the guy is not a winner.......I will say it a milion times....His character is not one to be admired.....we need winners...dont ask me to list players...better yet lets stick with the losers of the nba and never get better...look at the unknown players in the conference finals....look at novak , look at lin....players are out there
JR Smith Price Tag dropping
- Thread starter Knicks4Life_1985
- Start date
the guy is not a winner.......I will say it a milion times....His character is not one to be admired.....we need winners...dont ask me to list players...better yet lets stick with the losers of the nba and never get better...look at the unknown players in the conference finals....look at novak , look at lin....players are out there
Knicks4Life_1985
★The Floor General★
What makes a winner Skisloper? I you don't mind me asking how are Lin and Novak winners?
Real NY Baller
Starter
^^yeah, I'm interested in seeing his reply to this post too.
nyk_nyk
All Star
I ask you and others to list players because its so easy to say you don't want a certain player back, but given our cap situation at least list a viable replacement for him that we can realistically get. That would make your case stonger. I think that's fair.
Also, I agree with 1985 and Baller. What makes a winner and how do Lin and Novak meet that criteria?
Glad u asked....
Would u rather have Lin or JR ?
The point that u keep missing is there are NBA players out there that just do not get a shot...Look at LIN, Look at Blair , Look at George Hill....
we fill the roster with guys like JR and we will get the same result over and over again......
A winner would be classified as a class act guy...not someone busy tweeting naked women, getting arrested for no liscense, tweeting after the worst playoff performance of his career good bye NY,,,,,,,,,,,WHAT DO U NOT GET.....
That is not a guy with character or am I missing something ?
STAT1
Starter
There is no such thing as a "winner" & a "loser". The right situation can make any player a "winner" & the wrong situation vice versa. Look at Steven Jackson now with the Spurs, dude is looking like a cold blooded assassin out there a key part to a potential championship winning formula. Over his career he's been widely known as a malcontent, difficult to coach & has had several run ins with teammates, coaches, refs & sometimes fans. Is he a winner or a loser? I think this might be a poor choice of words. Maybe what you're referring to is his questionable shot selection? Or the occasional lack of focus on the floor? There's no denying JR has a ton of talent. His shot selection definitely needs work & he needs to be more aware out on the floor, but at $2.5 million (if he does not opt out) it's going to be hard to find better options. Not sure if you could get this guy for that amount, but Shannon Browne might be a decent alternative that will bring a lot of the same types of high flying plays in transition.
nyk_nyk
All Star
So you're saying a winner is determined by what they do off the court??? LOL. Sorry man but that makes no sense. All I care about is them laying it out on the court for THIS team.
Do some research and you will find plenty of people you deem "class act" as having run ins with the law and other off-court issues at one point or another. Your winners vs losers argument is full of fluff and dated.
nyk_nyk
All Star
Right NOW JR is actually more talented than Lin. It's because we have this desperate need for a PG that Lin is such an important player to us. If we were already set at PG and I had to choose, I'd take JR over Lin from a pure talent standpoint.
JR is a deadly scorer that will take some questionable shots, but if that's your only issue then you just don't like him because from a talent standpoint he's worth more than $2.5 mil and that's a huge bargain for us. He could easily get the full mid level and it wouldn't be considered overpaying.
Once again, if you know a better option for the vet min please let us know.
Please don't tell me your preferred plan is to gamble on some Euro or Dleague player and hope he's a "winner".
Knicks4Life_1985
★The Floor General★
6 months ago I would rather have Swish.. To be honest Swish is more proven then Lin the guy had a great.... GREAT run for two months. Swish is a 7 or 8 year vet who is a proven off the bench asset.
Have you ever seen Lin play 82 games? I love what Lin did for our team , we would have been looking on the outside of the playoffs for sure without him.
Also JR accepting his option has ZERO effect on us bringing Lin back. :2cents:
Have you ever seen Lin play 82 games? I love what Lin did for our team , we would have been looking on the outside of the playoffs for sure without him.
Also JR accepting his option has ZERO effect on us bringing Lin back. :2cents:
Everyone keeps putting JR at a higher level then he is.......
Based on every pro-JR argument made on this board it would make ZERO sense for Jr not to opt out as he can for sure can a better deal elsewhere....
If he does not opt out I am sure you will make the case he wants to stay with the Knicks and is willing to pass up on money.......
My point about LIN is that there are viable players out there that we need to find that sometimes just get passed up.....
You have to be a moron to think one's character does not tie into how someone is on the court in the locker-room or as a team player....
I guess you are the same one's who would argue Melo not playing hard under Dantonio all the while Tyson was playing with an almost broken hand was cool as well....
If you do not understand the " Winning Concept " then its tough to ever convince you. In the world there are winners ....guys that do whatever it takes and accept whatever role deemed in order to WIN........If you think JR is that guy and he opts to stay for the 2.5 million then I hope you are right...
BUT based on his high level of play you claim why in the world would he accept 2.5 million a year if he is worth 5 million or more for a 3-4 year deal....
Based on every pro-JR argument made on this board it would make ZERO sense for Jr not to opt out as he can for sure can a better deal elsewhere....
If he does not opt out I am sure you will make the case he wants to stay with the Knicks and is willing to pass up on money.......
My point about LIN is that there are viable players out there that we need to find that sometimes just get passed up.....
You have to be a moron to think one's character does not tie into how someone is on the court in the locker-room or as a team player....
I guess you are the same one's who would argue Melo not playing hard under Dantonio all the while Tyson was playing with an almost broken hand was cool as well....
If you do not understand the " Winning Concept " then its tough to ever convince you. In the world there are winners ....guys that do whatever it takes and accept whatever role deemed in order to WIN........If you think JR is that guy and he opts to stay for the 2.5 million then I hope you are right...
BUT based on his high level of play you claim why in the world would he accept 2.5 million a year if he is worth 5 million or more for a 3-4 year deal....
STAT1
Starter
I do not buy into the argument that because Tyson Chandler is a hustle style player that it somehow reflects negatively on Melo. I am not sure how much energy a player like Tyson Chandler would have left to expend on the defensive end of the floor if he were spending the rest of the game trying to carry the offensive load for this team. The reason why guys like Tyson, Shumpert & Jeffries can expend so much energy on the defensive end of the floor is because they are not being asked to expend much of their energy on the offensive end. These are what role players are for. Yes, you will see great players in this league who can star on both ends of the floor, but Melo has never been known to be a defensive minded player. It still puzzles me why Knick fans take such offense to the fact that he isn't giving forth a full effort on defense on most nights when he's the one who's usually having to carry the offense. Somebody needs to score, this is a team sport & you can't win games unless you score points. This why this team has guys like Tyson & the rest of the role players, just like the OKC Thunder have guys like Ibaka, Perkins & Sefolosha, they allow guys like Durant & Westbrook be great on the offensive end.
CA7
Scoring Champ
plese stop trying to make sense, thats unacceptable around here
nyk_nyk
All Star
All this writing and you still have not answered ONE question asked. SMH
Knicks4Life_1985
★The Floor General★
Nice post fellas. Bottom line JR for 2.5 is stealing money. If he comes back great if he does not on to the next one. :2cents:
friedtilapia
Rookie
So you'd rather have a bunch of inferior "classy" players than a JR Smith who can go off for 15 points off the bench on any given night? I'll agree with you that JR does chuck alot but honestly off the knicks bench this season he was the most talented player on that 2nd unit (Steve Novak's 3 ball comes close i guess)
I'll also agree with you that he does have some off-court behavioral problems but do you really care what he does in his spare time as long as he performs well on the court? If he was making all his shots in-game we wouldn't care if he sniffed coke or choked hookers in his off time. But just because he had a sub-par playoff performance we're looking for any reason to get rid of him.
Yeah he is a little rough around the edges but maybe that is what this team really needs. We should bring it back like the late 90's knicks --gritty, scrappy and fighting during every play. If he can bring toughness back to this knicks squad, he'll be a winner in my book. :2cents:
I will say it again......YES JR get light it up and get very hot in a game.
What I do not like is his inability to realize that when you are shooting 2 for 12 that maybe its best at that time to pass of the ball and stop firing away.
Of course Woodson should have realized that as well..........
Its not a matter of classy inferior players........I would rather have players that will do whatever is neccessary to win a game and could care less about their own stat sheet at the end of a game....
I would like to have a guy on defense who does not foul behind the 3 point arc or when there is a few seconds left on the shot clock....
We already have Melo for better or worse ( not here to debate that ) I just think a guy like JR and Melo is not a winning combination...
For JR to able to hoist up 16 shots in game 6 in 36 minutes YET have ZERO rebounds, steals, blacks or assists is a mind blowing statistic....
What does not make sense to me.....If So many of you are so confident we can keep him at the 2.5 million and nobody is offering him more money would that not be a telling sign that other teams see what I see ?
Please exchange the word " Classy " for " Winners ...Guys willing to whatever it takes to win a game " JR is not that guy to me.
SSj4Wingzero
All Star
Exactly. Melo is a competent enough defender to the point where we don't need to be focusing on his defensive shortcomings.
Hell, we don't need to be focusing on ANYBODY's defensive shortcomings.
The Knicks were the 5th best defensive team in the league last year. Tyson Chandler completely revamped our team's defense, and Coach Woodson's coaching finally turned Stat and Melo into OK defenders for none other than the main reason that they no longer had to run up and down the floor as much because of Mike D'Antoni's run and gun offense.
For all the talk of how good the Thunder's defense is...our defense during the season was BETTER than theirs. Anybody who watched the playoffs last year knows that our problem wasn't defense - it was the sheer inability to score because we lacked a competent distributor. There was absolutely NO ball movement on the court whatsoever when we played the Heat and when there's no ball movement, it's very easy to defend especially when the other team has an advantage in athleticism.
With regards to J.R. Smith, he's not opting out. His shooting stats this season were the worst they'd been since 2006. He's going to stay around and try to go off this season for a bigger payday next offseason. J.R. also took some time to really get in a shooting groove - I predict that with a full training camp and some real time off, he'll have a great year next year. I want to keep him around because we need shooters on this team.
If he does not opt out I do hope a full training camp help....I am not concerned with his shooting but his Bball IQ. The guy will dribble for 17 seconds trying to find a shot rather then move the ball...
After watching last night JR would get zero minutes on either NBA Finals team.
If nobody will offer him more then 2.5 million then its a safe bet we are not stealing him for 2.5 million