Nate Will Demand 10 MIL

[Supermansdaddy]

This is why they should just start Nate from now. Find out if he can be an everyday starting point in this league. If he can, then we should have no problem paying him 7-9 mil. We know he can score, we know he is capable of a 30 and 10 game every time he hits the court. If he can consistently run the team and put up good numbers, i have no problem paying him.

 

[Crazy⑧s]

Fans overrate Lee and Nate, because they're likable. But they're both benefitting from this system.

Lee is a good rebounder, and a good outlet passer, but is a liability defensively, and one dimensional offensively. His stats are inflated because we have no other rebounders, or post players, on our team.

Nate is a good scorer, but he's lazy defensively. He actually has the ability to be a very good defender, with his speed and athleticism. He should be a pest, like Mugsy Bogues or Nate Archibald. But he's not, and he tends to be a ball hog at times. His stats are also inflated, since he gets so many shots in this fast paced system.

They both will probably ask for a lot of money this summer, and I don't think they're worth it. They could be useful in a trade, since their value is so high. A sign and trade this summer might be a good idea.

You hit it again.

This season has at least been good as far as attracting some of the "target market" players that can be acquired in exchange for inflated stats.

Get us J Smooth.

I would love to keep Lee if it's gonna be a reasonable contract. N8 has turned it up there's no question, but if another team is willing to overpay him, then better them than us I say.

I'd still love to see N8 traded for Rudy Fernandez in some form of package deal that includes Travis Outlaw. Not sure if it's even slightly possible given his contract situation & that of others that could make it possible. Can't be bothered looking too deep into it either.

<!-- begin left column --> <!-- begin player -->

<!-- begin playerStatCont --> Rudy Fernandez #5 SG. - $1.1m 2 Years

<!-- comp -->

<table class="tablehead statCont" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="gamehead"><td colspan="4">2008-09 STATS</td></tr> <tr class="colhead playerStatSub"><td>PPG</td><td>APG</td><td>3P%</td></tr> <tr class="oddrow playerStats"><td>10.3</td><td>2.1</td><td>.386</td></tr></tbody></table>
<!-- begin left column --> <!-- begin player -->

<!-- begin playerStatCont --> Travis Outlaw #25 SF. - $4m 2 Years

<!-- comp -->

<table class="tablehead statCont" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="gamehead"><td colspan="4">2008-09 STATS</td></tr> <tr class="colhead playerStatSub"><td>PPG</td><td>RPG</td><td>APG</td></tr> <tr class="oddrow playerStats"><td>12.7</td><td>4.2</td><td>1</td></tr></tbody></table>
Both are good (cheap) shooters, particularly Fernandez who I think would be a great addition to the Knicks. Savvy player the likes of Manu. His performance vs USA @ Beijing was enough for me to want him in orange & blue.

Outlaw is long & athletic & can play at both ends. If he were to be traded here it would be a coming out party showing what he can really do. Under-rated as ****!

Bottom line:

N8 isn't worth too much. $7-8m/year is plenty enough.

Inflated stats apply to everyone & he's a very ****ing small fish in a big & madly talented pond.

 

[LeFlume]

We need BIGS. We don't need SF's or two guards. WE NEED BIGS. Give me a 7 footer or two and I'm happy...

 

[dre48ny]

Yeah the 7-8 mil a year sounds about fair. Teams will not throw more than that, not with this freaking economy and only a few teams with significant salary space. I f another team gives him 10, then we should not get into a bidding war.

 

[CoolClyde]

bullsh8

No one's going to offer N8 10Mill, not in this economy and
lower salary cap. But who the frack knows what teams are
going to offer N8 and DLee? Everything is up in the air
until the season ends, there's a good chance both players
will be gone if offered more than Walsh can muster, esp.
if matching interferes with PLAN2010 FROM OUTER SPACE.

I love DLEE and N8, I'll be pissed if we lose either player
just to rid contract (Curry/Jefferies). I hope Donnie and
No-D'antoni can work out a way to sign both players and
please their respective agent$, but I'm not holding my breath
anymore. Cheik please.

 

[Red]

How can we keep Lee & N8 plus sign 2 Max contract?

As I see it...

Walsh has something he hoped. Two (plus Chandler) young valued players. His options are dependent on other teams:

1. Re-sign as the young faces of the franchise who are "fan favorites" and will sell tickets/merchandise while performing at their current levels maybe better. Their prices are fair market value due to their impending free agency. By doing so Walsh is saying "these are our guys we're building around".

This plan is contingent on several factors. A) Are these players perfect for this system? B) Will another team blow them out of the water? C) By re-signing do you risk not being able to go after 2 Max contract worthy players (in essence negating all the cap clearing moves this season)?

2. Sign and trade for "upgrades" and to possibly rid the cap of Curry & Jeffries


This is contingent on one major factor being an Upgrade is available. This player must posses better skills than Lee or N8 and definitely should not deter signing 2 Max contracts- unless this is a player that has "superstar" abilities. Why trade a potential center piece for less, unless the player coming in is serviceable and provides cap relief for 2 Max's?


3. Let'em walk
This option comes when another team offers Lee or N8 way too much, leaving the Knicks without one or both.

Conclusion...

Walsh expects a sign and trade. He could of been signed them but wants to patiently see what other teams have to offer.

Why sign during the season when (if they perform well) other teams will bite? He checks the landscape during the off season knowing Lee and N8 will be offered "fair" if not below market value and the players love it here. If he can he will trade for an upgrade. If no one is there he re-signs N8 first then Lee (sorry Lee fans).

I say this b/c he knows N8 will be cheaper and will allow 2 Max's, N8's fan base is growing and Lee will command more from other teams than N8. If anyone is gone it will be Lee unfortunately. The question is what would you rather: Either Lee or N8 and 2 Max's... or Lee And N8 + 1 Max?

 

[KING~POETIQ]

Nate Robinson never said he was expecting 10 million a year. I'm sure the Knicks could re-sign him for 6-8 million a year. Robinson's a good player, but his stats are inflated. He's really a 15 point per game player who's beneftiting from playing on a team that has no leader, All Star, or true 1st or even 3rd scoring option.

He may not be expecting 10 Mil but that may be his starting price at the negotiating table, that way he can get a fair contract (7.5 mil to 8.5 mil).



He's definitely benefitting from the weak talent we have. Other players on our team are not taking that initiative, which makes nate that much wiser.


Doing what he does at 5'9 is rather impressive. Night in and night out he shows his fearlessness by going up against bigger guys. Nate is in attack mode the second he steps on the court, and other teams see that. His services are going to be sought out by many suitors in free agency time. Hopefully other teams don't go overboard with the cash so that we can have a shot at keeping him.

 

[the portable man]

fernandez would be a nice pick-up but that dont look possible since hes already averaging 10 ppg in his rookie yr and we cant offer them anyone for him

and nate NEEDS to be resigned, we're talkin about the most dynamic pg in the game

at this point nate is #1 in points per minute among pg's, prolly among sg's too

shoots 45% and that would only rise if he gets to start and dribble inside more, its common sense

signing any other pg would be retarded

 

[TunerAddict]

fernandez would be a nice pick-up but that dont look possible since hes already averaging 10 ppg in his rookie yr and we cant offer them anyone for him

and nate NEEDS to be resigned, we're talkin about the most dynamic pg in the game

at this point nate is #1 in points per minute among pg's, prolly among sg's too

shoots 45% and that would only rise if he gets to start and dribble inside more, its common sense

signing any other pg would be retarded

How does starting improves field goal percentage?

 

[WVKnickfan]

fernandez would be a nice pick-up but that dont look possible since hes already averaging 10 ppg in his rookie yr and we cant offer them anyone for him

and nate NEEDS to be resigned, we're talkin about the most dynamic pg in the game

at this point nate is #1 in points per minute among pg's, prolly among sg's too

shoots 45% and that would only rise if he gets to start and dribble inside more, its common sense

signing any other pg would be retarded

One of the main reasons that Nate is putting up those kind of numbers is b/c of Dantoni's system.I find it hard to believe that he would score and put those kind of numbers in anybody else's system.

 

[JayJ44]

fernandez would be a nice pick-up but that dont look possible since hes already averaging 10 ppg in his rookie yr and we cant offer them anyone for him

and nate NEEDS to be resigned, we're talkin about the most dynamic pg in the game

at this point nate is #1 in points per minute among pg's, prolly among sg's too

shoots 45% and that would only rise if he gets to start and dribble inside more, its common sense

signing any other pg would be retarded

The most dynamic PG in the game? Wow... I was thinking Chris Paul or Deron Williams, or even Derrick Rose.

 

[WVKnickfan]

The most dynamic PG in the game? Wow... I was thinking Chris Paul or Deron Williams, or even Derrick Rose.

Yeah I agree with you! I like Nate and he is a good player but to call him a dynamic player is a insult to Paul,Williams and even Nash.Nate has a long ways to go if he wants mentioned in the same breath of those three.imo

 

[the portable man]

How does starting improves field goal percentage?

he's driving more to the basket now, given the privilege to do more and create more is only gonna make him better...we're not talking about some guy who just started performing, i mean he did avg 10-11ppg in only 20 mins per game under isiah n brown, when crawford's mins should've cut down instead

i see nate easily becoming 2nd best pg if given power to run the team, and im not saying he has to create every play but when they need that random penetration which is MUCH quicker and more effective than duhon's methods, he can do it and top of that make it entertaining...the only other pg's u can say that about is paul rose n parker and they were given a lot of playing time since day one

 

[the portable man]

One of the main reasons that Nate is putting up those kind of numbers is b/c of Dantoni's system.I find it hard to believe that he would score and put those kind of numbers in anybody else's system.

dog the 'system' ur thinkin of is just habitual plays they run, the knicks play a lot of halfcourt offense too

ur basically saying anybody can increase their ppg in dantoni's system, the point is nate averaged 10ppg off the bench under isiah and his system didnt have as many options, ball didnt move as much

nate is putting up these numbers because of nate AND dantoni letting nate play, showing him n others some extra plays but ultimately its up to the players thats obvious so i dont see where ur coming from

 

[the portable man]

The most dynamic PG in the game? Wow... I was thinking Chris Paul or Deron Williams, or even Derrick Rose.

i agree with paul n rose, like in my previous post 'dynamic' to me is someone who can create, finish and top of that make it entertaining too

nate is in their league tho, its just a shame he's been comin off the bench for 4 years, big mistake

i mean we all know he's a good scorer and thats been his thing off the bench, but even averaging 4 asts now is BIG, duhon is averaging what 7-8 asts with all that playing time???? come on i know yall dont mean to tell me nate cant do that & more with a 10x better dribble, its simple the knicks just gotta do it and build their post game n defense

all we need right now is a good SG, i wonder if redd is FA in 2010, that would be a perfect fit along with a nice PF-C draft choice

 

[WVKnickfan]

dog the 'system' ur thinkin of is just habitual plays they run, the knicks play a lot of halfcourt offense too

ur basically saying anybody can increase their ppg in dantoni's system, the point is nate averaged 10ppg off the bench under isiah and his system didnt have as many options, ball didnt move as much

nate is putting up these numbers because of nate AND dantoni letting nate play, showing him n others some extra plays but ultimately its up to the players thats obvious so i dont see where ur coming from

Hey I did'nt say you had to agree with me I just told you what I think.Nate could'nt play in a slow ofense b/c he gets so hyped up and gets so crazy out there on the floor.He would go nuts having to play a halfcourt ALL GAME.The way he likes to run and gun there is no way he could put up those kind of stats playing halfcourt all game for another team b/c he would'nt be able to contain himself from running and gunning.

 

[clumsy]

If they pay him 10 mil, and David Lee, i know that James Dolan cares more about revenue generated from merchandise/ticket sales than having a winning franchise.

 

[JayJ44]

i agree with paul n rose, like in my previous post 'dynamic' to me is someone who can create, finish and top of that make it entertaining too

nate is in their league tho, its just a shame he's been comin off the bench for 4 years, big mistake

i mean we all know he's a good scorer and thats been his thing off the bench, but even averaging 4 asts now is BIG, duhon is averaging what 7-8 asts with all that playing time???? come on i know yall dont mean to tell me nate cant do that & more with a 10x better dribble, its simple the knicks just gotta do it and build their post game n defense

all we need right now is a good SG, i wonder if redd is FA in 2010, that would be a perfect fit along with a nice PF-C draft choice

Nah, Nate isn't in their league. 4 assists is pretty bad for a PG with starter minutes. Even Crawful averaged like 5 assists last season when he was playing PG.

Nate is a scoring combo guard, best suited off the bench. Nate=Barbosa. I don't think he could ever average more than 5 or 6 assists, even in this system. It's just not his game. It would be silly to pay him anything more than 6 or 7 million.

BTW, Redd sucks. He's one dimensional, and one of the worst defensive players in the league. He's a good shooter, that's about it. Why do you think the Bucks are playing better without him?

 

[the portable man]

Nah, Nate isn't in their league. 4 assists is pretty bad for a PG with starter minutes. Even Crawful averaged like 5 assists last season when he was playing PG.

Nate is a scoring combo guard, best suited off the bench. Nate=Barbosa. I don't think he could ever average more than 5 or 6 assists, even in this system. It's just not his game. It would be silly to pay him anything more than 6 or 7 million.

BTW, Redd sucks. He's one dimensional, and one of the worst defensive players in the league. He's a good shooter, that's about it. Why do you think the Bucks are playing better without him?

dog what are u talking about??? theres nothin to argue about cuz first off nate DOES NOT get starter minutes, he averages exactly 30 mpg, 7-9 mins less than any stars sitting atop any stat category
:barf:

and if u wanna use that then take a look at nates last 3 games where he HAS been getting starter minutes AND starting: 25ppg 7apg

then lets look @ duhon who has been getting starter mins ALL season and is #8 in apg with 7.6

then rose who is playing 37-38mins is averaging 16 and 6!

i dont see how a 'combo' guard means a bench role fits him best, being a combo guard means u have more abilities so it would be a contradiction to say he's a bench guy...and no offense barbosa is nice but he doesnt have the dribbling n passing ability of nate, who doesnt even need screens like most of these other PG's today...keep in mind barbosas been 6th man for the past three years, this is nate's first real 6th man year and the knicks NEED nate to be starting pg, the suns have nash and jrich so barbosas role IS suitable

other than that, redd IS a good fit for the knicks, its obvious u dont follow bball generally which is ok but why make it seem like u know...cuz if u've seen redd play in the olympics or nba, he's a SOLID defender(a lil over 1spg) stays in front of most players pretty well and on top of that he has one of the LOWEST TO's per game than any other SG

so with all that and u put him into dantoni's 'system' which is just a set of plays they usually run to open up their offense theres no reason for robinson not to continue doing what hes been doing especially in terms of assists, i see that # increasing easily considering the knicks have so many offensive options, lets be real here

 

[KING~POETIQ]

I doubt the Knicks let either play go. I don't understand why you guys should care about money. Its not your money. Lee and Robinson are what 25, 26 years old..not even in their prime. Lock them both up to long term deals.

I can't see them letting go of their 2 most popular players just for the small chance they'll sign someone to a max contract in another year.

hopefully they don't let them go. alot of people want to see the whole line-up replaced.

we shouldnt be a team that buys their whole roster. we need to build from past draft picks(nate, lee, chandler, gallo), future draft picks, and one or maybe two free agents.

replacing Nate for undeveloped talent like a fernandez or for an aging veteran like nash would be a major fail.