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Thread: Trading Gallo or Randolph for Carmelo will fail us.

  1. #76
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by moneyg
    we are tryin to build a dynasty here.... a first round pick in 2014 for us should be close to the last pick in the first round. first round picks have no value to team that goes far in the playoffs... late first round - early second round... all the same talent..
    This is what Isiah said about the Marbury trade.

    And the Curry trade.

    Keep talking yourself into it, but trading first round picks like it's going out of style rarely gets a team anywhere.

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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    This is what Isiah said about the Marbury trade.

    And the Curry trade.

    Keep talking yourself into it, but trading first round picks like it's going out of style rarely gets a team anywhere.
    yep..... see the lakers and boston....who is the last allstar player these guys drafted???? who did they draft with their first rounds picks over the last few years.. i can only think of bynum and he was another teams pick...

    and marbury was on the decline.. melo is not.. and also.. marbury had no other teamates.. thats why we got sweept by the nets... double teamed marbury and nobody could step up and make a shot..

    go do ur research

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    First round picks are expendable when a team is GOOD.

    Our team...is NOT good.

    A first round pick we trade HAS value.

    A LATE first round pick isn't much better than a second rounder in this day and age. If you notice about the draft usually you have a ton of talent stockpiled in the first 3-4 picks and then after it's mostly a crapshoot as to who's good or not. Finding a good player with the last pick in the first round is just as valuable as finding a good player with a mid-round pick in the 2nd round.

    The difference is, we need draft picks...draft picks are how teams rebuild, period.

  4. #79
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    Originally Posted by moneyg
    yep..... see the lakers and boston....who is the last allstar player these guys drafted???? who did they draft with their first rounds picks over the last few years.. i can only think of bynum and he was another teams pick...

    and marbury was on the decline.. melo is not.. and also.. marbury had no other teamates.. thats why we got sweept by the nets... double teamed marbury and nobody could step up and make a shot..

    go do ur research
    Lakers drafted Andrew Bynum, and it was the Lakers' pick. In 2005 the Lakers finished in the lottery, the #10 pick was theirs from the outset. So you are wrong there. Go do "ur" research.

    The Celtics won titles because they had a dominant scorer and moved for a dominant big man and got Rajon Rondo (in the draft - with pick 21). Go do "ur" research. He is an NBA All-Star.

    You are wrong here.

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    Alot of witty bantor here, but looks like the Knicks will be left out again. Sounds like Melo is going to end up in Jersey via a 4 team trade excluding the Knicks. There goes that 8th playoff spot the Knicks might have slid into. If Melo ends up in NJ, Walsh and D'ant should be fired right away and us Knicks fans should prepare for the worse.

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    IMO

    This is my opinion, not a fact...I'm not asking you guys to agree with this because I don't have much information to back this up, when I arrive home from school/work/boxing, Ill add some tidbits to make sense of this.

    Okay.

    I understand you guys see Carmelo as a top 10 player, thats understandable...the media brainwashes a lot of people, and people are easily convinced by what they see on TV.

    I believe our front court is the most perfect front court in the NBA.

    They're all the same height, but all have different styles.

    Gallo - Shooting/Toughness/IQ/Alot of Skills all around 6"10 230 lbs SF/PF. A leader, and a has great vision offensively and defensively. Team plays great when he's on the floor and he wants to win games, not pad stats. So much potential.

    Amare - Post scoring, athelicism, all star level of player, 9 rebounds and a couple of blocks per game...a great primary scoring option, playoff experienced...dominates the best players in the game.

    Randolph - Marcus Camby meets Lamar Odom. Probably will average 15-17 ppg a most, but will give us 2+ blocks per game 10+ rebounds and 3+ assist. Dynamically fundamentally and athletically all in one. 6"10 230 lbs



    Getting Carmelo would be greedy.

    But don't take this thread as a point where im going to favor one side.

    To get to the other side, if we were to trade for Carmelo.

    I would trade Gallo, believe it or not.

    I just feel Randolph is a player you can't pass up on...he has too many attributes that will separate him from the rest of his class. He can legit play SF/PF/C....that center position being more important.

    We have so many wing players, it decreases Gallo's value less and less.

    I hate to grade Gallo, but Im just being realistic here if this trade goes down, we should trade him over

    Its a ****ty situation.
    I love our team and players...I want to see them play together for a reason.
    agreed that when it comes to Value...Randolph>Gallo....Randolph's defense, versatility, and ball handling skills make him truly unique...were Gallo is just a pure spot up streaky shooter. Don't take me wrong I love Gallo but if we get Melo who is a pure 3, then Randolph is worth keeping because of his versatility and defensive abilities.

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    It's not an issue of us being able to win if we don't get Carmelo or if we do.

    Both ways are possible. Though it gets more divided if we are talking about winning actual championships.

    Standing pat and our hopes rest on a myriad of players living up to their abilities in concert. And then having those abilities be at a very high level.

    STAT-Melo-2yrs Felton-CAP SPACE, and a versatile mix of Walker/Douglas/Moz/Jordan is, simply put, MUCH more proven of a blueprint to content asap, and win titles.

    It would be tough to imagine Walsh and/or the players fcking up to the extent that NY couldn't swiftly raise up a juggernaut contender under that.

    Everything changes if we pull that trigger. Our legitimacy, our perceived strength as a franchise, the effect on future dealings.

    Everything is solidified. Including our present and future prospects.

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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    This is what Isiah said about the Marbury trade.

    And the Curry trade.

    Keep talking yourself into it, but trading first round picks like it's going out of style rarely gets a team anywhere.
    Too true. I mean look at Seattle/OK city. They suffered for a bit, but are now a powerhouse in the league and just going to get better. They have their first rounders and a true hall of fame talent who is still only like 22 or 23 with lots of other good to great players on that team.

    We got Gallo with the 6th pick which has been good, but imagine if we still had our other first round picks to complement him. Could've been bust picks, but also could have been great picks.

    So .

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    Originally Posted by jimkcchief88
    Alot of witty bantor here, but looks like the Knicks will be left out again. Sounds like Melo is going to end up in Jersey via a 4 team trade excluding the Knicks. There goes that 8th playoff spot the Knicks might have slid into. If Melo ends up in NJ, Walsh and D'ant should be fired right away and us Knicks fans should prepare for the worse.
    You do realize if we fire our coach and Donnie then the team that is here becomes null and void and it will take another coach at least two years of rebuilding to get HIS team proper. With limited to no 1st round draft picks the process becomes even worse.

    I don't care if we don't make the playoffs because for so many years we have been making bad choices and now it's time to start taking baby steps to success rather then the home run that NY is so used to.

    The team is starting to really take shape in that we actually have a legit star who will demand double teams and we have some really good young talent and a good floor general. We may not be complete in any real sense, but I see marked improvement of a well rounded team that on it's night could be deadly.

  10. #85
    Veteran mafra's Avatar
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    It looks like we would have to trade BOTH Gallo and Randolph for any chance at Melo.

    My left brain says that makes sense.... is fair enough. How that would make NYK a real player. We would still have Mozgov and Chandler's upside to ponder about. A legit PG and 2 absolute scoring machines in the paint.

    But then I think about the defense.... and the future beyond 2012, and how I would feel insulted.

    Let's face it: Melo would come to NY for all the wrong reasons. He would force us into selling our best young talent just so he can get his money. The team would be cashed out... again... a mere few months after finally getting under the cap. We would be left with little wiggle room to build around our big-2.

    We all would whine next year how we would have it all IF ONLY Melo waited.

    BUT NO. MELO WANTS HIS MONEY.

    This is when my right brain starts to chime in. It says HEY, ROLL THE DICE. Gamble. Maybe the Knicks will be better off (a more complete, balanced team) if we keep Gallo-Randolph.

    Let Amar'e be the face.... the leader. Allow Felton room to grow. Let everyone else prove the sum of their parts is more valuable than brining in a high volumn chucker.

    We would also still have cap space next Summer.

    Randolph + Gallo + Cap Space or Melo?

    We know what happens when we put all our eggs in one basket.

    Yeah, I know this is a 26 yr-old MELO. A PROVEN warrior and winner. Still, under the circumstances it would take to get him here?

    I guess I would trade both, but boy would I be the first one to call him out if he fails. He put his money ahead of winning. He would have to carry us like he did SU, otherwise he wouldn't derserve wiggle room.

    Playing for a few Eastern Conf titles wouldn't be enough. Not for the cost.

    But I guess you have to do it. The fact I don't like it or want to causes alarm bells to go off.

    BUT NONE OF US ARE WALSH-DOLAN.

    Would I really pull the trigger? Only way to make an informed decision is to see what I would have seen from Gallo-Randolph. Because if they look like they've grown... if I bet on their potential and am loving what an offseason did.... Than I keep the kids and the future flexibility and pass on MELO. Let him get his money and play in Newark.

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    Originally Posted by mafra
    It looks like we would have to trade BOTH Gallo and Randolph for any chance at Melo.

    My left brain says that makes sense.... is fair enough. How that would make NYK a real player. We would still have Mozgov and Chandler's upside to ponder about. A legit PG and 2 absolute scoring machines in the paint.

    But then I think about the defense.... and the future beyond 2012, and how I would feel insulted.

    Let's face it: Melo would come to NY for all the wrong reasons. He would force us into selling our best young talent just so he can get his money. The team would be cashed out... again... a mere few months after finally getting under the cap. We would be left with little wiggle room to build around our big-2.

    We all would whine next year how we would have it all IF ONLY Melo waited.

    BUT NO. MELO WANTS HIS MONEY.

    This is when my right brain starts to chime in. It says HEY, ROLL THE DICE. Gamble. Maybe the Knicks will be better off (a more complete, balanced team) if we keep Gallo-Randolph.

    Let Amar'e be the face.... the leader. Allow Felton room to grow. Let everyone else prove the sum of their parts is more valuable than brining in a high volumn chucker.

    We would also still have cap space next Summer.

    Randolph + Gallo + Cap Space or Melo?

    We know what happens when we put all our eggs in one basket.

    Yeah, I know this is a 26 yr-old MELO. A PROVEN warrior and winner. Still, under the circumstances it would take to get him here?

    I guess I would trade both, but boy would I be the first one to call him out if he fails. He put his money ahead of winning. He would have to carry us like he did SU, otherwise he wouldn't derserve wiggle room.

    Playing for a few Eastern Conf titles wouldn't be enough. Not for the cost.

    But I guess you have to do it. The fact I don't like it or want to causes alarm bells to go off.

    BUT NONE OF US ARE WALSH-DOLAN.

    Would I really pull the trigger? Only way to make an informed decision is to see what I would have seen from Gallo-Randolph. Because if they look like they've grown... if I bet on their potential and am loving what an offseason did.... Than I keep the kids and the future flexibility and pass on MELO. Let him get his money and play in Newark.
    Nice.

    Randolph + Gallo + Cap Space or Melo?
    Randolph + Gallo + Cap Space. The 3 equate to $17M - Gallo $4M, AR $2M, Curry leaves behind $11M. Exciting stuff.

  12. #87
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    It looks like we would have to trade BOTH Gallo and Randolph for any chance at Melo.

    My left brain says that makes sense.... is fair enough. How that would make NYK a real player. We would still have Mozgov and Chandler's upside to ponder about. A legit PG and 2 absolute scoring machines in the paint.

    But then I think about the defense.... and the future beyond 2012, and how I would feel insulted.

    Let's face it: Melo would come to NY for all the wrong reasons. He would force us into selling our best young talent just so he can get his money. The team would be cashed out... again... a mere few months after finally getting under the cap. We would be left with little wiggle room to build around our big-2.

    We all would whine next year how we would have it all IF ONLY Melo waited.

    BUT NO. MELO WANTS HIS MONEY.

    This is when my right brain starts to chime in. It says HEY, ROLL THE DICE. Gamble. Maybe the Knicks will be better off (a more complete, balanced team) if we keep Gallo-Randolph.

    Let Amar'e be the face.... the leader. Allow Felton room to grow. Let everyone else prove the sum of their parts is more valuable than brining in a high volumn chucker.

    We would also still have cap space next Summer.

    Randolph + Gallo + Cap Space or Melo?

    We know what happens when we put all our eggs in one basket.

    Yeah, I know this is a 26 yr-old MELO. A PROVEN warrior and winner. Still, under the circumstances it would take to get him here?

    I guess I would trade both, but boy would I be the first one to call him out if he fails. He put his money ahead of winning. He would have to carry us like he did SU, otherwise he wouldn't derserve wiggle room.

    Playing for a few Eastern Conf titles wouldn't be enough. Not for the cost.

    But I guess you have to do it. The fact I don't like it or want to causes alarm bells to go off.

    BUT NONE OF US ARE WALSH-DOLAN.

    Would I really pull the trigger? Only way to make an informed decision is to see what I would have seen from Gallo-Randolph. Because if they look like they've grown... if I bet on their potential and am loving what an offseason did.... Than I keep the kids and the future flexibility and pass on MELO. Let him get his money and play in Newark.
    Thank you for the dose of sanity Mafra.

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    Originally Posted by mafra
    It looks like we would have to trade BOTH Gallo and Randolph for any chance at Melo.

    I guess I would trade both, but boy would I be the first one to call him out if he fails. He put his money ahead of winning. He would have to carry us like he did SU, otherwise he wouldn't derserve wiggle room.

    Playing for a few Eastern Conf titles wouldn't be enough. Not for the cost.

    But I guess you have to do it. The fact I don't like it or want to causes alarm bells to go off.

    BUT NONE OF US ARE WALSH-DOLAN.

    Would I really pull the trigger? Only way to make an informed decision is to see what I would have seen from Gallo-Randolph. Because if they look like they've grown... if I bet on their potential and am loving what an offseason did.... Than I keep the kids and the future flexibility and pass on MELO. Let him get his money and play in Newark.
    Excellent post Mafra, but I come out the other way. I would not do it. We would not beat Miami, or LA or, perhaps for two years, even the Celtics. And then there is Oklahoma, Portland and Chicago with very strong teams. We might get farther along in the playoffs with Melo, but we are not going to grow by eliminating our young potential stars and future cap space. Watching a team develop is more valuable to me than a few extra playoff games.

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