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Thread: OFFICIAL: ANTI-D'Antoni Thread

  1. #121
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by StatVP
    No, I realize the talent is what makes the team first & foremost, but the coaching is definitely an important part of the formula, & playing defense is absolutely essential to achieve any real success at this level.
    But you are more likely to blame the coach for on-the-court struggles.

    For example: When I see Ray unable to step in front of his man on defense, it seems to me like you (and others) think "Man, D'Antoni ****ed up" whereas I see the same play and I think "Ray has to stay in front of his man." That is where the difference lies in informing our opinions.

  2. #122
    Veteran Clyde & The Pearl's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    The very fact that:

    1. This thread exists

    2. You (in general) keep making claims about D'Antoni's defense being poor and using obviously tongue-in-cheek comments to make your claim

    3. You criticize us for not playing good interior defense when literally the 2 centers on our team are an undersized Ronny Turiaf and an undrafted rookie Free Agent Center from Europe who had to learn the American game

    4. You ignore that D'Antoni has us where our talent/experience dictates we should be

    5. You are begging for Anthony Randolph, so much so that you will massage the facts to show he never played (no response to that Clyde)

    6. You refuse to watch videos of D'Antoni coaching defense because you "don't care about" learning all the facts about the coach, you know what you know even with your lack of total knowledge.

    All indicators that you think coaching is more important than the players.
    I'm very surprised you came back. I thought you and your points about MDA had taken too much of a beating for you to show your face. So to speak. The facts ARE:

    You called me out saying I was blind to what MDA was/is as a coach.

    I posted what my observations were and you called me an idiot.

    Eventually I posted DIRECT quotes from MDA which VALIDATES each and every point in my first post in this thread. These quotes from MDA himself render your argument TOTALLY INACCURATE.

    There is no spinning his quotes as you and Ron is attempting to do. They're there in BLACK and WHITE for all to read.

    Admit that you were wrong so we can all move on and kill this argument.

  3. #123
    Veteran Clyde & The Pearl's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    But you are more likely to blame the coach for on-the-court struggles.

    For example: When I see Ray unable to step in front of his man on defense, it seems to me like you (and others) think "Man, D'Antoni ****ed up" whereas I see the same play and I think "Ray has to stay in front of his man." That is where the difference lies in informing our opinions.
    Wrong. Obviously there will be players Ray will struggle against. This is where a scheme would be useful. Something MDA has no time for. Because as long as we score more than the other team we played the best defense.

  4. #124
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    I'm very surprised you came back. I thought you and your points about MDA had taken too much of a beating for you to show your face. So to speak. The facts ARE:

    You called me out saying I was blind to what MDA was/is as a coach.

    I posted what my observations were and you called me an idiot.

    Eventually I posted DIRECT quotes from MDA which VALIDATES each and every point in my first post in this thread. These quotes from MDA himself render your argument TOTALLY INACCURATE.

    There is no spinning his quotes as you and Ron is attempting to do. They're there in BLACK and WHITE for all to read.

    Admit that you were wrong so we can all move on and kill this argument.
    Dude, you posted your statements, which I read as tongue-in-cheek (I see D'Antoni as consistently ****ing with the media in his interviews), and you expect me to give those high consideration when you refuse to watch videos of D'Antoni coaching defense because you "don't care" to learn about the coach and improve your knowledge. Seriously? GTFO.

    Calling me out for spinning? "Anthony Randolph played over 11 minutes 1 time"...factually wrong, no response, massaging facts to try and prove his point. I didn't call you blind to what MDA is/was as a coach, I said you are blindly against him, there is a difference, no matter what MDA does you will dislike him. And I am the one spinning? LMFAO. I haven't seen you ever construct a good argument, you are maybe the worst poster on this board...

  5. #125
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    Wrong. Obviously there will be players Ray will struggle against. This is where a scheme would be useful. Something MDA has no time for. Because as long as we score more than the other team we played the best defense.
    Wait. So how is my statement wrong? You basically JUST said you are more willing to blame MDA when, for example, Ray doesn't step in front of his man. Which is what I said.

  6. #126
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by StatVP
    I'm sort of new here, didn't read through the entire thread nor do I think that's really important, I have been following along on the past few pages though if that counts for anything. I'm just giving my viewpoint on why I have a problem with D'Antoni's coaching style in general. Yes, I realize the team has been doing a better job of blocking shots this season so there has been some improvement defensively from last year, but that's not really the point. The point is this system in general doesn't place enough importance on playing defense because the main focus is on scoring points through a high volume of possessions. This coach has never been known to stress defense first, that's not his philosophy. It's the philosophy I question, nothing more. No need to take offense or to throw a hissy fit.
    That you didn't even read through the thread carefully says everything. As someone who's been here for a bit let me just pass this on: Start w reading the thread dude so you can understand where the debate has gone. Then comment.

    Oh, and I'm a passionate Knicks fan. You better get used to that around here.

  7. #127
    Veteran Clyde & The Pearl's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    YOU are the one who brought up MDA and defense in the first place!

    No one here is trying to evade points (except for you, see: your 60%/80% "facts" about confidence, your avoidance of you massaging the facts re: Anthony Randolph), my theory about there being two different types of people on this board EXPLAINS the dichotomy..
    Dude you're going back to MDA's confidence in Moz like its your ace in the hole. Trust me its not, Its more like a three.

    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    There are people here who are simply more likely to blame a coach when a team struggles, and people here who are simply more likely to blame players. You are the former, I am the latter. These diamterically opposed personality traits dictate our ideas and opinions, creating ideas and opinions that are (quite obviously) different from one another. Those traits INFORM every opinion on here, on way or another and is the root cause of our differences.
    Black how can you blame players for something that the coach doesnt instill in them? Players are going to play like they're coached. This really isnt hard to understand. Its not our opinion that MDA has no need for defense its FACT. His quotes tell you that 100 fold. What more do you want?

  8. #128
    Veteran Clyde & The Pearl's Avatar
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    STAT I should have warned you these two guys hate on newcomers. No matter how right you are.

  9. #129
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    Dude you're going back to MDA's confidence in Moz like its your ace in the hole. Trust me its not, Its more like a three.
    I only use it show your consistent massaging of the facts...how you consistently lie and bend truths...We want to go with something recent? How about responding to you massaging AR-related-facts? Why do I point it out? Because it is reflective of your (lack of) credibility.

    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    Black how can you blame players for something that the coach doesnt instill in them? Players are going to play like they're coached. This really isnt hard to understand. Its not our opinion that MDA has no need for defense its FACT. His quotes tell you that 100 fold. What more do you want?
    Because unlike you, on top of reading those comments, I listen to MDA mic'd up in the huddle and before the game, I watched the video of him specifically coaching Steve Nash, I take in everything I can about the team because I care about the team. And what I see/hear when he is mic'd up or in the locker room before games is him stressing certain things on defense. A "lack of effort" on defense to me is on players, especially when I DO see/hear the coach talking about it. Is it his main point? No, but it's there, he does stress it, he does make attempts, and he is talking about it in the huddles. That's what I hear, that's what I see. I don't know what happens at practice, but in pre-game and in-game, I hear him stressing defense. Of course, these are probably things you choose to not listen to or watch b/c you "don't care" about the team.

  10. #130
    Veteran Clyde & The Pearl's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by KBlack25
    Wait. So how is my statement wrong? You basically JUST said you are more willing to blame MDA when, for example, Ray doesn't step in front of his man. Which is what I said.
    Ray gets some blame for this. BUT, going into a game a coach should be able to determine where he is going to need help defensively. He should SCHEME to make sure that help is available.

    Now lapses happen, even in team defense. But if you scheme you shouldnt have a congo line to the basket every game...

  11. #131
    Fundamentally Sound ronoranina's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    I'm very surprised you came back. I thought you and your points about MDA had taken too much of a beating for you to show your face. So to speak. The facts ARE:

    You called me out saying I was blind to what MDA was/is as a coach.

    I posted what my observations were and you called me an idiot.

    Eventually I posted DIRECT quotes from MDA which VALIDATES each and every point in my first post in this thread. These quotes from MDA himself render your argument TOTALLY INACCURATE.

    There is no spinning his quotes as you and Ron is attempting to do. They're there in BLACK and WHITE for all to read.

    Admit that you were wrong so we can all move on and kill this argument.
    I don't think we're spinning.

    And I just posted new evidence that Mike d's teams focus on D you have yet to respond to. You didn't even get our d-rating ranking right dude...

  12. #132
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    STAT I should have warned you these two guys hate on newcomers. No matter how right you are.
    No hate for newcomers at all...

    Just dislike for people who insult (you started the insults against me a long time ago) when they are wrong, run from debates when boxed in a corner and they know it (see: Clyde & The Pearl).

  13. #133
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    STAT I should have warned you these two guys hate on newcomers. No matter how right you are.
    Lolz.. You sir are the KING of spin!

  14. #134
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    STAT I should have warned you these two guys hate on newcomers. No matter how right you are.
    The fack you sticking up for that newblood herb for? Jive ass low post count lover.

  15. #135
    Veteran KBlack25's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Clyde & The Pearl
    Ray gets some blame for this. BUT, going into a game a coach should be able to determine where he is going to need help defensively. He should SCHEME to make sure that help is available.

    Now lapses happen, even in team defense. But if you scheme you shouldnt have a congo line to the basket every game...
    Okay, but it's not like Ray is being beat by Derrick Rose every night, I watched Baron Davis' decrepit ass and Eric Bledsoe go right past him. How is that NOT on Ray? I'm sorry if you can't stay in front of Eric Bledsoe, you just aren't good defensively, it's a breakdown in fundamentals, not in the lack of a system.

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