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Thread: This 9 Man Rotation can be a threat, and alot of people don't know it.

  1. #31
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by BleedOrange&Blue
    I'm calling it now because I just don't see it with him. Statistics and daily observations all point to Gallo just being another guy. I have made the argument that he is regressing this season. How is this team going to win when our three point specialist is streaky at best. If Gallo was an elite shooter that needed to develop skills than hes worth waiting on but thats not the case. Show me one statistic that Gallo leads in. Show me the superior +/- or PER rating that suggests otherwise. I am not making this stuff up, again I call it like I see it and when I turn out to be right I expect my rep points!
    Dude, Gallo has a vast array of talents that will eventually be brought to bare at will in the NBA. Right now he simply does not have that mental comfort level that Chandler has.

    Watch them both out on the court and you'll see what I'm talking about. Chandler due to the court time he's had, which exceeds Gallo's, is simply more comfortable and thus better able to just play, w out thinking.

    Gallo on the other hand is still thinking out there. He's been set back by the back injury. No doubt about it. He feels alot better as evidenced by his willingness to get in the paint and draw fouls. He also looks much more mobile/agile, which tells me that he's close to, if not 100% physically.

    The reason people like myself are on Gallo to be a all-star type talent is because he has the array of skills in in all important areas at his height to be able to do it. He can create his own shot. He can shoot, I mean really shoot, w range. He can also facilitate for others. AND..... defensively and offensively he has real good savvy. He has what you need to be THAT kind of player.

    Right now he's still trying to get a feel.. IT'S STILL TO EARLY TO WRITE HIM OFF.. If Metro hasn't written off AR in all of his wackness then you can surely give Gallo a bit more time. He will continue to grow as Bargnani has..

    Bargnani is nasty now dude. It took him 5 seasons to the point he's at now tho.

    Gallo can do it too, trust.

    Gallo is growing every game. One moment I really liked against Denver was when Gallo, from the 3pt line, drew Sheldon Williams whom he promptly crossed over, got to the hoop and drew a foul. The cross over he weilded was on some Jamal Crawford type ish. You just don't see that ability to create from 6'10'' dude often. At the top of the key was Billups who as Gallo broke Williams off at the ankles had this look on face that just said "No he didn't just cross up Sheldon like that.." Gallo is bad bro, and he will get better. It will just take time. In the meantime enjoy the ride Bleedblue.
    Last edited by ronoranina; Dec 13, 2010 at 19:48. Reason: typos biatch!

  2. #32
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Your opinion on Marbury isn't fact. Its just a gather of all the information that has been fed to you by the media and you ate it all up. It bothers you because your afraid to go against the hand that feeds you. Its not your fault though and you're not the only one.

    Let me ask you something.

    How much have you watched Randolph play?
    as a Knick.

    Once you answer that, then we can continue this discussion.
    Because I can't take anyone seriously when they're trying to assess a basketball athlete under 20 games at MOST. Its just not a fair assessment nor an accurate one. Randolph has a good game or two, you will begin to feel a little idiotic for jumping to such an unclear conclusion. I just think its best to save yourself and avoid doing such things and wait until Randolph actually plays 20+ minutes for atleast 20-30 games before you jump to conclusion.
    I've watched the man play a handful of times when he was on Golden State Metro. How could I have watched him as a Knick that much when he's barely gotten any burn.. Dumb question. He's everything I've stated since the summer before he'd even gotten his feet wet as a Knick. I don't make an assessment of a player unless I've actually watched them a bit dude. Would make sense? It doesn't take a long for me either. I can get a really good sense of where a player is, what he can and can't do pretty quickly. Metro I'm telling you, you couldn't be more wrong about AR. He's bumalicious, lol.

    And.... On Marbury. My opinion of him his not based on what the media has sold.. I'll tell u what I think of what he brought to the court.

    As a player, just as player, I think there was always something missing from him as a PG. He lacks that ability to do what all great distributing PG's do-- instill that sense of confidence in the other four guys on the court that he will continue to go to them even if they miss or make a mistake. Magic had that psychological piece, Stockton had it, Paul does definitely. Felton even does. Marbury didn't. Point blank. Marbury should have been like Iverson. He should have just played at the 2 as scoring tweener. HE WAS NOT A POINT GUARD to me.

    His other antics speak for themselves ,if you're looking at his behavior objectively. Not really gonna touch that stuff.
    Last edited by ronoranina; Dec 13, 2010 at 21:20.

  3. #33
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    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    Dude, Gallo has a vast array of talents that will eventually be brought to bare at will in the NBA. Right now he simply does not have that mental comfort level that Chandler has.

    Watch them both out on the court and you'll see what I'm talking about. Chandler due to the court time he's had, which exceeds Gallo's, is simply more comfortable and thus better able to just play, w out thinking.

    Gallo on the other hand is still thinking out there. He's been set back by the back injury. No doubt about it. He feels alot better as evidenced by his willingness to get in the paint and draw fouls. He also looks much more mobile/agile, which tells me that he's close to, if not 100% physically.

    The reason people like myself are on Gallo to be a all-star type talent is because he has the array of skills in in all important areas at his height to be able to do it. He can create his own shot. He can shoot, I mean really shoot, w range. He can also facilitate for others. AND..... defensively and offensively he has real good savvy. He has what you need to be THAT kind of player.

    Right now he's still trying to get a feel.. IT'S STILL TO EARLY TO WRITE HIM OFF.. If Metro hasn't written off AR in all of his wackness then you can surely give Gallo a bit more time. He will continue to grow as Bargnani has..

    Bargnani is nasty now dude. It took him 5 seasons to the point he's at now tho.

    Gallo can do it too, trust.

    Gallo is growing every game. One moment I really liked in against Denver was when Gallo, from the 3pt line, drew Sheldon Williams whom he promptly crossed over, got to the hoop and drew a foul. The cross over he weilded was on some Jamal Crawford type ish. You just don't see that ability to create from 6'10'' dude often. At the top of the key was Billups who as Gallo broke Williams off at the ankles had this look son face that just said "No he didn't just cross up Sheldon like that.." Gallo is bad bro, and he will get better. It will just take time. In the meantime enjoy the ride Bleedblue.
    100% I made the pt in a different thread today about how Wilson has an extra yr+ as a player.

    And look where Wilson as last year compared to this....

    I still think you're being too diplomatic.

    It isn't just a feeling anymore that Gallo has all-star talent. It's a fact. Look, you, me, anyone...can say whatever the **** we want, and that's just how life is -- bull**** is inevitable and we all dish it out and run with it sometimes. But you can not watch his play over a period of time, and objectively say you don't see the ability to be a rare NBA force and all-star.

    Some saw this and sensed it before he even set foot as a Knick. At this point, you just can't deny it, and we are now simply at a pt where it's a question of just how good he gets, just how soon it happens.

    Two things have been admitted by even his biggest detractors the past 2 years:

    1.) He is just a 1trick pony 3pt specialist (last year)
    2.) He is our worst shooter and just drives and draws fouls and hits his ft's well (this year)

    Ok. Even if we accept the negative at it's most absolute face value, we have concluded the following:

    Gallo is a 22yr old, 6'10'' player, with range and a shot good enough to make him a NBA 3pt specialist; Gallo's ability to score and be an effective player happens even if he is the worst shooter on the team.

    That is the definition of a bigtime prospect. You can't cut that **** up any other way, even if you don't want to credit the consistent, sometimes big, contributions he makes to the team as a whole.

    O': Gallo is a leader in +/-....And I will bet he leads or is extremely close to being the leader of the team in ft%, 3pt%, and is right behind STAT in getting to the line when the season ends.

  4. #34
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by iSaYughh
    100% I made the pt in a different thread today about how Wilson has an extra yr+ as a player.

    And look where Wilson as last year compared to this....

    I still think you're being too diplomatic.

    It isn't just a feeling anymore that Gallo has all-star talent. It's a fact. Look, you, me, anyone...can say whatever the **** we want, and that's just how life is -- bull**** is inevitable and we all dish it out and run with it sometimes. But you can not watch his play over a period of time, and objectively say you don't see the ability to be a rare NBA force and all-star.

    Some saw this and sensed it before he even set foot as a Knick. At this point, you just can't deny it, and we are now simply at a pt where it's a question of just how good he gets, just how soon it happens.

    Two things have been admitted by even his biggest detractors the past 2 years:

    1.) He is just a 1trick pony 3pt specialist (last year)
    2.) He is our worst shooter and just drives and draws fouls and hits his ft's well (this year)

    Ok. Even if we accept the negative at it's most absolute face value, we have concluded the following:

    Gallo is a 22yr old, 6'10'' player, with range and a shot good enough to make him a NBA 3pt specialist; Gallo's ability to score and be an effective player happens even if he is the worst shooter on the team.

    That is the definition of a bigtime prospect. You can't cut that **** up any other way, even if you don't want to credit the consistent, sometimes big, contributions he makes to the team as a whole.

    O': Gallo is a leader in +/-....And I will bet he leads or is extremely close to being the leader of the team in ft%, 3pt%, and is right behind STAT in getting to the line when the season ends.
    Gallo's game makes me giddy at times. He does things that alot of players, really good players, can't do.

    He has a complete offensive skill-set that I'm not sure I've seen at his height from a guy his age.

    I'll give a comparison.. He's like a Paul Pierce/ Drasen Petrovich hybrid.

    His slashing is Pierce-esque-- he has the handle and fundamental steps to get to where he wants when he wants to on the court and then finish w either hand or draw the foul.

    And his shooting while not on Drasen's level yet has the potential to get there as his mechanics are pure.

    And...., he's 6'10''.

    This guy, once he figures it all out, is going to be a REAL PROBLEM.

  5. #35
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    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    I've watched the man play a handful of times when he was on Golden State Metro. How could I have watched him as a Knick that much when he's barely gotten any burn.. Dumb question. He's everything I've stated since the summer before he'd even gotten his feet wet as a Knick. I don't make an assessment of a player unless I've actually watched them a bit dude. Would make sense? It doesn't take a long for me either. I can get a really good sense of where a player is, what he can and can't do pretty quickly. Metro I'm telling you, you couldn't be more wrong about AR. He's bumalicious, lol.

    And.... On Marbury. My opinion of him his not based on what the media has sold.. I'll tell u what I think of what he brought to the court.

    As a player, just as player, I think there was always something missing from him as a PG. He lacks that ability to do what all great distributing PG's do-- instill that sense of confidence in the other four guys on the court that he will continue to go to them even if they miss or make a mistake. Magic had that psychological piece, Stockton had it, Paul does definitely. Felton even does. Marbury didn't. Point blank. Marbury should have been like Iverson. He should have just played at the 2 as scoring tweener. HE WAS NOT A POINT GUARD to me.

    His other antics speak for themselves ,if you're looking at his behavior objectively. Not really gonna touch that stuff.
    Watching Golden State basketball is like me watching Florida International play ball under Isiah's whacky offense. Its just not a realistic statement. Lets just be real and say you haven't watched Randolph enough to believe he cannot produce at the NBA level.

    Marbury was full of ability, probably the most talented PG we've seen from the 90's who never reached full potential sadly. Marbury is 20th all time in career assist. He can ALWAYS pass, that was never a doubt. When you take into consideration and a clear assessment on who his teammates were, then you'll understand why Marbury struggled to win. Great teams win championships, not great players. KG was a top 3 player for most of his career before he won a championship. LeBron is now, and he never won it all.

    I don't know what SG is 20th all time in assist and had a career assist total at 8 per game. Marbury's career has surpassed Felton, so do not compare. Marbury never had the opportunity to play with players like Gallo, Chandler, and Amare (He had Amare when he was a rookie, same goes for KG) When you're FORCED to compared Marbury to the greatest pointguards of all time then you know your arguement is flawed. This isn't about Marbury being the greatest, he isn't. But he wasn't bad, nor he was never a problem. The problem was how teams were built around him. This was a man who can drop 12 + assist and 30 + points on any given night, especially in his prime. You think thats a problem to have? Its a luxury.

    as for Marbury's behavior...who are you?

    Who are you to judge Marbury?
    Judge Mathis?

    Come on man, your no saint either. Whatever Marbury does is his business and his life. He's hurting no one. People get angry and hateful at those who are truely free and can express themselves in anyway they feel. Thats what Marbury does, and a lot of people in this world can't do that and be bold as Steph, so they hate.

    Heres a quote from Marbury

    Stephon Marbury: When you’re happy and your smiling, haters are frowning. When you have a clear conscious and your mind is free, others are confused. When you can see where you’re going and no longer living in the dark, others are blinded by your light.

  6. #36
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Watching Golden State basketball is like me watching Florida International play ball under Isiah's whacky offense. Its just not a realistic statement. Lets just be real and say you haven't watched Randolph enough to believe he cannot produce at the NBA level.

    Marbury was full of ability, probably the most talented PG we've seen from the 90's who never reached full potential sadly. Marbury is 20th all time in career assist. He can ALWAYS pass, that was never a doubt. When you take into consideration and a clear assessment on who his teammates were, then you'll understand why Marbury struggled to win. Great teams win championships, not great players. KG was a top 3 player for most of his career before he won a championship. LeBron is now, and he never won it all.

    I don't know what SG is 20th all time in assist and had a career assist total at 8 per game. Marbury's career has surpassed Felton, so do not compare. Marbury never had the opportunity to play with players like Gallo, Chandler, and Amare (He had Amare when he was a rookie, same goes for KG) When you're FORCED to compared Marbury to the greatest pointguards of all time then you know your arguement is flawed. This isn't about Marbury being the greatest, he isn't. But he wasn't bad, nor he was never a problem. The problem was how teams were built around him. This was a man who can drop 12 + assist and 30 + points on any given night, especially in his prime. You think thats a problem to have? Its a luxury.

    as for Marbury's behavior...who are you?

    Who are you to judge Marbury?
    Judge Mathis?

    Come on man, your no saint either. Whatever Marbury does is his business and his life. He's hurting no one. People get angry and hateful at those who are truely free and can express themselves in anyway they feel. Thats what Marbury does, and a lot of people in this world can't do that and be bold as Steph, so they hate.

    Heres a quote from Marbury

    I believe I've watched him enough. Maybe you need more time to watch AR, but i've seen enough for now.. It's not like I don't see the good in him too. But those mistakes and the lack of fundamentals... Damn, that just overshadows everything else for me about him right now.

    Listen, I agree w you that Marbury had the tools to be one of the all-time greats. That is not debatable. You were wrong to come at me w a comprehensive defense of Marbury. I sited the crux of Marbury's problems as a player,and that is the psychological/mental piece. That is why I compared him to the greats. That aspect is what separates him from them. Your confused, lost in my rather simple argument.

    1. What Marbury lacks that other true floor generals have is the ability infuse a sense of confidence and positive spirit into the other four men he was on the court w. Magic, Paul they keep their teammates up, Nash too. They keep their teammates on good mental footing, they won't let them get down and they exude & encourage comaraderie. This is an important and sometimes overlooked aspect of being a true floor general. Some call it leadership. However it is more powerful and profound from the PG because they are the focal point and main facilitators of the offense. The PG get players the ball (or atleast are supposed to) at a point or spot on the court where they can do the most w it. If those guys miss it is the PGs job to keep them from getting down by going back to them, talking to them, using psychology. Marbury had no concept of the importance of this aspect true PGs must have. And it kept him from being able to lead a team properly.

    2. It doesn't take a genius to see Marbury moves to the beat of his own drum; and doesn't take X-ray vision to see he was a my-offense-first type of point guard. Marbury would rather score than use his savvy & vision to find and set up teammates or he did not have the vision to set up teammates and as result relied on his scoring more. Point blank. He had the passing ability of Nash or Paul. But imo his vision was not has good as those guys. I think he compensated for this lack of vision w scoring. This often distracted from the flow of offense on the clubs he ran.

    These two aspects, faults rather, are what doomed him from HOF status at the position and also from being a true floor general.

    He had the talent, but mentally he was hampered. That's why the mental aspect of the game is so important. It can truly limit one from reaching full potential, not just in basketball but in any profession.

    In Marbury's case the IQ factor kept him from getting to immortal status and that is the great tragedy and what makes him a fraud to me.

    But there is one last major flaw... Iverson at least had the sense to know although he could distribute he was a scorer and not a PG. Marbury's HUBRIS kept him believing he was a true PG, even though he wasn't. I think he would have been better off as a great tweener scorer like Iverson; then his mental makeup would not be in conflict we what he needed to do at the position. Iverson could get assists. Hell so could Jordan. But in their bones, deep down they're scorers. They have that mentality. Marbury always had more of scorers mentality at the PG position to me.
    Last edited by ronoranina; Dec 13, 2010 at 23:29.

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    First of all, D'Antoni has done a good job so far. We lost two close games, and looked great in all our victories. D'Antoni has a roster with 5 new players in Fields, Turiaf, Randolph, Felton, Mozgov. and Kelenna, Rautins, Mason who haven't really been part of the rotation. Its impressive me to get these guys gelling early.

    Lets assess this 9 man rotation and present a theory on why they will be a threat.

    Felton
    Passing - B
    Pick and Roll - B+
    Speed and Agility - B+
    Defense B
    Scoring - B-
    Quite possilby

    He's not Chris Paul or D-Will, but he goes in. Excellent all around PG.

    Fields

    Athelicism - B+
    Inside/Outside Ability - B
    Defense - B
    Jumpshot - B

    Only knock on Fields is his lateral quickness. But to assess, he's another overall offense/defense guy and meshes well with Ray Ray.

    Gallinari
    Shooting A
    Defense C
    Rebounding D
    IQ/Awareness - B+
    Inside Game - F

    Gallo to me is just Peja with more defense and potential. He is what he is.

    Stoudimire
    Inside scoring A+
    Pick and Roll C
    Defense - B-
    Rebounding - B
    Value - A+

    He's our franchise player...needs to work on his pick and roll play with Felton

    Turiaf

    Energy, Defense, Shotblocking, Rebounding, Intangibles

    Mozgov

    I don't know.

    Chandler

    You guys know I been a hater, but he's been our best all around player, I can't front. I feel like if he keeps playing like this we should use him as trade bait to get a superstar.

    Walker, love him.

    Douglas, I'm in love. seriously. Offensively, Defensively; he's been Jon Starks like.

    Randolph could be our best overall player once he starts getting minutes.

    This team is DEEP, strong and work well together. Everyone on this team can do something defensive and offensively.

    We're no longer one dimensional.

    Celebration bitches!
    Bolded and underlined part that really made me scratch my head and wonder... what you were thinking saying something like that. He really needs to get some understanding of the game. He does not have a great B-ball IQ

  8. #38
    Sexy Stud knickzrulezH20's Avatar
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    The Marbury debates/wars will never end lol.

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    It doesn't help that Marbury was part of an era that's basically like the Knicks' Dark Ages. Isiah's meddling didn't help and he made the dumbass move of seeing if Marbury and Steve Francis could work well together (and he was wrong).

    Chemistry-wise I'm not sure but there's no doubt that Marbury certainly was a talented player. Problem is the team could never put it together and I won't lie I don't think Marbury's feuding really helped (although considering Larry Brown's personality and Isiah being Isiah you wonder if one can really blame him).

    All in all he had some solid years with us but frankly those years were the worst years ever to be a Knicks fan so it's hard to like the guy for me. All in all I do think the Knicks handled the buyout badly...last I recall he showed up to training camp in D'Antoni's first year ready to play and in shape. For some dumbass reason D'Antoni gave the starting job to Duhon...but whatever.

    In any case now I think Randolph needs to grow up and mature a bit but for ****'s sake he's 21 years old and it takes many players 4 or 5 years to even be relevant in the league. Hell look at Steve Nash he came into the league at 22 years old and it still took him until his 5th year in the league to become anything close to being relevant. That means he was six years older than Randolph when he became a decent player and frankly it wasn't until his 30's that he started becoming a legit superstar and the best floor general in the league.

    Players take time to develop. Randolph is no exception, he'll need time before he becomes better. And if we don't trade him, we need to play him for him to get better. I understand that you don't want to mess with the winning streak, but does Randolph really deserve minutes over Mozgov?

    With regards to Gallo I think he'll really have an amazing season next year when he breaks out and really puts it all together. Last year we saw him as a one-trick pony who didn't do much more than shoot the open 3's until late in the year when he started having better games, especially that one where he matched up against Carmelo very well. This year we've seen him drive to the basket a lot more, drawing fouls and having much more confidence in his body and being willing to take a beating inside. He's also shown HUGE improvement on the defensive end, making good plays and all in all fitting much better into our team. Remember for all intents and purposes this is Gallo's second year...a second year forward adapting to the NBA game putting up 16 PPG is a pretty GOOD thing...

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    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    D'antoni knew from the get that Marbury was not a pass first PG. That is why he never had a chance at running our offense.

    Coach could not tolerate him. As bad as Duhon was he's was still a pass first guard.

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    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    D'antoni knew from the get that Marbury was not a pass first PG. That is why he never had a chance at running our offense.

    Coach could not tolerate him. As bad as Duhon was he's was still a pass first guard.
    Marbury never having a chance under D'Antoni was all politics.

    Marbury is 20th all time in the NBA in assist and has a career averaging of 8 assist a game.
    Passing wasn't a weakness for Marbury. Lets not kid ourselves here.

    He was no J-Kidd or Stockson, but Marbury is no slouch.
    He did carry a depleted Knicks roster into the playoffs averaging 22 and 9.
    I can't see Felton or Duhon EVER doing that, so lets just stop this madness.

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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    Marbury never having a chance under D'Antoni was all politics.

    Marbury is 20th all time in the NBA in assist and has a career averaging of 8 assist a game.
    Passing wasn't a weakness for Marbury. Lets not kid ourselves here.

    He was no J-Kidd or Stockson, but Marbury is no slouch.
    He did carry a depleted Knicks roster into the playoffs averaging 22 and 9.
    I can't see Felton or Duhon EVER doing that, so lets just stop this madness.
    As I stated in my above synopsis of Marbury, his ability to pass is not the problem. I said very clearly that Marbury's passing ability is on par w the all time greats..Did you read my response to you?? It's his vision that is the issue, or lack thereof, along w his propensity to lean more towards scoring than finding teammates. It's almost like Marbury begrudgingly passed to his tms. That was the air he had about him to me.

    As I said before Marbury's stubborn hubris blinded him to the fact he wasn't a true floor general. IMO he held on to this notion inspire of the reality he was more of scoring guard, w good passing skills. There have been plenty of those. None of them immortals as PGs however..

    Oh and Marbury's 21st on the all-time career assists list not 20th. He's behind Tiny Archibald.

    Metro, Marbury basketball-wise is everything I've stated. He is tweener who could pass and he lacked great vision. Again his assists were more of the "okay i'll pass to u because they're no better options" variety. He is not the quintessential TRUE PG. His lack of vision ie the ability to see the entire floor, read his teammates and defenders movements, while processing that info to make good split second decisions is the reason he is not higher on the list you site and also why he can't be considered amongst the great PGs of all time. That and his propensity for scoring over passing FIRST is what makes him what he is. These two aspects sort of act to fuel the other, a feedback loop if you will... But nonetheless they keep him from being a true floor general and legitimately great PG.

    And, it you read you would see I characterized him as lacking pass first ability. I didn't say he couldn't pass. Let's be clear here my dude.

    Felton however is a pass first PG or else he wouldn't be starting for Mike D'antoni. Period.
    Last edited by ronoranina; Dec 14, 2010 at 21:13.

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    Felton>>>>Marbury

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    Originally Posted by ronoranina
    As I stated in my above synopsis of Marbury, his ability to pass is not the problem. I said very clearly that Marbury's passing ability is on par w the all time greats..Did you read my response to you?? It's his vision that is the issue, or lack thereof, along w his propensity to lean more towards scoring than finding teammates. It's almost like Marbury begrudgingly passed to his tms. That was the air he had about him to me.

    As I said before Marbury's stubborn hubris blinded him to the fact he wasn't a true floor general. IMO he held on to this notion inspire of the reality he was more of scoring guard, w good passing skills. There have been plenty of those. None of them immortals as PGs however..

    Oh and Marbury's 21st on the all-time career assists list not 20th. He's behind Tiny Archibald.

    Metro, Marbury basketball-wise is everything I've stated. He is tweener who could pass and he lacked great vision. Again his assists were more of the "okay i'll pass to u because they're no better options" variety. He is not the quintessential TRUE PG. His lack of vision ie the ability to see the entire floor, read his teammates and defenders movements, while processing that info to make good split second decisions is the reason he is not higher on the list you site and also why he can't be considered amongst the great PGs of all time. That and his propensity for scoring over passing FIRST is what makes him what he is. These two aspects sort of act to fuel the other, a feedback loop if you will... But nonetheless they keep him from being a true floor general and legitimately great PG.

    And, it you read you would see I characterized him as lacking pass first ability. I didn't say he couldn't pass. Let's be clear here my dude.

    Felton however is a pass first PG or else he wouldn't be starting for Mike D'antoni. Period.
    Vision? Vision for what? His teammates were not elite players or anyone worth speaking off. No one would have been successful with the roster that was inherited throughout his years in Minnesota, New Jersey, Phoenix and NYC.

    Marbury's scoring was a gift. Too many people get offended by his ability to score the ball when it actually won us a lot of games. Marbury's dynamic ability to score and pass are special. When Marbury was on, he was on.



    Wow, 21 and 20. Such a difference. Thank you for clearing that up, you really made a HUGE point right there. Well, actually not. The fact that Marbury is next to Tiny Archibald just shows you what kind of class of elite PG's he's in.

    This whole lack of vision thing is totally an unproven notion by you that you're really looking too deeply in, its actually thoughtless in a sense. Was Marbury BLIND to the point he had no vision to see his teammates? No. You can't average 8-9 assist a game without no vision. Marbury didn't have Jason Kidd or Steve Nash vision, but he had something special that separated him from your average PG. You're spending too much energy into hating this guy rather than realizing his talents and attributes. He was a dynamic PG; history, stats and analysis will prove this.

    Felton is a pass first PG...uhm. The man is averaging the same Marbury average most of his career. He spent the half of his NBA career playing shooting guard for the Bobcats next to Brevin Knight (even though that was a questionable move by the Bobcats organization). Subjective and bias, yes. This isn't really factual that Felton is a pass first PG. He's more of a dynamic PG like Marbury. He helps us with his passing and SCORING.

    A pass first PG is Rajon Rando. Not Felton. Rando's scoring is horrible, and he shoots Free Throws like Shaq. His entire game is based on passing, not scoring. Felton is 2nd on the team in scoring. That is a fact.

    Nash, Rondo, Paul, Calderon. Pass first guys.

    Williams, Rose, Jennings, Felton...dynamic guys.

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    Originally Posted by Crazy8s
    Felton>>>>Marbury
    Haters gonna hate.

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