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  1. #16
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    Hornacek at this point is just company manning his way to end of season and/or firing


  2. #17
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    I saw in this thread Knits may go back home during the summer. Knicks need to make it mandatory they both workout together in the offseason. I'd prefer in the states but since they both aren't from here originally I'd be okay with it offshore as long as they are together.


  3. #18
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    Nice on/off thread bout Frank Knits ..
    So far I grade Frank .. B-minus
    Before anyone call out Frank Knits performance / stats having to play spot-minute in the coach 100 different lineup a game .. remember .... the knicks veteran players n coach were not going to let a 19 yr old come in n call the shots on offense!
    Plus remember .. The Knicks has the top-3 worst coaching-staff in the NBA!
    There's very little movement without the ball in Hornacek offense .. there's rarely any passing to moving players in Hornacek offense .. and Hornacek's defense has stunk for practically 2 seasons.

    Those who are comparing rookie performance / stats need to understand the 2017 draft class has over 12 future all-star players.
    Donovan Mitchell or Dennis Smith Jr. would not have gave Hornacek a better record than the Knicks have now during all star break.

    I recall the predicament the knicks were in last year this time from having so many losses .... I also recall on draft night our 30 shots per game Iso-Melo refuse to sign the NTC in his contract.
    Knicks selecting DSJ offense to replace Rose offense was not a bright idea after a no defense knicks season.

    We all knew what we were getting when we selected Frank Knits defensive strength / length.
    There's nothing wrong when a 19 yr old want to go home for the summer.
    If Perry/Mills higher a new head coach before the 2018 draft night .. I'm sure Frank Knits will attend the Knicks summer league games.

  4. #19
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    Drafting Knits and giving a B- grade is definitely grading on a curve and giving this a homeristic edge...sorry it's not a B-. Now if he shows some giddy up last 25gms or so and clearly stands out it may get close to this grade but as of today no way is it anywhere near a B

  5. #20
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    Originally Posted by Broadway
    Drafting Knits and giving a B- grade is definitely grading on a curve and giving this a homeristic edge...sorry it's not a B-. Now if he shows some giddy up last 25gms or so and clearly stands out it may get close to this grade but as of today no way is it anywhere near a B
    I think Kiya is giving Ntilikina a B- grade as a young prospect so far and giving the Knicks an F as an organization for how they have handled him.

  6. #21
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    If you're Ntilikina, you leak to the world that you plan on returning to France for the offseason in the middle of February because you are upset with the Knicks. Ntilikina is going to practice, seeing how the focus is on Mudiay and hearing how Mudiay is becoming the starting PG. If you believe the internet, our team either has very poor or no real development coaches to work with a young PG (hence the interest in Prigioni).

    Like I said earlier in this thread, I've seen the writing on the wall. Unless our head coach and front office change between now and the start of next season, Ntilikina probably has no future with the Knicks. I could even see us not picking up Ntilikina's team option after the end of the 2018-19 season. Remember, Mills and Perry are gearing up for the 2019 offseason (to get who, I don't know).

  7. #22
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    The main target for 2019 is Kyrie Irving. So, getting Knits or Mudiay up to snuff the next 107 games will be futile if we then turn around and sign KI.

    Now, the team can’t depend on KI coming here, bc if he doesn’t the team is screwed without a plan-B.

    It’s almost as if Perry is fine if either Mudiay or Knits is here come 2019-2020, as long as Irving or Klay Thompson sign here.

    Now... if both prove to be HR gems.... this means we can pass on KI and spread dollars around building a supporting cast.

    I think we should all wait until the 20 game mark next season before we start to assume what sort of player Knits will be. Let’s see what improvements he makes from year 1 to 2.

    Remember, Knicks knew he was the most raw prospect of the bunch they considered... the Knicks felt he had the highest ceiling. This means, they believe Knits will improve his game over the next 3 seasons significantly more than DSJ and DM. While all players have room to grow, not all grow at an equal pace.
    Last edited by mafra; Feb 21, 2018 at 16:05.

  8. #23
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    Originally Posted by Broadway
    Drafting Knits and giving a B- grade is definitely grading on a curve and giving this a homeristic edge...sorry it's not a B-. Now if he shows some giddy up last 25gms or so and clearly stands out it may get close to this grade but as of today no way is it anywhere near a B
    I gave Frank a B-minus the same way I grade Burke a C+plus .. the two young PG played very well in lineup having Quinn Mcderm Beasley .. not so well in lineups having shoot first players Kanter KP THJ Lee n Lance .. 5 Knicks players who don't move without the ball always standing in one spot begging for the ball as if they know the team is TANKING the season.
    How many times Burke was hot as a fire cracker then taken out the game n never put back in the game till garbage minute.
    If Frank average 18 to 20 minute per game throughout 4 quarters how many minute are Frank averaging per quarter. Remember Frank is a 19 yr old rookie who should have been receiving playingtime in a lineup tandem in the backcourt with Jack for 6 minute a game, tandem with Sessions for 6 minute per game, tandem with Lee for 6 minute per game, and tandem with THJ for 6 minute per game.
    Not tandem with a raw project Baker for 5 minute per game. POOR POOR Coaching !!!

  9. #24
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    if we then turn around and sign KI.
    Here, good sir, I fell off my chair laughing.
    "Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand."
    Kurt Vonnegut

  10. #25
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    Originally Posted by mafra
    The main target for 2019 is Kyrie Irving. So, getting Knits or Mudiay up to snuff the next 107 games will be futile if we then turn around and sign KI.

    Now, the team can’t depend on KI coming here, bc if he doesn’t the team is screwed without a plan-B.

    It’s almost as if Perry is fine if either Mudiay or Knits is here come 2019-2020, as long as Irving or Klay Thompson sign here.

    Now... if both prove to be HR gems.... this means we can pass on KI and spread dollars around building a supporting cast.

    I think we should all wait until the 20 game mark next season before we start to assume what sort of player Knits will be. Let’s see what improvements he makes from year 1 to 2.

    Remember, Knicks knew he was the most raw prospect of the bunch they considered... the Knicks felt he had the highest ceiling. This means, they believe Knits will improve his game over the next 3 seasons significantly more than DSJ and DM. While all players have room to grow, not all grow at an equal pace.
    If Dolan wasnt so greedy wanting to TANK 3 to 6 seasons in a row .. Dolan would have kept center Robin Lopez plus had a meeting with Oakley then had Phil sign Oakley to develop KP inside game on offense/defense .. Don't believe the hype bout Dolan isn't involve the Rose for Lopez trade and the Melo signing were all owner Dolan's doing.
    To make young Knits n Mudiay into a star tandem backcourt in the NBA is easy .. Hire Mark Jackson or Jason Kidd weeks before the 2018 draft night.

    I watch the Dallas Mavs coach Rick Calisle back in the daze coaching the Detroit Pistons turn a defensive PG Billups into a superstar MVP PG!
    Cuban would have selected Knits over DSJ n Mitchell for headcoach Rick Carlisle !!!

    I don't want a shoot-first PG from the draft or from free agency (Kyrie Irving) .. I do want a shoot first SG from the draft (Dotson) or from the free agent market (Klay Thompson).
    Hint .. if Tim Hardaway was shooting the way he was shooting the past 7 KNOCKS game 18% fg on the Atlanta Hawks Tim would have been DNP bench in the 4th game like last year on the Hawks.
    It's hard for any Knick player to deny the Knicks are not TANKING !!!

  11. #26
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    The formal part of Knicks practice was over Wednesday. Some players hoisted shots, some did interviews on camera. Off to the side, coach Jeff Hornacek huddled with Emmanuel Mudiay, who at the end of the talk put in additional running.

    On Tuesday night, Mudiay worked often with the first unit, a task he repeated the next day. Blend all this with Hornacek indicating he is committed to change — “I think you probably can say that,” he said — and Mudiay is the likely starter at point guard when the Knicks resume play Thursday in Orlando.

    If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it is probably Mudiay starting at point guard against the Magic. Hornacek declined to name his starters, but all indications say Mudiay gets first call over rookie Frank Ntilikina to replace Jarrett Jack on the first unit to initiate the final 23 games.


    “Definitely means something to me,” Mudiay, the No. 7 pick in 2015 who was acquired at the trade deadline from the Nuggets in a three-team trade, said Wednesday in Tarrytown. “I’m not going to take it for granted. I came in as a lottery pick, so I was kind of handed the spot. The fact that I’m in that position again, it’s a blessing. … I just have to take full advantage.”

    Sounds like he’s starting. With Denver this season, he came off the bench in all 42 games he played. That was after starting 66 games as a rookie and 41 of 55 games last season. He averaged 17.9 minutes with Denver this season, 23.0 in three games with the Knicks. So after practicing for just a second time with a team whose season has been stamped “lottery bound” amid an eight-game losing streak, Mudiay huddled with Hornacek.

    “Just kind of go over things. Basically just ask him if he’s got a good feel for what our guys can do, ” said Hornacek, who stopped short of acknowledging Mudiay as the starter.

    “We’ll see. We have a lot of point guards that we want to see get time. Whether he plays the one or the two, if he starts or comes off the bench, you know all the minutes will probably go up so I’m excited to see how they do,” Hornacek said.

    Ntilikina remains in the equation. For a second straight day, Hornacek claimed the starting point guard spot is not etched in stone. One game could mean Mudiay, another Ntilikina. Eventually, they could start together, but don’t look for that on the immediate horizon.

    “Two big guards, tall guards. Defensively, I think he’s great. Offensively, I think he’s getting more confidence. And I’m just going to try to feed as much confidence in him as I can. He’s 19,” the grizzled 21-year-old Mudiay said of Ntilikina. “The fact that he’s going to play a lot more, he’s going to get to grow faster. Make a couple mistakes and then take his ups and downs but mostly ups I feel like. And he’s a great talent.”

    One who has struggled and seen shifts in his role. All part of the growing process, Hornacek said.

    “I think he hit a little bit of a wall. The energy, and his [sore] knee,” Hornacek said. “He just looked exhausted at some times. … Can he play the 30 minutes without his knees hurting? Part of that is growth. He’s young.

    “These last two practices … he’s looked really good and he’s not complaining about any knee issues.”

    So Hornacek eventually envisions that tag-team approach for his starting point position — when they’re not together.

    “It’s giving guys some opportunities,” Hornacek said of employing different starting units. “We still have guys that maybe some nights they’re playing really well and a guy might only get 15 minutes. Then you say, ‘OK, let’s mix it up.’

    “When you come off the bench, to play 30 minutes you’re almost playing straight through. So that will just be looking at who is getting what minutes and if we can balance that out and give them all good [opportunities].”

    (NY Post)

  12. #27
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    Here’s what I get out of Hornacek’s quotes:

    “We’re going to do complete random bull**** and what’s going to happen is going to be a complete mystery to everyone but me until the second that it happens. Also, Mudiay is the new starter and Ntilikina is great on defense, so he’s never going to play.”

  13. #28
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    Frank's development in the rotation will be determined for the rest of his knick career. He will have the opportunity to play the shooting guard position as a Tony Allen type. He will provide defense and occasional three point shooting. He is young, so expect mistakes, however, he is capable of getting a triple-double like against the Nets this season. Frank and Mudiay will provide youth, athleticism and a future.
    "The Knicks are back" - Amare

  14. #29
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    Originally Posted by Broadway
    Hornacek at this point is just company manning his way to end of season and/or firing

    finally..hornacek should have done this 20 games ago. He has to go full blown youth movement now. Play Dotson and this new guy Troy Williams over Lance Thomas and Lee/Hardaway. Play Kornett often and develop his outside shot. I can see the Knicks developing these good players slowly and getting into a good draft position. I want Mikal Bridges, Trae Young, or Bamba and I don't mind us trading up with a player for a better pick. We should do everything to obtain another first round pick this season. These should be some goals.
    "The Knicks are back" - Amare

  15. #30
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    Originally Posted by Kiyaman
    I gave Frank a B-minus the same way I grade Burke a C+plus .. the two young PG played very well in lineup having Quinn Mcderm Beasley .. not so well in lineups having shoot first players Kanter KP THJ Lee n Lance .. 5 Knicks players who don't move without the ball always standing in one spot begging for the ball as if they know the team is TANKING the season.
    How many times Burke was hot as a fire cracker then taken out the game n never put back in the game till garbage minute.
    If Frank average 18 to 20 minute per game throughout 4 quarters how many minute are Frank averaging per quarter. Remember Frank is a 19 yr old rookie who should have been receiving playingtime in a lineup tandem in the backcourt with Jack for 6 minute a game, tandem with Sessions for 6 minute per game, tandem with Lee for 6 minute per game, and tandem with THJ for 6 minute per game.
    Not tandem with a raw project Baker for 5 minute per game. POOR POOR Coaching !!!

    Once again sounds like you're using a curve when I see a word like "IF". It's one thing to believe he's a B- type talent but no evidence this yr has shown this. I mean as bad as the Magic have been with developing their talent many of their prospects have forced the organization to give players looks in larger roles, in doses. Now there was never any fluidity, rhyme or reason, or sticktoitness with how they were going about it but each player gave them something optimistic to think about...Knits has sewed doubts every since day 1 of drafting him and has never eliminated this. Remember he started off SL with suspicion(delicate body) and that was his chance to play against chump comp...Hornacek is still echoing doubt he can't physically play 30min/night

    A player that has truly shown a high arc of talent would not cause an organization to look at Baker/Sessions/Jack(was almost out of the league)/Mudiay(who's stock was as low as it could get) before giving him the first chance to prove otherwise

    He doesn't deserve a B, he does have 25gms to improve on his grade
    Last edited by Broadway; Feb 22, 2018 at 01:16.

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