What criticisms do you have for the team or its individuals after 7 games?

Crazy⑧s

Evacuee
This is not a reactionary thread!

This is a thinker's thread. We'll see who has been deducing the ins and outs of Woodson's crew.

An analytical thread.

You may well learn something you didn't know.

Please don't come in with the typical reactionary BS Knick fans conjure up after a loss.
________________

I'll kick off with an easy one to avoid rattling on.

★ I don't like the way Felton has been denying Melo the ball in the high post. It's been specific only to occasion, but has happened far too often. In the past 2 away games I've noted that Felton has been reluctant to pass the ball to Melo as he muscles for position.

The reasoning is questionable, but the rights to the offence are Melo's
 

21 Shump Street

Benchwarmer
I wish Chandler would actually show up each game and be consistent like last year.

The whole team needs to pick up the defense BIG time in the first half and be much more aggressive on the boards. Going small doesn't help our rebounding, but we need to do better.
 

New New York

Quiet Storm
I've said it all season offensive rebounds are killing our great defensive stops.

We are playing 24 good seconds of defense and some no name player is just scooping up the ball and getting a layup each time off the rebounds...those kill momentum for us and gives momentum to the other team.


I do not mind Novak's shooting slump (he'll come out of it) but I do mind his all of a sudden bad shot selection...he never took many shots over defenders before and now he's seemingly forcing shots...the misses are affecting his confidence. He needs to utilize the shot fake more...get a guy flying by him and then even stepping into a 3 or heaven forbid drive towards the basket to either set up a teammate with a hockey assist or just simply a closer shot.


I said this before last night's loss that Woody needs to play Camby....there really is nothing more to it! I get that he needs to be in better conditioning...but 12 minutes from him will make a difference. We suck at rebounding Camby led the league in rebs per 48 minutes...not Rocket science!

Chandler has to rebound better...he has never been a player who grabs a ton of rebounds...but that has to change a little. Chandler is basically a tall Scottie Pippen because of his versatility on defense (which is a huge huge plus for us and why he is a better defender than Dwight) but he needs to channel his inner Oakley! He needs to be counted on for 10 per game....
 

Weissenberg

Grid or Riot
- Rebounding: I'm wondering what's the point of having such a deep frontcourt while we barely use our bigs. Chandler has underachieved lately, a top five center averaging less than 10 boards is unacceptable and there is no excuse for letting Camby, who's an excellent rebounder, to rot on the bench. In my opinion it's about time to move Carmelo back to the small forward position, we lack size and anyone who watched the Memphis game would agree defensively we looked much better with Sheed and Chandler playing respectively the PF and C spots;

- Ball movement: while almost every analyst starts jerking off while talking about the Knicks ball movement I realize our offense has been much more stagnant recently, there's been much more isolation and over-dribbling, not to mention we rely too much on our three point shooting. I'm wondering, where is that extra pass coach Woodson talked about?

- Whining about each and every call: frankly, what the **** is Carmelo thinking? It's ridiculous how many T's he's already got and how many points we allowed with CA discussing with referees instead of getting his ass back to defense.

Summurizing, I believe we needed that L, it'll take a lot of pressure off our guys, but there is still plenty of work to do.
 

NY17KNICKS

★Melo Mafia★
That loss was the best thing to happen because we have fvckin ego's that need to be checked. I love Melo but just stfu and play,the refs are a$$holes we get it.

I have ZERO complaints about JR SWISH. Absolute beast so far.

My biggest complaint so far is the pu$$y we have at Center, reigning Defensive Player of the Year and he's playing like a straight B!TCH.
I love the ManHandler so when he actually shows up I'll be happy.
 

MeloforMayor

BALL DON'T LIE
- Rebounding: I'm wondering what's the point of having such a deep frontcourt while we barely use our bigs. Chandler has underachieved lately, a top five center averaging less than 10 boards is unacceptable and there is no excuse for letting Camby, who's an excellent rebounder, to rot on the bench. In my opinion it's about time to move Carmelo back to the small forward position, we lack size and anyone who watched the Memphis game would agree defensively we looked much better with Sheed and Chandler playing respectively the PF and C spots;

- Ball movement: while almost every analyst starts jerking off while talking about the Knicks ball movement I realize our offense has been much more stagnant recently, there's been much more isolation and over-dribbling, not to mention we rely too much on our three point shooting. I'm wondering, where is that extra pass coach Woodson talked about?

- Whining about each and every call: frankly, what the **** is Carmelo thinking? It's ridiculous how many T's he's already got and how many points we allowed with CA discussing with referees instead of getting his ass back to defense.

Summurizing, I believe we needed that L, it'll take a lot of pressure off our guys, but there is still plenty of work to do.

I agree that its time to move Carmelo back to the three spot. It will be a smart move to improve interior rebounding (Rasheed seems to be a better rebounder than I expected), and it can be a chance for Melo to get used to playing in the three spot once Amar'e returns. Moving him back to the three won't hurt, IMO. We have Camby and Kurt to back up our bigs.

...and why didn't Camby get any playing time against the Grizz? It was clear that we were getting destroyed on the boards. I'm surprised Woody didn't let him play... maybe the Cambyman is injured again? :boohoo:

and to answer the OP's question...

:alert:Melo needs to stop complaining to the refs when he doesn't get a call. I can let it slide if it happens once in ten games but he does it every ****ing game. It costs us a technical foul sometimes and he doesn't run back on defense when he gets frustrated. Don't get me wrong, his defense is much improved compared to last season, but its these little things that he's got to control. I hope Woody or the vets can talk to him about it.. 16 techs are the limit before a suspension and he already has FIVE. (On a side note, I can't believe Rasheed hasn't commited a technical yet.)

There's nothing more I can complain about our play though, I think our lack of rebounding stems from our style of play and our propensity to play small ball, which has been effective so far. Once Camby gets regular playing time, I expect us to improve in that department because we'll have excellent rebounding from positions one to five on the floor at times:

A line up of...
Kidd
Brewer
Melo
Camby
Chandler
....should be a great rebounding unit for our team.
 
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MeloforMayor

BALL DON'T LIE
He did, last night he ran away from the ref after commiting a personal and was awarded with a T. :teeth:

:jawsdown:

I can't believe I missed Sheed's first technical as a Knick. Just saw it on Youtube.



That was a bull**** call by the ref. Possibly one of the undeserving technicals I've seen. A technical for running after a clean block? Jesus Christ. :barf:
 

NYk_Reloaded718

★KNICKS-TAPE★
we need to rebound the ball better, shoot free throws better and come out with stronger defensive intensity.. im pretty much satisfied with everything else im seeing.
 

erivera

Benchwarmer
i think woodson needs to do like the spurs and go with different lineups based on matchups. when we face bigger teams like the grizzlies the advantage melo might have on the offensive end gets negated by the size they give up on the defensive end. i also think chandler's play hasn't been great because he's the only true low post defender on the court when woodson goes small.
 

Red

TYPE-A
I've said it all season offensive rebounds are killing our great defensive stops.

We are playing 24 good seconds of defense and some no name player is just scooping up the ball and getting a layup each time off the rebounds...those kill momentum for us and gives momentum to the other team.

I said this before last night's loss that Woody needs to play Camby....there really is nothing more to it! I get that he needs to be in better conditioning...but 12 minutes from him will make a difference. We suck at rebounding Camby led the league in rebs per 48 minutes...not Rocket science!

Chandler has to rebound better...he has never been a player who grabs a ton of rebounds...but that has to change a little. Chandler is basically a tall Scottie Pippen because of his versatility on defense (which is a huge huge plus for us and why he is a better defender than Dwight) but he needs to channel his inner Oakley! He needs to be counted on for 10 per game....


- Rebounding: I'm wondering what's the point of having such a deep frontcourt while we barely use our bigs. Chandler has underachieved lately, a top five center averaging less than 10 boards is unacceptable and there is no excuse for letting Camby, who's an excellent rebounder, to rot on the bench. In my opinion it's about time to move Carmelo back to the small forward position, we lack size and anyone who watched the Memphis game would agree defensively we looked much better with Sheed and Chandler playing respectively the PF and C spots;

That loss was the best thing to happen because we have fvckin ego's that need to be checked. I love Melo but just stfu and play,the refs are a$$holes we get it.

I have ZERO complaints about JR SWISH. Absolute beast so far.

My biggest complaint so far is the pu$$y we have at Center, reigning Defensive Player of the Year and he's playing like a straight B!TCH.
I love the ManHandler so when he actually shows up I'll be happy.

Agreed. But it only matters if we learn from it.

We have to utilized our tools.

Camby
Thomas

If we clean up the boards, we'll win games cleaner.

I think the consensus is REBOUNDING. The easy answer is to play more size, assuming size will help boxing out and grabbing boards.

But rebounding is a skill and it seems Woodson doesn't recognize it in some players, or more so sees other skills that he values such as JR or Wallace's offensive prowess.

Camby may be hurt. We cannot blame coach for resting him until he's 100% while we were winning. The demand may have been there but using Camby was not eminent during our streak.

I'll add perimeter defense. I see a weakness with our guards stopping penetration. My mind says this will be a point of attack by the opposition. We saw Holiday and Parker exploit this, and Mayo flash on the perimeter.

In the long run we assume Shump will help this, in the meantime coach has to use what we have and adapt. We can expect Brewer and other guards to address this, and more play for guys like Thomas, Camby, and Cope.

I'm getting worried about STAT. Not sure if he can be 100% again, and even more uncertain he can improve our rebounding and defense.
 

CA7

Scoring Champ
Chandler- Needs to box out and crash the boards more, pretty much thats it. We need 12 rebounds a game from him

Anthony- Stop complaining about non-calls, **** happens just keep playing. Be more aggressive off the ball to get scoring opportunities. 8-10 rebounds a game and 3-5 assists please. We need him to start carrying the load for us.

Brewer- Keep it up

Kidd- Keep it up

Felton- More play creator instead of scoring PG. He needs to get Melo going early on with easy 2's, dunks and lay ups and then establish the rhythm of the team and get his off of that

Smith- Keep playing under control, less 9 dribble moves, just catch and attack the D

Novak- Better job getting open, we need him stretching the floor

Wallace- Doing pretty good, better footwork on his D, less tick tack fouls

Prigioni- Come on and get guys going, pretty much keep it up but move the ball more

Camby- Get your ass on the floor

Thomas- Keep it up

Woodson- Feed your star and defend him when he's getting killed out there.
 

welcometonycity

Rotation player
Yesterday Melo should have played the 3 starting Sheed at the 4. I also was really disapointed with Camby getting no burn. If anything we needed him last night most! Its just a loss we needed it anyway. Just some things I was thinkin about. When we vs teams like that we cant play small balll.

I agree with what crazy said about Felt too. Hes been denyin Melo the balll a lil too much. Like late in the game last night when Melo was phenin for the ball he didnt dish it. Other then that Felt has performed well.
 
We have to go to a more traditional lineup. We are getting bruised on the boards because Tyson has to box out 2 guys most of the time and Melo is just not dominating enough to condone running him at the 4. Also teams are switching on Melo so why run him at the 4?

We need to start Sheed and call it a night, Melo can be a spot 4 here and there but to have him at the 4 is dumb because teams know how to combat him now. Lebron is the only guy that can get away with that simply because he is a freak of nature, but Melo needs to be put back into his natural position because he is just a scorer. He cannot pass at the same clip as Lebron or rebound nor can he defend the post as well as Lebron.

Let Melo run at the 3 against weaker/shorter players and he can bully his way to the basket and wont risk injury from getting pounded all game by 7 footers...

Also another flaw that is seen when running this small lineup is that when the other team switches on Melo, Brewer/Kidd cant take advantage of one of the PF/C's guarding them so it is literally a useless strategy. Last night Brewer could not take advantage of ZBo guarding him so the plan failed. If we had Shumpert and Jr in thats different but about time Shump comes back Amare will have been back for a month...

Bottom line this small ball is useless, Miami does this to make helping on Lebron and Dwade a big mistake but here is the things they have that we lack.

1. Multiple knockdown 3 point shooters at their disposal.
2. A big that can shoot the midrange consistently.
3. 2 excellent passers in Wade in Lebron, who also can get to the rim at will and draw help to free up shooters.

So Miami's gameplan works because they have the personnel for it and we simply do not. Our team is built for the halfcourt yet Woody wants us to be the 06' Suns.

I hate how coaches are going toward this small ball lineup when other than Miami, no team has ever won a championship like that. Play the way the game is meant to be played and dont follow the footsteps of a almost impossobly talented Suns dynasty and the 2012 Heat who have the greatest Talent in the history of the game along with one of the greatest Shooting guards ever and a pretty good bigman...

We have too many bigs to be running a small ball lineup as our base, we need to dominate the boards and then our wins so far would have been by 25+ every time because we were dominating while being abused on the boards which has never happened nor will ever win a championship.

Get big so we can combat easy layups, Rebounds and have more open shooters since we will have better screen setters and we can truly dominate.

Melo at the 4 is a myth, he is without a doubt a SMALL FORWARD, who can be slotted into the 4 when the OTHER TEAM goes small, but he is a legitimate 3 and should not be forced to play the 4 all season long. Melo cannot pass, defend, finish, or rebound good enough to take the risks of him playing at the 4 because the Cons outweigh the Pros heavily so far.
 

smokes

Huge Member
If you get 10 boards out of Tyson on the year you're absolutely thrilled.

The style of defense we play is not conducive to the Man Handler putting up career rebounding numbers, he's everywhere on defense and can't be relied upon to put up big boards, too much help defending and switching.

We aren't going to change to playing a bigger lineup, this worked 6 out of 7 games and it will continue to work against most teams, because most teams don't have the best rebounder in the league alongside another 7 footer.

Woodson had a good plan last night, for us to concede some ground against their bigs on defense while Melo got their bigs in foul trouble on the other end.

That gameplan got thrown out of the window when the refs decided not to call anything in the entire first half of the game. So Woody adjusted, deciding to fight fire with fire and use our second unit bigs to get us back in the game while their starters rested, and it worked very well.

Sadly the refs decided the best way to calm the game down after the hectic first half was to start calling every little foul there was and we didn't get the memo.

The one thing I take out of the game last night is we have to play the refs better, that's it. Stop complaining so much and pissing off the refs.
 
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