Lakers-Knicks Discussing Pau/Amare Swap?

YuvalNYC

Rotation player
As long as Shump isnt included, I would support this kind of trade..
Including Novak would be hard to take though.
 
Crazy⑧s;255852 said:
If it were STAT and Novak, I'd do it. Not a reactionary comment in regard to Novak, BTW, I just think that he's not likely to fit the mould with Woodson.

● Are the Lakers legit about this though?

Where do Amar'e, D12 and Kobe find a cognitive nich??

Surely Gasol returning to form (as well as being insured) is better than trying to fit in Amar'e considering Gasol's experience in LA and his diversity. If people have an issue with his defence, then they're not likely to enjoy the services of STAT.

I just can't see LA replacing what's considered a bad contract with a worse one that's uninsured. They'd be that much better off with 1 or multiple unwanted expiring contracts and focusing on the trio of Howard, Bryant and Nash, and from there adding what they can to their window of opportunity.

I give this a 1 in 100 chance of even being a remote possibility. The Lakers aren't that stupid, and we're not that lucky.

Agreed. There's very little chance that they will trade Pau for Amar'e straight up. Any possible Pau for Amar'e trade begins and ends with Shumpert, who they may want to backup Kobe and groom to pick up the slack at SG when Kobe starts to fade and retire. Shump would do well alongside Nash who isn't a very good defensive guard. The Lakers don't want frequently injured Amar'e's huge uninsured contract unless they get to screw the Knicks in the deal. Just look at the way the trades they got with Nash and Dwight. Amar'e is a longer, uninsured, and worse contract than Pau. Being in win-now mode with the short Kobe/Nash twilight window, they don't want draft picks either. Frequently injured Amar'e with his medical history (eye, back, knee damage) would pretty much wipe out the Lakers' window since he can't seem to stay healthy.
 

p0nder

Starter
Not gonna happen. It's just not. I;m not in favor of it and it's not going to happen.

Amar'es contract is just too nasty to be traded to any team, especially the lakers. Pau is not better then Amar'e and provides nothing of value to our front court that Amar'e won't give us and then some. Not to mention that Pau would then need to be worked into the offense and Woodson's schemes, while Amar'e already knows the role he plays here. Amar'e > Pau
 

iJoe

Rotation player
Not gonna happen. It's just not. I;m not in favor of it and it's not going to happen.

Amar'es contract is just too nasty to be traded to any team, especially the lakers. Pau is not better then Amar'e and provides nothing of value to our front court that Amar'e won't give us and then some. Not to mention that Pau would then need to be worked into the offense and Woodson's schemes, while Amar'e already knows the role he plays here. Amar'e > Pau

I agree that its not gonna happen because Amare's contract is toxic.

Amare > Pau ?????

  • Better rebounder
  • At this point a better shooter
  • Much better post player
  • everyone is better than Amare at defense right now

Amare's probably just better at running in D'Antoni's system which is the only reason these rumors are going around.

Think everyone forgets the crazy MVP talk when Pau first joined the Lakers. He was a beast. He's struggling because he always plays with a dominant Center. Bynum hogged the inside, then Dwight.

For the Knicks, we don't have a big man who can post, so Pau could fill that spot easy.
 
I rather wait to see what Stat can do under woodson's leadership. He never had a coach to teach him defense before and he worked on his post game over the summer. Let's see what he can do before trading him. This is the first time the Knicks really worked together so lets give Stat the chance to prove himself. I like Gasol, but he is not better than Amare, especially if he picked up some good moves from "The Dream" in the off season. let's not jump the gun and rush things here. The Knicks are known for panicking when they lose, just relax. This is a great team that only needs a bit more time before EVERYONE knows this.
 
This is something that I've talked about a lot on twitter. I'm really happy to see that it's getting some heat and the teams are at least in talks about a swap.

A lot of people believe that Amare wouldn't work for the Lakers. That he would clog up the paint, and take space away from Dwight Howard. Now to some capacity that is true, but the ideal way for Amare to play with the Lakers wouldn't be starting next to Dwight and Metta, but coming off the bench.

You see Mike D'Antoni's system has been at its best with a small line up. A PG that can run his system, ONE dominant big man who can be his pick and roll weapon, all surrounded by shooters. Pau Gasol should not and will not be starting next to Dwight because he's a half court player who thrives on post ups. It clogs up the paint for Dwight to work in and his ISOs kill the flow of D'Antoni's system.

As long as D'Antoni is coach, Pau Gasol's place in his system should and eventually will be coming off the bench, and letting him take over and thrive in his half court system against the bench players right? WRONG. This kills the flow of D'Antoni's system. It was the same problem in NY with Woodson/Melo and D'Antoni/Amare. You can't run two systems. It's impossible. Gasol will come in off the bench, the flow will be ruined, and once the starters come in they'll have to change systems which kills all momentum.

The other alternative to this is forcing Gasol to play in the D'Antoni pick and roll system, where he is no where near as effective as he is in the half court!

Now instead of those two options, wouldn't it benifit the Lakers much better to have the greatest player outside of Steve Nash ever to play in the D'Antoni system? Have Amare come off the bench with Duhon, continue to run the pick and roll and build on what the starters did in the first quarter. Instead of bringing in a guy who you have to change systems for and kill the flow of the offense. This trade would be phenomenal for the Lakers.

As for us, it's the same argument on opposite sides. Pau fits better then Amare. He plays off the ball, rebounds, and doesn't clog up the paint like Amare does. He's the secondary scorer Carmelo Anthony needs to change the Knicks from an "Interesting Playoff team" to "Championship Contenders".
 

p0nder

Starter
Rebounding Amare = Pau

Shooting Amare = Pau (generually speaking)

Defense Amar'e = Pau (possibly a slight edge to Amar'e if he comes back playing like he was)

Post Play Pau > Amar'e (though Amar'e just spent the offseason working on his post moves with the dream)

Running in transition Amare> Pau

Help defense Amar'e > Pau

Creating his own shot Amar'e > Pau

Attacking defenses Amar'e > Pau

Passing Pau > Amar'e

High Post play Amar'e > Pau

Perimiter play Amar'e > Pau

Ability to score against opponents Centers Amar'e > Pau

I just don't see Pau as a great contributor anymore. If he couldn't get it going with Nash, Kobe and Dwight, what makes you think having Felton pass him the ball wiith melo next to him will make him better?

I agree with Real NY. Let Amar'e come back healthy and contribute to the team that he helped build.
 
Rebounding Amare = Pau

Shooting Amare = Pau (generually speaking)

Defense Amar'e = Pau (possibly a slight edge to Amar'e if he comes back playing like he was)

Post Play Pau > Amar'e (though Amar'e just spent the offseason working on his post moves with the dream)

Running in transition Amare> Pau

Help defense Amar'e > Pau

Creating his own shot Amar'e > Pau

Attacking defenses Amar'e > Pau

Passing Pau > Amar'e

High Post play Amar'e > Pau

Perimiter play Amar'e > Pau

Ability to score against opponents Centers Amar'e > Pau

I just don't see Pau as a great contributor anymore. If he couldn't get it going with Nash, Kobe and Dwight, what makes you think having Felton pass him the ball wiith melo next to him will make him better?

I agree with Real NY. Let Amar'e come back healthy and contribute to the team that he helped build.
 

Forrest17

Rotation player
Crazy⑧s;255852 said:
If it were STAT and Novak, I'd do it. Not a reactionary comment in regard to Novak, BTW, I just think that he's not likely to fit the mould with Woodson.

● Are the Lakers legit about this though?

Where do Amar'e, D12 and Kobe find a cognitive nich??

Surely Gasol returning to form (as well as being insured) is better than trying to fit in Amar'e considering Gasol's experience in LA and his diversity. If people have an issue with his defence, then they're not likely to enjoy the services of STAT.

I just can't see LA replacing what's considered a bad contract with a worse one that's uninsured. They'd be that much better off with 1 or multiple unwanted expiring contracts and focusing on the trio of Howard, Bryant and Nash, and from there adding what they can to their window of opportunity.

I give this a 1 in 100 chance of even being a remote possibility. The Lakers aren't that stupid, and we're not that lucky.
But it is insured. They never used their amnesty.. right?
 

Forrest17

Rotation player
I think this trade is kinda dumb anyways. Never trade with the lakers. the other team always gets ****ed. If the lakers want to trade someone its because their is something really wrong with them. Pau isn't gonna help us more than amar'e is.

this should only be considered if he comes back healthy and we somehow are terrible or something or he doesn't work with Carmelo. We don't know that he does yet.

People can say oh well, we they didn't play well together last year blablabla.. Well we had no point guard and we had D'Antoni as coach... So obviously our offense is going to go nowhere.
 
But it is insured. They never used their amnesty.. right?

No, Amar'e can't be insured. The insurers refused to insure Amar'e's contract on account of the micro-fracture surgery on his knees. Micro-fracture surgery is considered experimental, since you basically damage the knees by creating new micro-fractures in them in hopes that the new damage will inspire the body's natural healing process to produce more cartilage. The fact that the surgery basically means creating new fracture damage to the knees and the questionable results from this experimental procedure means that no insurance company will cover his contract. So, unlike other contracts that can be fully or partially insured, the team is on the hook for the full amount, since insurance companies won't cover it. Also, as mentioned above, no team that trades for Amar'e may amnesty him regardless of whether they already used their one-time amnesty or not, since you're only allowed to amnesty him if he was on your roster prior to the end of the CBA lockout. Any team that trades for him will be on the hook for the full monetary amount if something happens to him (a strong possibility with his injury history and damaged body), with no insurance company to pick up part of the tab.
 

metrocard

Legend
Not gonna happen. It's just not. I;m not in favor of it and it's not going to happen.

Amar'es contract is just too nasty to be traded to any team, especially the lakers. Pau is not better then Amar'e and provides nothing of value to our front court that Amar'e won't give us and then some. Not to mention that Pau would then need to be worked into the offense and Woodson's schemes, while Amar'e already knows the role he plays here. Amar'e > Pau

Pau is better than Amare, and what role are you talking about? Amare showed he doesn't fit in. He went from being a 25 ppg wrecking ball into a guy who can't move his feet and gets raped defensively and offensively.

Gasol is a superior offensive player, rebounder and defender. It's a total upgrade and Gasol is a better fit, we don't have a passing big man except Camby.
 

VeryGundy

Benchwarmer
you can only amnesty a player if they were on your team prior to the CBA and I think LA would only do it if they think Nash can re-ignite STAT's game

When Nash is healthy enough to play and that's not going to be very often.

Lakers are too old to run and gun. Trading Gasol makes perfect sense but I think they would want a younger version of STAT.
 

metrocard

Legend
p0nder, you're tripping on bath salts.

Rebounding
Gasol's career high was 11.3 rebounds per game. Amare is 9.6
Amare's struggle to get 8 boards a game, where Gasol floats around 9. Gasol isn't the better rebounder by FAR, but you're thinking of Amare back in his Phoneix days. Amare's rebounding isn't even respectable at this point. Gasol beats him here.

Shooting, Gasol is superior by far. I don't know why you keep equaling attributes that Gasol is better than Amare.

Last season, shooting percentages from 10-23 Feet.

10-15 Feet Gasol shot 43% > Amare shot 30%
16-23 Feet, Gasol shot 43% again > Amare shot 35%

Amare is not the same player that we saw hitting those mid range shots. His game is shot and broken.

Defensive, they're not equal.

Come on, Amar'e Stoudimire better than anyone on defense? You're comparing Amare to a guy who shut down the best center in the NBA Finals.

Gasol is better on defense just simply based on height, Gasol can alter shots and defend the post better. They're not excellent defenders, but Gasol is not HORRIBLE like Amare. He's the worst in the NBA at defending the pick and roll and one of the worst interior defenders in the league.






Gasol doesn't even have to be good on defense to be superior to STATue.

Help defense....Amare is weak at this. Just because he averages more blocks than Gasol doesn't make him a better help defender. Amare sucks at support defense...guards own Amar'e in the paint.


BTW, Gasol has blocked more shots than Amar'e in the past 5 years.


Amare hasn't create his own shot since 2011.

Perimeter play? Gasol is more well rounded with his skill set.




Rebounding Amare = Pau

Shooting Amare = Pau (generually speaking)

Defense Amar'e = Pau (possibly a slight edge to Amar'e if he comes back playing like he was)

Post Play Pau > Amar'e (though Amar'e just spent the offseason working on his post moves with the dream)

Running in transition Amare> Pau

Help defense Amar'e > Pau

Creating his own shot Amar'e > Pau

Attacking defenses Amar'e > Pau

Passing Pau > Amar'e

High Post play Amar'e > Pau

Perimiter play Amar'e > Pau

Ability to score against opponents Centers Amar'e > Pau


Now this is terrible. Worst thing written in this thread.

It's been over 10 games into the season.
Mike Brown got fired.
Steve Nash got injured.
Dwight Howard didn't even come back at 100%.
To evaluate Gasol over this shorten season is foolish and pointless. It doesn't prove anything except a false premature assumption that he doesn't fit.



I just don't see Pau as a great contributor anymore. If he couldn't get it going with Nash, Kobe and Dwight, what makes you think having Felton pass him the ball wiith melo next to him will make him better?
 

metrocard

Legend
When Nash is healthy enough to play and that's not going to be very often.

Lakers are too old to run and gun. Trading Gasol makes perfect sense but I think they would want a younger version of STAT.

Screw the Lakers.
They can take Amar'e.
Amare is 30 years old.
Gasol is 32 year olds.
Not much of a difference.
Amare's athleticism and agility has decreased a great amount.
Gasol's game never relied on his physical attributes.
Gasol will have a longer basketball career over Amar'e.
Amar'e is highly overrated and he isn't the same guy he was in 2011.
 

erivera

Benchwarmer
No. No team can amnesty Amar'e Stoudemire. The only team that may amnesty a player is the team that had him on their roster prior to the end of the lockout. Which means the Knicks were the only team allowed to amnesty him. But since the Knicks spent their amnesty already, they can't use it anymore, at least not till the next CBA is signed, assuming the next CBA will also include a one-time amnesty clause. But right now, ZERO teams in the NBA may amnesty Amar'e Stoudemire. Teams can't trade for him and then amnesty him, it doesn't work that way.


thanks for clearing that up. i figured they couldn't but i wasn't sure about it.
 

Rob Low

Rotation player
If there's anybody on this site that thinks Gasol isn't an upgrade from Amare you leave me no choice but to never take anything you say on here serious. Gasol is better than Amare at almost every aspect of basketball aside from dunking and blocking shots. Gasol is not a great defender but Amare is without a doubt the worst defender in the league. Not to mention Gasol's contract runs out after next season. No doubt in my mind he can still play at a high level for the next 2 seasons. Imagine when he play the Nets he would feast on Humphries and Lopez in the post
 
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