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Thread: Are the Knicks better WITHOUT Gallo?

  1. #31
    Member BleedOrange&Blue's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by LJ4ptplay
    We beat the Spurs without Melo, we must be better without Melo.

    Dallas is winning without Dirk, they must be better without him.

    Knick fans overreact over everything. Sometimes they are the best fans but sometimes they are the worst.
    Winning is not the metric that must be used to determine whether we are better with or without a player so your logic is a little loose and simplistic. The question is are we better without Gallo? (as in do we play better?) While it is certainly to early to say one way or the other, We did not miss Gallo against the Spurs as we scored 128 points against a reasonable defensive team and our defense and rebounding was better.

    Many on ere including myself have been saying that Gallo is expendable for months now as e does not provide us with what we need which is defense and rebounding. Between Amar'e, Felton and Chandler we can score all day and Gallo's value is severely diminished. Gallo is basically Matt Bonner of the Knicks right now, His role is easily filled by Shawne Williams or Bill Walker. So looking forward it might be better to trade Gallo or make him part of the our shallow second unit.

  2. #32
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    Btw, i'd like to add, I enjoy wins...

    But I wasn't happy giving up 90+ points by the third qtr win or not. Its indicative and a formula for long term failure.

    And I do realize we can't shoot 67% over a half against the bst teams, I add that to my evaluation also. Keep it funky my n!ggas.

  3. #33
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    Originally Posted by BleedOrange&Blue
    Winning is not the metric that must be used to determine whether we are better with or without a player so your logic is a little loose and simplistic. The question is are we better without Gallo? (as in do we play better?) While it is certainly to early to say one way or the other, We did not miss Gallo against the Spurs as we scored 128 points against a reasonable defensive team and our defense and rebounding was better.

    Many on ere including myself have been saying that Gallo is expendable for months now as e does not provide us with what we need which is defense and rebounding. Between Amar'e, Felton and Chandler we can score all day and Gallo's value is severely diminished. Gallo is basically Matt Bonner of the Knicks right now, His role is easily filled by Shawne Williams or Bill Walker. So looking forward it might be better to trade Gallo or make him part of the our shallow second unit.
    Exactly, and my bad if I offended you in any other posts.

  4. #34
    Veteran LJ4ptplay's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Red
    Wake up McFly, I mean LJ....

    We've been discussing this for years, since he got here.
    The current circumstance I.e we have a legit 1 & 4, adds to the situation which may or may not be coming to frucian.

    Posters/ writers make assertions, state opinions, then we look at the data... theory, then application. That's it, not reaction. Gallo has always been limited, we haven't always had a chance to see how we do with better players minus his inconsistent contributions.

    Evaluate and let me know using your logic, not your personal feelings.

    Originally Posted by BleedOrange&Blue
    Winning is not the metric that must be used to determine whether we are better with or without a player so your logic is a little loose and simplistic. The question is are we better without Gallo? (as in do we play better?) While it is certainly to early to say one way or the other, We did not miss Gallo against the Spurs as we scored 128 points against a reasonable defensive team and our defense and rebounding was better.

    Many on ere including myself have been saying that Gallo is expendable for months now as e does not provide us with what we need which is defense and rebounding. Between Amar'e, Felton and Chandler we can score all day and Gallo's value is severely diminished. Gallo is basically Matt Bonner of the Knicks right now, His role is easily filled by Shawne Williams or Bill Walker. So looking forward it might be better to trade Gallo or make him part of the our shallow second unit.
    I'll repost this since you two missed the point:

    And for those of you that watched the game last night, Turiaf only played his typical 20 minutes. We still played small ball for the majority of the night.

    This has nothing to do with starting a traditional lineup. Williams and Walker, not Turiaf, got Gallo's minutes. Chandler still played a lot at PF and even some at Center, not at SF. I'll take Gallo over Williams and Walker any day.

    Chandler, and the other players, stepped it up with one of our key pieces down. This is what good teams with a good coach do. End of discussion.

    And this was one freaking game. Sheesh. If we beat the top teams with Chandler playing starter minutes at SF and go back to our inconsistent ways when Gallo takes over at SF, then we can debate this. Until then, drop your desire to root against D'Antoni and Gallo.

  5. #35
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    Hey red monkey ass - why don't YOU shut the fkk up? hmm...

    that guy didnt even say **** to you and you explode like a little bitch.

    pffhhh, w/e...

  6. #36
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    btw, YES......gallo sucks man. for as hard as he tries, he's a streaky player. goes big or goes home, and unfortunately that's half the time.

    PLUS he's injury prone...wilson chandler is actually better than gallo at just about everything, INCLUDING 3-pts... lols

  7. #37
    SWAGABURY KingStarbury3's Avatar
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    Interesting Read....I read through just about all this thread.

    Originally Posted by Toons
    gallo spreads the floor period.....so he is needed, and his shot is respected around the league, no one leaves him wide open anymore. I just dont think he should be playing 30+ mins. 20-25 mins of gallo is all i need for this season. Until he earns more mins, he deserves travis outlaw mins.
    This post probably sums it up the best, I could see Gallo being a real nice fit off the bench. I think hes still getting some extra star treatment from his fellow Italian buddy coach. There was a very interesting chart in the gamethread about how our offense is better with Gallinari but our defense is better without him.


    <TABLE style="HEIGHT: 130px" border=1 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=322><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102></TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>W/ GALLINARI</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>W/O GALLINARI</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Pts/48 Mins</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>108.9</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>99.4 (937 in 452 min)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Opp Pts/48 Mins</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>106.9</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>101.3 (955 in 452 min)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Pt diff/48 Mins</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>+2.0</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>-1.9 (-18 in 452 min)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>48.0</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>43.1 (350-812)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>3-pt FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>38.6</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>34.1 (85-249)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Opp FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>47.7</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>44.2 (353-799)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Opp 3-pt FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>38.9</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>32.2 (56-174)</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


    So thats minus 9.5pts from our offense without him but our defense gives up 5.6 less points with him not on the court. The gain is not bigger then the loss, so clearly Gallo has some value on this team. Thats just for the posters that are anti-Gallo and want him off this team. But what Toons said is perfect....20 to 25 minutes off the bench.

  8. #38
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    Everyone knows if we substitute Gallo for Mello we are a much improved team. If the opportunity is there you have to jump on it. I doubt that Stat Felt and Wilson will be playing hot in every game, not with this many minutes. We already have Dougie and Turi playing thru pain. So we must add more fire power. The fact that Gallo is out for 2 to 3 weeks with ONLY a Mild knee spain is another reason why this tuff team doesn't need this frail flopping D'antoni son. We will have a better chance without him on the team. You can look at his numbers and see that for yourself...he is expendable. What part is hard to understand?

  9. #39
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    Originally Posted by LJ4ptplay
    I'll repost this since you two missed the point:

    And for those of you that watched the game last night, Turiaf only played his typical 20 minutes. We still played small ball for the majority of the night.

    This has nothing to do with starting a traditional lineup. Williams and Walker, not Turiaf, got Gallo's minutes. Chandler still played a lot at PF and even some at Center, not at SF. I'll take Gallo over Williams and Walker any day.

    Chandler, and the other players, stepped it up with one of our key pieces down. This is what good teams with a good coach do. End of discussion.

    And this was one freaking game. Sheesh. If we beat the top teams with Chandler playing starter minutes at SF and go back to our inconsistent ways when Gallo takes over at SF, then we can debate this. Until then, drop your desire to root against D'Antoni and Gallo.
    Seriously tho, what is your point? I am actually pro D'Antoni and anti-Gallo so your assumptions fail . Wat i am trying to say ere is tat Gallo is not needed, if we can trade for a big man, Shawne Williams and Bill Walker can fill the role of one dimensional gunner off the bench.

    As for your assertion that this is just one game, again your logic is flawed. Gallo has been inconsistent and mediocre all season. Even when he has good games, hes not going for 25-30 points on 50% shooting. He is not a lockdown defender, and he is a crappy rebounder for his 6-10 frame. This evaluation is not the reaction to 1 game but a whole season of disappointment and mediocrity.

    Even the sensible Gallo Fans will tell you hes not playing to their expectations and that Chandler is head and shoulders above him right now.

  10. #40
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    Originally Posted by KingStarbury3
    Interesting Read....I read through just about all this thread.



    This post probably sums it up the best, I could see Gallo being a real nice fit off the bench. I think hes still getting some extra star treatment from his fellow Italian buddy coach. There was a very interesting chart in the gamethread about how our offense is better with Gallinari but our defense is better without him.


    <TABLE style="HEIGHT: 130px" border=1 cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 width=322><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102></TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>W/ GALLINARI</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>W/O GALLINARI</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Pts/48 Mins</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>108.9</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>99.4 (937 in 452 min)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Opp Pts/48 Mins</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>106.9</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>101.3 (955 in 452 min)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Pt diff/48 Mins</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>+2.0</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>-1.9 (-18 in 452 min)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>48.0</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>43.1 (350-812)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>3-pt FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>38.6</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>34.1 (85-249)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Opp FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>47.7</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>44.2 (353-799)</TD></TR><TR><TD vAlign=top width=102>Opp 3-pt FG pct</TD><TD vAlign=top width=103>38.9</TD><TD vAlign=top width=131>32.2 (56-174)</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


    So thats minus 9.5pts from our offense without him but our defense gives up 5.6 less points with him not on the court. The gain is not bigger then the loss, so clearly Gallo has some value on this team. Thats just for the posters that are anti-Gallo and want him off this team. But what Toons said is perfect....20 to 25 minutes off the bench.
    I think you make some good points here. Right now Wilson is a superior player and can play SF and PF effectively. When Gallo is on the floor Wilson is pushed into the PF position which makes us undersized and very susceptible to being out-rebounded. With Gallo coming off the bench Chandler plays his more natural SF spot and we get to add Size and rebounding with Turiaf or a potential trade or signing of a big man like M. Gasol or Tyson Chandler. If we were to trade Gallo it wouldn't hurt as he is replaced by Shawne Williams and Billy Walker

  11. #41
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    Default Gallo - Chandler - Melo

    Last night's results produced a thread that at base reflects some disdain for Gallinari's talent level. To some extent it resurfaces the common Chandler versus Gallo theme. And in the background, of course, is the what do we do about Melo question.

    Chandler has been sensational this year and he is currently plainly more consistently productive than Gallo. But being currently less productive than Chandler is hardly embarrassing. There are precious few players performing at a level equal to or above Chandler's.

    If we get the opportunity to sign Melo as a free agent, we will not be able to sign Chandler within whatever the cap is likely to be. If we trade for Melo and the Nuggets do not demand Chandler, we will have to give up Gallo as well as other assets and the cost of keeping Melo and Chandler will put us over the cap going forward for a substantial period of time. And we will still be without a reasonably dominant big man, a back-up point guard, and perhaps a backup shooting guard.

    Chandler's emergence makes me less inclined to seek out Melo. Chandler's game is similar, though obviously not as strong offensively, as Melo's. Gallo would probably complement Melo better than Chandler. And Chander will be less expensive than Melo, thus increasing cap room for other needs. Assets otherwise spent in acquiring Melo will be available to fill our other needs.

    I like our current team and consider both Chandler and Gallo integral parts of the team.

    If anything, last night's game suggests that D'Antoni can afford to give more minutes to Williams, Walker and others, with or without Gallo.

  12. #42
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    Originally Posted by BleedOrange&Blue
    Seriously tho, what is your point? I am actually pro D'Antoni and anti-Gallo so your assumptions fail . Wat i am trying to say ere is tat Gallo is not needed, if we can trade for a big man, Shawne Williams and Bill Walker can fill the role of one dimensional gunner off the bench.

    As for your assertion that this is just one game, again your logic is flawed. Gallo has been inconsistent and mediocre all season. Even when he has good games, hes not going for 25-30 points on 50% shooting. He is not a lockdown defender, and he is a crappy rebounder for his 6-10 frame. This evaluation is not the reaction to 1 game but a whole season of disappointment and mediocrity.

    Even the sensible Gallo Fans will tell you hes not playing to their expectations and that Chandler is head and shoulders above him right now.
    Co-sign.

    I'll add Gallo has been inconsistent and mediocre his entire career.

    Head and shoulders. Now if this continues, do our plans for Gallo and Ill Will change?

  13. #43
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    Originally Posted by BleedOrange&Blue
    I think you make some good points here. Right now Wilson is a superior player and can play SF and PF effectively. When Gallo is on the floor Wilson is pushed into the PF position which makes us undersized and very susceptible to being out-rebounded. With Gallo coming off the bench Chandler plays his more natural SF spot and we get to add Size and rebounding with Turiaf or a potential trade or signing of a big man like M. Gasol or Tyson Chandler. If we were to trade Gallo it wouldn't hurt as he is replaced by Shawne Williams and Billy Walker
    While i do think trading Gallo would hurt our offense a little bit, I do believe it would be worth it if we got back Mark gasol or especially Tyson Chandler. Chandler might be available now, the Mavs know they aint winning no championship with caron butler out the rest of the year. I dont care how good that team plays, they wont get past the spurs and the Lakers. They know it too just like the Jazz and most the other teams out west.

    The impact Tyson Chandler would make on this team defensively is greater then the impact losing gallo would have on our offense.

    However, my gut tells me that all of this is irrelevant and the Knicks are still trying to find a way they can **** up the team and get carmello. Id rather have his teammate and former Knick (for only a few minutes) Nene Hilario

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    If I'm right, Denver can't really dictate what or who we should give up....not with that extension still sitting on the table. If Mello wants to come here (and nowhere else) Denver is going to have to settle. I really don't think Denver has any real power in this, They can take what we give them or loose out completely in FA.

    We have a better chance at keeping Will if we trade for Mello now and not wait for the off season. Anyway you put it I doubt Wilson is leaving NY. The fans will not allow it...especially if he keeps playing like the way he is.

    Great teams always find a way to keep their best players...always.

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    Since this thread is based off of last night's performance, I think we need to fix some errors in some arguments:

    Chandler is having his best season and playing a majority of his minutes at PF NOT SF, meaning he has been playing WITH Gallo not replacing him.

    Chandler last night did not replace Gallo, Walker and Williams took Gallo's minutes.

    Turiaf played his 20 minutes, we were small ball most of the time. We did not change our strategy.


    So the argument I believe, should come down to this: Is Walker and Williams >>> Gallo?

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