Game Thread: New York Knicks vs Detroit Pistons 7:30 pm 3/27/2017 [Game#74]

mafra said:

Yeah, we should be DNPing Melo vs DET, not SA. A few meaningless wins could crippled this franchise. 2 years ago 2 wins meant KP and not KAT. 10 years ago, consecutive seasons of winning a few games late meant Gallinari and Hill (and not Westbrook and Curry).

Bottom line: Picking in too 6 and you're pretty much guaranteed a franchise cornerstone piece. If, perchance, we slip and fall in the 7-10 range.... we'll, that could mean having to settle for a Gallinari and miss out on a Westbrook.

Click to expand...

Just as there are best case scenarios, there are also worst case scenarios such as a team in the 6 to 10 range moving up that isn't us(Think Cleveland over the past 5-6yrs). As in we get leaped over or bumped down and in this case we don't want to get bumped down any further than necessary. It's imperative we finish as high as we possibly can.

Yes it's nice to know of the possibilities of winning the lottery with slimmest of chance...we don't need to lessen it but know if we don't the ugly possibilities remain too.

tiger0330 said:

The triangle was working yesterday. Guys were moving the ball for the best shot yesterday, on some plays guys were passing up wide open looks for even higher % shots under the basket. Phil may decide that fine tuning next year may be better than a complete re-boot of the roster where Horn has to start teaching the triangle all over again to new players.

I can see his point, if he blows up the roster and decides to tank, there goes his legacy, his final two years will be a waste except to lay the groundwork for the next GM. Tank and he'll probably go down in Knicks history as the GM with not only the worst single season record but the all-time worst record for any GM in club history.

Click to expand...

So are you saying it easier to teach "old dogs" new tricks? I'd reason it would be easier to teach players who haven't had habits set in. Although one could argue is the triangle a "new trick"...lol

Broadway said:

Alexy Shved and Andrea Bargnani were end of season hall of fame performers oh how quickly we forget the good ole days...lol

I take absolutely nothing away from these games... I concluded the assessing of this team 50-70gms ago. They can't even lose games graciously when needed. Detroit had been floundering it was a perfect time limit guys minutes, bring them off the bench, or DNP them

GMs around the league already know who Melo is(they either value him or they don't), a meaningless win against Detroit will not sway them 1 iota

Click to expand...

I think it's funny to say, but I seriously have my doubts that all the GMs in this league put the same perspective into their decision making that you do.

It may be meaningless at this point in the season, but watching Porzingis play well is still a lot more fun in the short term than watching him get more fouls than shots made.

That said, it's better if we just lose out.

htr10 said:

I think it's funny to say, but I seriously have my doubts that all the GMs in this league put the same perspective into their decision making that you do.

Click to expand...

I'd put all of Kiyaman's posts on the table and say with absolute confidence not 1 GM in this league is looking at a single game Melo is playing at this point in the season and hedging on his trade value...:2cents:. They know what he does and doesn't bring to the table.

I do agree with you 100% in that not all GMs see Melo's value as I do...:thumbsup:

melo's actual trade value, however anyone sees it, is kind of irrelevant at this point. Given phil's poor trade skills in recent history regarding the knicks, what matters more than anything at this point is how GMs around the league figure they can scam phil. they know he desperately wants to get rid of melo. how little they can give away in return... that's what matters more than melo's ACTUAL value.
this is all about how phil will be able to negotiate the trade. based on his history with the knicks to this point, i don't have much confidence in the dude. i get the feeling we're going to get fleeced, and phil's ego will never allow him to admit it, AND he will be confident that he did the right thing no matter what.

tiger0330 said:

The triangle was working yesterday. Guys were moving the ball for the best shot yesterday, on some plays guys were passing up wide open looks for even higher % shots under the basket. Phil may decide that fine tuning next year may be better than a complete re-boot of the roster where Horn has to start teaching the triangle all over again to new players.

I can see his point, if he blows up the roster and decides to tank, there goes his legacy, his final two years will be a waste except to lay the groundwork for the next GM. Tank and he'll probably go down in Knicks history as the GM with not only the worst single season record but the all-time worst record for any GM in club history.

Click to expand...

Hornachek just stated that the main goal of the offseason is to upgrade defensively..... obviously, signing Lee and Noah and retaining Thomas and KOQ didn't really do the trick.

---//

"I think if you look at our defense this year, we can use some more defensive players," Hornacek told Ian Begley of ESPN. "[Management] will look at that. [General manager] Steve [Mills] and [president] Phil [Jackson] and those guys will look at whatever can help us out. We know we need some help there."

The Knicks allow opponents to score 19 points per night from the free-throw line -- the sixth highest total in the NBA. New York has also given up the highest amount of offensive rebounds and second-chance points per game, in addition to the fifth-most points in the paint.

I love the concept of defensive players like this is the NFL and not a game where the same idiots play both ends of the court. Maybe the NBA will allot us 100 timeouts a game so we can change players every time the ball passes mid court.

htr10 said:

I love the concept of defensive players like this is the NFL and not a game where the same idiots play both ends of the court. Maybe the NBA will allot us 100 timeouts a game so we can change players every time the ball passes mid court.

Click to expand...

This made me laugh. Great quote htr10.

Michael Kay is blasting NYK for winning last night. The team dropped from 4th to 6th.... said if teams like GSW, SA, CLE rest stars for good of franchise (to win in post season) then NYK should do the same.... rest Melo and rose for good of franchise (its future).

Rose walked away from NYK for a game... went MIA... So why should NYK help him boost free agency value by playing well last 10 games?

Melo and Rose had 70 games and they let team down... so why should nYK play those 2 the final 10 games?

PHI openly tanked 3 entire seasons.... why can't NY just tank 10 games?

Didn't they learn 2 years ago?

mafra said:

Michael Kay is blasting NYK for winning last night. The team dropped from 4th to 6th.... said if teams like GSW, SA, CLE rest stars for good of franchise (to win in post season) then NYK should do the same.... rest Melo and rose for good of franchise (its future).

Rose walked away from NYK for a game... went MIA... So why should NYK help him boost free agency value by playing well last 10 games?

Melo and Rose had 70 games and they let team down... so why should nYK play those 2 the final 10 games?

PHI openly tanked 3 entire seasons.... why can't NY just tank 10 games?

Didn't they learn 2 years ago?

Click to expand...

I think Silver's memo about resting players has something to do with it along with this being a home game and the MSG ticket prices being the highest in the NBA. Customers should expect to see the teams best players for the money they're paying and no matter what the standings are, it's always nice to see the home team win. I'd love to see the team tank and not get meaningless wins but the reality is fans at the Garden are paying top dollar to see Melo and Rose not Baker and Kuz.

That, of course, is one of the big arguments. And, supposedly, one of the main reasons Dolan wanted Melo re-signed.

But, let's be honest, there's a reason NYK was rated by Forbes as the #1 rated NBA franchise (based on value/worth).

The corporate culture at MSG ensures most tickets are bought anyway. I mean, heck, this team has been lousy for almost 2 decades and they still maintain "sell-out" streaks.

So, catering to fans who bought from scalpers would be short-sighted; and, actually, I doubt this is even a serious consideration at this point of the season. It's late March, the team has nothing to play for, and is pitted against the bland DET Pistons....

You can argue whether or not to rest Melo and Rose.... maybe.... but playing them in the fourth quarter?

NY fans are astute and in tune.... if they were saps enough to actually go to a game at this point.... I'm sure they'd be on board with running Randle, Plumlee, Kuz out there in the fourth for the betterment of the future.

Then again, maybe Horn feels best way to lose is to play ISO-Melo and Rose in the 4th.... it just happened to backfire last night.

We all know what will happen if NYK ends up drafting 8th instead of 4th.... fans will be livid.

But.... livid or not.... angry or not.... tickets will still be sold out regardless.

Well, the Sixers beat the Nets, so now we're tied with them for the 5th worst record in the NBA with 8 games to play.

tiger0330 said:

I think Silver's memo about resting players has something to do with it along with this being a home game and the MSG ticket prices being the highest in the NBA. Customers should expect to see the teams best players for the money they're paying and no matter what the standings are, it's always nice to see the home team win. I'd love to see the team tank and not get meaningless wins but the reality is fans at the Garden are paying top dollar to see Melo and Rose not Baker and Kuz.

Click to expand...

Resting doesn't mean DNP them on end...but they could limit their minutes and/or bring them off the bench that is well within the rules. The real problem Hornacek opened his mouth to the media stating our tanking methodology/approach to close the season...lol

This team does absolutely everything wrong

Knicks have a home and away vs MIA, then they host Bos, Chi, Wash, before heading to MEM. Before ending season on a 2-game homestand (TOR, PHi).

8 games.... 6 home and 2 away.

NYK will probably go 3-5.... I see them beating either MIA once or CHI and then beating PHI. However, a split vs a MIA and beating both Chi and Phil wouldn't shock me.

31-51 will probably be their record.

Orlando has Nets twice, DET and CHI and Indy.

Sixers have 2-3 winnable games and SAC has Minny, Mavs, Suns, NO, and Suns.

So, still a great chance NY finishes in the top 4-6 worst records. That last game vs PHI should be fan appreciation night. Get a ticket and get to play 15 minutes....

htr10 said:

Well, the Sixers beat the Nets, so now we're tied with them for the 5th worst record in the NBA with 8 games to play.

Click to expand...

MN also pulled out a squeaker against Indy on Rickys 3 fts after a disputed Teague foul on his 3. Those 2 teams are not tanking looking to build good habits for the future.

Knicks have the toughest schedule of the teams vying for that 4th spot, that's to our advantage. Horn needs to help.

A loss to the Heat tomorrow mathematically eliminates us from making the playoffs. Maybe that makes Horn play his tank lineups and rest Melo and DRose, a potentially important game if it does.