Game Thread: New York Knicks @ Memphis Grizzlies 8:00pm 1/16/2016

Odd usage of KP in the second? Hope it's bc DF wants KP fresh for the 4th... 54-52 NYK at the half.

Our guys have made an art out of attempting out of control attacks at the rim, losing the ball, complaining about not getting a foul, and letting the other team score easy points down the other end in transition.

Gasol and Randolph are thriving on offense, but Porzingis has made both of them look very bad at times when they are trying to defend him. Tie game at 66 - 66 after an O'Quinn jumper with 5 minutes to go in the 3rd quarter.

KP has that jump shot working tonight making a tough midrange against Gasol.

Story of this game is our complete lack of answers for defending Marc Gasol. He is already way above his season average.

Tied at 73 - 73 with one quarter to play. If we can at least slow down Marc Gasol a little in the 4th quarter, we have a shot.

Terrible possession with Grant stuck with the ball for a 24 sec violation.

Memphis playing stifling defense and we have very few answers so far in the 4th. Down by 8 with less than 7 minutes to play.

Miracle shot by Rolo, spinning hook shot near the foul line but Williams hits a 3 at the other end for an 8 pt lead.

That was a killer 3 offensive RBs one play resulting in a layup . Biggest lead of the night. Gasol is a one man show and the Knicks could not score the 2nd half.

We had 54 at the half and 73 after three... With about 3 minutes remaining in the game... NYK have 25 points in the second half... 6 so far in the 4th...

There really are no words to describe just how poorly Affalo, Calderon, and Grant have played tonight.... Especially when you look at the guards MEM start.

NYK 0-5 without Melo.

Grant with 0 and 0... Affalo 3-11 shooting.... Gasol has 35 points... Another 4th quarter collapse...
What is perplexing... PORZ red hot in first.... Had like 10 points on 4-5 shooting... But only gets 6 or 7 shots rest of game? Just shows you how bad our guards are for not feeding the hot hand... And how poorly DF manages his minutes.

Tough to win w/o Melo, the Nets game showed that. Disappointed that we are not above .500 but maybe we can get to .500 against the Sixers and Jazz before facing the Clips.

mafra said:

We had 54 at the half and 73 after three... With about 3 minutes remaining in the game... NYK have 25 points in the second half... 6 so far in the 4th...

There really are no words to describe just how poorly Affalo, Calderon, and Grant have played tonight.... Especially when you look at the guards MEM start.

NYK 0-5 without Melo.

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This speaks to a thread I started about "How Good Are We?" We missed Melo many games last yr and our record reflected poorly and this yr looks to be no different. If Melo were to miss a bunch of games going forward what would our record look like?

We are now 9-16 against teams with winning records with an overall middle of the pack SOS to this point.

Broadway said:

This speaks to a thread I started about "How Good Are We?" We missed Melo many games last yr and our record reflected poorly and this yr looks to be no different. If Melo were to miss a bunch of games going forward what would our record look like?

We are now 9-16 against teams with winning records with an overall middle of the pack SOS to this point.

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Last year we were bad with Melo and bad without him. This year, we're
Improved bc Melo is healthy and we brought in some vets and a lottery pick.... But clearly... We see when he is not playing what AA and KL say about Melo... He makes it easier for them bc the defense is focused on stopping Melo. When the defense doesn't have to worry about Melo...
Pretty much lights out for NYK except for KP and DW, to a certain extent.

In a way, Melo does make players around him better...

The only chance we have without Melo is when we share the ball and play as 1 unit... There were times (like in the second Q when LT, AA, DW, seraphim, Grant were on the floor...
Nobody passed the ball)... When these guys try taking turns playing hero... Start trying to make up for the loss and score points... We get in trouble.

But... Like you said... How good are we? We have an extremely raw lottery pick with enormous potential. We have two wing players in LT and DW (role players) and we start a back court that would be a decent but not great backup duo on a winning team. We have a legit C... Not great but not bad... And that's pretty much it (without Melo).

We have 40 games to play. Say hypothetically, Melo was healthy for all of them, I'd guess we'd win somewhere in the range of 18 to 22 games and likely finish the season right around 0.500.

Say instead hypothetically, Melo missed all the rest of our 40 games, I'd guess our ceiling and floor of wins drops dramatically and we are looking more at winning somewhere in the 8 to 12 games range, meaning that we'd still be in the running for a 50 loss season. On the flip side, Porzingis would probably have crazy scoring stats by the end of the year, for what that's worth.

We may have missed Melo's D as much as his scoring allowing the 28th (MEM) and 29th (NETS) ranked teams in the league to score more than 100 ppg.

To Mafra and Htr

We should have beat Brooklyn and the Rockets(who haven't been good either). I think we're actually 0-4 without Melo so with roster upgrades we should be .500 without him in small sample sizes. It wasn't to highlight Melo's value to the team, it's to show the miscalculation from last yrs roster to this yrs roster if circumstances were equal.

You add AA, Lopez, O-Quinn, Rook, Rook, Williams compared to Melo along with rest of roster being healthy last yr as they've been this yr...what's the true Win replacement total? Healthier roster last yr without the gimmicks of losing later in the season we were probably a 27 win team and not 17. So if we're pacing to win 38gms this yr all those additions/replacements only equate to 11wins, Phil shelled out $90mil for this kind of low win increase?

Melo didn't go from not making players better for 12-13yrs and then all of a sudden to making teammates better this yr. Several players on this team aren't even having career yrs this yr. They'e been extremely hot and cold in any given game or over stretches of games this yr.

Broadway said:

To Mafra and Htr

We should have beat Brooklyn and the Rockets(who haven't been good either). I think we're actually 0-4 without Melo so with roster upgrades we should be .500 without him in small sample sizes. It wasn't to highlight Melo's value to the team, it's to show the miscalculation from last yrs roster to this yrs roster if circumstances were equal.

You add AA, Lopez, O-Quinn, Rook, Rook, Williams compared to Melo along with rest of roster being healthy last yr as they've been this yr...what's the true Win replacement total? Healthier roster last yr without the gimmicks of losing later in the season we were probably a 27 win team and not 17. So if we're pacing to win 38gms this yr all those additions/replacements only equate to 11wins, Phil shelled out $90mil for this kind of low win increase?

Melo didn't go from not making players better for 12-13yrs and then all of a sudden to making teammates better this yr. Several players on this team aren't even having career yrs this yr. They'e been extremely hot an cold in any given game or over stretches of games this yr.

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Melo always made teammates better bc he commands so much attention. He's a scoring FWD... Not sure what many expect him to be? He's not LJ or Bird, but it cannot be denied that he helped players bc (when he passed the ball) they had space and were more open than they would normally be if the defense wasn't concentrating and game planning on stopping Carmelo.

I think PJ went with Plan-C and overpaid for somewhat dependable vet types in ROLO and Affalo bc (1) the upcoming salary cap increase made it possible to do so and (2) the hope was that if he built a respectable roster, Even if only incrementally better, to compliment a healthier Melo... Was our best selling point and only hope to attract free agents this Summer. Plus they gave him trade chips...

Who knows. Bc the previous idiots dealt this year's first round pick...
It wasn't feasible and would've been a PR nightmare if we just went in tank mode and passed on signing anything in free agency even remotely respectable.

However.... I am in agreement with you... If we fail to make playoffs this season and then cannot attract the top tier guys in free agency this Summer.... Then I would trade everything this summer... Melo would probably welcome it (I hope)... And would go in tank mode and build around KP, Grant, DW, LT, and LG... Stink and snag another lottery pick is really the only hope at that point... Otherwise, we risk not being Title worthy for the foreseeable future, and could squander the pre-prime years of POrZ

mafra said:

Melo always made teammates better bc he commands so much attention. He's a scoring FWD... Not sure what many expect him to be? He's not LJ or Bird, but it cannot be denied that he helped players bc (when he passed the ball) they had space and were more open than they would normally be if the defense wasn't concentrating and game planning on stopping Carmelo.

I think PJ went with Plan-C and overpaid for somewhat dependable vet types in ROLO and Affalo bc (1) the upcoming salary cap increase made it possible to do so and (2) the hope was that if he built a respectable roster, Even if only incrementally better, to compliment a healthier Melo... Was our best selling point and only hope to attract free agents this Summer. Plus they gave him trade chips...

Who knows. Bc the previous idiots dealt this year's first round pick...
It wasn't feasible and would've been a PR nightmare if we just went in tank mode and passed on signing anything in free agency even remotely respectable.

However.... I am in agreement with you... If we fail to make playoffs this season and then cannot attract the top tier guys in free agency this Summer.... Then I would trade everything this summer... Melo would probably welcome it (I hope)... And would go in tank mode and build around KP, Grant, DW, LT, and LG... Stink and snag another lottery pick is really the only hope at that point... Otherwise, we risk not being Title worthy for the foreseeable future, and could squander the pre-prime years of POrZ

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This is the 10,000lb elephant in the room