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Thread: Carmelo AndNoD is a Fraud.

  1. #16
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    People who claim Melo is overrated because of his defense and his low shooting percentages have to realize that Carmelo practically beats teams on his own when he has to.

    Seriously this is a team that CRUSHED the CP3-led Hornets and beat the Dirk-led Mavs all the while an aging Chauncey Billups shooting 42% was their primary second option...Melo is legit, he's got game and his track record proves it.

    Edit: So I went and looked at it some more...

    Carmelo is 7th amongst NBA forwards in assists per game. That's not bad considering he, unlike LeBron and whatnot, is NOT ever the primary ballhandler for his team...he's not a Point Forward like LeBron is, he works just fine having a PG distribute the ball to him because he's a great off the ball player.

    Carmelo is one of the best rebounding SF in the league - he's 19th in the league (or was it 17th? I counted badly...doesn't matter) in rebounding amongst NBA forwards, but all of the players ahead of him are generally power forwards...in other words he's probably one of the better rebounding SFs there is in basketball.

    Carmelo is 7th in the league in FTA per game, and is improving his 3-point shooting as well.

    Make no mistake guys, this guy is a premier offensive threat in the league. His defense may be questionable AT TIMES, but he's the real deal and his offense is just THAT good. If LeBron and Wade who are the same player with different heights can complement each other well enough on that Miami Heat team, then Carmelo and Amar'e can both do excellent considering both are great whilst not functioning as the primary ball handler of the team.

    In other words, let's get him.
    Last edited by SSj4Wingzero; Dec 23, 2010 at 23:19.

  2. #17
    Super Moderator RunningJumper's Avatar
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    I'm just sick of the "We need Melo" line. We don't even know what would happen if he came to our team. It's more of a toss-up situation. He'd get his numbers, but would we have the depth?

    Push for Curry's contract plus a pick or two and someone who doesn't look like they might be in our future rotation. Denver can get cap-space. If they don't like that then forget it.

  3. #18
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    Yes certainly it doesn't do us any good to get Carmelo whilst giving up half of our rotation.

    We should do what we can to build the best team possible...that's all there is to it...if we can get a good trade, then pull the trigger on it. But if there isn't a good trade...then it's not worth giving up what we have. We're already a middle of the road playoff team in the East...to become a top tier team we just need a better C and a solid second scoring option, that's it...

  4. #19
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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzero
    People who claim Melo is overrated because of his defense and his low shooting percentages have to realize that Carmelo practically beats teams on his own when he has to.

    Seriously this is a team that CRUSHED the CP3-led Hornets and beat the Dirk-led Mavs all the while an aging Chauncey Billups shooting 42% was their primary second option...Melo is legit, he's got game and his track record proves it.

    Edit: So I went and looked at it some more...

    Carmelo is 7th amongst NBA forwards in assists per game. That's not bad considering he, unlike LeBron and whatnot, is NOT ever the primary ballhandler for his team...he's not a Point Forward like LeBron is, he works just fine having a PG distribute the ball to him because he's a great off the ball player.

    Carmelo is one of the best rebounding SF in the league - he's 19th in the league (or was it 17th? I counted badly...doesn't matter) in rebounding amongst NBA forwards, but all of the players ahead of him are generally power forwards...in other words he's probably one of the better rebounding SFs there is in basketball.

    Carmelo is 7th in the league in FTA per game, and is improving his 3-point shooting as well.

    Make no mistake guys, this guy is a premier offensive threat in the league. His defense may be questionable AT TIMES, but he's the real deal and his offense is just THAT good. If LeBron and Wade who are the same player with different heights can complement each other well enough on that Miami Heat team, then Carmelo and Amar'e can both do excellent considering both are great whilst not functioning as the primary ball handler of the team.

    In other words, let's get him.
    ^^ very nice. For one, he doesn't have a great cast if shooters knocking down his assists, and either way for a forward he IS a capable passer as I was saying w what I believe is ~3 assists/game.

    Let's be real, this isn't Monte Ellis who is more of a true "ball hog". Idk. Ellis isnt even that bad. He isn't Jamal Crawford.

    Metro's stat seems to show he isn't a terribly "efficient" scorer. Right? I'm sure there's something to it. In turn, Gallo is a leage leading type guy in True Offensive Scoring stats, when clearly as a player, he is rather inconsistent and shoots a low %fg.

    I counter the Melo doubters, who don't necessarily have incorrect doubts, by just saying: if we don't get Melo, the only way we realistically win a title is if Gallo/Chandler, ages ~22, become legit all stars, and/or we beast this off season in signings. We have a championship window to optimally work within, and go for the kill as many times as we have years within it.

    **I predicate all this upon Walsh being a cut throat negotiator, and setting it up where DEN can **** off if they don't buckle and risk Melo just walking so they can get NJ offer or what not. In which case I won't shed a tear; I'm a fan going the other route, though I think it's riskier. Kirilienko, BigBaby, M.Gasol, Richardson, Mayo, keeping Chandler. The off season could be ripe w acquisitions.

    edit -- will say, Rono dogging Melo so hard worries me. Broheem can evaluate talent. A no wonder he's such a staunch Gallo fan.

  5. #20
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    If we don't get Melo then I think our best bet is to go for Mayo and a backup C. Then we sign CP3 as a free agent the next offseason and with a core of:

    CP3
    Mayo
    Gallo
    Amar'e
    Backup C

    We'd be in business.

  6. #21
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    Nobody here has yet to disprove Metro's comparison of Melo to Glen. It is a very good comparison.

    I'll help: The one big difference between Melo and Glen is that Melo has more 4th quarter comebacks. Also, Melo has a better post game.

    Beyond that, I'm not sure.

    My big worry is still the fact he has been an isolation player his entire career and we run a different system. There is nothing that garuntees he can make the transition so well.

    In addition, Melo is not an automatic three point shooter and Melo's post game will not be utilized in our system. Look at our players, even STAT is a face up player. We will be taking away a huge aspect of Melo's game. So how effective will he be then?

    Melo does not make our team better in our current system. And we aren't even there yet with our current roster.

    For Example:

    Suns stats

    05-06 - 110.2 ppg, 47.9% FGP, 39.9%3PP
    06-07 - 110.2 ppg, 49.4% FGP, 39.9%3PP
    07-08 - 110.1 ppg, 50.0% FGP, 39.3%3PP

    Us currently,

    10-11 - 108.1 ppg, 46.6% FGP, 36.9%3PP

    So how does Melo help our team? We run a system where we have to have range and efficiency. Melo fails at both of those aspects and by taking away his post game he is even a worse player.
    Last edited by Blas; Dec 24, 2010 at 08:53.

  7. #22
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    Originally Posted by Blas
    Nobody here has yet to disprove Metro's comparison of Melo to Glen. It is a very good comparison.

    I'll help: The one big difference between Melo and Glen is that Melo has more 4th quarter comebacks. Also, Melo has a better post game.

    Beyond that, I'm not sure.

    My big worry is still the fact he has been an isolation player his entire career and we run a different system. There is nothing that garuntees he can make the transition so well.


    In addition, Melo is not an automatic three point shooter and Melo's post game will not be utilized in our system. Look at our players, even STAT is a face up player. We will be taking away a huge aspect of Melo's game. So how effective will he be then?

    Melo does not make our team better in our current system. And we aren't even there yet with our current roster.

    For Example:

    Suns stats

    05-06 - 110.2 ppg, 47.9% FGP, 39.9%3PP
    06-07 - 110.2 ppg, 49.4% FGP, 39.9%3PP
    07-08 - 110.1 ppg, 50.0% FGP, 39.3%3PP

    Us currently,

    10-11 - 108.1 ppg, 46.6% FGP, 36.9%3PP

    So how does Melo help our team? We run a system where we have to hae range and efficiency. Melo fails at both of those aspects and by taking away his post game he is even a worse player.

    We have a winner.

  8. #23
    Veteran la2ny's Avatar
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    I wonder if they let D'ant go after this year

  9. #24
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Melo could be more efficient, ala Bernard King. Who shot over 50% for more than a few seasons when he was devastating the League. However Melo shoots threes at a low %, which drives down his fg%.

    If I had to say whether he leans more towards Glenn Robinson or Bernard King, I'd have to say he's more like Bernard. He just needs to "augment" his game like Clyde likes to say by scoring closer to the basket where he'd make more, or become a better shooter from range. It would be a quicker fix for him to eliminate the 3 point bombing, for him to go old school like Bernard. Then he be much more efficient..

    In our offense tho we want guys to take 3's, so if we were to get him the above would not be a viable answer for solving the efficiency question. We'd have to hope that he'd get better looks in transition and in the flow of our offense in the half court. The way our offense is, it would not be illogical for us to expect a slight numbers/ efficiency bump. Right??

    I have to be real and say that although Melo and Amare have similar games, ultimately they'd work it out. I've changed my thinking on this some.. There'd be stagnation initially, maybe a bit of leaning curve re: how to play off of one another, but we'd be better obviously and teams would have a hard time w the two of them and our complimentary pieces working within the confines of SSOL. It would undoubtedly be tough on teams.

    One thing we are missing, is how great Melo is at running the floor and finishing in transition. This would be a great ++ for our Offense as we luv to get the ball up the court quickly. Melo likes to basket hang for easy buckets and can play w a certain savvy in the half court that would help us score even more effectively than the high level we have been, as long as we don't have to give up too many of our other pieces, which doesn't seem to be likely scenario if we were to trade for him.

    Ultimately NJ has more to give Denver so we are at a disadvantage anyway. Hence the preference Denver has for dealing w them. I'm not sure they're even taking Donnie's calls at this point. And, unless Donnie can put together a better package than NJ, which he can't, logically would it make sense for them? This is why Denver won't change their stance on whatever their asking from us, whatever that is-- and if it's too much Donnie shouldn't do a deal. He should avoid a rape at all costs.

    Denver is just going to continue to wait until Melo agrees to resign w NJ. Denver is in a good position. They have a team that already has the package they want. AND they have the prospect of a new CBA, which means a tremendous amount to Melo for obvious reasons, prolly more than coming to NY (i realize i'm speculating here). And pls be real, NJ would not trade for him unless he agrees to resign. That's the only thing holding up this trade. I think he'll agree sooner or later.

  10. #25
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    I realize Melo isn't a great 3 point shooter...but is that REALLY such a big problem?

    He can hit an open 3 if he HAS to, and Melo's strength is in his post game and his ability to use his insane athleticism to get to the basket and draw fouls better than ANYBODY else in the league.

    Why would we lessen his effectiveness by having him behind the arc? We already have great 3-point shooters...furthermore if Amar'e is not on the floor (which is probably the times when Carmelo is going to get the ball the most) then we can put Chandler/Fields/Felton on the floor with Carmelo and they can hit the 3-point shot just fine...

    Again Melo isn't the most EFFICIENT scorer but he makes up for it by getting to the line really well. We should take advantage of that and instead have Melo use his post game and his quickness to draw fouls.

  11. #26
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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzeo
    I realize Melo isn't a great 3 point shooter...but is that REALLY such a big problem?

    He can hit an open 3 if he HAS to

    He doesn't though.

    Bernard King wouldn't be a good it on this Knicks team either, same goes to Glenn and Melo. so you post is pointless rono.

  12. #27
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    He's about as efficient as Monta Ellis. Actually less efficient. Would you trade Fields + Chandler + Gallo for Monta Ellis?

  13. #28
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    Originally Posted by LJ4ptplay
    He's about as efficient as Monta Ellis. Actually less efficient. Would you trade Fields + Chandler + Gallo for Monta Ellis?
    Thank you.
    Thank you.
    and Thank you.

  14. #29
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    Are we really comparing Melo with Monta now? No. seriously are we?

    Howard has similar numbers with Shaq just for arguments sake but that doesn't mean they are to be put in the same sentence.

  15. #30
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by metrocard
    He doesn't though.

    Bernard King wouldn't be a good it on this Knicks team either, same goes to Glenn and Melo. so you post is pointless rono.
    Admittedly, sometimes i'm just posting something to post something.

    But...

    I don't agree at all that my post was pointless. You're entitled to your option tho..

    I made an assessment, w a comparison, of a player you called a fraud, and a prognosis for how he'd fit w Amare. Which is hardly irrelevant, no?

    Oh and Melo's a fraud but Marbury isn't?? Common dude.. You might want to rethink that one Metro.
    Last edited by ronoranina; Dec 25, 2010 at 16:57.

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