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Thread: Are the Knicks better WITHOUT Gallo?

  1. #151
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    Originally Posted by iSaYughh
    Dude. The quote was saying that games we do lose we would have lost without Gallo in the lineup, too -- you parsed it -- and that the entire premise of most of these discussions is moot, and the points trying to show Gallo's (lack of worth) don't hold up.

    Anywaya, the only reason we've had a chance to compete and win some tough games (a la OKC) since Gallo's return has been because of...Gallo. The team getting W's in games during an ice cold stretch, mainly bc of Felton n Amare n Chandler as individuals poor play, doesn't reflect their worth -- let alone Gallo, who's played pretty well.
    Uh huh... sounds good.

  2. #152
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    Default Gallo's Worth

    In classical logic there is a fallacy known as "post hoc, ergo propter hoc" (after X, therefore because of X). It is a fallacy.

    There is legitmate ground for criticizing Gallinari, particularly in light of the hyped support he seems to be given by management, but to suggest that the Knicks are better without him or that he is responsible for the current string of losses is ridiculous.

    Over the last five games -- all losses -- Chandler has averaged 10.6 points at a field goal percentage of .348 and a 3 point percentage of .181. Felton's numbers for the same period are 12 points a game, a .291 field goal percentage and a .285 3 point percentage. Amar'e's percentage for the five games is .423. For the season it is .498, a number below his career percentage. Fields' numbers are reasonably steady but his season field goal percentage is .517 and for the last 5 games it has been .423. But Fields does not take a lot of shots. He has taken only 32 over the last 5 games. Amar'e has taken 111, Felton 79 and Chandler 66.

    Over the last 5 games Gallo has taken 43 shots, at a field goal percentage of .465. He has taken 15 three point shots and converted 5 for .33. He has averaged 16.8 points a game.

    Our recent problems are primarily the poor offensive play of Felton and Chandler. We were winning in large part becuase of their stellar play. During our losing streak Gallo's play has improved. He is not the current culprit.

  3. #153
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    Gallo's 7-12 night was amazing and demonstrates that he can be an excellent contributor just driving to the basket.

    D'Antoni needs to shake up to game plan and find a way to get Chandler and Felton to stop taking shots when they've been shooting cold. Gallo is the only player we have who might actually be on a hot streak

  4. #154
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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzero
    Gallo's 7-12 night was amazing and demonstrates that he can be an excellent contributor just driving to the basket.

    D'Antoni needs to shake up to game plan and find a way to get Chandler and Felton to stop taking shots when they've been shooting cold. Gallo is the only player we have who might actually be on a hot streak
    He's also one of the few players with the will and skill to be icing games for us and performing in the clutch right now.

  5. #155
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    Originally Posted by Oldtimer
    In classical logic there is a fallacy known as "post hoc, ergo propter hoc" (after X, therefore because of X). It is a fallacy.

    There is legitmate ground for criticizing Gallinari, particularly in light of the hyped support he seems to be given by management, but to suggest that the Knicks are better without him or that he is responsible for the current string of losses is ridiculous.

    Over the last five games -- all losses -- Chandler has averaged 10.6 points at a field goal percentage of .348 and a 3 point percentage of .181. Felton's numbers for the same period are 12 points a game, a .291 field goal percentage and a .285 3 point percentage. Amar'e's percentage for the five games is .423. For the season it is .498, a number below his career percentage. Fields' numbers are reasonably steady but his season field goal percentage is .517 and for the last 5 games it has been .423. But Fields does not take a lot of shots. He has taken only 32 over the last 5 games. Amar'e has taken 111, Felton 79 and Chandler 66.

    Over the last 5 games Gallo has taken 43 shots, at a field goal percentage of .465. He has taken 15 three point shots and converted 5 for .33. He has averaged 16.8 points a game.

    Our recent problems are primarily the poor offensive play of Felton and Chandler. We were winning in large part becuase of their stellar play. During our losing streak Gallo's play has improved. He is not the current culprit.
    I really dig your posts Oldtimer.

    That said, make no mistake about it, the thread was meant to discuss are we as a team better, not if we should trade Gallo, or he is the reason for this or that.

    Thanks for the stats though, I had no idea how much Gallo's presence messes everyone up...lol

  6. #156
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    Default Gallo's Fault for Felton's Misses

    C'mon Red, are you suggesting that Gallo's presence is responsible for Felton's recent shooting at a 29% clip?

    In the Thunder game, Landry Fields hit a 3 point shot with 5:09 left. No one other than Felton or Amar'e took a shot after that, and the two of them were 2 or 3 for 11 in that span of time. i am not sure that any one other than Felton or Amar'e even touched the ball in the offensive half court in the last three or four minutes. Felton alone lost that game because he tried to be the hero and, at the end, neglected even Amar'e.

    i can accept an argument that Gallo should not start or that his minutes should be limited, but you seem to think he belongs in street clothes next to Eddie Curry. He is valuable, perhaps not as valuable as some of us think, but he is certainly valuable.

    Gallo is somewhat athletically challenged, but he is an effficient scorer because he gets his points without being a volume shooter and he does spread the floor. Although his recent driving to the hoop is at times impressive, some of his "finishes" verge on the comical. But Gallo does not interfere with anyone else's play. Indeed, D'Antoni's system seems to plant him in the corner, waiting like a statue for a kick-out which rarely comes. He neither demands the ball nor does he get it frequently.

  7. #157
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    ^^he may provide comic relief with his bizarre game, but he is serious in what he does... and that's a shame.

    I just think we can do better, trade him and follow him thru out the league just like the rest of the people we dump for all I care. Since we are in the biz of dumping...we should dump the waste and build on the players that play well with each other...not getting dunk on all the time, flipperty flopping and waiting in the corner waiting for your sorry shot to come.
    Why keep him if we can get better?

  8. #158
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    Cool Gallo's raw performance is the 8th man off the bench

    This thread seems to aim more at Gallo being a "Starter" and a "33 minute Player", which Gallo is neither.
    Gallo's inconsistency plus raw talent questions his position/usage as an offense/defense player. A 6.10 Gallo in his 3rd season has showed no consistency in any area of his talent. The talent/potential is there but Gallo shows to many signs in his performance of still being underdevelope for the NBA, poor developing from the headcoach. Gallo is lost on the defensive end of the court..... who should Gallo defend in a man to man defense? PF? SF? SG? or in a zone defense? peremeter? paint? or both at the foul line?

    Consistency is doing the samething for 3 to 4 games straight no matter the different competition, which Gallo has yet to do in 3 seasons, or 3 quarters in a game.
    Who performance were better their first season with the Knicks?
    Gallo or Shawn Williams? or were the two players equal?
    Next season should Shawn Williams be a 33 minute starter???

  9. #159
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    Gallo is the second most valuable player on our team. We are talking about a 6'10 forward who can handle run the floor hit the long ball and gets to the line (6FTA PG)

    How does this team not benefit from having him on the floor. I however think he should play a Ginobli role when with the second unit because Toney D is raw at the PG position and Gallo has shown ability to run the ball.

    Maybe he should come off the bench because when he is with the starters there is always a 4-7 min period where he doesn't even touch the ball, Even though he is one of our most efficient scorers on our team. He has had multiple games with 18+ points on less than 10FGA


    No way this team is better without Gallo.

  10. #160
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    Originally Posted by Oldtimer
    C'mon Red, are you suggesting that Gallo's presence is responsible for Felton's recent shooting at a 29% clip?

    In the Thunder game, Landry Fields hit a 3 point shot with 5:09 left. No one other than Felton or Amar'e took a shot after that, and the two of them were 2 or 3 for 11 in that span of time. i am not sure that any one other than Felton or Amar'e even touched the ball in the offensive half court in the last three or four minutes. Felton alone lost that game because he tried to be the hero and, at the end, neglected even Amar'e.

    i can accept an argument that Gallo should not start or that his minutes should be limited, but you seem to think he belongs in street clothes next to Eddie Curry. He is valuable, perhaps not as valuable as some of us think, but he is certainly valuable.

    Gallo is somewhat athletically challenged, but he is an effficient scorer because he gets his points without being a volume shooter and he does spread the floor. Although his recent driving to the hoop is at times impressive, some of his "finishes" verge on the comical. But Gallo does not interfere with anyone else's play. Indeed, D'Antoni's system seems to plant him in the corner, waiting like a statue for a kick-out which rarely comes. He neither demands the ball nor does he get it frequently.
    No I'm not sugessting Gallo was directly responsible for Felton or anyones numbers, I was joking.

    I do feel we as a team play better with him off the floor for many reasons, and he's better served coming off the bench. We agree.

    Without him we focus more on d, move the ball bettr, have more efficient possessions and just play better together. It almost feels like everyone knows he's favoured, limited but really can't do anything but try and play with him.

    I even stopped short of compiling actual game film and situations that illustrate my point but I chose not to.

    I was tempted to post video from recent games, where we were behind and just ran up the court and let him chuck, multiple times. No ball movement, no hesitation, no cerebral ball, just run up and shoot. Bad shots, worse shot selection, poor fundamentals.

    I look for logic, and the buck stops w MDA and Gallo who else is responsible for such boneheaded mistakes? And it happens time after time, game after game. So obvious that to me if I have to break out the game film and show this...

    Then to me you don't know basketball. When you see Gallo play whether you're a fan or not, yu can LIKE him, but if you can't conclude this dude has no real basketball skill in terms of body movement, balance, how to use his body and take fundamental shots, then you aren't worthy of a real bb discussion.

    If you know ball, you know what I mean.

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    Great post, Red. I think even the most die hard Gallo fans are strating to see this now. He is a rhythm killer. People really need to watch the games. Do they notice when and where we go on spurts... and where and when we go in slumps.

    I would have no problem with this dude if he came off the bench and wasn't the coaches son. He clearly is favoring him over others and his minutes are way up for some one who mainly hides around the 3pt line

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    Gallo averages 10.5 FG per game which is 4th on our team despite being the most efficient scorer on the team he's only 4th in shots taken.

    Tell me again how he's favored over other players? If anything he's NOT favored. He's taking the 4th most shots despite being a player who uses his possessions very efficiently, unlike a guy like Felton who as of recently has been chucking the Knicks out of a ton of games by trying to be the go-to guy in the 4th quarter (which basically killed us against the Thunder).

    Gallo's had a few bad games here or there but I still don't see how a player taking the 4th most shots on the team despite being the most efficient scorer can be considered favored by the coach. Would you rather see Toney Douglas getting more shot attempts?

  13. #163
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    We need Gallo.

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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzero
    Gallo averages 10.5 FG per game which is 4th on our team despite being the most efficient scorer on the team he's only 4th in shots taken.

    Tell me again how he's favored over other players? If anything he's NOT favored. He's taking the 4th most shots despite being a player who uses his possessions very efficiently, unlike a guy like Felton who as of recently has been chucking the Knicks out of a ton of games by trying to be the go-to guy in the 4th quarter (which basically killed us against the Thunder).

    Gallo's had a few bad games here or there but I still don't see how a player taking the 4th most shots on the team despite being the most efficient scorer can be considered favored by the coach. Would you rather see Toney Douglas getting more shot attempts?
    Some would rather see a random beggar outside the subway be our stating sf, if he could pass a 6 Degrees of Separation Test from D'antoni.

    Nice crisp post, again. What else can be said? Just more truth to have faith in Gallo and respect his game; and less reason to have faith in thinking D'ant is some Shakespearian hack character hellbent on favoring his godson as he comically tries to destroy the season and our players.

  15. #165
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    Originally Posted by SSj4Wingzero
    Gallo averages 10.5 FG per game which is 4th on our team despite being the most efficient scorer on the team he's only 4th in shots taken.

    Tell me again how he's favored over other players? If anything he's NOT favored. He's taking the 4th most shots despite being a player who uses his possessions very efficiently, unlike a guy like Felton who as of recently has been chucking the Knicks out of a ton of games by trying to be the go-to guy in the 4th quarter (which basically killed us against the Thunder).

    Gallo's had a few bad games here or there but I still don't see how a player taking the 4th most shots on the team despite being the most efficient scorer can be considered favored by the coach. Would you rather see Toney Douglas getting more shot attempts?
    No what I would rather is a coach & team that understands what the term "high percentage shots" means... do you?

    Or how about the term "fatigue", or "rotation", sh*t i'd settle for a comprehensive understanding of the term "big man".

    Do you know what these mean?

    Here's a bonus... do you know what the term "shooting yourself out of games" means?

    Gallo off the bench, behind wilson or mello @ the 3. Use of a center would help too as Turiaf proved b4 injury, but hey the game is still young maybe these things aren't the way... and maybe they are.

    *Gallo on Durant for the final shot instead of Chandler... wtf? Since u got the stats please provide "Defensive" numbers please to give us a more clearer picture, rebounds included. Then we'll analyze.

    Stats don't lie, statisticians do. And really evryone knows Chandler is better all around, so the only reason they both are on the floor at the same position is.... you tell me

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