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View Full Version : I'm already over this loss; we just went on a nice little run.



KnicksFanFromQueens1985
Mar 11, 2011, 00:02
Would have been nice to go 7-3 since the trade, but we're 6-4 & playing .600 baskebtall since the Melo addition. Thats pretty good considering the teams & road games we've played.

Billups has been out for some time now, he's expected to be back with us come the home & away Pacers series. Billups & Douglas will make for a solid PG duo, & it's always a good sign getting a proven veteran leader back with the team. I'm glad we competed without him.

We just got dominated on the road against a great Mavs team without Billups; it's not the end of the world.

Playing 7 games during a 10 day stretch is never an easy task.

We still have plenty of practices & 17-18 games to improve & gel as a team before heading into the playoffs. You cant play team defense, until you gel & learn to play with eachother as a team. We only seen a sneak preview of this Knicks team of 2011. The best has yet to come.

Bring on Indy. I've hated that franchise since Miller of the 90's. Lets sweep & make it 5 W's during our last 6 games.

Clyde & The Pearl
Mar 11, 2011, 00:13
Would have been nice to go 7-3 since the trade, but we're 6-4 & playing .600 baskebtall since the Melo addition. Thats pretty good considering the teams & road games we've played.

Billups has been out for some time now, he's expected to be back with us come the home & away Pacers series. Billups & Douglas will make for a solid PG duo, & it's always a good sign getting a proven veteran leader back with the team. I'm glad we competed without him.

We just got dominated on the road against a great Mavs team without Billups; it's not the end of the world.

Playing 7 games during a 10 day stretch is never an easy task.

We still have plenty of practices & 17-18 games to improve & gel as a team before heading into the playoffs. You cant play team defense, until you gel & learn to play with eachother as a team. We only seen a sneak preview of this Knicks team of 2011. The best has yet to come.

Bring on Indy. I've hated that franchise since Miller of the 90's. Lets sweep & make it 5 W's during our last 6 games.

Glad you're over it. I wanted this one bad. Especially after getting blown out at MSG by this same team. I just figured we'd show much better...

MusketeerX
Mar 11, 2011, 01:34
Glad you're over it. I wanted this one bad. Especially after getting blown out at MSG by this same team. I just figured we'd show much better...

This one was lost before it even started. With the back-to-back, emotional win the previous night, and our usual disposition towards lack of defense, the chances of winning this one were slim to none.

As I posted in another thread, we are not going to shoot like we did against the Jazz and Grizzlies on a nightly basis. We need defense to anchor us through difficult games. Just didn't have it tonight. That's the NBA. I'm look forward to the next game against Indiana...

Even if we don't have Amar'e... what a BS technical! They better rescind that.

Sprewell-Houston
Mar 11, 2011, 04:38
Our players were tired and it just wasn't a night where they gave 100% after the big win in Memphis. Can happen, not the end of the world, especially against a very good team on the road. The Mavericks bench is fearsome, they can sub in 5-6 quality guys who can all score - very hard to defend them. They hit a lot of their shots and our defense wasn't up for it last night. Let's forget about this game and hope we can bounce back.

What worries me more is that those Lakers bottled it again vs Miami. Now the Heat will go on a run and win a lot of their remaining games. Defeat last night would have been the nail in the coffin - now their confidence will be at it's peak and they will regard themselves as the greatest team ever again. Thank you Lakers

TakMan
Mar 11, 2011, 05:02
Hold on. I realise that last night the defensive display was -at least- tragic, however let's not forget where we are defensively compared to the pre-trade era. The Knicks have shown significant signs of improvement in most games (Cleveland and Mavs games excluded) and are -generally- improving as time goes by. Beating Atlanta, New Orleans, and Memphis relatively easily (though Tiredness became evident towards the end of the Memphis game) is no easy accomplishment. By the time the team faced the Mavs they were dead. They managed to maintain their offensive flow (mainly second half) but were very lucid at the back. Still made the game last 4 quarters and that's all you can ask for.

Red
Mar 11, 2011, 06:14
Would have been nice to go 7-3 since the trade, but we're 6-4 & playing .600 baskebtall since the Melo addition. Thats pretty good considering the teams & road games we've played.

Billups has been out for some time now, he's expected to be back with us come the home & away Pacers series. Billups & Douglas will make for a solid PG duo, & it's always a good sign getting a proven veteran leader back with the team. I'm glad we competed without him.

We just got dominated on the road against a great Mavs team without Billups; it's not the end of the world.

Playing 7 games during a 10 day stretch is never an easy task.

We still have plenty of practices & 17-18 games to improve & gel as a team before heading into the playoffs. You cant play team defense, until you gel & learn to play with eachother as a team. We only seen a sneak preview of this Knicks team of 2011. The best has yet to come.

Bring on Indy. I've hated that franchise since Miller of the 90's. Lets sweep & make it 5 W's during our last 6 games.
Agreed. No big deal considering the circumstance. Although Dallas did also play 4 games in 5 or something like that.

That's what depth of size can do for you.


Glad you're over it. I wanted this one bad. Especially after getting blown out at MSG by this same team. I just figured we'd show much better...

Nah, 7 games in 10 days, mad back to backs, with our lack 9of size depth isn't going to work out well.

I hope Donnie realizes his job is not done. He has to go just as hard to fill the roster with quality bigs if he's here going forward.

Dal and the like, even the Heat whom the media claims have no size can trot out at least 3 bigs. Its a necessity. We have to continue to force MDA to adapt by adding more bigs.

Having 5,6,7 "medium 6'8 - 6'10" guys won't get it done. I can't remember a contender without a servicable 7 footer...

The Pistons maybe OKC? And Rasheed is at least 6'11. I can't recall. Lakers, Celtics, last and previous yr Cavs, Spurs, Orl who...?

If I'm not mistaken, every contending team had at the least a servicable 7 footer, not to mention depth in the form of 6'11"+ big bodies.

Am I correct?

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 06:24
Well, we're so glad you're content. Unfortunately, some fool like me actually spent 100 bucks to go watch this nonsense. If it weren't for Mike D'antoni, Jared Jeffries would be going back to school to earn his MBA b/c he wouldn't have a job in the NBA. The dude is the real agent zero. It's almost as if the Knicks play 4 on 5 when he's on the court.

Shawne Williams was so lost on defense, he made Marion appear as if he was D-Wade.

I paid money to see Carmelo Anthony... but he never arrived at the arena.

No heart. NO energy. NO passing. No communication. NO boxing out. NO hustle. NO sweating. NO yelling. NO urgency. I watched us score 5 baskets in the 1st quarter.

Basically, I dropped 100 bucks just to watch the shoot around and a few player attempt free throws.

KnicksFanFromQueens1985
Mar 11, 2011, 06:33
lol but keep in mind we all pay to see the Knicks play. If it weren't for sports I could care less about cable TV & if it weren't for the Knicks I wouldn't spend money on the NBA league pass. If I would have known the Knicks would lose last night, I would have ate what was here instead of getting pumped up & spening 25 on pizza, bread sticks, pepsi & a tip right before gametime.

You weren't the only one who paid to see your team lose :-) on a more serious not... The Knicks just werent focused during the 1st half, 7 games in 10 nights took it's toll on the team.

AmareForPresident
Mar 11, 2011, 06:40
Defense win Championships and Mike D'antoni doesn't teach defense, get what i'm saying? We will never win a championship with Mike D'antoni as a coach. As Mafra said on another thread, If D'antoni were the coach of Philly they would be 10-50

KnicksFanFromQueens1985
Mar 11, 2011, 06:48
"If D'Antoni were the coach of the 76ers" lol... How did D'Antoni do with PHX? Had his team competing every year against elite teams. Check his winning % with the Suns. Outstanding.

"If D'Antoni were with the 76ers" lol & if Phil Jackson never had MJ & Pippen or Shaq & Kobe guess what? He never wins a championship.

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 07:22
"If D'Antoni were the coach of the 76ers" lol... How did D'Antoni do with PHX? Had his team competing every year against elite teams. Check his winning % with the Suns. Outstanding.

"If D'Antoni were with the 76ers" lol & if Phil Jackson never had MJ & Pippen or Shaq & Kobe guess what? He never wins a championship.

I think this is typical for why we all can't wait to see MD leave... This game perfectly sums up our coach. You... yourself... talked about how we've played a bunch of games lately, that we just ran out of gas... back-2-back on the road. This is wherethe coach makes his money. MD failed to get this team up.

I witnessed this firsthand. This team had ZERO energy to start the game.

1) We were playing on national TV.
2) We went 1-2 on our last "road trip."
3) PHI is on our heels.
4) Obviously we would be tired after game in MEM

Coach needed to have this team fired up and ready to play. HEY, if we can out sprinting and then ran out of gas... I could live with that. If we were playng hired, but were a step slow and didn't have enough pep in our step to get up for those jumpers... I'm cool. BUT, to come out sluggish and going through the motions? This is unacceptable! This is on coach.

We were playing DAL, in DAL, a good team who just lost. They were going to coe out swinging. We were on national tv for the world to see. We have off until SUN.

YOU GET YOUR TEAM UP! COME UP FIRED UP. Tell team the country is watching, that DAL wants to run you out of Texas. EMPTY THE TANK b/c you can collapse and sleep in the plant ride home... Rest Fri & Sat.

Ultimately, it's always on the players. BUt you can't fire the players. If they wont respond to the coach... and if his system does't fit... then what should we do?

Sprewell-Houston
Mar 11, 2011, 07:32
Come on guys give our team a break. We were coming off an emotional last second win in Memphis. Dallas is very very hard to play, especially with Amar'e at center. Dallas were up for it after bottling it the other night in New Orleans. Defeats like that can happen. No big deal, at least we didn't give up, were within 10 when the fourth quarter started and Toney Douglas had another good game. It's just a defeat on a day when we had no energy, get over it.

The Pacers games are way way more important. The CLeveland losses were way way more important, because we lost against a **** team...3 times in a row. Dallas is the third best team in the NBA record wise, no big deal losing on the road.

I'm sure our bad defense was a product of our fatigue, playing so many games after the Denver trade. I don't think (and hope) we're back to square one on defense. I think it was just a slip up.

If not then D'Antoni will be gone in the summer anyway.

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 07:45
Come on guys give our team a break. We were coming off an emotional last second win in Memphis. Dallas is very very hard to play, especially with Amar'e at center. Dallas were up for it after bottling it the other night in New Orleans. Defeats like that can happen. No big deal, at least we didn't give up, were within 10 when the fourth quarter started and Toney Douglas had another good game. It's just a defeat on a day when we had no energy, get over it.

The Pacers games are way way more important. The CLeveland losses were way way more important, because we lost against a **** team...3 times in a row. Dallas is the third best team in the NBA record wise, no big deal losing on the road.

I'm sure our bad defense was a product of our fatigue, playing so many games after the Denver trade. I don't think (and hope) we're back to square one on defense. I think it was just a slip up.

If not then D'Antoni will be gone in the summer anyway.

Chandler hardly played b/c of fouls (17 minutes)... Dirk wasn't his usual efficient self (23 points on 19 shots). Knicks lost b/c they allowed DAL to grab 17 offensive rebounds. When DAL shoots 51% from the field & 46% from downtown... Well, lights out people.

Granted a few of those rebounds were just bad luck... long rebounds that just found MAVS' players... STILL...

Marion-Haywood-Brewer just out-worked NY. They wanted it more.

STAT used his spirirt to will the Knicks in the 2nd half. Not sure where the rest of the team was though. Carmelo never showed up. Williams gave nothing on defense. Walker was a ghost again.

Turiaf-Jeffries-Walker-Williams combined for 6 rebounds in 68 minutes. These 4 players should never have an off night when it comes to hustle. These are borderline players who shuold be battling for their careers. They should faint from exhaustion before they play with a lack of effort.

Sprewell-Houston
Mar 11, 2011, 07:57
I can understand that you're angry, you payed 100 bucks and saw a weak Knick team. I think I would have been disappointed too. But you know these things happen. Sometimes it's not your day. Yes Melo had an average day and so had some others, but let's not act like the Miami Heat now. Our team is pretty good, I like Jeffries contribution so far. Toney Douglas has been great as a starter, Melo and STAT are the best offensive duo in the league. A multiple All Star will return pretty soon to help us at the PG spot, Shawne Williams is one of the best 3 pt shooters this season...Turiaf brings toughness and shot blocking every night. We're 6-4 since the trade.
Let's not forget that. Yes we didn't play well in Dallas, our defence was disgusting and I can fully understand you, but let's not make things more dramatic than they are.

I like our team much more than before the trade. And we had 2-3 fantastic defensive performances since then. Beating Miami on their home court, blowing out the Hornets at MSG and bitch-slapping the Hawks in Atlanta.

We are improving defensively, things like the Dallas game can happen. We're not there yet, but we're good and things are way more positive than one semi blowout suggests.

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 08:15
Since the trade, we're allowing about 105 a game. This is basically the worst in the NBA. In our 4 losses, we're allowing 119 a game. YIKES.

What I see, when our jumpers aren't falling we bring that offensive futility with us to the other end of the floor. Vice-versa works too, b/c when we're clicking on all cylinders and hitting shots... We seem to carry the energy over to the defenside side of tha ball as well.

The 105 is skewed slightly b/c of a late 4th quarter run, and some meaningless points vs our scrubs... But that 119 is alarming. That 14 point disparity can be directly attributed to a few letdowns... blown assignments... as we're clearly still focused on a poor offensive possesion or something.

In 3 of those 4 losses, the lack of effort was simply the refusal to go after defensive rebounds, as CLE (2x) and DAL just owned us for 21, 16 & 17 of them. ORL just put together a great 4th quarter to beat us.

I understand this wont be a major problem in the playoffs. We're have rest and we'll bring the energy every game. This is not a fatal flaw to this team or anything. I get that.

BUt, also, let's remember that team defense is like muscle memory, and TRUST ME... CHI OR MIA will be formidable foes. CHI will give us fits on the glass, in the paint, and they will make offensive tough for us. MIA will be nearly impossible to stop.

I just can't fathom any scenario where our BIG FOWARDS, like Jeffries, Turiaf, Williams... toss in Walker... How can they grab only 6 rebounds in almost 70 combined minutes? Walker-Williams can leave the offense to STAT-MELO... hit your 3s and CRASH THE DARN BOARDS. Jeffries needs to avg 9-11 rebounds a game to justify playing him 20+ minutes.

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 08:23
"I just don't think we had enough energy," Mike D'Antoni (http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Mike+D'Antoni) said. "We came out like we've played seven games in 10 nights."

Coach is just full of excuses. Instead of firing his players up, he's paving the way for a lackadasical performace.

Aside from Carmelo (5) and Douglas (8)... where were the assists? NO BALL MOVEMENT. Shawne Williams had 2 assists and 4 others had 1 assist. This told me two things:

1) NObody wanted to work. Little penetrate and kick, work to get open shots for other people.

2) NObody cared about team offense. BLACK HOLES. Just touch ball and try to get yours. DAL had 6 players with 2 or more assists.

DAL was playing the backend of a back-2-back. They've played 4 games in 5 days.

TakMan
Mar 11, 2011, 09:05
I think this is typical for why we all can't wait to see MD leave... This game perfectly sums up our coach. You... yourself... talked about how we've played a bunch of games lately, that we just ran out of gas... back-2-back on the road. This is wherethe coach makes his money. MD failed to get this team up.

I witnessed this firsthand. This team had ZERO energy to start the game.

1) We were playing on national TV.
2) We went 1-2 on our last "road trip."
3) PHI is on our heels.
4) Obviously we would be tired after game in MEM

Coach needed to have this team fired up and ready to play. HEY, if we can out sprinting and then ran out of gas... I could live with that. If we were playng hired, but were a step slow and didn't have enough pep in our step to get up for those jumpers... I'm cool. BUT, to come out sluggish and going through the motions? This is unacceptable! This is on coach.

We were playing DAL, in DAL, a good team who just lost. They were going to coe out swinging. We were on national tv for the world to see. We have off until SUN.

YOU GET YOUR TEAM UP! COME UP FIRED UP. Tell team the country is watching, that DAL wants to run you out of Texas. EMPTY THE TANK b/c you can collapse and sleep in the plant ride home... Rest Fri & Sat.

Ultimately, it's always on the players. BUt you can't fire the players. If they wont respond to the coach... and if his system does't fit... then what should we do?


This doesn't make much sense. You want a just over 50% team (pre-March)
to turn into a 70+% team within the space of 2 weeks. Not gonna happen; particularly when the team is ending a 7 in 10 stretch playing against the the West's 2nd best. The fatigue factor was evident for all to see during the 4th Quarter of the Memphis game. Despite this the team seemed to set the foundations for a thrilling 4th Quarter. In the end it didn't happen but regardless there are many positives one can take from the last 10 days, even in the absence of Billups.

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 09:11
This doesn't make much sense. You want a just over 50% team (pre-March)
to turn into a 70+% team within the space of 2 weeks. Not gonna happen; particularly when the team is ending a 7 in 10 stretch playing against the the West's 2nd best. The fatigue factor was evident for all to see during the 4th Quarter of the Memphis game. Despite this the team seemed to set the foundations for a thrilling 4th Quarter. In the end it didn't happen but regardless there are many positives one can take from the last 10 days, even in the absence of Billups.

Fatigue was the reason Walker-Williams-Turiaf-Jeffries managed 6 rebounds in nearly 70 minutes?

What about Carmelo? He sat the 4th quarter in 2 games last weekend. We have off until Sunday.

Again, I understand we're tired. But it's always something. It's Sunday afternoon... we're too tired. Some of you act like allowing 110 points and getting dominated on the glass isn't the norm under this coach.

How the heck is Jeffries tired? He hasn't played all year!

Douglas is too exhausted now? MAYBE I grant that. But Williams? Walker played like 6 minutes? He had zero hustle when he was on the floor. Mason has barely played either... he should be fine.

Some of you just love excuses. You can be tired and still have intensity... just ask Amar'e.

TakMan
Mar 11, 2011, 09:19
Fatigue was the reason Walker-Williams-Turiaf-Jeffries managed 6 rebounds in nearly 70 minutes?

What about Carmelo? He sat the 4th quarter in 2 games last weekend. We have off until Sunday.

Again, I understand we're tired. But it's always something. It's Sunday afternoon... we're too tired. Some of you act like allowing 110 points and getting dominated on the glass isn't the norm under this coach.

How the heck is Jeffries tired? He hasn't played all year!

Jeffries accumulated +3 while he was on the court. 7 days of travels alone is enought to contribute substantially to fatigue (mental and physical) I'm not making excuses for the team's general performance this season. Yesterday however had a lot going against this new team. Don't forget Dallas have maintained their foundations all season. You cannot deny that our defence has improved since the trade, and I believe it's only set to get better. I cannot recall the last time I saw the Knicks record comfortable wins in the manner they secured them with NO, Atlanta, and the Jazz. Memphis was looking comfortable as well however I feel tiredness kicked in during the 4th. 60% is still a decent stat for any team.

mafra
Mar 11, 2011, 09:33
Jeffries accumulated +3 while he was on the court. 7 days of travels alone is enought to contribute substantially to fatigue (mental and physical) I'm not making excuses for the team's general performance this season. Yesterday however had a lot going against this new team. Don't forget Dallas have maintained their foundations all season. You cannot deny that our defence has improved since the trade, and I believe it's only set to get better. I cannot recall the last time I saw the Knicks record comfortable wins in the manner they secured them with NO, Atlanta, and the Jazz. Memphis was looking comfortable as well however I feel tiredness kicked in during the 4th. 60% is still a decent stat for any team.


I don't buy that they were tired in MEM. They had an off day, and most were rested b/c they sat the entire 4th vs Utah. I just think we had one of our 4th quarter hiccups, and after 8 solid quarters... we were due for a clunker.

I do think, overall, our defense has been better more often than it was before the trade... BUt I wont applaud averaging 105 ppg. Still, we've managed to hold teams under 100 more than before.

I was there last night. It was more than just fatigue. They had nothing from the moment the ball was tipped off.

Did Amar'e look tired?

I don't buy into the +/- nonsense. The eye test is all. Jeffries was bad. really bad. Haywood ate him alive. You can't have a small center who doesn't score on the floor if he wont rebound. Simple as that. He shouldn;t be playing in the NBA. NOt sure why he is on this team really...

BUt I do agree with the fact that this isnt wroth getting freaked out over. We'll get Billups back, and Douglas looks like he's playing his best ball right now. We will tighten our rotation come the playoffs. BUt BREWER proved last night that he is more valuable than Jeffries-Mason. Especially if we play MIA.

Billups-Fields-Williams-Melo-Stat will start against MIA. Douglas, Jeffries will be a part of the rotation; Turiaf will come if for a burst of energy. Walker or Mason will get their chance to hit a 3 or two.

So all will be good.

STILL, if we were so tired... Then why not send Balkman and Shelden out there in the 2nd quarter?

YungMelo15
Mar 11, 2011, 10:47
I don't buy that they were tired in MEM. They had an off day, and most were rested b/c they sat the entire 4th vs Utah. I just think we had one of our 4th quarter hiccups, and after 8 solid quarters... we were due for a clunker.

I do think, overall, our defense has been better more often than it was before the trade... BUt I wont applaud averaging 105 ppg. Still, we've managed to hold teams under 100 more than before.

I was there last night. It was more than just fatigue. They had nothing from the moment the ball was tipped off.

Did Amar'e look tired?

I don't buy into the +/- nonsense. The eye test is all. Jeffries was bad. really bad. Haywood ate him alive. You can't have a small center who doesn't score on the floor if he wont rebound. Simple as that. He shouldn;t be playing in the NBA. NOt sure why he is on this team really...

BUt I do agree with the fact that this isnt wroth getting freaked out over. We'll get Billups back, and Douglas looks like he's playing his best ball right now. We will tighten our rotation come the playoffs. BUt BREWER proved last night that he is more valuable than Jeffries-Mason. Especially if we play MIA.

Billups-Fields-Williams-Melo-Stat will start against MIA. Douglas, Jeffries will be a part of the rotation; Turiaf will come if for a burst of energy. Walker or Mason will get their chance to hit a 3 or two.

So all will be good.

STILL, if we were so tired... Then why not send Balkman and Shelden out there in the 2nd quarter?

Im sorry bu Im with Mafra on this one. There shold be no excuses on how many games we play within 10 dys. In the playoffs,a 7 game series, the games arent over a 3 week span. Games like these are bi for a team. Think about it, if we pull a win against dallas out, that says alot about a team

I gaurantee were not the only team to play that many games in so many nights. Its an 82 game season. Dallas has won 20 of their last 23. It shows fight in a team, heart, toughness, ability to compete. It make you elite.

All championship teams sh*t on adversity in times like this during the season, and its not just the players, its the coaching staff as well.

If you LET any team shoot 51% from the field and out rebound you like dallas did,you can chalk that up in the loss column. Our caching staff has to preach a bette sermonm or our team will settle for being mediocre. I know were bette than that.

AmareForPresident
Mar 11, 2011, 10:47
"If D'Antoni were the coach of the 76ers" lol... How did D'Antoni do with PHX? Had his team competing every year against elite teams. Check his winning % with the Suns. Outstanding.

"If D'Antoni were with the 76ers" lol & if Phil Jackson never had MJ & Pippen or Shaq & Kobe guess what? He never wins a championship.
That's why he failed to get them to the. Finals wijh such a talented roster? Why? Because he didn't teach them defense.

Sprewell-Houston
Mar 11, 2011, 10:52
I can understand your bitterness mafra, I was as disappointed and angry after the third Cleveland game. (I was really really pissed).

I'm not going to argue with you, because at the end of the day what you say is all right and undeniable, my point is: It doesn't lead us any further. Bad loss and we play bad defense more often than not, but staying positive is always worth more than turning negative. A negative attitude will bring motivation and joy down very quickly.

There is nothing more we can do atm other than forgetting about Dallas and focussing on Indiana. Try to think about the positive aspects during the last couple of games, there were plenty. If we keep losing and slipping behind Philly we can start hating, but at the moment we should stay positive and support our players.

I know that we probably won't make it out of round 1 this season, especially if Miami is the opponent, but until then we should believe in a miracle and support our guys.

At the end of the day there is still hope that Dolan might replace D'Antoni, his brother and Phil Weber in the off season.

TommyMSG
Mar 11, 2011, 12:33
This loss proved that we need Billups back as soon as possible.

AmareForPresident
Mar 11, 2011, 13:16
This loss proved that we need Billups back as soon as possible.
No it proved that we need a defensive minded coach.

Carmare
Mar 11, 2011, 14:50
^ I would say both.

I think the Knicks in general prove we need a defensive coach, not just this game.

petescud
Mar 11, 2011, 15:14
I wasn't surprised about this loss. WE need to take baby steps. Can't go from being a .400 club to wining it all. Dallas IMO is a top 5 team. They also have quite a few quality big players, which kills us. This combo and it would be nearly impossible to beat them, unless they beat themselves...We need to steal Hayward or Chandler from them

WrongIslander
Mar 11, 2011, 16:08
Defense win Championships and Mike D'antoni doesn't teach defense, get what i'm saying?

What you're saying is irrelevant because it's a fallacy.

Mike D'antoni does teach defense = fact.

Defense doesn't just happen overnight with a completely new team = fact.

Nothing you say matters worth a shiney shi*e until at the very least when the playoffs are over when he's still not really had anything like a reasonable amount of time to work with his team.

Every team realistically favourite for this competition has been playing as a team and working on their drills as a team from DAY ONE.

People continue to take for granted what Mike can do on offense and if we had Larry Brown here it would be all about how his offense stank.

Some people just love to keep saying the same old same old regardless if it is conducive or productive.

WrongIslander
Mar 11, 2011, 16:12
That's why he failed to get them to the. Finals wijh such a talented roster? Why? Because he didn't teach them defense.

Convenient way to look at it, but not exactly true.

He had a PG that couldn't defend, a PF that wouldn't and he had his team OVERachieving. The reason you talk about the Suns at all is because MDA made them into a force, the fact he ran into the teams that won the whole thing was just one of those things.

You can talk about MDA not teaching defense all day long but Stat was a totally different cat back then and Nash just can't defend period. If MDA had tried to defend against better defensive teams (i.e. all of them) then he wouldn't have even got the to playoffs.

iSaYughh
Mar 11, 2011, 16:50
^^^ Excellent and overlooked point that if we were this grand "defensive" team, we would simply have a lesser offense.

This isn't about defense vs offense. Everyone knows you want the highest respective quotients of *both*, to be the best you can be.

The best place to derive whether or not the coach is getting the best, or a very high overall quotient (aka GETTING THE MOST OUT OF YOUR TEAM...aka BEING A GOOD COACH), is by,

how players are performing
how the team is performing/winning
how dangerous the team could potentially be in a given game, or series

Over the backdrop of expectations and goals by fans and analysts.

By these *legit* metrics, diluted by emotions and logical fallacies and argumentative speculations...regarding "offense" vs "defense"

Mike D'antoni...Is, and has been, a very good coach of our New York Knicks. Period.

The improvements we need to make -- falsely assumed to be MDA himself's fatal flaws -- are,

problems MDA himself recognizes
problems which Walsh himself has the greatest ability in fixing
problems which are on an upward trend of being fixed

Simply, problems. Which any,

incomplete
young
restructured
non-elite team

Will have. In spades. And be a cause of losing games.

KnicksFanFromQueens1985
Mar 11, 2011, 18:07
NY is playing .600 since the trade. Billups has been out for some time. MDA is on the verge of leading the Knicks to the playoffs for the 1st time since 2004. Before the trade MDA had 4 of 5 starters in Felton, Fields, Amare & Mozgov who weren't with NY last season. Coaching a brand new team. After the trade MDA is working with 5 starters who weren't here last season. And he's STILL winning & only 3 games back of the 5 seed. MDA has NY winning despite the fact that as a team? We have next to zero experience working together. Fields is only a rookie who still has alot to learn. MDA is allowing Fields the chance to learn on the fly. MDA doesn't have a true Center to rebound, fill the lanes, block shots or even defend. The Knicks still rank as a top 3 offense. MDA has yet to have a training camp, offseason or preseason to work with our 3 leaders in Billups, Melo & Amare. MDA has never had a chance in hell to win with NY. He's made the most of his ONLY chance this year & he's leading NY back to playoffs. Sad...