After season, Mike may be Done'toni

Kiyaman

Legend
Hint from the Phoenix Suns past.....

Those who are not old enough to remember the Phoenix Suns SSOL with
PG-KJ (D.Rose) and SG-Hornachec that beat the Magic Johnson Lakers in
a playoff series, and in the offseason traded SG-Hornachec to Philly for
Charles Barkley need to wake-up to how long the Phoenix Suns been one of
the longest uptempo teams in the NBA. Jason Kidd & Mcdyess ran teams out
of Phoenix needing oxgen-tanks with their uptempo system back in the daze.
 

TR1LL10N

Hannibal Lecter
Hint from the Phoenix Suns past.....

Those who are not old enough to remember the Phoenix Suns SSOL with
PG-KJ (D.Rose) and SG-Hornachec that beat the Magic Johnson Lakers in
a playoff series, and in the offseason traded SG-Hornachec to Philly for
Charles Barkley need to wake-up to how long the Phoenix Suns been one of
the longest uptempo teams in the NBA. Jason Kidd & Mcdyess ran teams out
of Phoenix needing oxgen-tanks with their uptempo system back in the daze.

You obviously fail at understanding what SSOL is. D'antoni INVENTED it so how could it have been run prior to him? Short answer...it can't.

Funny how active you are when we lose and how silent you are when we win. SMFH.
 

Kiyaman

Legend
You obviously fail at understanding what SSOL is. D'antoni INVENTED it so how could it have been run prior to him? Short answer...it can't.

Funny how active you are when we lose and how silent you are when we win. SMFH.


Trillion......u are to slow for this board.
What is the ssol? its players running to shoot on the offensive-end
before their oposition can get back to setup on defense.
D'antoni INVENTED
High Schools, college, semi-pro, and pro-ball been playing certain
teams "And-1" style of ball for many decades.
Nash & Finley started running that uptempo system when they had
Jamison & Dirk in the frontcourt. After the Princton-offense, nobody
bothered to "label" any uptempo transition offensive team.
 

TR1LL10N

Hannibal Lecter
Trillion......u are to slow for this board.
What is the ssol? its players running to shoot on the offensive-end
before their oposition can get back to setup on defense.

High Schools, college, semi-pro, and pro-ball been playing certain
teams "And-1" style of ball for many decades.
Nash & Finley started running that uptempo system when they had
Jamison & Dirk in the frontcourt. After the Princton-offense, nobody
bothered to "label" any uptempo transition offensive team.



What's slow is your comprehension of basketball. D'ant didn't just label a traditional up-tempo offense SSOL guy he completely invented a new offensive system and philosophy. I find it ironic that you come here to complain about D'antoni and you clearly don't even understand his system! SMFH.

I can't wait for the Knicks to get on a roll and start winning strings of games because the side effect is that you stay silent. It's an easily observable pattern where you only come here to complain after some losses yet stay silet probably flogging yourself after each and every win.
 

nuckles2k2

Superstar
What about the offense did D'Antoni create? I see an adaptation of European style basketball that's run at a faster pace than they do over there.

MDA, as far as I know, never called his "system" seven seconds or less...that's the name of a book that Jack McCallum wrote about the 05-06 Phoenix Suns. The name kind of took off because of the fast paced ball that they played, but MDA most certainly did not create fast paced basketball.

I guess at best he took FIBA style ball and injected it with some nitrous oxide, if you call that creating something...then I guess you're technically right. But the system at it's core would be FIBA ball, no? He didn't invent that either...so...
 

TR1LL10N

Hannibal Lecter
What about the offense did D'Antoni create? I see an adaptation of European style basketball that's run at a faster pace than they do over there.

MDA, as far as I know, never called his "system" seven seconds or less...that's the name of a book that Jack McCallum wrote about the 05-06 Phoenix Suns. The name kind of took off because of the fast paced ball that they played, but MDA most certainly did not create fast paced basketball.

I guess at best he took FIBA style ball and injected it with some nitrous oxide, if you call that creating something...then I guess you're technically right. But the system at it's core would be FIBA ball, no? He didn't invent that either...so...

Read the book or look at the myriad of threads dedicated to this subject. Google is also good and comes up with several breakdows. I and others have gone into this in detail and I'm not going into it again. Sorry.
 

nuckles2k2

Superstar
So running a primarily run and gun sytle; then using a lot of screens and rolls, almost all of which brings the bigs out of the paint to a few steps in from the 3-point line, the high post, or elbow area (where bigs who can shoot would be valuable...like in the european style of basketball) to create early perimeter shots to maintain that quick pace and create more possessions = a brand new system?

The run and gun style has been around before MDA, and utilizing a lot of screens and rolls to get perimeter shots in leagues where the 3 point line was closer (shots were easier) and there was no defensive three seconds rule...so forays into the paint for lesser athletic players wasn't exactly preached, also isn't something that MDA created.

I guess he's the first to bring the two together, but he's using a mindset (Eurostyle) that's based on a game with a different set of rules, regulations, and players who are taught the game from a different perspective...with the adjustment that needs to be made to adapt that style of basketball to the NBA...speed things up.

The offense seems too hit or miss, and it doesn't really generate many easy shots in the NBA. Those perimeter shots might be the easier shots in European leagues, and it puts on a good show in the NBA when the shots are falling, but when they're not, there doesn't seem to be any way for us to generate easier shots other than STAT or Melo going one-on-one.

By the way, I didn't really find any breakdowns of the offense via google, just a bunch of sites trying to sell DVDs, playbooks, and shit. You can find breakdowns of the Triangle offense, Princeton offense, 4-out 1-in motion offense, ball screen oriented offenses used in Europe, etc.

I didn't read McCallum's book tho, maybe that would help shed some light on how this isn't a style developed for Euro leagues with some run and gun thrown in. I guess I gotta pick up the book.
 

MusketeerX

Rotation player
SSOL is the name of a book about D'Antoni's system. Never read it. D'Antoni's system is of his own creation, but really it is just a variation of most European offenses with more emphasis on smart decisions by the point guard. His system requires almost perfect play by the PG, which is why Steve Nash is so impressive. There are few PGs in the NBA that could run his system effectively, which is very impressive when it is run effectively.

However, because it concentrates so much of offense and not enough on defense, when his players are not hitting their shots (usually because the other team is playing defense), and his team is not playing defense, the losses result in high point differential. Hence why our point differential is approximately only one point.

The problem he runs into is that other teams are not playing a high octane system the whole year around and have less wear and tear come the post season. His offense is not set and more improvised when it is being truly run, so it is more difficult to guard against...

But, Nuckles is right, as well. It works better when the three point line is closer.
 

TR1LL10N

Hannibal Lecter
So running a primarily run and gun sytle; then using a lot of screens and rolls, almost all of which brings the bigs out of the paint to a few steps in from the 3-point line, the high post, or elbow area (where bigs who can shoot would be valuable...like in the european style of basketball) to create early perimeter shots to maintain that quick pace and create more possessions = a brand new system?

The run and gun style has been around before MDA, and utilizing a lot of screens and rolls to get perimeter shots in leagues where the 3 point line was closer (shots were easier) and there was no defensive three seconds rule...so forays into the paint for lesser athletic players wasn't exactly preached, also isn't something that MDA created.

I guess he's the first to bring the two together, but he's using a mindset (Eurostyle) that's based on a game with a different set of rules, regulations, and players who are taught the game from a different perspective...with the adjustment that needs to be made to adapt that style of basketball to the NBA...speed things up.

The offense seems too hit or miss, and it doesn't really generate many easy shots in the NBA. Those perimeter shots might be the easier shots in European leagues, and it puts on a good show in the NBA when the shots are falling, but when they're not, there doesn't seem to be any way for us to generate easier shots other than STAT or Melo going one-on-one.

By the way, I didn't really find any breakdowns of the offense via google, just a bunch of sites trying to sell DVDs, playbooks, and shit. You can find breakdowns of the Triangle offense, Princeton offense, 4-out 1-in motion offense, ball screen oriented offenses used in Europe, etc.

I didn't read McCallum's book tho, maybe that would help shed some light on how this isn't a style developed for Euro leagues with some run and gun thrown in. I guess I gotta pick up the book.

1st of 3 parts: http://knickerblogger.net/what-is-mike-d%E2%80%99antoni%E2%80%99s-offense-part-i/

EDIT**

Part 2: http://knickerblogger.net/what-is-mike-d’antoni’s-offense-part-ii/

part 3: http://knickerblogger.net/what-is-mike-d’antoni’s-offense-part-iii/


BTW, your point reminds me of that movie about the guy who invented the variable windshield wiper. When he was suing GM for stealing his patent the GM lawyers claimed he didn't really invent anything new since it was made with existing parts and existing computer chips. He countered that Charles Dickens created a new book, A Tale of Two Cities but did not invent a single new word. He took existing words and letters and rearranged them into an original novel. Simply put, yes there are elements of other systems and styles but D'ant was the first to arrange those elements in that way and did indeed create his own system.
 
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