Has crawford really improved? Is he better than a mediocre SG?

nyk_nyk

All Star
Why are there two threads devoted to JC this week? I've been really critical of Jamal this off season for some reason so I went to NBA.com and just watched some of his highlights last night. The thing that impresses me about Jamal is his ability to hit tough shots...the thing that pisses me off about Jamal is that he often causes shots to be difficult shots. I mean I want to say he has potential but, like it was stated earlier, can we really be saying that about a seven year player who still makes rookie mistakes. I mean we still say Eddy has "potential" to be this or that, but it almost seems more realistic to think Eddy's game will evolve. To Jamal's credit there have been times when he has stepped up for us, like in the home game against Pheonix this past season, we were undermanned playing an elite team, and he kept us in it, and like was also stated he has a positive attitude both on and off the court. But I think he may be better suited for another team, what can we get from him if he is not scoring is the question I often pose on this site. A player like Kobe, D- Wade, Rip, or Joe Johnson will take advantage of him on defense. Again to his credit he can light them up too when he's hot, but it is a real hit or miss with Jamal either his is lighting up D-Wade or getting burned by Willie Green. I remember the game against the Bulls this year when we were mounting a comeback and, he was in a 1 on 3 fast break, and he forces the shot I think gets called for a charge, then the Bulls come down a bury a 3 the next possesion breaking our momentum. And that is the problem after 7 years he's still making those mistakes, seriously Mardy Collins a rookie wouldn't have made that mistake, I don't think Nate as a sophomore would've either (and that's saying something). I like his handle on the ball, and he's as quick a guard in the NBA, but these are offensive traits ! Our interior D is the worst in the League! So we need solid defenders on the perimeter, not the type who can play D at times. If what I read was true that he just started playing less than 10 years ago, then that would explain his lack of knowledge of the game, I just don't think he knows anything other than put the ball in the hoop. Can he come back with a new understanding after this off season?....yeah in fact I think all the talk of compettion in the backcourt may mean that all of our guards are going to be working hard this offseason on their weaknesses, so I am in no way saying he's a lost cause. But what he shows us this year is who he's going to be for the rest of his NBA career. So the potential tag has been lifted, Steve is gone so there is no question as to who is starting and who's coming off the bench at the 2, and now let's see what we have here, another Rip, or another Ricky Davis, Ray Allen or J.R. Smith.
Jamal has improved every year since he's been here. If you've watched Jamal from his chicago days up until this season, he has stopped playing reckless and passes more. I know he is still inconsistent as far as shooting but he is not the same player he was on the Bulls.

A lot of this had to do with L. Brown and Jamal is better because of it. Defensively, Jamal isn't the worst defender and does a good job of using those long arms to poke the ball away. I guess it would help him to move his feet a bit more instead of relying on his wingspan to cover area.

I'm not worried about Crawford's game because as bad as people want to make him out to be, he was one of our best players and you can make an argument that with him in the lineup at the end we would have made the playoffs.
 

jzero29

Rotation player
No he hasn't

Jamal has improved every year since he's been here. If you've watched Jamal from his chicago days up until this season, he has stopped playing reckless and passes more. I know he is still inconsistent as far as shooting but he is not the same player he was on the Bulls.

A lot of this had to do with L. Brown and Jamal is better because of it. Defensively, Jamal isn't the worst defender and does a good job of using those long arms to poke the ball away. I guess it would help him to move his feet a bit more instead of relying on his wingspan to cover area.
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Crawford had better assit numbers in his last season with chicago(means he passed better). His numbers are very similar to what they are now, except he has more turnovers and less assists now, than in chicago, because he is a poor passer, has excellent handle for a SG, but below avg for a PG. Still makes poor decisions Like a rookie!(as isiahs advocate pointed out) I really wish people would stop saying he's improved!!! Look at his stats! He was winning more in chicago than he is here! He had a career year with chicago in every stat! Not one is as good as it was then! Got to his player profile and look. He at times plays good, but often reverts to old form. I just can't say it enough. He's a good guy to have on the bench a role player. Shouldn't be paid as much(but you can say that about 90% of the knicks. I give up!!!
 

nyk_nyk

All Star
Crawford had better assit numbers in his last season with chicago(means he passed better). His numbers are very similar to what they are now, except he has more turnovers and less assists now, than in chicago, because he is a poor passer, has excellent handle for a SG, but below avg for a PG. Still makes poor decisions Like a rookie!(as isiahs advocate pointed out) I really wish people would stop saying he's improved!!! Look at his stats! He was winning more in chicago than he is here! He had a career year with chicago in every stat! Not one is as good as it was then! Got to his player profile and look. He at times plays good, but often reverts to old form. I just can't say it enough. He's a good guy to have on the bench a role player. Shouldn't be paid as much(but you can say that about 90% of the knicks. I give up!!!
Okay so tell me who you would replace Crawford with right now that's available?
 

jzero29

Rotation player
Okay so tell me who you would replace Crawford with right now that's available?

Q-rich or marbury at SG or an old sneaker. Heck i'd even take a boot. Is becky hammon available? realistically, you couldn't just trade him, You'd have to part with some of the new blood, maybe morris and somebody else. Even if there was someon out there you couldn't sign him without gettingrid of crawford. Realistically because of crawford we couldn't get anyone for him either. My point is he hasn't improved really that much at all in the last 3-4 years. I'm just saying it was a bad move to sign him. There was talent out there. this off season, rashard lewis. was a sign and trade for a draft pick. Mo peterson.(may have been restricted) You can get a guy like mat carrol or mat barnes cheap, but solid, paly better d, more consistent shot, wouldn' need 15-20 shots a game to hit their number. You would have to rely more on other scores, but knicks have plenty of those(curry randolh marbury q-rich, nate). Would easy some ball sharing issues. If i could trade crawford for matt carrol i would, if the other team eats crawfords bloated salary. We'd take carrols modest salary and let him be a role player. He doesn't have the penetration jamaal has, but steph, and nate would have to pick up that slack and he's a better shooter, which is what the knicks need. Solid, not as streaky(all shooters are streaky, crawford more than most)
 

jzero29

Rotation player
Deshawn stevens,

he'd have been nice. he signed for 11mil 4 yrs. shot better from 3pt range than crawford from anywhere on the floor, He would have been awesome, can shoot and defend. Mo peterson, mat carrol,( i don't care what anyone says about that, he would fit the knicks much better than jamaal does!!! He plays with heart and hustle also comes at a fraction of the price of crawford. You see any cheap sg could fill his spot and it would fix some of the knicks problems. Isiah has put to many versitile players on the same team, they all need to dominate the ball, he needs just some role players, would get the job done. A nice 3 point shooter would be great. Forget crawford, mr i do everything well, and nothing great! We need a great 3pt shooter.
 

metrocard

Legend
. If you've watched Jamal from his chicago days up until this season, he has stopped playing reckless and passes more.

Yes, we've watched Crawford, I'm sure you haven't to say that. Crawford is the same player from the Chicago trade. If he did really "progressed" We would have a 20 ppg 44% FG 37% 3pt shooter with solid defense who doesn't play like he's in the circus. But we don't. He's an average 3pt shooter who doesn't use his talent on the court the right way;he's a better mid range shooter than 3pt shooter, but is fearless on chucking ridiculous shots, instead of coming screens where he would be much more accurate on shooting. Crawford must believes he gets 2pt points for every crossover he does, that why he never finishes the play he's suppose to. He doesn't drive to the basketball enough, which just makes him a spectator on offense waiting to chuck or throw an alley-oop to Chubby. Therefor, Crawford is Crawford, a streaky inconsistent player you CANNOT rely on, unless you want to lose a lot of basketball games(hence one of the reasons Crawford has never help his team make the playoffs, this dude isn't just the type of guy to have on the team to win or make the playoffs, Crawford is only for entertainment). With that said, I have zero interest in Crawford, and under the circumstances, I would gladly trade him and let Richardson, Collins, Chandler, and Nichols patrol the SG area till we get an upgrade.
 

metrocard

Legend
Is it me or is Jamal more valuable to this team than steph? Our three best players last year was curry, lee, and crawford before he got injured, hands down marbury was played real good for just 3 months. and the season before that, Q, Crawford, and frye. Crawford won games by himself last season, he adapts easily to any style of play that the coach wants, while it takes marbury (who's been in the leage 11 years) half a season to get the concept of passing the ball to eddy curry. Dont get me wrong crawford can be replaced, but there aren't a lot of available SG that will fill his position better. to me Marubury is more expendable at his position.

Crawford lost a lot more games than he has won, by a large margain. He just isn't a smart basketball player. He's very careless with the ball and takes the shots that he doesn't need to take.

Marbury is a superior NBA player compared to Jamal, by far. Marbury is B/B+ Crawford is a C+ player at best, would be a C cause his defense is so bad and he's one dementional.

All this all star potential junk needs to go too. He's too one dementional and doesn't post up good enough all around stats to be an all star, period. The only way he makes the all star team if he averages 25 ppg. He couldn't even do that in Chicago as the main option. He's very talented, but his performance on the court is no where near All star level. A less talented guy like Ginobili made the all star averaged 15 or 16 ppg, why? Defensively, he's one of the best at his position, he was an excellent passer and an unselfish player, who at the same time was very entertaining and a smart basketball player, an all around game. You don't even need to be flashy...check out Rip Hamilton, dude is as one dementional at Crawford, but whats the difference? Consistency.

There a tons of SG's in the NBA who can fill his position much better, from Kobe to Raja to even an all around combo guard like John Salmons who plays defense or a defensive role player like Francisco Garcia. These guys know how to play basketball. Send Crawford and Robinson back to the circus so they can preform their tricks. I'm tired of sacrificing wins so these bums can look autistic on the court.
 
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datruth

Your Best Bet is B Ez
well numbers dont represent everything cuz yeah FG% is not that good but jamal is in the position alot of times to take a shot wit 1 second on the shot clock and he's not like other NBA players who stumble/fumble the ball when the game clock is running down and they on the opposite side of the court, jamal doesnt worry about his numbers, that should count for something
 
Crawford lost a lot more games than he has won, by a large margain. He just isn't a smart basketball player. He's very careless with the ball and takes the shots that he doesn't need to take.

Marbury is a superior NBA player compared to Jamal, by far. Marbury is B/B+ Crawford is a C+ player at best, would be a C cause his defense is so bad and he's one dementional.

There a tons of SG's in the NBA who can fill his position much better, from Kobe to Raja to even an all around combo guard like John Salmons who plays defense or a defensive role player like Francisco Garcia. These guys know how to play basketball. Send Crawford and Robinson back to the circus so they can preform their tricks. I'm tired of sacrificing wins so these bums can look autistic on the court.

Preach ! No disrespect to Jamal he's been a player that I've liked......but there are lesser know players who can make us better, the before mentioned Deshawn Stevenson ( who could be a Knick along with Butler if we didn't chase Jefferies) who can play the 3 and let Q slide back to the 2. What we need is a 2 with a high B Ball IQ, Jamal is a street baller who just happens to play in the NBA, remember how all impressed we all were with his off the back board dunks when he first got here because the Knicks lacked entertainment value during the Layden regime, and I think we never paid much attention to how incomplete a player he was. Now it has become clear that he's just a scorer (and not all that great of one). Also I don't know the Stats on this but he has to have the lowest scoring average, and feild goal pct, of any player to notch 50 plus in a season....meaning he is extremely streaky on any given night Jamal can score between 5 and 55 or knocking down 16 straight or missing 13 straight. Too bad Steve Kerr already dumped a contract in Seatle....that's it! we trade Jamal to Seatle for Kurt Thomas, see if Kurt wants to stay a Knick or not, if not waive him ( right before we waive Jerome James) and let him go to SA to win a championship ( Ex Knicks usaully win thier firs season in SA) ! it's a win win for all, Kurt either returns to the team that made him, or he wins a championship in his home town, Jamal returns home, and Seatlle gets a SG, we either add another complimentary bench player to our weak starting front court, or we cut a contract with just one season left on it. Someone send this propostion to Isiah please
 

jzero29

Rotation player
Finally some people who speak with reason?

Thank you metrocard and Isaiahs add, I can't believe how many people like datruth and reul there are out there that don't see as much as he's exciting and fun sometimes, he's just plain aweful sometimes as well. I think a regular sg, a guy playing the role, would really work well with our line up. It would give more shots to our shot hungery offensive players. Forget crawfords handle we have a ton of point guards. Lets get a pure shooter. A deadly outside shot. let the PGs do the crossovers and penetrations! We have talented point guards in nate and steph. Hey if you take the ball out of crawfords hands and let someone else run the offense, you'll see the PGS assist #s rise. Trust me.
 

GiantsKnickFan

Benchwarmer
Knicks for life and datruth write he's not better than mat carrol, i'm not saying they have better games, they are just better SG. With all the scoring options we have, Curry, Zach, marbury, q-rich even robinson off bench. Do we really need another scorer or just some one who can take a step back and consistently hit 3's. Like those guys i compared him to. They also were cheap, p.s. mat carrol just inked himself a nice little long term contract. We only need a role player with all the other scoreing. Take away jamaals game, are you saying marbury and nate can't break people down? are you saying no one else has mid range jumper? not q rich or zach? every part of his game,except his heart, is replacable. I'll give him that he tries hard. But passing to curry? any point guard worth his salt should be able to do that? isn't that a point guard job, feeding the big men inside?

and shairan we don't need a great scoring sg, we just need someone defenses don't want to leave open behind the 3. Hate to say it but most other shooting guards can do that. We have plenty of scoring elsewhere.

knicksforlife, lets not get crazy with the triple teams. I'll give you the double teams not triple teams.
Giantsknickfan, your right on track, crawford is a good back up pg/sg type player. He's good off the bench. He's not a spot up shooter that can help spread the defense. You are right he did regress back to his chucking days in some games. I'd like to see him play a less dominant role in the offense, less shots, let zach take more mid range give marbury more shots take a couple away from jamaal. He's an overpaid backup, that shots to much. But where did you get that stat about the most game winning shots? I'd like to see that. I'd also like to see how many chances these other guys had, plus how many he didn't make, i watched 80% of games. I remember a few games where he came up big and a bunch more where he came up short.

I'm not saying he's a bumb or worthless, he's just overpaid and not as good as people give him credit for. He's mediocre. He's dare i say it again, replacable. I'm telling you, get a real SG and you guys would never know he's gone. I'm telling you. Get a guy who makes more and shoots less, like matt carrol. That will leave more shots and scoring oppurtunities for the people on the knicks with more talent! Sure him and curry had chemistry, but jamaal and his midrange jumper took away fryes game. We need a pure PG and a pure SG, not a bunch of PG who act like sg's (marbury, robinson and fransis when here) and not SG who can't shoot and has to act as PG because we don't have a true one!!! I'm telling you for what we're paying him, we should get more...I hope jamaal proves me wrong. But So far each season his stats seem very similar each year, and the win total also! So I need to see some big improvements from him to become a crawford supporter. Or he'll always be the back up that gets to start and shoot to much to me. LB had his role Nailed! less shots, take only better shots and come off the bench. Now we need a real SG to start!

I forgot exactly the source where i read it, i think i was stoned, but it said that Arenas and Kobe lead the league with 9 GW shots the past 2 seasons, Jamal was 2nd with 7. (and this doenst include game tying shots, its GW shots under 24 secs)
 
I forgot exactly the source where i read it, i think i was stoned, but it said that Arenas and Kobe lead the league with 9 GW shots the past 2 seasons, Jamal was 2nd with 7. (and this doenst include game tying shots, its GW shots under 24 secs)

No mistake about it he wants the big shot and hits his share of them....but how many costly turnovers,bad shots, and missed game winning and game tying shots has he missed? Look up that stat compare it to the 7 game winners he's hit and see if it evens out. One more time I like Jamal, and wouldn't mind him as a 6th man, but not a starter, just like Nate he's a bench player. He's the only player in our starting lineup that would probably not start for too many other teams. Nate Jamal David Renaldo makes for probably the best bench in the league. Naturally my man Colllins slides to the PG w/ Steph at the 2. That just gives us a little more balance on Offense
 

datruth

Your Best Bet is B Ez
No mistake about it he wants the big shot and hits his share of them....but how many costly turnovers,bad shots, and missed game winning and game tying shots has he missed? Look up that stat compare it to the 7 game winners he's hit and see if it evens out. One more time I like Jamal, and wouldn't mind him as a 6th man, but not a starter, just like Nate he's a bench player. He's the only player in our starting lineup that would probably not start for too many other teams. Nate Jamal David Renaldo makes for probably the best bench in the league. Naturally my man Colllins slides to the PG w/ Steph at the 2. That just gives us a little more balance on Offense

its not only 7 cuz theres more where he hit big shots, for intance the last game he played b4 the injury against miami he knocked down a three to give the knicks a 4 point lead and also against the lakers he had the game winning assist, alley opp to curry, love em or hate em, he is the best knick in the clutch
 
Knicks for life and datruth write he's not better than mat carrol, i'm not saying they have better games, they are just better SG. With all the scoring options we have, Curry, Zach, marbury, q-rich even robinson off bench. Do we really need another scorer or just some one who can take a step back and consistently hit 3's. Like those guys i compared him to. They also were cheap, p.s. mat carrol just inked himself a nice little long term contract. We only need a role player with all the other scoreing. Take away jamaals game, are you saying marbury and nate can't break people down? are you saying no one else has mid range jumper? not q rich or zach? every part of his game,except his heart, is replacable. I'll give him that he tries hard. But passing to curry? any point guard worth his salt should be able to do that? isn't that a point guard job, feeding the big men inside?

and shairan we don't need a great scoring sg, we just need someone defenses don't want to leave open behind the 3. Hate to say it but most other shooting guards can do that. We have plenty of scoring elsewhere.

knicksforlife, lets not get crazy with the triple teams. I'll give you the double teams not triple teams.
Giantsknickfan, your right on track, crawford is a good back up pg/sg type player. He's good off the bench. He's not a spot up shooter that can help spread the defense. You are right he did regress back to his chucking days in some games. I'd like to see him play a less dominant role in the offense, less shots, let zach take more mid range give marbury more shots take a couple away from jamaal. He's an overpaid backup, that shots to much. But where did you get that stat about the most game winning shots? I'd like to see that. I'd also like to see how many chances these other guys had, plus how many he didn't make, i watched 80% of games. I remember a few games where he came up big and a bunch more where he came up short.

I'm not saying he's a bumb or worthless, he's just overpaid and not as good as people give him credit for. He's mediocre. He's dare i say it again, replacable. I'm telling you, get a real SG and you guys would never know he's gone. I'm telling you. Get a guy who makes more and shoots less, like matt carrol. That will leave more shots and scoring oppurtunities for the people on the knicks with more talent! Sure him and curry had chemistry, but jamaal and his midrange jumper took away fryes game. We need a pure PG and a pure SG, not a bunch of PG who act like sg's (marbury, robinson and fransis when here) and not SG who can't shoot and has to act as PG because we don't have a true one!!! I'm telling you for what we're paying him, we should get more...I hope jamaal proves me wrong. But So far each season his stats seem very similar each year, and the win total also! So I need to see some big improvements from him to become a crawford supporter. Or he'll always be the back up that gets to start and shoot to much to me. LB had his role Nailed! less shots, take only better shots and come off the bench. Now we need a real SG to start!


Again, I wonder which Knicks team you watched last year. Did Curry's numbers go up when Jamal went down? No, he did less, and teams made others do more. I wonder why? Maybe becuase they actually RESPECT Jamal's ability from the outside even though he can at times be streaky. The fact that he is so streaky garners respect as if he was NOT streaky. The sheer fact he can score 20 in a quarter before you know it scares teams enough to stretch the defense. No one is leaving him wide open. When does that happen? So again, tell me the need to get a one trick pony like Matt Carrol who can do nothing when a defender gets on him? Same for Barnes? That is why they don't get the huge money, because they can't defend, or put the ball on the floor. So that means they NEED to have other players around them to succeed at what they do best. Right now, on this Knicks team right now, Matt Carrol would STILL BE CRAWFORD'S BACKUP. TODAY. They press steph, who are you passing too? Carrol? They put Bowen on Carrol, is he scoring? Maybe if they double Eddie with Bowen. If not... Carrol gives you nothing. Can't go to the rim, no athleticism. Jump-shooter. Glorified Steve Kerr... IF THAT.

The Cavs just got to the finals with a broken down Hughes and someone named Boobie along with Lebron. Who can REALLY shoot out of those 3? Now no one is underating having a great shooter at the 2... But I think you are overrating the need, especially on this team to have a great one.

They have enough solid shooters to space the floor for Curry. When those solid shooters went down ( Q, Crawford, Nate for a bit ) All the sudden so did our scoring and effectiveness on offense. So that tells me despite how you feel personally about the SG on the team, the LEAGUE feels differently because they, unlike you respected the shooters we had. Enough to less frequently double a man in the middle no one can gaurd one on one.

Far as triple teams are concerned, with no illegal defense and no perimeter threats, they certainly did triple Curry.

Vs Orlando late in the season, I believe we lost by a point late, they freuqently had Battie in front, Dwight in back, and whoever the gaurd was opposite Steph, that player lagged off to make the entry pass tough. Basically daring Balkman, Collins, Rose, Hurt Francis or the like to shoot a long J. Battie, Howard and a g or forward... Yea... that's 3 people on one. Go back and watch some late tapes and see how they shaded their defenses the last 10 games or so to have two on Curry even without the ball, and bring the third defender down.

And I was at a lot of these games, so I seen the angles the tv don't show...
 
its not only 7 cuz theres more where he hit big shots, for intance the last game he played b4 the injury against miami he knocked down a three to give the knicks a 4 point lead and also against the lakers he had the game winning assist, alley opp to curry, love em or hate em, he is the best knick in the clutch

Alright lets have him in at the end of every game....just not the start! The problem is that every clutch play makes the highlights, so it appears that this guy is Tony Kukoc. But how many times have we seen that end of the game isolation play ran and the defender doesn't buy the cross over and he's shooting a fade away jumper from just inside the three off the wrong foot. It is actually the type of shot he takes too often during the course of the game. Look if any NBA player gets that many chances at the end of the game he'll a few down, I do admire his courage to want the shot, but let me ask you this would you consider Eddy clutch? He's hit a pair of free throws to force OT against Pheonix, caught a game winning alley oop, hit a Three at the buzzer against the Bucks, so does that make him the best clutch center in the league? Clutch to me is on both ends of the floor, preventing your man from hitting the game winner is just as important to me.How comfortable would you feel w/ Jamal isolated in the final seconds of the game with us up one? Case in point, take the ball from his hands and there is not much to him.
 

ShairanXIII

Rotation player
ummmmmm... let's remember the squad we had when we signed Mal...

SG
Penny Hardaway, Allan Houston, Jamal Crawford, Jermaine Jackson

PG
Stephon Marbury

PF
Maurice Taylor, Malik Rose, JYD, Butler, Sweetney

SF
Tim Thomas, Ariza

C
Bruno Sundov, K. Thomas
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

remember, we got Mal to be H20's back up yall... think about it as a GM... H20 is 33... recovering from knee surgery and prolly retiring soon... this kid in Chi just had a monster year and you've been following him for a few years now... perfect scenario is the kid learns the art of the SG from H20 and becomes his replacement when he isn't effective...

H20 got hurt... and Mal was our most talented substitute... we didn't have a team that could survive with Caroll or Barnes at the 2... Mal's talents were supposed to be honed with H20's mentoring... but that didn't happen and here were are almost 4 years later with Craw stagnant... his signing was similar to the JJ13 (but far better from a basketball perspective) in that way... he filled a desperate need we had... but things didn't pan out the way we expected them to...

i think we're overlooking the key elements Craw brings to the table in our rush to ship him out... I would only trade him away if we got an offensive facilitator (Brevin Knight) and a relyable scorer (think Steve Kerr, John Paxson type)... since Mal is good at both but not good enough to make a differnce... otherwise... I say keep him since he has the best chemisty with Curry on the team (for real... even Eddy's demeanor changed after Mal was hurt) and he is the most willing to take the game winning shot...

and everyone clamoring for stevenson... did you see how brightly he shined in the playoffs? i thought so...
 

metrocard

Legend
ummmmmm... let's remember the squad we had when we signed Mal...

SG
Penny Hardaway, Allan Houston, Jamal Crawford, Jermaine Jackson

PG
Stephon Marbury

PF
Maurice Taylor, Malik Rose, JYD, Butler, Sweetney

SF
Tim Thomas, Ariza

C
Bruno Sundov, K. Thomas
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

remember, we got Mal to be H20's back up yall... think about it as a GM... H20 is 33... recovering from knee surgery and prolly retiring soon... this kid in Chi just had a monster year and you've been following him for a few years now... perfect scenario is the kid learns the art of the SG from H20 and becomes his replacement when he isn't effective...

H20 got hurt... and Mal was our most talented substitute... we didn't have a team that could survive with Caroll or Barnes at the 2... Mal's talents were supposed to be honed with H20's mentoring... but that didn't happen and here were are almost 4 years later with Craw stagnant... his signing was similar to the JJ13 (but far better from a basketball perspective) in that way... he filled a desperate need we had... but things didn't pan out the way we expected them to...

i think we're overlooking the key elements Craw brings to the table in our rush to ship him out... I would only trade him away if we got an offensive facilitator (Brevin Knight) and a relyable scorer (think Steve Kerr, John Paxson type)... since Mal is good at both but not good enough to make a differnce... otherwise... I say keep him since he has the best chemisty with Curry on the team (for real... even Eddy's demeanor changed after Mal was hurt) and he is the most willing to take the game winning shot...

and everyone clamoring for stevenson... did you see how brightly he shined in the playoffs? i thought so...


So? It was one series. If we're gonna judge players on one series, lets all glorify Jerome James and his well deserved contract.
 

jimkcchief88

All Star
I like Jamal. He is the type of guard you need in the today's NBA because has the skills to play either the 1 or the 2 when needed. He is not a pure shooter but how many pure shooters are out there anymore. He more than makes up for his streak shooting with his ability to slash and score in the paint. Jamal is probably the most complete player on the team and I think he still has potential to get better. Remember he played very little college ball before he went pro. Really liked him here in Chicago and was really glad we picked him up. Definately a keeper in my book.
 

metrocard

Legend
I like Jamal. He is the type of guard you need in the today's NBA because has the skills to play either the 1 or the 2 when needed. He is not a pure shooter but how many pure shooters are out there anymore. He more than makes up for his streak shooting with his ability to slash and score in the paint. Jamal is probably the most complete player on the team and I think he still has potential to get better. Remember he played very little college ball before he went pro. Really liked him here in Chicago and was really glad we picked him up. Definately a keeper in my book.



Alot pure shooters in the NBA. From Miller, Allen, Dirk, Nash, Redd, Bibby, Kapano, Peja, Raja, Lewis, Brent Barry, Barbosa, Krover, etc. I would even put guys like Kobe and Arenas on there, they can hit from anywhere in the court, the only problem is their shot selection. What seperates them from Jamal is their superior ability and talent, and slashing and driving to the paint, something Crawford rarely does.

The problem is, Crawford doesn't slash or score in the paint.

Crawford is the most one dimensional player on this team, I laughed when you said he's the most complete player for the New York Knicks.

Crawford is a NBA veteran already, no more potential talk. Yes he can get better, but he was an over hyped player.

This is the same guy who said Marbury isn't even worthy to be on the Knicks, but "Jamal" is a keeper, lmao.:teeth:
 
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jimkcchief88

All Star
Alot pure shooters in the NBA. From Miller, Allen, Dirk, Nash, Redd, Bibby, Kapano, Peja, Raja, Lewis, Brent Barry, Barbosa, Krover, etc. I would even put guys like Kobe and Arenas on there, they can hit from anywhere in the court, the only problem is their shot selection. What seperates them from Jamal is their superior ability and talent, and slashing and driving to the paint, something Crawford rarely does.

The problem is, Crawford doesn't slash or score in the paint.

Crawford is the most one dimensional player on this team, I laughed when you said he's the most complete player for the New York Knicks.

Crawford is a NBA veteran already, no more potential talk. Yes he can get better, but he was an over hyped player.

This is the same guy who said Marbury isn't even worthy to be on the Knicks, but "Jamal" is a keeper, lmao.:teeth:

Most of the guys on your list are not "pure" shooters. Remember a "pure"shooter most times is a "specialist" brought in for must have baskets and breaking down packed in defenses. Just because you can hit baskets from anywhere sometimes does not make you a pure shooter. MJ wasn't even a pure shooter. The Miller on your list must be Reggie Miller because Mike Miller is a streak shooter, not a pure shooter. Kobe is far from a pure shooter and I wouldn't even put Gilbert on that list though he is close. Pure shooters are guys like Nate McMillen, Kerr, Pax, Craig Hodges and the like. Most pure shooters cannot get their own shot, but are deadly when left open. The guys that can do both are the most deadly legends like Bird and Reggie Miller. I would put Allen Houston in that catagory also except for body of work. I like Jamal because he has old school game. If you leave him open he will hurt you, if you run at him its blow by and then stop and pop( midrange game). He can also finish around the basket which is a deadly combo. You guys forget that today's "veteran players" are yesterday's college juniors and seniors. While I am not against early entry into the league, the guys who do need more time to progress because most NBA coaches coach not teach. They assume your toolbox is already full. Since Jamal has had so many injury problems the word potential still applies. I would hate to see him realize that in another team's uni. Marbury on the other hand is a known quantity, we all know what he can do(score and dish) and what he can't do(make guys around him better and lead a team to quality playoff wins).
 
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