The Official Crawford Sucks Thread

clumsy

Rotation player
Wait first of all don't act like Houston wasn't known to disappear down the stretch in big games. His D was poor (but he worked harder than Jamal), and he never wanted to take the big shot. Nor did he drive the lane either. But the reason why he was >>>>>>>> Than Crawford is cuz of his FG%. He didn't hurt the team by taking stupid shots. Or just being an mediocre shooter liek Crawford.

Houston had a great jump shot. Line drives all day
 

clumsy

Rotation player
but in Crawford's defense i don't think Houston was ever asked to lead...while they had Ewing, Spree, LJ, Camby at least. He was what Jamal should be...a one dimensional - 3rd option. Except Allan made people pay for leaving him open. With jamal no matter where/how he shoots it's random whether it goes in or not.
 

pat

Starter
but in Crawford's defense i don't think Houston was ever asked to lead...while they had Ewing, Spree, LJ, Camby at least. He was what Jamal should be...a one dimensional - 3rd option. Except Allan made people pay for leaving him open. With jamal no matter where/how he shoots it's random whether it goes in or not.

I agree with you on that Houston was never asked to do what Crawford is, but I disagree with on which option H20 was. Definitely not the 3rd. Especially not when Ewing was hurt or after he was gone. You really can't compare them (not just in terms of quality but also in terms of style). You can't even tell what JC is, point guard or shooting guard, which again is a sign of poor coaching.
 

Pricey

Rotation player
Im not too sure why i have been brought into this, ive never abused anyone on this site except for that thekid131 fella copying thekid13. Im pretty sure i even posted on this exact forum that we shouldnt be abusing eachother verbally and shit. Just because i agree with a lot of what MSG and Metro and ABCD say doesnt mean im attacking anyone.
 

jzero29

Rotation player
Crawfords good play? my @ss

How can people say he's clutch and has been playing well? The only reason he is playing well is because he has no playoff pressure. There is no pressure, because everyone has lost faith in the current knicks team!!! No one expects them to make a push for the playoffs, everyone expects them to fade off into the NBA lottery, where amazingly they actually have their first rounder!! He has been clutch? sure he's clutch in pointless meaningless games. The knicks haven't played a meaningfull game in god knows how long. Meaning full games can't happen in 1st half of season, unless it is for the division lead which the knicks have not seen in many many moons. Sure he has been fun to watch, a rare bright spot on a terrible team. Being a good player on a bad(terrible) team doesn't make you good. This has to be the worst NY knicks team I have ever seen. They might not even get to 23 wins like they did under Larry Brown. They did him a favor by firing him.
 

MSGKnickz33

The Gold Mac
Im not too sure why i have been brought into this, ive never abused anyone on this site except for that thekid131 fella copying thekid13. Im pretty sure i even posted on this exact forum that we shouldnt be abusing eachother verbally and shit. Just because i agree with a lot of what MSG and Metro and ABCD say doesnt mean im attacking anyone.

I wouldnt pay attention to them, im in a similar situation. They're accusin me of always agreein with Metro, and thats true. I almost always agree with him but Im dissapointed that people think that i post things just to agree with him, or anyone. There are some different opinions that me and metro have, but im not goin to get into them. I respect all of Metros opinions because he does a great job of backin them up.

How can people say he's clutch and has been playing well? The only reason he is playing well is because he has no playoff pressure. There is no pressure, because everyone has lost faith in the current knicks team!!! No one expects them to make a push for the playoffs, everyone expects them to fade off into the NBA lottery, where amazingly they actually have their first rounder!! He has been clutch? sure he's clutch in pointless meaningless games. The knicks haven't played a meaningfull game in god knows how long. Meaning full games can't happen in 1st half of season, unless it is for the division lead which the knicks have not seen in many many moons. Sure he has been fun to watch, a rare bright spot on a terrible team. Being a good player on a bad(terrible) team doesn't make you good. This has to be the worst NY knicks team I have ever seen. They might not even get to 23 wins like they did under Larry Brown. They did him a favor by firing him.

Great post Jzero, I was waitin for you to post. You know the deal with Crawford, to bad the others dont.
 

metrocard

Legend
The first sentence I bolded, you didnt mention any names. IM sure your talkin about me, then in the 2nd bolded sentence you make the mistake of bringin up my name.

Everytime you try to post you come in tryin to sound smarter and better then us, but what you say is always completely off topic. You CONTRIBUTE NOTHING to this forum, shit head.

Because of elite posters like metro and myself, this forum has survived even with the Knicks suckin as a team. Anyone who blames me and Metro for destroyin this forum, all yall can get MAC 10 the f*ck down!!!!!!

Stop bein a b*tch, gettin all emotional. Your feelins hurt? Stop bein sensitive, tell me what you contribute to this website? You have no right to bring me into this, dumb fuck. You can take your tears to another forum bitch.

I put alot of time into makin game threads and educatin others, not for assholes like you to bring my name up. If your gonna be brave and say my name at least do it when replyin to one of my posts. You completely disrespected an elite member on this website.

Your just a bench warmer on this website, Im a star. You be on the bench like Randolph Morris and Wilson Chandler. You got no rite to be sayin the stars name, know your position. I had to put you in your place, dickhead.

Fuck outta here kid

Dudes gotta respect the Gods.

I just wanted to keep it simple so you can understand what I am saying. Mhh, lets think about why I included MSG and Pricey... No, not . But because obviously there are always two factions in each and every argument and those two generally support the same ideas as you. So: nothing personal. But you guys will never have a debate on anything. Another reason why I don't write more is that the state of this forum is that we discuss the same things over and over again and there isn't really anything intelligent to say about them anymore: Isiah sucks, Eddy Curry is fat and lazy, and Crawford is a chucker. I could also add the infamous "Marbury sucks" discussion.



Just post where I did that. I still have my Houston jersey and I still rock it in practice. You are obviously mixing up different posters. Just cut down on the green stuff.

I even suggested that you should write a blog on KO.com (a while ago) because your posts used to be controversial but some time after that you really crossed a line an now its all deliberate slander.

But back to the original discussion: Crawford definitely is not the answer to the Knicks problem. But then again I doubt there is really one except that the Knicks need a real coach, a system and playerS willing to do their job. On the Stephen A. Smith show Joe Dumars once said that he interviews each and every player he wants to sign just to check out what is really important to him. If Joe gets the impression it is their individual numbers or money, he just doesn't bother to sign them. What this franchise really needs is this kind of mentality and a coach who tells the players what to do.


Why you bugging out? My post was directed to DaTruth or anyone who feels they have to compare Crawford/Houston. I never doubted you as a Houston fan.
 
First of all Jamal Crawford sucks and is nothing more then a playground baller. There are number of ridiculous things that I read in here that I have to comment on.


Alan Houston was a leader, one of the best SG in Knicks history and the greatest shooter in Knicks history. Alan Houston WON at the same time and was CLUTCH. Even with bad knees, Houston left his body on the court just to give his team a chance.

This is where you lose all credibility metrotard. Allan Houston a leader? hahaha He was never a leader everyone who watched those teams knew that in his early Knick career it was Oakley and Ewing who led the team and in his latter years Sprewell, Camby and of course L.J. who was probably the Knicks best leader during Houston's time with the the team. Agreed he was one of the best 2 guards we have ever had but to call him the best shooter in franchise history is lunacy. Have you heard of Dollar Bill Bradley, Clyde Frazier, Dick Barnett, Earl Monroe, Bernard King? All those guys were better shooters then Houston.

This type of posting is exactly why a lot of people have stopped reading and writing the KO forum. Nobody insulted you. Why do you have act like that? This is not a war. Nobody around here works for the Knicks and what we want to do here is talk about basketball.

Seconded Metrotard just doesn't seem to understand that his behavior adds nothing to whatever is being debated it would be tolerable if he at least was funny but alas, he's not.

Houston was bigger than Crawford
Houston was stronger than Crawford
Houston was a leader, Crawford is a loser
Houston is a sharp shooter, Crawford is a clanker
Houston has the skillset to get to the free throw, Crawford wishes he had a brain.
Houston was a role model and real man, Chuck Norris status.
Crawford looks like a crack head version of Elmo from Seseme Street.
Houston won us games
Crawford lost us a ton of games in a short period of time.
Crawford is one of the worst defenders in Knicks history.
Houston is the greatest shooter in Knicks history.

Houston was definitely a better player then Crawford. Allan was awful defensively but nowhere near as bad as Crawford. Unlike Jamal, Houston was able to contribute on the d by understanding Coach Van Gundy's defensive schemes and played decent team defense. Crawford does handle the ball better then Houston ever did and has the ability to create his own shot which Houston never could. Unfortunately for Jamal after creating a shot for himself he usually misses.

Have you guys ever seen a guy make as many nice moves where you can actually hear the crowd ooohing and aahing only to have him miss the shot? Jamal's game is like pre-cum it just never finishes.



Before Houston was injured, he wasn't a liability on defense. You obviously weren't around to watch the games. Crawford is the worst defensive guard in Knicks history. Houston has cojones and still played games with two fucked up knees. Crawford plays with that stupid tampon thing on his shoulder, dude is 100% pussy.

You're wrong again, Houston isn't a good shooter, he's was an ELITE shooter, understand that.


Dude Houston was always a liability on D, if he wasn't scoring Van Gundy would bench him down the stretch of close games for Starks and later on for either Charlie Ward, Chris Childs or Kurt Thomas. Playing Thomas at the 4 and shifting L.J. to the 3 and Sprewell to the 2.

He also was never an elite shooter, a very good shooter yes but Houston was never in the class of Reggie Miller, Ray Allen, Glen Rice, Dell Curry etc. Just a cut below that group. Also as someone else mentioned Houston was famous for many second half disappearing acts and many a time when he had a big game the guy he was guarding had a big game.

All that said he was a good player who you could definitely win with as a starting 2 guard. Jamal's game is better suited for a 6th man role at best because he's a guy who shoots all the time but can't shoot unless he's on a hot streak.
 
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metrocard

Legend
You have no credibility to begin with.

Houston took the leadership role in 2003 till his retirement. You have a poor assessment of the Knicks the last decade that indicates you don't watch enough games which makes you unworthy to have a discussion with me.

Houston is a better shooter than all those guys on the list. Mid range game, 3pt range shooting and accuracy, spot up shooting, catch and shoot, shooting off the dribble or stepping back for the wet J, Houston was at the elite level and was one of the greatest all around shooters in NBA history.

Houston could create his own shot, if you think other wise, you haven't watched any Knicks games. Breaking a guy's ankles isn't the only technique to create your own shot. Go learn the basic techniques of basketball and how to create space for a shot; then you could be credible enough to chat with me.


Pancakes said:

"Jamal's game is like pre-cum it just never finishes."

WOW....I guess Pancakes wanted to jump out the closet early in the year.

Houston was a career 40% 3pt and 86% FT, along with one of the most consistent mid range shots in the NBA, Houston always been one of the better shooters in the NBA. You statements never have any explanation, its really easy to pull disagreements out of your ass. I'm looking for people to disagree with facts and logical. You don't fit the description.
 

MSGKnickz33

The Gold Mac
I know i said i wasnt goin 2 respond to pancakes anymore but since i brought this thread up which took some of metros time to routinely son pancakes, i got sumthin to say.

Allan houston is one of the top 3 best shooters in knicks history. I havent been watchin them since the beginnin of their existance but I have never seen a knicks player since 94 when i started watchin shoot with the smoothness of houston. He mite be the best shooter but im not the person to ask. Theres no way hes not top 3 at least.

Pancakes:

Allan was awful defensively

Dude Houston was always a liability on D

Houston was able to contribute on the d by understanding Coach Van Gundy's defensive schemes and played decent team defense

Sumthin aint rite with these 3 quotes from pancakes. Who can tell me whats wrong? Lets move onto the next subject.

Jamal's game is like pre-cum it just never finishes

uuhhh....whoops, wrong quote

Allan Houston a leader? hahaha He was never a leader everyone who watched those teams knew that in his early Knick career it was Oakley and Ewing who led the team and in his latter years Sprewell, Camby and of course L.J. who was probably the Knicks best leader during Houston's time with the the team

Spree and Houston were the 2 leaders, they took the big shots and made the big plays down the stretch.

Camby was a leader on the defensive end

L.J. made an impact on the team but to put him ahead of houston is givin him too much credit, get off LJ's cock.

These knicks teams from the late 90's/early 2000's did have more then 1 leader, another being Charlie Ward but the 2 main leaders were sprewell and houston.


Pancakes it dont matter what you say, the only thing you gettin from me is a youtube video. I dont have the time to reply to your elementary posts. You call people out for the dumbest things and routinely get shot down by the mac 10/take a knee because of the deadly body shot.
 
You have no credibility to begin with.

Houston took the leadership role in 2003 till his retirement. You have a poor assessment of the Knicks the last decade that indicates you don't watch enough games which makes you unworthy to have a discussion with me.

Houston is a better shooter than all those guys on the list. Mid range game, 3pt range shooting and accuracy, spot up shooting, catch and shoot, shooting off the dribble or stepping back for the wet J, Houston was at the elite level and was one of the greatest all around shooters in NBA history.

Houston could create his own shot, if you think other wise, you haven't watched any Knicks games. Breaking a guy's ankles isn't the only technique to create your own shot. Go learn the basic techniques of basketball and how to create space for a shot; then you could be credible enough to chat with me.


Pancakes said:

"Jamal's game is like pre-cum it just never finishes."

WOW....I guess Pancakes wanted to jump out the closet early in the year.

Houston was a career 40% 3pt and 86% FT, along with one of the most consistent mid range shots in the NBA, Houston always been one of the better shooters in the NBA. You statements never have any explanation, its really easy to pull disagreements out of your ass. I'm looking for people to disagree with facts and logical. You don't fit the description.

I never said he was a bad shooter, I said he was very good but not among the elite. If he was he would be joining Bradley, Miller, Allen, Frazier, Monroe etc in the Hall of Fame.

Leadership role in 2003? The team was already a train wreck then. By leadership you must also mean how he refused to operate on his knee in the offseason only to reinjure it worse then it was before effectively ending his career. Houston was a classy, good guy but a quite guy. Nobody would ever call him a leader it just wasn't his personality.

Man you can not be for real you have to be some kind of put on cause the stuff you say is just so wrong.

Please explain how Houston would create his own shot? The majority of Houston's points came off of screens, screen roll, ball movement, Sprewell passing him the ball off of penetration, passing that came out of the post and of course his patented coming off the curl play which he was probably the best in the NBA at running.

Houston's not alone in not being able to get off his own shot, neither can Reggie Miller, Ray Allen, Peja etc. Guys in the NBA who can create their own shot are rare and the only good thing about a guy like Jamal Crawford. However the problem with him is like I said before, he misses.

Shooting off the dribble? He would turn the ball over almost every time he attempted to put the ball on the floor. He had no handle at all, do you not remember when Van Gundy tried running him at the point and what a disaster that was?

If you think Houston was a better shooter then Miller, Rice, Allen, Bradley Frazier, King etc I really can't help you. Just because you say it doesn't make it true.

I give you plenty of explanation, drop plenty of knowledge but you refuse to acknowledge any of it because you can't admit to not knowing everything. If you actually bother to try and learn something instead of always arguing and denying reality nobody would think any less of you.

I don't how making a joke about pre-cum makes me gay but I guess considering your needle dick is impotent you wouldn't know what that is.
 
I know i said i wasnt goin 2 respond to pancakes anymore but since i brought this thread up which took some of metros time to routinely son pancakes, i got sumthin to say.

Allan houston is one of the top 3 best shooters in knicks history. I havent been watchin them since the beginnin of their existance but I have never seen a knicks player since 94 when i started watchin shoot with the smoothness of houston. He mite be the best shooter but im not the person to ask. Theres no way hes not top 3 at least.

Pancakes:







Sumthin aint rite with these 3 quotes from pancakes. Who can tell me whats wrong? Lets move onto the next subject.



uuhhh....whoops, wrong quote



Spree and Houston were the 2 leaders, they took the big shots and made the big plays down the stretch.

Camby was a leader on the defensive end

L.J. made an impact on the team but to put him ahead of houston is givin him too much credit, get off LJ's cock.

These knicks teams from the late 90's/early 2000's did have more then 1 leader, another being Charlie Ward but the 2 main leaders were sprewell and houston.


Pancakes it dont matter what you say, the only thing you gettin from me is a youtube video. I dont have the time to reply to your elementary posts. You call people out for the dumbest things and routinely get shot down by the mac 10/take a knee because of the deadly body shot.

He isn't one of the 3 best shooters in Knick history however since 1994 I would agree he has been the best. However if I had to give the ball to one guy to take a big shot for the Knicks I'd give it to Spre before Houston. I may even take Derek Harper over Houston but ya'll are prolly too young to remember how clutch he was for the Knicks.

In Knick history Dollar Bill, Bernard King, Clyde, Pearl and Dick Barnett all were better then Houston.

Houston wasn't one of the team leaders and neither was Charlie Ward. The two of them were the team's good boy Christian corner. You guys probably don't remember but there was a very famous, controversial New York Times Magazine article back in the day detailing Houston and Ward's 'leadership'. You should look it up if you can, you'll learn a thing or to about what great 'leaders' they were.

Don't hate on L.J. year after year Van Gundy and the team would vote him MVP. That guy did it all on both ends of the floor, was a leader and consumate team player. He was the kind of player where the numbers didn't even tell half the story of what he gave to the team. I'm not just putting him ahead of Houston as a leader, I'm putting him ahead of the rest of the players to. L.J. was the locker room leader of the late 90s Knicks everybody who followed the team back then knows this. No coincidence that soon after L.J.'s body fell apart so did the Knicks.
 

GetRealistic

Starter
I'm huge Allan Houston Fan but Houston was a below average defensive player. Early in his tenure in NY he wouldn't see any 4th quarter minutes because he didn't play defense. Crawfords defense is much worse but lets not make Houston out to be a great defender.


I agree with Metro that Allan had proably the best jump shot in team history.

But I agree with ECHS that LJ was the team leader of successful Knicks teams not Allan and that Allan often struggled to create one on one.
 
I'm huge Allan Houston Fan but Houston was a below average defensive player. Early in his tenure in NY he wouldn't see any 4th quarter minutes because he didn't play defense. Crawfords defense is much worse but lets not make Houston out to be a great defender.


I agree with Metro that Allan had proably the best jump shot in team history.

But I agree with ECHS that LJ was the team leader of successful Knicks teams not Allan and that Allan often struggled to create one on one.

You agreed with them about one thing and disagreed with them on 3 others. What will Metro and MSG do? Will they....

A) call you out for being a fucking idiot who knows nothing
B) call you an ass eating lover of grandmama
C) tell you to get the fuck outta here
D) make a puta take a knee
E) short circuit because they do not know how to handle someone disagreeing and agreeing with someone at the same time
 

GetRealistic

Starter
You agreed with them about one thing and disagreed with them on 3 others. What will Metro and MSG do? Will they....

A) call you out for being a fucking idiot who knows nothing
B) call you an ass eating lover of grandmama
C) tell you to get the fuck outta here
D) make a puta take a knee
E) short circuit because they do not know how to handle someone disagreeing and agreeing with someone at the same time


haha Hilarious
 

metrocard

Legend
I never said you said he was a bad shooter.
Houston isn't an elite player. But he is an elite shooter.

Houston got respect amongst his teammates and showed leadership on the court. How are you going to bitch about a man who'll go through pain to play basketball for his team? Houston sacrifice his health for the better of the team. You show no appreciation for this and show no understanding what a "leader" is. The difference between Houston and Crawford as leaders is that Houston brought that winning attitude to the Knicks. The 2002-05 Knick teams weren't as good as the previous years, but they played with a lot of heart and toughness, despite being old and under size. Houston and Sprewell were the leaders after Ewing was traded, and once Sprewell departed, Houston took full leadership responsibility. So not only you're wrong on Houston not being an elite shooter, you're also wrong on your definition of a leadership and Houston's status with the Knicks. Research would help this weak arguement you're holding. Don't get frustrated, if you want to look better take the time to do research.



Houston created his own shot a couple of times, he scored 53 points on a couple of good defenders(Fox, Byrant, George).

You sound like you don't know alot about playing basketball, you use a lot of elementary terms that make me laugh when you consider a former NBA all star doesn't know how to create his own shot.

Houston was on an elite level on terms of footwork. His foot faking was a work of art and amongst the best in the NBA, very similar to the likes of Jordan.
Houston had an awesome jab step that got him free whenever he pleased and if he was on fire it was natural for him to go for 30+.
Houston use to toy his defenders with multiple shot fakes and jab steps that made his already picture perfect jumpshot more efficient.

LOL @ Ray Allen being unable to create his own shot. Just shut up already, you're making an ass out of yourself.

Obviously this shows you lack knowledge of basketball techniques in creating space. Crossing over isn't the only way to create your own jumpshot.

Van Gundy tried running Sprewell at the point, not Houston. Houston only average 2 turnovers a game, thats average for a 20 ppg scorer.

You're not helping me because you're not explaining anything. Benard King played in the paint, he wasn't a shooter, his style was comparable to Carmelo Anthony of today. SF with a lot of post skills. He shot 71% from the FT and 10% from 3pt range.
Did I say Allan was the best in NBA history?
I said he was one of the best and definitely was on Rice, and Allen's level. Miller is the best shooter of all time because of his history, famous shooting form, and how he dominated with his shooting.
Bradley and Frazier are from the old days, and Frazier was more of a penetrator than shooter. Houston was obviously the better pure shooter.

You got yourself hanging on a rope here now, you're not providing enough information or even a solid arguement to back up these clown ass statements that Houston isn't an elite shooter, Houston was never a leader, he can't create his shot, the only way to create a shot is with a fancy cross over, and that even Benard King is a better shooter than Houston. You have a history of saying the most ludicrous things here just to get attention on here. Now you own the title of most losingest poster in KO history.

Why have you gone from embarrassing yourself in talking about basketball to now discussing that my dick is "impotent"? You've really lost yourself here.
 
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