knicks fan" argument, to me, is a cheap way out without truly debating anything.
 

TR1LL10N

Hannibal Lecter
So I am not a "real knicks fan", but I joined KO.COM a year before you did. You demonstrate your stupidity making dumb-ass comments like that. Maybe I should get some cheerleaders in my sig like you to show how "much of a fan I am" like you???? Right. Just because I'm not like the three blind mice believing that "STAT" will revolutionize the east, D'ant will be coach of the year, and GS and Carolina cast-offs won't lead us to the promised land doesn't make me less of a fan. I just keep it real. The fact you won't bet me just proves how full of **** you are. Keep trying to stunt for the rest of the board, but as soon as someone pulls your little *****-*** card, you back up like the eight-legged-crawdad-coward you are. And I put that ON CHIEF!!!!


You're a sad clown.

sad_clown.jpg




You may have been a fan years ago when you still had testosterone running through your body but now you are pure emo estrogen. Take some Midol...it will ease your cramping and maybe help alleviate your douche-bagged'ness.

You are a fake fan because you don't like our roster, don't like our coach, don't like our management and want to bet AGAINST the Knicks doing good. Dude, I don't need to make some stupid bet, call me any name you want because it does not bother me and I will continue to call you Jimqueef the Style Thief. That said, I am all in on the Knicks making the payoffs this year and you can quote me on that. Further I never made any claims that D'ant will win COY or that Amare will "revolutionize" the East...that my dimwitted over the hill chump is a delusion you made up in order to dodge all my REAL points. And my skeet I put that ON CHIEF!!!!
 

jimkcchief88

All Star
While I disagree with your opinion on the team (I think being a Golden State cast-off is not necessarily something that is so revolutionarily horrible because Nellie is a crazy person) I do agree with the sentiment that people here are or are not "real" Knicks fans.

As someone who has been called a fake Knicks fan because I was not positive I wanted Patrick Ewing to become head coach (sidenote: I asked a friend of mind who is a Magic fan about the prospects of Ewing becoming a head coach he followed his initial uproarious laughter with the statement "Trust me, you want no part of that"), I know that it is not only a ridiculous statement, but is entirely untrue. To me it's like when somebody criticizes the war in Iraq and the right-wing calls those people "un-American" accusing them of basically hating America.

We all have differing opinions about how to get to ultimately the same goal: winning a championship. Now, on the argument I tend to align myself more with Trill - but I can't really respect an argument that revolves around not being a "true" Knicks fan. The fact that we spend all this time on the board criticizing, praising or whatever else means that we are true Knicks fans, all of us. We spent all this time on the board following a team that has been an embarassment for the past decade (I spent time on the HoopsHype Knicks board before coming here). We spend money, directly or indirectly on the team. We all want a Knicks title.

So, I'm calling out a moratorium on the "not a true Knicks fan" argument - stick to debating the actual facts. We can have different opinions, but the "not a true Knicks fan" argument, to me, is a cheap way out without truly debating anything.

100% agreed KB. Just the simple fact we all even bother to follow a team that has been bad for a decade means WE ARE ALL FANS!!!!
 

jimkcchief88

All Star
You're a sad clown.

sad_clown.jpg




You may have been a fan years ago when you still had testosterone running through your body but now you are pure emo estrogen. Take some Midol...it will ease your cramping and maybe help alleviate your douche-bagged'ness.

You are a fake fan because you don't like our roster, don't like our coach, don't like our management and want to bet AGAINST the Knicks doing good. Dude, I don't need to make some stupid bet, call me any name you want because it does not bother me and I will continue to call you Jimqueef the Style Thief. That said, I am all in on the Knicks making the payoffs this year and you can quote me on that. Further I never made any claims that D'ant will win COY or that Amare will "revolutionize" the East...that my dimwitted over the hill chump is a delusion you made up in order to dodge all my REAL points. And my skeet I put that ON CHIEF!!!!

BTW TRILLY A WOMAN...... WHICH WOMAN ARE YOU IN YOUR SIG????? THE ONE ON THE RIGHT OR THE ONE ON THE LEFT?????
 
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