Change of Heart regarding CP3

Dario8676

Benchwarmer
I completely support your pov ronoranina and agree 100 percent. CP3 is a top 5 player in the league and the fact people aren't willing to trade galo and/or chandler or Randolph is just crazy to me.
 

ronoranina

Fundamentally Sound
Yea I don't know what people see anymore when they watch basketball games.


Sometimes numbers really help drive home a point.

:gony:
 

nuckles2k2

Superstar
See...I'm not talking about individual numbers. I'm talking about in the team concept and the overall scheme of things...would what he brings to the court be worth worth giving up other players if what we have right now is serviceable and can cause havoc for a team to defend. This has nothing to do with what he can do individually.

I'm saying this...5 on 5 basketball, right? If we have 3 guys 6'10'' and above, all doing different things, we have 3 dudes who demand attention. Not because they're superstars (at least not all of them) has nothing to do with Hall of Fame numbers, it's just 3 guys who are damn near 7 feet. How are you going to guard all 3? Play a zone? they all have decent to wet jumpshots, along with Felton who's a decent shooter. Zone; failed. Do you play straight up defense and switch off? Who's switching onto Gallo and can Gallo see clean over his head? Shoot. If it's a big on him on the perimeter who's on the paint helping on Amar'e? Someone that he can muscle out the way? Make your move; beast. Is it the other big on the court? Make your move if it's 1-on-1. Should he miss, who's boxing out AR? Is it now a 2-on-1 rebounding situation with Amar'e and AR because the other legit big is on the perimeter showing on Gallo? Someone grab the board. What if the other team plays big to combat our height? When we're on defense if the other team misses.. where's Felton? Get the ball to him. Everybody run. Gallo trail, and if we can't score in the paint or draw a foul, kick it out to Gallon in transition. Shoot. You get the picture.

Now if we lose Gallo and have CP3, Amar'e and Randolph that other big is never moved away from the paint and scoring around the rim is tougher, unless suddenly AR becomes a threat from deep; and from what I've seen he has a decent mid-range shot, not Gallo's range to really force a big to commit.

If we lose AR, then Gallo still stretches the floor but we lose a weak side defender and someone who's going to help gobble up rebounds, which equals less second chance points and more possessions for the opposing team. We also lose someone who's going to run the court on fast breaks who also happens to be one of the tallest dudes on the court, that's a lot of cheap fouls we're not picking up.

So CP3 brings assists, some on-ball defense and steals, a better run half court offense, and obviously a little bit more production from the PG spot in terms of playmaking and scoring.

With our current lineup we could dominant the paint, the boards, the transition game, spread the floor like no other team with a dude who's 6'10'' and going to be shooting clear over peoples' heads, we're almost assured to be more athletic at the 4 and 5 every night, get other teams bigs in all sorts of foul trouble, cause mismatches all over the place up the ass, and there's no one defensive set to stop the dynamic created.

Would I sacrifice the points and assists that CP3 brings to create more of an entire team that can't really be guarded?

It's all about creating that dynamic with complementary players like the Pats with Welker and Moss. One stretches the D vertically while the other abuses the D with quick cuts in his routes underneath. If you don't have the right personnel and scheme, you're not stopping it. (and I hate the Pats so don't mistake me for a NE fan)

I don't know which team has 3 dudes with the height, length, and athleticism to stop 3 dudes 6'10'' and above, one of which has a nasty 3 point shot, so you're not playing zone all night.

While I agree that CP3 is a special player, he wasn't the difference for his team in NO. We saw how Channing Frye was popping off with Nash and STAT, that could be Gallo, but now add a freak of nature like AR and what do we have?

When it comes to basketball I try to look at names and numbers less and more at how teams would be constructed and what problems they would cause for the defense. And with Felton driving and kicking it out to Gallo, a big coming out to contest and Gallo driving to the rim or dumping it down low, that contesting big is going to be all turned around, now go to work STAT who can score it 1-on-1, get fouled, or force the remaining big to commit to him and make a play for AR who's going to be contested at the rim by someone who's head comes up to his chest? Nah.

I want to see what we have before anyone goes anywhere. At least in the preseason games. This could be a filthy team dynamic we have here.

I can't stress enough PG (lightning fast), 2 (dunno who it's gonna be), 3 (6'10'' sniper from outside, can also drive when forced to), 4 (might be the most offensively dominate player at his position), 5 (almost 7 feet, wingspan of something stupid like 7'3'', very athletic and can both help defensively from the weak side as well as rebound...oh and he handles the ball and is a skilled player already at the age of 21)

If the prospect of that team doesn't get you excited...I don't know about you. If it's all about the big names then fine, so be it, but you have to at least agree that there's a handful of teams in the NBA that would look at that layout right there and go ":shock2:"
 
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Bunta

Benchwarmer
I keep changing my mind all the time on if this trade would be a good thing or not.

The team as it is could be good, but probably not a contender right now

A team with CP3 would maybe be closer depending on what we have to give up.

Oh and would getting Okafor be so bad? Doesnt he pretty much cover up Amare's perceived weaknesses in defence and rebounding? I think they would be a good front court. Sure we couldnt get Melo next year but we may not need him if who ever is left out of Gallo/Wilson/Randolph is producing at a reasonable level. Then come December 15 we could try and trade Felton for a shooting guard, Memphis are looking for a point guard and have been shopping Mayo have they not?

If all went to plan we could have later in the year as a starting line up

Okafor
Stat
whoever is left out of Gallo/Wilson/Randolph
Mayo
CP3

that would be nice to see
 

ronoranina

Fundamentally Sound
See...I'm not talking about individual numbers. I'm talking about in the team concept and the overall scheme of things...would what he brings to the court be worth worth giving up other players if what we have right now is serviceable and can cause havoc for a team to defend. This has nothing to do with what he can do individually.

[I]I'm saying this...5 on 5 basketball, right? If we have 3 guys 6'10'' and above, all doing different things, we have 3 dudes who demand attention. Not because they're superstars (at least not all of them) has nothing to do with Hall of Fame numbers, it's just 3 guys who are damn near 7 feet. How are you going to guard all 3? Play a zone? they all have decent to wet jumpshots, along with Felton who's a decent shooter. Zone; failed. Do you play straight up defense and switch off? Who's switching onto Gallo and can Gallo see clean over his head? Shoot. If it's a big on him on the perimeter who's on the paint helping on Amar'e? Someone that he can muscle out the way? Make your move; beast. Is it the other big on the court? Make your move if it's 1-on-1. Should he miss, who's boxing out AR? Is it now a 2-on-1 rebounding situation with Amar'e and AR because the other legit big is on the perimeter showing on Gallo? Someone grab the board. What if the other team plays big to combat our height? When we're on defense if the other team misses.. where's Felton? Get the ball to him. Everybody run. Gallo trail, and if we can't score in the paint or draw a foul, kick it out to Gallon in transition. Shoot. You get the picture. [/I]

Now if we lose Gallo and have CP3, Amar'e and Randolph that other big is never moved away from the paint and scoring around the rim is tougher, unless suddenly AR becomes a threat from deep; and from what I've seen he has a decent mid-range shot, not Gallo's range to really force a big to commit.

If we lose AR, then Gallo still stretches the floor but we lose a weak side defender and someone who's going to help gobble up rebounds, which equals less second chance points and more possessions for the opposing team. We also lose someone who's going to run the court on fast breaks who also happens to be one of the tallest dudes on the court, that's a lot of cheap fouls we're not picking up.

So CP3 brings assists, some on-ball defense and steals, a better run half court offense, and obviously a little bit more production from the PG spot in terms of playmaking and scoring.

With our current lineup we could dominant the paint, the boards, the transition game, spread the floor like no other team with a dude who's 6'10'' and going to be shooting clear over peoples' heads, we're almost assured to be more athletic at the 4 and 5 every night, get other teams bigs in all sorts of foul trouble, cause mismatches all over the place up the ass, and there's no one defensive set to stop the dynamic created.

Would I sacrifice the points and assists that CP3 brings to create more of an entire team that can't really be guarded?

It's all about creating that dynamic with complementary players like the Pats with Welker and Moss. One stretches the D vertically while the other abuses the D with quick cuts in his routes underneath. If you don't have the right personnel and scheme, you're not stopping it. (and I hate the Pats so don't mistake me for a NE fan)

I don't know which team has 3 dudes with the height, length, and athleticism to stop 3 dudes 6'10'' and above, one of which has a nasty 3 point shot, so you're not playing zone all night.

While I agree that CP3 is a special player, he wasn't the difference for his team in NO. We saw how Channing Frye was popping off with Nash and STAT, that could be Gallo, but now add a freak of nature like AR and what do we have?

When it comes to basketball I try to look at names and numbers less and more at how teams would be constructed and what problems they would cause for the defense. And with Felton driving and kicking it out to Gallo, a big coming out to contest and Gallo driving to the rim or dumping it down low, that contesting big is going to be all turned around, now go to work STAT who can score it 1-on-1, get fouled, or force the remaining big to commit to him and make a play for AR who's going to be contested at the rim by someone who's head comes up to his chest? Nah.

I want to see what we have before anyone goes anywhere. At least in the preseason games. This could be a filthy team dynamic we have here.

I can't stress enough PG (lightning fast), 2 (dunno who it's gonna be), 3 (6'10'' sniper from outside, can also drive when forced to), 4 (might be the most offensively dominate player at his position), 5 (almost 7 feet, wingspan of something stupid like 7'3'', very athletic and can both help defensively from the weak side as well as rebound...oh and he handles the ball and is a skilled player already at the age of 21)

If the prospect of that team doesn't get you excited...I don't know about you. If it's all about the big names then fine, so be it, but you have to at least agree that there's a handful of teams in the NBA that would look at that layout right there and go ":shock2:"

Bra, what the ***k was that nonsense?? Have you even seen coach's offense???

Listen, in coach's offense we run the pick and roll w the PG and PF at the top of the key, two swings on either wing and the C down low. The PG is the focal point of the offense!! The more dynamic the PG, the better this offense runs!! The PF sets a narsty pick and you have CP3 coming off it and becoming the threat that we know he could be w the options he then has:

He can pass back to Amare if his man helps. If he's freed by the pick and one of the wing defenders comes over to help, he passes it to either Gallo or Azzy or whoever is at the 2, for the open three. If no one helps he only has the C to beat if he comes over, the pass goes to (who would actually be starting, not AR) Turiaf or Oke. If the center stays home -- lay-up. I've seen Nash do this with aplomb too many times in this offense. CP3 would do this and more. Felton would do a competent job as well. The offense would never stagnate.

Other than that it's just up-tempo, unbeatable transition torture for the other team. A quick pass to Gallo w 4 sec into the shot-clock for a three. Paul comes down and just pulls up, or beats his man, attracts help and kick for an open two or three, usually a three. Give or take a few odd iso's for STAT, Gallo and whoever is at the two.

That's it~! This offense is simple, yet unstoppable

All that mumbo-jumbo you typed up there... Man you aught to be ashamed of yo' self.

It is all about having the best players, not role players.. CP3 would dominate w coach on the Knicks and make everyone around him that much better. The fact that I have to explain this to someone is ridiculous.

Oh and numbers are important. That's how you WIN! It's all about what each player you have can bring to the table.

CP3's OR Felton's numbers would either enable us to dominate, ala Phoenix Suns circa mid to late 2k, or what we've seen from this team with Nate, Marbury and Duhon, who couldn't run this offense the past few years.

CP3 three would bring his HOF numbers to this system. Nash didn't have numbers like his before working w coach, neither does Felton. This guy is special. He's done it on a mediocre team in NO for five years. HE made all of his teammates better.

Call me crazy but I want that for this team.
 
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Gallo is a streaky tall skinny wannabe jump shooter with flawed defensive skills. Amare will be sitting on the pine for some games due to the constant running in D'antoni's system. All the new cats will be wondering if they will be traded because the Boo birds will not wait for another season for their team to gel. The Knicks brass will panic again (as usual) and make some rediculous trade by mid year. CP is probably damage goods but uses all this FA talk to boost his value, (smart hustle move). No one has seen him or this current Knick team play but there are more predictions being tossed around than Nostradamus can even make up.

My post is actually a prediction too, but probably holds more weight because of the familiar patterns...rebuild, wait and watch for chemistry, advertise the best players (NY media) for a possible future trade or first round pick. Tell the fans we are making great strides, fans get hype of rumers off of Kobe and Jordan coming to the Knicks, Knicks loose out in FA and Draft, fans become irate than become happly delusional when they learn that their weak draft picks played in Rucker park..........wash and repeat.

I respect fans but I really don't understand the high optimism here, I sure hope people aren't making these predictions just off of paper...or even worse...a video game.

Fall is almost here, and the truth will be revealed...and no time sooner.
 
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